The games you remember will never exist again (X-COM, Syndicate)

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jonc151

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#1  Edited By jonc151

For someone who grew up playing x-com ufo defense and syndicate the idea has crossed my mind that these games are part of an era that cannot exist again. Has the slow chess style of game disappeared? Looking back I remember a Rainbow Six that had a high level of tactical strategy as opposed to the chest high wall shooter "Rainbow Six Vegas". Not that I don't enjoy shooting terrorists in the face in 'Vegas' but that's not the point. Has the ability to play strategic games waned? or am I just being old and nostalgic? Not to say that the new XCOM or Syndicate won't be fun to play, but it won't be the same thing we grew up with.

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Chummy8

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#2  Edited By Chummy8

I agree. I'm playing through Baldur's Gate 2 now and "they just don't make em like they used to".

That slow, strategic, and tactical style of gameplay will not be made in this current game market. That's unfortunate, because for me, there's nothing quite like a sweet, tactical, turn based RPG (like Fallout 1 + 2). The demand these days is for more action, more graphics, and simpler game play. So, the games of our youth, as we know it, are gone for good.

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Video_Game_King

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#3  Edited By Video_Game_King
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James_ex_machina

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#4  Edited By James_ex_machina

There are certain styles of games that we might not see again(as new games). I have never played X-com but played through most of Syndicate. I would welcome another game in that style. Some people miss games like Zork. I like FPS but hope someone will revive these old game styles into new games to give us more variation.

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Akyho

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#5  Edited By Akyho

Indeed. When the Xcom game was announced it was awsome. Then gameplay....it looked vastly diffrent...ok aslong as it plays the same. Nope in the end not even the gameplay is similer. Its either the awful Spiritual succesort UFO or just go play the originals. I Baught Xcom for the ps1 as it has better graphics and the iconic music to me. Cost me £40 as if it was a full priced 360 game two years ago. I dont regret it.

Syndicate I was a fan of Syndicate wars. So i was excited by the rumors and then announced and then...no its not the same game. Story might be syndicate but gameplay lets see if there is a slither in it.

Fallout 3 was coming out and i saw the Fallout 1 and 2 bundle so i got and played completed 1 and then got half way through 2. So I became an old Fallout fan months befor Fallout 3. While its not the same gameplay. It still hold alot of the stuff that IS fallout. So its somthing ill put my hands up and go ok.

However xcom is looking unrecognisable and Syndicate is still to be proven.

I dont want old games remade now.

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BeachThunder

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#6  Edited By BeachThunder

I disagree, they may not be as prevalent now or made by hude AAA developers, but I would say that there are still many 'old school' games being made now. There may be somethings that interest you here. Also, check out Frozen Synapse, which is now a part of a Humble Bundle.

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Jimbo

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#7  Edited By Jimbo
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CptBedlam

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#8  Edited By CptBedlam

I hope it's just a "cycle" thing.

Or maybe as gamer generations get older, they want more tactical and other "slow" games again and once enough of those people are ready to invest money into those type of games, they'll make them again.

Unfortunately you can't expect big budget productions for this type of game happening nowadays. Until my theoretical scenario becomes reality, I hope we see at least a few titles of this kind coming out of the indie game scene.

For now I have to resort to playing old games and do found myself doing it more often recently (started playing SimFarm a few days ago). Jagged Alliance 2 will also always be great and probably unsurpassed!

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bibamatt

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#9  Edited By bibamatt

These types of games might be overlooked by the big studios, but they'll certainly be upheld by the 'indie' developers (who are probably a similar size to the original development teams!).

As mentioned, check out Frozen Synapse. It's great and almost exactly what you're asking for. Also, Advance Wars.

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CptBedlam

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#10  Edited By CptBedlam

@Akyho said:

Syndicate I was a fan of Syndicate wars.

Too bad. Syndicate Wars was already a big step down from the original Syndicate (in my opinion).

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capt_ventris

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#11  Edited By capt_ventris

The above post reminded me why I like Paradox Interactive so much.

They make the games I want to play.

It is a shame that EA felt it needed to turn Syndicate into another FPS in order for it to move but they own it so nothing can do there (well except not buy it ).

There is a market for the type of game Syndicate was, but I don't just want a HD version of that game from then.

I want to see what a Syndicate made in this era would be, a better AI, UI a global multiplayer mode, voice command, user generated mission and so many more wonderful things that have become part of modern gaming.

Oh well at least Paradox is listening.

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TheSouthernDandy

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#12  Edited By TheSouthernDandy

Its all about what sells and slow paced tactical games like the original syndicate and xcom aren't gonna bring in high numbers. It sucks but with larger budget games being the risk that they are, we're kinda stuck with it. At this point I just hope the game they do make is good.

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Chummy8

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#13  Edited By Chummy8

On the other hand, I'm kinda digging the gameplay of Dark Souls.

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astonish

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#14  Edited By astonish

I think it is just a cycle thing. Though they may never be the AAA games, someone will make a game in the spirit of the original games. The barrier to entry on game development has never been lower. Even mods/levels of stuff from games often end up as lower budget titles of decent quality. Just wait it out

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zidd

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#15  Edited By zidd

@jonc151: Rainbow Six could play itself if you did your planning right. That was the beauty of those classic RS games. The franchise a shadow of its former self as far as pure tactical gameplay goes.

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joejaen

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#16  Edited By joejaen

@CptBedlam: I dunno if I agree with that. It was pretty different, yes, but I still found it to be a great game.

Also, Jagged Alliance 2 - AWESOME!

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capt_ventris

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#17  Edited By capt_ventris
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Chummy8

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#18  Edited By Chummy8

@Zidd: Oh yeah, the first Rainbow six was awesome. I spent so much more time planning the assault rather than the actual shooting. Plus, the firefights were realistic. A couple of shots and you were dead. You really had to have everything planned down to the last detail to survive.

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#19  Edited By joejaen

@TheSouthernDandy: So why make it such a large budget game? You could make an awesome isometric Syndicate game on a A or even perhaps a B budget. I don't understand why every game now needs to cost as much as a summer blockbuster film.

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TheSouthernDandy

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#20  Edited By TheSouthernDandy
@JoeJaen

@TheSouthernDandy: So why make it such a large budget game? You could make an awesome isometric Syndicate game on a A or even perhaps a B budget. I don't understand why every game now needs to cost as much as a summer blockbuster film.

Cause as bassackwards as it seems, there is brand recognition with that name and a built in audience. It seems crazy cause that audience was a fan of something totally different but a known quantity has a better chance then a new IP. I agree with your point about budgets but it seems like the middle ground is disappearing. Stuff that sells is either a small budget title that catches peoples attention ala Bastion or Limbo or AAA stuff.
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Little_Socrates

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#21  Edited By Little_Socrates

Were X-COM, Syndicate, and the like ever really made by "big studios" to begin with? I mean, look at Tropico, Dawn of War, Devil Survivor, Frozen Synapse, and Archon. There are totally weird and thoughtful games being made (even in the strategy genre!) but making a slow=paced triple-A strategy game is competing directly with Civilization and StarCraft, and ultimately they won't sell much more than Devil Survivor on the DS.

These games still get made, and by the same number of people they used to be made by. No, they're not 400-person studios, and these old names are getting bought by EA and being turned into large-scale first-person shooters. But the games are still being made, and still being released, and still being played. Don't despair just because the name of something you enjoy is getting misused. Just remember there were only two Star Wars movies.

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Vinny_Says

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#22  Edited By Vinny_Says

The don't make those kind of games because people don't want to play those kind of games.

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Vodun

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#23  Edited By Vodun
@rebgav Don't come here with your reason, this thread is about self righteous whining about an imagined loss of class and intelligence in our favored medium.
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Grumbel

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#24  Edited By Grumbel

I don't really mind that XCom and Syndicate won't play like the originals, those are after all 15-20 years old and as nice as those have been, I don't want somebody going along, clone the gameplay and slap a new coat of paint on them. If I want something that plays exactly like the originals, I can always play the originals (wouldn't mind a remake with polished interface for $15). What I have a problem with is that both of those new games look like every other random FPS shooter. It's like developers have forgotten that there once up on a time there was creativity and that not every game had to be derived from the tired old shooter formula with some minor variations thrown in.
 
The thing for example that I loved about XCom wasn't that it was a slow ass round based game, but that it simulated a whole large scale conflict with an alien race in a dynamic non-linear fashion. It had a great sense of exploration and discovery and events such as intercepting and UFO and then going down with a ground troop investigating the crash side just don't happen in modern linear shooters, which always look you into a specific character instead of giving you a play of every part in the conflict. It is those ideas behind the games that I would like to see expanded up on, not just their round based nature. For the ground combat I think something like Full Spectrum Warriors would make a great fit, its a kind-of realtime environment, but still keeps everything tactical or maybe something like Valkyria Chronicles. But it's really the scope of the conflict and having multiple modes of play that made the thing interesting for me.
 
Equally the thing that made Syndicate interesting was again its scope and dynamics, having whole interactive cities to go around in was great, including taxis, trains and all that stuff. In some ways one could call it a proto-GTA, just from a completely different perspective. Having a group of four, instead of just a single guy was of course equally important and allowed some nice strategies and tactics. And while the new trailer looked interesting, it didn't really show any of those, it all looked like another corridor shooter with no real sense of scale.
 
Anyway, in the end the thing that bothers me the most is simply that far to many games these days tend to always start from the shooter formula, instead of trying to create something fresh. Say what you want about gaming 20 years ago, but it was much harder to put games into fixed genres back then, as a lot of games crossed borders or combined parts of multiple genres into one game. That's what I miss most. 
 

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CounterShock

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#25  Edited By CounterShock

I feel like some indie PC developer is totally going to make new versions of XCOM and Syndicate, like how Torchlight is an analogue for Diablo.

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deactivated-6281db536cb1d

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I don't think I'd want some of those games back. Peeling back the nostalgia shaders, you often find most games play janky, are poorly tested, are horribly unbalanced in both difficulty and gameplay experiences, are repetitive, and just generally obtuse.

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Dagbiker

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#27  Edited By Dagbiker

Viva Pinata, Creatures

I like games were strange and unique creatures rely on me, and i have no clue what i am doing. i also like exploring worlds, and adventure games.

the i discovered the creatures games one late night at the Best Buy some time in the early 1990's and loved them right until the bitter sweet end. the viva pinata games looked like a modern compromise, a compromise that i could be happy with. but alas it was not to be.