Starfield and Redfall both delayed to 2023

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Big_Denim

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#1  Edited By Big_Denim

Whomp whomp. I do respect the developers' time and lifestyle, and I certainly want a quality game without crunch. That being said, this one does sting a bit (particularly Starfield).

The Fall 2022 season is looking a bit barren now. What say you, fellow bombers? What Xbox games have got you excited for the Fall season now that one of their heavy hitters has been delayed to next year?

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Broshmosh

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#2  Edited By Broshmosh

I don't even remember Redfall getting a 2022 release date, when the hell did that happen? I thought they were focusing on Starfield, but I guess outsourcing development offers the possibility of getting it out sooner.

I doubt either game will run on a new-from-the-ground-up creation kit, so I'm not expecting amazing things. Mostly just expecting the same Bethesda jank with even less of the heart than was in Skyrim. The benefit of time allows for much perspective on something like Bethesda's work.

Bethesda's obsession with reverential release dates was due to be their downfall, I'm glad they've at least seen reason.

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ALLTheDinos

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This is pretty surprising, since they seemed awfully proud of the 11/11 release date for Starfield. However, this really sheds light on the complete lack of gameplay footage / screenshots so far. I certainly hope this results in a better overall product; while I didn’t care for Doom Eternal, at least it ran well for me when it eventually came out.

I’m sure there’s gonna be a lot of questions about this for Grubb in an hour.

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tartyron

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This doesn’t surprise me at all. Cyberpunk set a precedent for buggy AAA games that no one wants to repeat. That likely also why they didn’t say a date but instead just vague window for the delay. It’s fine, delays are overall good things.

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mellotronrules

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#5  Edited By mellotronrules

hopefully this is a positive outcome for the game and devs. delay doesn't necessarily = quality of life (extended crunch), so here's hoping the management is keeping it on the up-and-up over there.

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BaneFireLord

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Yeah that sucks. Despite a lot of people saying “called it,” I’m legitimately surprised…the “they haven’t shown much, a delay is inevitable” calculus generally hasn’t applied to BethSoft’s strategy for marketing cycles.

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monkeyking1969

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I fully expect that even with a delay that when they four month before launch, they will again be in crunch. A lot can happen with an acquisition of a company, improvements in management and corporates culture; but 'crunch' is very sadly baked into too many software development jobs - I don't think Xbox Studios can fix that.

So, now we know they were not showing it off not for the typical Bethesda's secretiveness, but because what they had was not in any state to be shown even to select press. And, this is two games, that says top management is making changes (maybe for the better--- this could be very good) for these two studios that are hundreds of miles apart.

If nothing else Microsoft is organized, ruthless and bottom-line focused, but organized. You could almost spin this as Xbox Game Studios as giving these two games a fair shot without the mismanagement of Zenimax tainting them. I hope these games turn out good, when Bethesda made games I liked 'half-way' competently they were engaging games. I hope the new top-level publisher management turns this around into a positive.

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physicalscience

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My surprising obsession with Elden Ring has really had me thinking about what I even want out of a Bethesda game lately. I'm not sure what to expect from Starfield, but Bethesda's track-record over the past decade haven't inspired much confidence from me.

Skyrim came out in 2011, and Fallout 4 was alright, although I got tired of the janky base-building pretty quickly.

Fallout 76 was an absolute disaster in my opinion. I have tried more times that I feel good about to give that game a shot (usually after a big update), and trying to play that game with friends is miserable.

Skyrim was an absolute banger, and what they were able to do in a handful of years after Oblivion on the same console was really impressive to me. Since then it's been nothing of note from them.

Long development cycles of any software project become problematic, and generally fall into almost a waterfall cycle, where you had all these ideas and requirements soooo long ago, that by the time you actually release something it isn't near what the user wants/desires because things change so fast. Root causes to this are generally out of whack project scope and poor development pipelines, I wonder what state the game is actually in right now.

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GTxForza

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Oh no, all we can do is stay tuned until Bethesda Game Studios & Arkane Studios finish developing their respective games.

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Broshmosh

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This is pretty surprising, since they seemed awfully proud of the 11/11 release date for Starfield.

That was definitely the publishers, rather than the developers: This Jason Schrier tweet speaks volumes.

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ThePanzini

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#11  Edited By ThePanzini
@monkeyking1969 said:

I fully expect that even with a delay that when they four month before launch, they will again be in crunch. A lot can happen with an acquisition of a company, improvements in management and corporates culture; but 'crunch' is very sadly baked into too many software development jobs - I don't think Xbox Studios can fix that.

So, now we know they were not showing it off not for the typical Bethesda's secretiveness, but because what they had was not in any state to be shown even to select press. And, this is two games, that says top management is making changes (maybe for the better--- this could be very good) for these two studios that are hundreds of miles apart.

If nothing else Microsoft is organized, ruthless and bottom-line focused, but organized. You could almost spin this as Xbox Game Studios as giving these two games a fair shot without the mismanagement of Zenimax tainting them. I hope these games turn out good, when Bethesda made games I liked 'half-way' competently they were engaging games. I hope the new top-level publisher management turns this around into a positive.

343i is MS largest studio and have crunched on every Halo game a work culture pretty much carried over from Bungie, not only has MS not done anything about it but the studio was seemingly setup in this way using temp contrators.

Halo Infinite was delayed a year yet still released with missing features and the live service isn't going well, Everwild another MS game is stuck in dev hell.

Doesn't seem very organised or ruthless considering, MS also stated they were going to be hands off and Bethesda run themselves after the acquisition, I very much doubt MS will do anything given their previous mo.

Though sometimes a delay is just that and simply needs more time.

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redcream

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This delay made me realize that Microsoft can be incentivized to delay games so people can remain subscribed to Game Pass for longer. It's probably not their intent but I imagine some people purchasing a year of Game Pass in anticipation of the release of Starfield only to have to renew their subscription before its release.

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Undeadpool

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Whomp whomp. I do respect the developers' time and lifestyle, and I certainly want a quality game without crunch. That being said, this one does sting a bit (particularly Starfield).

The Fall 2022 season is looking a bit barren now. What say you, fellow bombers? What Xbox games have got you excited for the Fall season now that one of their heavy hitters has been delayed to next year?

I always see this sentiment shared with delays, but sadly: it usually just means longer crunch and less respect for their time.

Especially from a company like Bethesda. I'm sure they just have to get the cheese wheel physics JUST RIGHT.

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Besetment

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Wait, delayed? As in, there was a release date to begin with? They don't even have a screenshot.

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BaneFireLord

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@undeadpool: Every chance things have changed in recent years and there’s a Jason Schreier expo in the works, but as far as I’m aware Bethesda Game Studios has a reputation for not being a crunch studio.

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MindBullet

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@redcream said:

This delay made me realize that Microsoft can be incentivized to delay games so people can remain subscribed to Game Pass for longer. It's probably not their intent but I imagine some people purchasing a year of Game Pass in anticipation of the release of Starfield only to have to renew their subscription before its release.

This came up during Grubb Snax, and I have to ask... How many people are signing up to Game Pass for games that aren't actually out yet? Also... Why? Am I missing something here?

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Efesell

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@redcream said:

This delay made me realize that Microsoft can be incentivized to delay games so people can remain subscribed to Game Pass for longer. It's probably not their intent but I imagine some people purchasing a year of Game Pass in anticipation of the release of Starfield only to have to renew their subscription before its release.

This came up during Grubb Snax, and I have to ask... How many people are signing up to Game Pass for games that aren't actually out yet? Also... Why? Am I missing something here?

Yeah this is one of those things that if someone did get burned by this it's like... well you maybe should have thought for literally any amount of time before hand.

Although honestly who pays regular price for Game Pass anyway I think I've redeemed the 1$ deal for three months in a row.

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El_Blarfo

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#18  Edited By El_Blarfo
@tartyron said:

This doesn’t surprise me at all. Cyberpunk set a precedent for buggy AAA games that no one wants to repeat.

I wonder if anyone would tolerate even Bethesda's usual level of broken-ness in a post-Cyberpunk world. Skyrim and Oblivion at least were 99% playable at launch, but actually, honestly finished?

Nowhere close.

Maybe they learned a lesson.

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monkeyking1969

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@thepanzini: Bethesda was/is a terrible developer of very buggy games. To say Microsoft needs or should to stay out of Bethesda way is laughable.

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tartyron

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@tartyron said:

This doesn’t surprise me at all. Cyberpunk set a precedent for buggy AAA games that no one wants to repeat.

I wonder if anyone would tolerate even Bethesda's usual level of broken-ness in a post-Cyberpunk world. Skyrim and Oblivion at least were 99% playable at launch, but actually, honestly finished?

Nowhere close.

Maybe they learned a lesson.

Yeah, I really think that the whole industry saw how bad it can go. Bethesda also had Fallout 76 to eat shit on in the recent past too. The tolerance for broken AAA is at an all time low and I don't any company can get away with it like they used too.

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FacelessVixen

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More time to play other games.

Works for me.

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ThePanzini

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#22  Edited By ThePanzini

@monkeyking1969: Expecting the folks behind the MCC to get stuck in to Bethesda, and fix all their jank (that still sells stupidly well) is like 'The pot calling the kettle black'. Now I ain't saying they shouldn't, but you know I kinda doubt it.

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Undeadpool

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@undeadpool: Every chance things have changed in recent years and there’s a Jason Schreier expo in the works, but as far as I’m aware Bethesda Game Studios has a reputation for not being a crunch studio.

Here's to hoping!

Beyond not ruining employees' lives, I hope they learnt from Fallout 76 that people aren't willing to write off "open world jank" because it makes for entertaining Youtube videos anymore.

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BladeOfCreation

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I'm super excited for Redfall.

Bethesda picking a date for Starfield and then pushing that date six months before it's supposed to happen seems like a bad sign.

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Slaegar

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#25  Edited By Slaegar

If they are delaying it for more "polish" like they did with Fallout 76, I'm guessing they plan on releasing them in 2025 after modders fix it.

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AV_Gamer

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#27  Edited By AV_Gamer

I believe Redfall will happen, but Starfield is an interesting case. On the one hand, nobody wants another Cyberpunk 2077 situation, where the game is released too early and filled with lots of game breaking bugs. But at the same time, this game might be another example of a game that promises the world and eventually gets cancelled, never coming out. It seems like the developers are having trouble doing flight in the game based on how it's designed. This means Xbox won't have any AAA games coming out this year, not a good look, especially after they bought all those major studios.

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I dont even know how to articulate what I'm trying to say - but as much as I enjoy Bethesda's library (FO3, ES2-5), I cant help but feel like for every great new leap they've made they've also introduced some sort of... crack into the foundation. The kind of cracks I'm not sure can be fixed without a completely fresh start from the ground up. I'm not a game developer and maybe they've already tried that. But a lot of their games just feel like they're trying to brute force these aging engines to work miracles.

Anyway I hope it turns out really well and produces something that shanks this bethesda jank legacy. Pretty skeptical myself.