Since gamepass has had beacoup crazy sales what if Series X came with a lifetime subscription to the service?

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fourthline

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The backroom deals are how Microsoft makes their money. All the infrastructure that the oil industry spends to drill for oil is very much justified by consumer perpetual consumption needs. Microtransactions arent going anywhere either. If Microsoft wants to crush Sony they could offer gamepass for much longer than their 14 day or 30 day trial. If Series X launched for $500 and came with a life of the box subscription that would get them the capital and mindshare they need to really take over the videogame market. Worst case scenario is the service is terrible with old 360,XBone, and a few new games 5 or 10 years from now. But that model still has them getting paid and they can kneecap the service when it comes time like they just did with Mixer.

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Efesell

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Seems like uh.. a lot of lost money with this idea?

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Ry_Ry

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Seems more likely that they'll heavily promote a 2-3 year subscription model where you pay $30-ish a month for a Series X console with gamepass & XBL bundled in. Completely change the math to become a monthly charge like Netflix, Spotify, etc.

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BaneFireLord

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@ry_ry said:

Seems more likely that they'll heavily promote a 2-3 year subscription model where you pay $30-ish a month for a Series X console with gamepass & XBL bundled in. Completely change the math to become a monthly charge like Netflix, Spotify, etc.

Yeah, this makes a lot of sense. I had no interest in getting an Xbox this current gen, but then they did the Xbox All Access program with the 0% 24 month financing and two years of Gold/Game Pass and I bought in. It's probably the best gaming investment I've made...$39 a month at the same cumulative cost as buying everything up front is a hell of a deal.

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colourful_hippie

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Free lifetime makes zero sense. At most I could see them offering a 6 or 12 month free trial for Series X owners but fat chance at even that

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fourthline

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@colourful_hippie: So you have people that will go lifetime and never buy a game. For context, have you ever paid for email? I hope not. Data is essentially free when you reach the scale of xbox and ps4, or a pretty minimal cost. If they get people in the door that never buy a console, would never buy a pc for game, and probably game on their phone they expand the market. My phone is essentially free games for life even if I cancel my cellphone plan. Yes, just the free-to-play games but people pass down models to their kids. They could make their money of movie sales, microtransactions, controllers, and ultimately when people become gamers they will buy games that aren't on gamepass. Imagine a family of 4. As the kids move up and out of the house that one box has the lifetime subscription, just like Netflix is eventually going to lockdown your account from all your buddies. I think you guys are thinking small and really don't understand the gaming industry and why Microsoft is even in the game.. it's not because Phil Spencer really likes games.

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Efesell

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They sell all of those things as well as a subscription service, what is the benefit to providing the latter for free?

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ghost_cat

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So somehow they will pull money out of thin air for things like maintenance, servers, contractors, marketing, licensing, bandwidth, customer service, PR, legal work, and a bunch of other stuff? Please take me to the dimension you live in.

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fourthline

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@ghost_cat: it’s a limited offer. Let me think for you. I’m sure you’ve seen warranties for life commercials for car sales. Buy your car from Getting Jiggy Motors and you get oil changed for life and bumper to bumper warranty. I don’t know how they do it. You don’t know how they do it. Because chances are you work for someone else. But they do it. It could be the first 5 million consoles. It could be tied into a monthly installment plan like phones have. The next big game is an unknown property if people with lifetime subscriptions buy games outside of Microsoft games on a Microsoft system then Microsoft gets paid. They don’t get paid on other systems. If I buy a game on stadia it is essentially free for life. How are they making money off of me 10 years from now? Keep your snarky stadia won’t be around comments to yourself.

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Efesell

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#10  Edited By Efesell

How do you use so many words to say nothing?

Also free oil changes for life is a notorious scam tactic so I dunno about this.

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ll_Exile_ll

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The point of gamepass isn't to get people to buy an Xbox Series X, the point of their consoles at this point is to get people to subscribe to gamepass. You've got the whole thing backwards. They don't want to give away their subscription in order to get people buy the console, their ultimate goal is to get paying gamepass subscribers. That's why gamepass is on PC and and will remain on Xbox One. That's why they're making such a point about bringing all their games to PC and not abandoning the Xbox One ecosystem.

Giving away the subscription is the exact opposite of their entire business strategy. They don't care on which platform you utilize it, as long as you are a gamepass subscriber. The $1 a month deals and free trials are to get people in the door, "the first hit is free" (or really cheap). Giving it away makes no sense.

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ghost_cat

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@fourthline: So you take an scenario you don't understand financially to relate to another industry you also don't understand financially? How old are you?

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fourthline

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#13  Edited By fourthline

@ll_exile_ll: Microsoft is the most cuttingest runningest company I've ever known. They want to bury Sony and nothing safe is going to do that. The only reason someone's Mom might mistakenly call the gaming system their kids play an Xbox rather than a PlayStation or even a Nintendo is because Microsoft decided to get in the game a few years ago. They succeeded in their original vision.

They have to strike. If you look at the TV you bought, the car you drive, cellphone, computer, or even where you dine. All of the frontrunners from a decade ago are not leading the pack (Motorola) and the underdog is not as laughable (Hyundai telluride). If anything their way behind if not defunct. I wouldn't have imagined buying anything other than a Sony, Samsung, or Toshiba tv a decade ago. Now they couldn't give me 1 yet alone 100 reasons to choose them over any box. Videogame systems are at that point. They bury Sony with a choice...free gamepass for life. of the console Much like the million of services your signed up for and never use (but probably pay for) people will not even use the thing because they would have moved on to the next thing or sold it to a friend to make rent. But you got them in the door.

They came out smashing on 360 and they should the same. Xcloud is not some break even service. It's a break Stadia service at whatever cost. These studios will put games on other service. If you get a breakout hit you sell it on Switch and PS4. It's almost like Sony and Nintendo work for you with a scenario like that. So do the math.. $15 a month for 5 years is $900. Do you really think whatever bandwith they provide assuming you use it to the fullest is a real world cost of $900 it's probably like $75 or $100. Do you really think Netflix needs your $15 a month to break even on their services. Probably like $0.75.. look at what Sling TV wants to do and what PlutoTv already does...

We haven't even discussed ads revenue and the next Big Pimpin or Sneakking

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Onemanarmyy

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Microsoft's original vision: Have moms accidently call a playstation / nintendo an xbox instead.

Fictive person: signs up for millions of services just cause , but actively has to sell stuff to not get kicked out of their home.

I just don't think my brain is compatible to understand the world fourthline is living in.

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Onemanarmyy

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#17  Edited By Onemanarmyy

@fourthline: Thank you for the service of tagging me when Microsoft reveals that everyone will get a free lifetime subscription with their series X purchase. In the meantime i will think about cheese some more i guess?

Seems like your comment got deleted. woops!

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Ry_Ry

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you seem really hung up on the idea of data being free to make any of this work. remember data being free is a result of storage & access costs in a continuous race toward zero. this is different from the creation of said data.

yes companies subsidize products for market share gains. that’s where you get a $50 kindle with a $10 a month kindle unlimited plan

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ghost_cat

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@fourthline: So you got nothing legit to say while declaring you're a narc. You could have just said that and make it easier on yourself.

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ll_Exile_ll

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#20  Edited By ll_Exile_ll

@fourthline: Microsoft's current goal is not to sell more Xbox Series X than Sony sells PS5s. If that was their goal, they wouldn't be putting system seller games like Halo Infinite on PC and Xbox One. Their goal to get as many people to subscribe to gamepass as possible, whether that be on Xbox One, PC, or Series X. Their idea of marketshare is having a ton of gamepass subscribers, they've even talked about potentially having gamepass on other platforms like switch.

They are trying to position themselves as the Netflix of games, Netflix doesn't care what platform you access their service on, as long as you're a subscriber. This is the direction Microsoft is going, the exact opposite idea of giving away a subscription to sell a $500 box to you one time.

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fourthline

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@ll_exile_ll: The fight they have to win is for the box under your TV. A business model that offers more games when I already have 100s of games is not sustainable when their competitor already does that better than them. If Sony sells more boxes than them the Xbox is going the way of Windows Phone, Zune, or Mixer. Any TV manufacturer in the next 5 years can pick their streaming game service of choice some might go for Stadia, PSNow, Ubisoft,Ea, XCloud, or some Amazon service. Every single console gamer at most right now has a 3 year commitment (because of the $1 boy you guys sure showed corporate America with our bing rewards and whatnot) to a videogame streaming service. So let's just say we are all on the fence in the 5 year view (companies do this people should but don't) that's sure alot of people you have to persuade. My landlord would love to lock me into a lifetime contract, would settle for a year, and hates month to month. There's no guarantee the kind of video service someone subscribes to because they are all splintered but Amazon tied their service to delivery of tampons and they will have Amazon Prime members for life because of it. Microsoft needs to figure out for life that's what they're cooking up. They aren't think 'oh I hope fourthline still finds value in our service in the 3rd quarter of 2022,' they want me not going elsewhere because my little month to month is very much subject to change.

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ThePanzini

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#22  Edited By ThePanzini

@fourthline: A few caveats though Game Pass has been around a while and not helped the XB1 against the PS4, why would the Series X be any different? None of the best selling games are on Game Pass and at the end of the day content is king.

Sony has 20b cash on hand, sure not MS money but plenty to match Xbox in the videogame space. The PS3 outsold the 360 5 to 1 with a $100 premium and releasing a year later, Sony mindshare with PS4 is much much higher, MS could give game pass away it would make no difference across the EU & Asia.

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ll_Exile_ll

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The PS3 outsold the 360 5 to 1 with a $100 premium and releasing a year later,

Where are you getting this? All the numbers floating around for that generation put the 360 and PS3 at around the same total sales number, with the PS3 a few million higher. Both sold in the 84 -87 million range. PS3 certainly didn't sell 5 times more than the 360.

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ThePanzini

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#24  Edited By ThePanzini

@ll_exile_ll: I mean in Europe, at Sony worst point MS couldn't get close which is half the market.

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fourthline

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@thepanzini: @ll_exile_ll: then what do you suggest they do to move the needle. I’d agree Xbox is more in play for Europe than Asia. China just opened up to consoles a few years ago so nothing there is a foreigners conclusion.

I say the go free game pass in Europe and America it’s not like other places can run that stuff reliably anyway. And in Asia let it be business as usual by the time series x is done most people will be streaming and unless Sony can come up with their own model (i think PS Now is solid) they will be mostly okay but with the movie industry being what it is, psTv folding, the irrelevance of videogames boxes, nobody wants their phones, 4K TVs a dime a dozen, and all the different pots Sony has their hands I think Sony as a company is struggling. They need PlayStation to work more than any other division that they have. Everything they do puts them at risk. If PS5 has some sort of red ring, data breach, or general lack of interest once the world reopens and people don’t want to ever be home again they are in trouble.

I really don’t think PS4 has been crushing it in Japan. That would be Nintendo. And Asia seems to be more into pubg, crossfirex, fortnite and games that Sony isn’t exactly known for. I think their box can play those games but the numbers they boast for the Judgments, Dragon Quest, and God of Wars are like 10 and 15% of console sales. When you look at modern warfare, fortnite and siege numbers those make up a heftier percentage. Those games can be played on anything. Current generation has truly been platform agnostic and Sony knows that more than anybody.

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navster15

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@fourthline: I’m genuinely perplexed at everyone’s concern for the well being for multi-billion dollar Microsoft lately. Let’s say their strategy flops and by 2023 they’re out of business, so what? In that time I’ll have saved money and got to play some cool games. If I’m worried about my collection I can then snap up disc versions of said games on discount. So I ask again, who cares? Just enjoy the ride and stop playing Monday morning executive.

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fourthline

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@navster15: well for one. Their policies are not set in stone as of yet. I’m laying out what’s it going to take for me to make a purchase either way. It’s not about the company’s health it’s about them making the right moves for me to go with their box. I have way too many devices as is. For them to move the needle we are outlining what needs to happen. I appreciate your contribution to this post greatly.

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ThePanzini

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#28  Edited By ThePanzini

@fourthline: Basically MS problem is 70% of XB1 sales are from the US they are very US centric.

Shooters do better in the US than anywhere else and storybased games do much better in Europe which is pretty much all of Sony's AAA content, rebooting God of War away from its action roots to focus more on a story was to appeal more towards an EU audience. Source

Nearly all of Sony's first party focus on narrative is geared towards the EU and timed exclusive deals with COD & Destiny help push it in the US. MS is pretty much all in on the US with Halo & Gears, they need a lot more narrative focused content.

What Sony does better than anyone else is localisation when I say Asia don't just think Japan, Sony do better in emerging markets than anyone else, for example Sony sold more than 1m PS4's across the middle east they were the first to translate their dashboard into Arabic and dub their games too.

Sony operate in more countries and translate their games into more languages with dub far more than MS. A common issue is MS dub their games in Mexican Spanish and not EU Spanish which is a different accent and it was only until relatively recently users could set their dashboard language different to the game but its still an issue in countries with more than one offical language.

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colourful_hippie

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@fourthline: So you take an scenario you don't understand financially to relate to another industry you also don't understand financially? How old are you?

Thanks for saving me a reply.

Also I get that MS has deep pockets to do something as stupid as free "lifetime" Game Pass for Series X owners, but they don't have to. With the flawed logic that the OP here is using why doesn't MS just buy out Sony's Playstation division. Their market cap is so fucking huge nowadays that they could swallow up all of Sony no problem.

So why don't they do that? Because they don't have to and would prefer going for something more long term and more efficient.

This is all silly talk.

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simmant

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@ll_exile_ll: My landlord would love to lock me into a lifetime contract, would settle for a year, and hates month to month.

I just want to highlight this statement as it may be the single most absurd thing said in this thread.

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mikewhy

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"For context, have you ever paid for email?"

Like every company ever? Either directly to MS / Google, or indirectly through their own IT departments or domain registrar.