What would you expec to see, and what would you hope to see in the new Mass Effect?

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Hyuzen

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#1  Edited By Hyuzen

Vinny's hope/idea for a Mass Effect in the latest Beastcast as being focused on a single system with non-galaxy-ending stakes sounds interesting to me, and I think makes sense regardless of which ending from ME3 they pick. I agree that the Mass Effect world is interesting enough that you could make a game set in a single location, like Omega or the Citadel, or a solar system and still have a lot going on.

But Vinny's idea also doesn't sound realistic at all. I feel like EA isn't going to greenlight a new game in the series known for traveling across the galaxy that would appear at first glance to have a much more limited scope.

Likewise seeing what presumably is Liara in that trailer had me thinking for a time that maybe she could be the main character. But then I realized that Bioware wouldn't make a Mass Effect game where you couldn't create your own character. While I personally don't think that's a requirement, and it would be cool to play as Liara a couple hundred years in the future, I also recognize it's not gonna happen.

So trying to think more realistically it would be great if you could pick different races as your main character, and not just be a human. Let me choose from Human, Asari, Turian, Quarian, Salarian, Drell, or Geth(?)! That's a lot of duplicate dialogue to record so maybe restrict to just the first 3 or 4, but more variety in who you can play as is the thing that seems both doable and something I'd hope they do.

What are your hopes and more realistic expectations for the new game?

-Edit: SMH this guy said 'expec'

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MezZa

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#2  Edited By MezZa

I'm really not sure. I like the thought of a more localized situation and a smaller scale mystery thing to focus on. But I also don't mind if they go for a bombastic "oh shit time to save the galaxy" again. Execution is more important to me so as long as they execute well I don't mind what scale we're looking at.

Main thing I didn't like about Andromeda was dropping almost everything interesting about the setting to try to reboot it but largely do nothing with it in the end. Being back in the milky way hopefully means we'll get to see more of the political climate and status of the races as they are now.

It'd be really cool if they did s dragon age style of create a character. I just hope the character creator is more robust than the old ones. Still struggle to make a decent looking character that isn't the default Shepard.

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bigsocrates

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I have zero expectations. Bioware isn't Bioware anymore, the last Mass Effect was bad, and EA doesn't make big budget single player games anymore. Outside of Fallen Order (which was admittedly a good game) the last time they made a major single player game was arguably Mirror's Edge: Catalyst, and that was bad. You might be able to count some of the Battlefield/Titanfall/Battlefront games if you want, but those are more multiplayer focused affairs.

In terms of what I'd want...honestly it's just some kind of focused vision. I would be totally up for a Mass Effect that took place in a single location. I would probably love it! Honestly the idea that you have to go to multiple systems is kind of silly because obviously game world size is what matters, not nominal size. Mass Effect systems tend to be small anyway so they could have a larger game take place on a single planet or in a single solar system. There's this weird idea in sci-fi that individual planets all have to have the same biome but that's preposterous because every biome we know about exists on one planet. Earth.

I would also be fine with flying around the galaxy again. Give us a ship that that can warp on its own. Or heck, set the whole game on a generation ship going off to a new galaxy. That would be cool.

I just want good AARPG mechanics, a focused story, a strong setting, and lots of cool aliens and character relationships. Look at how many ways stories are being told in the Star Wars universe right now. There are big space epics, small focused character stories, every type of story you can imagine. Mass Effect is just as if not more expansive and fascinating as a universe. I'm up for anything, it's all about the execution.

Even people who are like "I don't want to play as Shep again, his/her story is over" I guarantee there are ways to bring that character back that would work fine. Would I prefer that? No. But I could get on board.

The problem is that I don't see EA or Bioware as really capable of making a great game in the series at this point. Jeff basically said he disliked Mass Effect 3 not for the ending but for the way it didn't care about the series' earlier storytelling and felt rushed out the door (because it was.) That mentality has only gotten worse at EA over the years, and the important staff have all left Bioware. You might say "but why even bother bringing back Mass Effect if you're not going to do it justice" and I'd answer "look at Anthem." Heck, look at the Battlefront series.

Fallen Order gives me a little bit of hope, but Respawn is clearly EA's A-team right now and Bioware is...not.

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development

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A frank apology about the direction the series started taking after the EA acquisition. We're talking wants, not expectations, right?

What do I expect? Another mystery galaxy-ruining calamity. So, if that's what it's going to be, I just want them to hire better writers, and give them plenty of time.

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MrGreenMan

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Something more along the line of 1 and 2, but maybe not as big. At this point, we are so far off from this game seeing a release, I really not sure what I would even want honestly.

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BrunoTheThird

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#6  Edited By BrunoTheThird
  • Good performances.
  • Characters with actual motivations that drive them -- Wrex's genophage cure hopes, Tali striving for Quarian peace, Garrus' space super-cop ambitions, etc.
  • Fewer but multi-layered side quests that can unfold x number of ways, and don't amount to just hopping between NPCs to trigger the next waypoint. Let me fund a science facility that contacts me, claiming it can revive a dead crewmate, based on Lazarus project tech, only to find out that they return seemingly normal but the ship's doctor soon observes they are slowly deteriorating. It could become a game-long side quest to stabilize the neural and physical decay of this crewmate, who is becoming unreliable as the game progresses, having sleepwalking nightmares, not being able to control their biotics safely. They could start to resent being brought back, that could unfold several ways. It's not sci-fi genius, but it creates something else to care about that has a less predictable trajectory. Choosing to bring them on certain missions could be extremely risky despite having important relevance to it. That could be an interesting choice. Gimme something that makes me really think about potential or permanent repercussions.
  • Just let me romance who I want, please. I want to romance Tali as femshep, so just let me. Real life is not an 'everyone is bi' free-for-all, but this is RPG fiction, let me carve my version of the story please.
  • More biotic combos. Just let me incinerate a singularity to burn everyone trapped in it. Let two singularities meld to create a super one that pulls debris and shit off tha walls. Let me 'throw' a teammates poorly placed grenade into a cluster of baddies. Let me detonate a teammate's combat drone. Let me put a barrier on anyone I want and have them charge into the fray.
  • Bigger fish tank. This is the dealbreaker.
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Serryl

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As others have commented, I've always thought the Mass Effect setting was deep enough to support a variety of game types. The obvious comparison is Star Wars, where we've had big "save the galaxy" titles like KotoR and small "experiences" like Vader Immortal.

I think a linear, 15-20hr game that follows an established character would be a smart way to win back fans and serve as a bridge to their next big open-world RPG.

No character creation. Less planet hopping. Strong story.

That said, the teaser trailer is stirring in a way the suggests this is gonna be BIG, so I don't think my idea has good odds.

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doctordonkey

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I expect absolutely nothing. BioWare is not BioWare anymore in the same way Blizzard isn't Blizzard anymore. This is not the same team that made that original trilogy, and even then 3 was shaky in a lot of spots.

Considering their output in the last few years, there is zero reason to have any faith in BioWare at this point. They need a redemption arc to happen, Dragon Age has to be absolutely incredible for them to earn any faith from me.

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mellotronrules

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@serryl said:

I think a linear, 15-20hr game that follows an established character would be a smart way to win back fans and serve as a bridge to their next big open-world RPG.

No character creation. Less planet hopping. Strong story.

100%. they need to lose the concept of a 'shepard'- that is, an anodyne player avatar with no story of their own. give us a real character with real motivations.

and they need to scale the scope of the story all the way down- mass effect succeeds on its characters and world-building, not its propensity for spectacle.

that said, i don't expect either of these suggestions to taken.

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Junkerman

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#10  Edited By Junkerman

@mellotronrules: I'd argue pretty passionately that Shepard is one of the better blank slate protagonists we've seen outside of maybe the Jedi Exile in Sith-Lords so I'm not sure if we need to go with a Geralt style established protagonist... just make it a fun video game with a good story and meaningful choice.

Not that I would complain if they went that route.

I just want it to be good!

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ll_Exile_ll

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#11  Edited By ll_Exile_ll

Setting aside concerns about modern Bioware and whether they have any good games left in them, I have a few key thoughts about what I feel the next Mass Effect needs to do.

Before this trailer, the number one thing I would have said is that it needs to be in the Milky Way and needs to be set after Mass Effect 3, preferably quite a long time after. There is so much established lore, history, locations, and world building within the Milky Way that not utilizing it feels like ignoring what makes Mass Effect so interesting. While Andromeda had a lot of problems going far beyond just the setting, it was hamstrung from the start by being unable to utilize much about what makes the ME universe so great. Luckily, the trailer seems to clearly indicate that the upcoming game is both in the Milky Way and takes place after ME3. I don't think many people wanted a prequel, I certainly don't.

Another key for me is that Shepard is over and done with and not part of the story going forward. I see some people hoping the game takes place right after the specific ending in ME3 where Shepard appears to take a breath. That is just insanity, Shepard is done and trying utilize that character either as the protagonist or as a major factor in the narrative would just scream pathetic desperation on the part of the writers. Shepard's story is done, the franchise needs to move forward. Luckily, despite the N7 armor tease in the trailer, I really don't think this will be the case. Liara appears to have age lines on her face, and given she was super young for an Asari in the trilogy, this seems to imply the game is set quite a long after ME3, centuries most likely.

As for the narrative and structure of the game itself, I have some ideas about what I'd like to see. I am not quite onboard with the idea of a single system as the setting, but the general idea of a smaller scale story is definitely something I've wanted out of this series for quite a while. I am pretty sick of massive stakes in RPGs where the entire world/galaxy/universe etc. is at risk. I'd much rather a more personal and smaller scale story about a group of interesting characters. I don't think that means the game needs to take place in a small number of locations, because I feel travelling to different planets is part of the Mass Effect appeal. I would favor populated planets with a focus on narrative driven side content rather than huge empty plots of land on unsettled worlds. Which leads me to the next point.

No open world. The open world elements were bad in Andromeda, they were bad in ME1. Many put a premium on the concept of "exploration" and I just don't understand why. I would much rather go to a civilized planet with a bunch of characters to talk to and interesting stories to discover than to drive around on a 50 square km patch of land with nothing but wilderness and fetch quests. I would much prefer effort and resources go into developing compelling side quests driven by narrative than crafting huge open areas. I love Mass Effect because of the compelling characters, strong world building, and engaging storytelling, not for the ability to "explore" uninhabited planets.

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Efesell

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On the one hand it's not the Bioware of Legend but on the other hand.. is that bad? Could new people not make good games?

I have no expectations and no real real demands. Shoot for the moon and let's see what happens.

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wollywoo

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#13  Edited By wollywoo

I enjoyed the Mass Effect games, but they sometimes seemed like they were trying too hard to raise the stakes and make you feel like a badass. I like the world and the lore they've created and I'd like to see them do something more with it than the usual cliches.

I personally never liked the blank-slate type of protagonist. Shephard in particular was just SO bland. I'd like a strong central character who has a motivation beyond "I need to save the universe." Maybe someone who is more of a plucky hero type and not a badass military action hero.

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ll_Exile_ll

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#14  Edited By ll_Exile_ll

@efesell said:

On the one hand it's not the Bioware of Legend but on the other hand.. is that bad? Could new people not make good games?

I have no expectations and no real real demands. Shoot for the moon and let's see what happens.

I think this is a very good point. There seems to be big concern, especially within Bioware fandoms, about how long certain individuals working on current game have been with the company. As we've also seen in this thread, there is also the idea that because Bioware doesn't consist of all the same people that were there when the studio made KOTOR and ME1, that Bioware is dead.

Yes, the studio's recent output hasn't been great, but I think we've learned enough about the development of Andromeda and Anthem to understand how fraught and poorly managed those development cycles were. I don't think it necessarily speaks to the capability of the individuals working there to make quality games. Of course, unless the way the studio operates is addressed, issues are likely to continue. Hopefully, the public airing of these issues will lead to action to remedy the culture inside the studio.

To bring it back, the fact that there's a lot of new blood at Bioware does not inherently mean anything about the ability of those people to contribute to a quality product. Change is inevitable and new people are always joining established studios and the old guard all eventually leave. Everyone starts somewhere, new hires today could be respected industry veterans in 10 years. Obviously the studio needs to prove they can still make good games, but I think it's unfair to assume the new folks working hard to make great games can't possibly ever match what the developers in the past achieved.

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Ares42

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Haven't thought too much about it, but the first thing that popped into my head is that I think they should go back to focusing on the whole Spectre thing. Becoming a "Space Cop" was one of those pivotal moments that sold me on the first game, and they could easily make a more grounded story in that design space. Just make the game about travelling across the galaxy solving space crimes and exploring awesome space cities and landscapes etc.

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Efesell

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You know I’m not sure focusing on space cop with unlimited authority would be the play I’d shoot for at the moment.

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Ares42

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@efesell: I dunno, I feel like the protagonist in about half the "major" titles every year is some sort of warrior/soldier taking the law into their own hands and going on a mass murder spree for vengeance (or something like that), so it feels odd that it would be noticeably worse than what we're used to seeing.

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RoyalGhost

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A game that isn't a trashfire

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mellotronrules

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@mellotronrules: I'd argue pretty passionately that Shepard is one of the better blank slate protagonists we've seen outside of maybe the Jedi Exile in Sith-Lords so I'm not sure if we need to go with a Geralt style established protagonist... just make it a fun video game with a good story and meaningful choice.

Not that I would complain if they went that route.

I just want it to be good!

yeah that's a totally fair perspective- i've just realized personally i don't really care about player choice vis-a-vis plot anymore. i'm not sure it's possible to produce an ideal mass effect- that is, an incredibly complex matrix of choices and outcomes that pay off in a way that doesn't come down to red/green/blue or good/bad/neutral. the development investment- with production values as high as they are- seems too great a mountain to climb.

for my part- give me a carefully choregraphed and calculated story progression with deliberate character development- and the emotional payoff will be just as high if not higher- even if it involves a player character making choices that i necessarily wouldn't.

these days i'm looking for a good story more than a possibility space- a linear narrative has way more appeal than an open world. but that is in fact just my preference, so *shrug*.

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ll_Exile_ll

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@junkerman said:

@mellotronrules: I'd argue pretty passionately that Shepard is one of the better blank slate protagonists we've seen outside of maybe the Jedi Exile in Sith-Lords so I'm not sure if we need to go with a Geralt style established protagonist... just make it a fun video game with a good story and meaningful choice.

Not that I would complain if they went that route.

I just want it to be good!

yeah that's a totally fair perspective- i've just realized personally i don't really care about player choice vis-a-vis plot anymore. i'm not sure it's possible to produce an ideal mass effect- that is, an incredibly complex matrix of choices and outcomes that pay off in a way that doesn't come down to red/green/blue or good/bad/neutral. the development investment- with production values as high as they are- seems too great a mountain to climb.

for my part- give me a carefully choregraphed and calculated story progression with deliberate character development- and the emotional payoff will be just as high if not higher- even if it involves a player character making choices that i necessarily wouldn't.

these days i'm looking for a good story more than a possibility space- a linear narrative has way more appeal than an open world. but that is in fact just my preference, so *shrug*.

I'd argue that The Witcher 3 proved that decision making can be done in a big expansive RPG with actual payoff to the choices you make. The thing I think The Witcher 3 really nailed above other "choice driven" RPGs is the way it wielded unforeseen and unintended consequences. At several point in the story choices you made 10, 20, 30+ hours prior come back around and have an effect on the world and/or story in a way you couldn't have predicted. Personally, I feel that is the ideal form of choice and consequences.

Too many games feel the need to lay out exactly the choice you're making and what outcome it will have in the very moment. I like the idea of making choices while not really knowing what the outcome will be and just hoping for the best, and I feel the Witcher 3 has done that very well. I also really appreciated the way the ending you got was, in part, influenced by your response in conversations with a specific character throughout the course of the whole game. Some didn't like the somewhat obtuse nature of how that worked, or which options resulted in which outcome. Issues with the specifics aside, I really like the idea of an ending being determined by a taking into account your actions throughout the game, rather than choosing A, B, or C at the very end.

All that is to say, I think it is possible for choices to matter in a big expansive RPG. I think the key is to have a handful of choices that really have a big impact on the world, characters, and overall story, while peppering the game with a lot of minor choices that feel meaningful but don't have long lasting repercussions.

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Junkerman

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Mass Effect + Deadspace = Mass Effect 4, this would be my preference.

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mellotronrules

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#22  Edited By mellotronrules

@ll_exile_ll: what you're describing re: The Witcher 3: Wild Hunt does sound appealing (haven't gotten around to playing it yet). maybe that's the key- rework the concept of choice as it's appeared in Mass Effect previously in favor discrete 'paths' players can opt in or out of, whether consciously or not.

and while they're at it- they should lose the paragon/renegade system. the quicktime interrupts were neat/fun, but that system made every moral dilemma feel so binary and min/max-y that it feels antiquated now. maybe keep the interrupts but make them more neutral?

ultimately i just want good character writing. give me characters with depth and their own development (loyalty missions) and honestly that's a win for me. i would play a game as a volus stockbroker if the character motivations were interesting enough.

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NexivSelecaf

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Andromeda 2, but good.

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Whitestripes09

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Honestly I just want more of the Milky Way galaxy setting and well thought out characters. I really dig that established federation alien society and it's one of the reasons why I don't really like Andromeda. Exploration is a fun idea, but I don't think it's the best part about Mass Effect.

I think a post-Destroy choice Milky Way (judging by the Reaper corpse in the trailer, that seems like what they are going for) will bring a lot of questions. What does the galaxy look like without machines and AI? Liara as a main character would be fascinating because she would be one of the only people to remember life before the Reapers.

I can't really demand anything else than that than a return to its original setting, a compelling story, and well written characters. The characters and companions are key. It's why the original trilogy was so outstanding because there were so many likable and relatable characters. The worse thing they could do is make a whole cast of boring characters, which is pretty much what we got with Andromeda.