1 dead at university shooting, gunman tackled by students

  • 56 results
  • 1
  • 2
Avatar image for turambar
Turambar

8283

Forum Posts

114

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 2

#1  Edited By Turambar

Before arguments over gun control breaks out, let's take a moment and marvel at how absurdly fucking brave that student had to have been to take down and disarm a guy with a shotgun that just shot a bunch of people. You want a hero in this day and age? There he is.

[MOD EDIT: Copy/pasting a long news article is just as spammy as just dropping a link. Summarize the news to provide context and drive discussion. You can provide a link to the full story for those interested - http://seattletimes.com/html/localnews/2023778865_spushootingxml.html. As this already has generated some discussion, this thread will stay open for the time being.]

Avatar image for alistercat
alistercat

8531

Forum Posts

7626

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 2

User Lists: 27

Avatar image for fredchuckdave
Fredchuckdave

10824

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 2

#3  Edited By Fredchuckdave

Sounds like a champ, though ideally he'd have done it before they managed to kill anyone like this guy. As far as it goes it wouldn't be overly hard to sneak up on most of the crazies that do this sort of thing, people just don't have the balls to do it most of the time. The guy being a christian helps, makes you less scared of dying.

Avatar image for extomar
EXTomar

5047

Forum Posts

4

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#4  Edited By EXTomar

So you don't need open carry, stand your ground, and everyone heavily armed people to stop things like this? I've been lied too!

Avatar image for hunkulese
Hunkulese

4225

Forum Posts

310

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#5  Edited By Hunkulese

@fredchuckdave: It's not a videogame pal. It's petty much impossible to sneak up on someone without them noticing you, especially when they're expecting it. It had nothing to do with balls, purposely tying to get shot isn't going to help anyone.

Avatar image for iamnotbatman
IAmNotBatman

704

Forum Posts

43

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

Oh a school shooting in America again? It's a good thing it's as easy as it is to get hold of a gun over there, what would they do without all of those school shootings? It would be boring as fuck.

Avatar image for extomar
EXTomar

5047

Forum Posts

4

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#7  Edited By EXTomar

By writing "pretty much impossible" you mean "happens all of the time" because it turns out that the military has known and FBI statistics show it is easy to get to the drop on people when they start fighting. You know that whole "cover formation" thing is an important thing to drill into them for their safety instead of "give them something to do" or "look cool".

Avatar image for fredchuckdave
Fredchuckdave

10824

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 2

@hunkulese: Well you should be decrying this guy for his lack of courage or something then. Of course it's possible to sneak up on people; but ultimately if you can just get to closing distance (~10 yards) only a combat-trained person is going to be able to react in time. Most of the crazies aren't big imposing people so just getting there should be enough.

Avatar image for fear_the_booboo
Fear_the_Booboo

1228

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 3

Man how shitty it is that these things happen. Sure, crime and murder are going down and whatever but it still happens. Makes me sad all the time.

Avatar image for hunkulese
Hunkulese

4225

Forum Posts

310

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

@extomar said:

By writing "pretty much impossible" you mean "happens all of the time" because it turns out that the military has known and FBI statistics show it is easy to get to the drop on people when they start fighting. You know that whole "cover formation" thing is an important thing to drill into them for their safety instead of "give them something to do" or "look cool".

I know it's tough to imagine but there is a slight difference between the military working as a team to flank someone and random linguistics student. There is also a big difference between fighting and slaughtering. At the point he suggested sneaking up on him there's no one threatening him to take his attention away from his surroundings.

Avatar image for spraynardtatum
spraynardtatum

4384

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 1

User Lists: 1

#11  Edited By spraynardtatum

@fredchuckdave:

As far as it goes it wouldn't be overly hard to sneak up on most of the crazies that do this sort of thing, people just don't have the balls to do it most of the time.

No offense but that is a completely stupid thing to say. How the hell do you know?

Avatar image for hailinel
Hailinel

25785

Forum Posts

219681

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 10

User Lists: 28

@hunkulese: That SPU is a Christian college does not mean that all of its students are Christian.

Avatar image for unclebenny
UncleBenny

756

Forum Posts

80

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 6

#13  Edited By UncleBenny

Man, even as an apathetic gun enthusiast it's hard to argue that we don't need gun control. We are obviously not responsible enough to make sure this shit doesn't happen anymore.

But Kudos to that Jon Meis duder who had the wherewithal to take out this psychopath. Let us never mention his name. Psychopaths don't deserve to be recognized.

Avatar image for onarum
onarum

3212

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

... what is it with you north americans and shooting in schools? seriously...

Avatar image for fredchuckdave
Fredchuckdave

10824

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 2

@spraynardtatum: It's simple numbers, there's 500+ people around and there's 1 shooter. Unless you're absolutely terrified of the guy for other reasons. I mean if MCD went on a rampage then sure don't fuck with him, but some frail, pale dude with a gun is just not very intimidating. This is also an individualistic vs communal thing; our people are so self-centered that of course they're going to be scared shitless of dying. But there's no reason to be scared of dying because nigh everyone is completely and utterly meaningless. There's millions of people and say 0.01% of them are crazies but only 0.0001% are heroes without it being part of their job description.

Ecclesiastes 1:2 "Meaningless! Meaningless!" says the Teacher. "Utterly meaningless! Everything is meaningless."

Avatar image for unclebenny
UncleBenny

756

Forum Posts

80

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 6

@onarum said:

... what is it with you north americans and shooting in schools? seriously...

It's actually a recent legislation that was passed by our shadow government. People must die so that I can live. I FEED ON THE BLOOD OF THE YOUNG, FEED ME CHILDREN.

Avatar image for hunkulese
Hunkulese

4225

Forum Posts

310

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

@fredchuckdave: There's a big difference between charging someone reloading their weapon and trying to sneak up on someone with a loaded gun. Maybe this is the really detrimental effect video games have on people. They all think they're ninjas or special agents. How do you intend to get within you imaginary ideal 10 foot perimeter? Do you know how easy it is to scan your surroundings and don't you think that's exactly what they'd be doing? There's absolutely no way to sneak up on someone who is expecting to be snuck up on.

Avatar image for leejunfan83
leejunfan83

1241

Forum Posts

54

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 2

VIDEO GAMES!!!!!!!!!

Avatar image for hunkulese
Hunkulese

4225

Forum Posts

310

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

@hailinel said:

@hunkulese: That SPU is a Christian college does not mean that all of its students are Christian.

What does that have to do with anything?

Avatar image for hailinel
Hailinel

25785

Forum Posts

219681

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 10

User Lists: 28

@hunkulese: Sorry Meant to reply to Fredchuckdave. Responding from mobile is a pain.

Avatar image for hunkulese
Hunkulese

4225

Forum Posts

310

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

@spraynardtatum: It's simple numbers, there's 500+ people around and there's 1 shooter. Unless you're absolutely terrified of the guy for other reasons. I mean if MCD went on a rampage then sure don't fuck with him, but some frail, pale dude with a gun is just not very intimidating. This is also an individualistic vs communal thing; our people are so self-centered that of course they're going to be scared shitless of dying. But there's no reason to be scared of dying because nigh everyone is completely and utterly meaningless. There's millions of people and say 0.01% of them are crazies but only 0.0001% are heroes without it being part of their job description.

Ecclesiastes 1:2 "Meaningless! Meaningless!" says the Teacher. "Utterly meaningless! Everything is meaningless."

Now you're just coming off as a crazy person. Pick a side and stay there. You can't praise people for their heroics in saving lives and then say all lives are meaningless.

Avatar image for draugen
Draugen

1007

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 20

Ayup. That's pretty dang brave.

Avatar image for zolroyce
ZolRoyce

1589

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

I think my cynicism peek level has been achieved. The people are going to get upset for a while, some will make good points, most will want to use the tragedy to further their own agendas. The politicians will only use it to further their agendas or release a message about how terrible it all is and how sorry they are but wont actually do anything about it.
The media will froth at the mouths and trip over each other to achieve the best "story" they can get out of it which will involve the saddest/most gruesome image they can muster up.
Everyone will move on, then it will happen again and rinse and repeat and rinse and repeat and rinse and repeat and nothing will change and no one will do anything meaningful and psychos will be psychos and people will be people and politicians will be politicians and the media will be the media and fuck it all.

Anyone wanna build a secret underwater city with me? We could just live there instead, away from everyone, I don't foresee anything going wrong with it at all.

Avatar image for johncallahan
johncallahan

918

Forum Posts

1852

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 1

User Lists: 1

You're right. Putting all the gun control stuff aside, that kid is a fucking hero. I've run through the scenario of a gunman showing up at my school, and always like to think I'd be willing to try and stop the guy before people get hurt. But god damn, in all honesty the thought terrifies me, don't know if I'd be able to. Kudos to that kid, for real.

On the issue of yet another shooting. Come on people, it almost feels rote at this point to continue saying we need to do something about gun control here in the US. I mean christ, I come from a family that loves guns. My dad's a collector, has been since he was a kid. I have inherited that love of guns. Guns are awesome, they can be a lot of fun. However THEY'RE ALSO DEADLY! The fact that it is sooo easy to get guns in this country so easy to get fully automatic ones, that... that's just fucked up. The link that IAmNotBatman posted is horrifying. The fact that I see yet another shooting and no longer reel in horror and sadness is horrifying. The fact that this has become so common here in the states is horrifying. Looking at other countries who have regulated guns better, and have had so few incidents. Like just look at it man, numbers don't lie.

Avatar image for leebmx
leebmx

2346

Forum Posts

61

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 4

Man, even as an apathetic gun enthusiast it's hard to argue that we don't need gun control. We are obviously not responsible enough to make sure this shit doesn't happen anymore.

That's the kind of thing I don't understand about guns in America. I get that as a nation you might want to decide that people should have access to guns, but surely you don't get to have access to something dangerous until you have proved you are responsible enough to handle it.

These shootings are not just caused by access to guns, but until US society has solved the problems that make people want to mow their class/workmates down it might be a good idea to make them harder to obtain, or at least reduce the power of those on the market.

But who am I kidding, the whole problem is so wound up in horrible culture wars politics that it will never be solved, there will just be more and more grieving families, injured victims, and paranoid classrooms.

Avatar image for spraynardtatum
spraynardtatum

4384

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 1

User Lists: 1

@spraynardtatum: It's simple numbers, there's 500+ people around and there's 1 shooter. Unless you're absolutely terrified of the guy for other reasons. I mean if MCD went on a rampage then sure don't fuck with him, but some frail, pale dude with a gun is just not very intimidating. This is also an individualistic vs communal thing; our people are so self-centered that of course they're going to be scared shitless of dying. But there's no reason to be scared of dying because nigh everyone is completely and utterly meaningless. There's millions of people and say 0.01% of them are crazies but only 0.0001% are heroes without it being part of their job description.

Ecclesiastes 1:2 "Meaningless! Meaningless!" says the Teacher. "Utterly meaningless! Everything is meaningless."

It's not simple numbers. You're trying to put order to something extremely chaotic.

Avatar image for frymillstrum
frymillstrum

1347

Forum Posts

1

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 1

It's those damn videogames man...

lol

Avatar image for zevvion
Zevvion

5965

Forum Posts

1240

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 6

User Lists: 2

@fredchuckdave You sound like the kind of guy that is all talk. Specifically because he has no idea what he is talking about. I've had a gun aimed at me before. Let me tell you that shit is a lot scarier than you can imagine it would be. First, if you try to disarm someone you can most certainly die no matter how trained you are. Second, fear is absolutely a thing. You talking 'if you're not terrified'. You're going to be. There is no point in trying to dismiss that.

But yes, of course it is possible to do. I bet not by most people though. Everyone tends to think actually doing things in conflict is a lot easier than it actually is.

Avatar image for s-a-n-jr
s-a-n-JR

3256

Forum Posts

2993

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 1

User Lists: 15

#29  Edited By s-a-n-JR

Fucking hell.

The man who tackled him, Jon Meis, is a hero in the truest sense of the word.

Avatar image for justin258
Justin258

16684

Forum Posts

26

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 11

User Lists: 8

#30  Edited By Justin258

@fredchuckdave said:

some frail, pale dude with a gun is just not very intimidating.

A person's strength and complexion has nothing to do with the power of the gun they're holding.

I am happy to hear about someone being a hero. Being able to keep yourself calm enough to realize that you've got an opportunity to wrestle a killer down does show a lot of bravery.

Avatar image for obcdexter
obcdexter

999

Forum Posts

3

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 17

#31 obcdexter  Online

@sanj said:

Fucking hell.

The man who tackled him, Jon Meis, is a hero in the truest sense of the word.

Yep, it's easy to imagine how you'd be all heroic in a situation like this; but acting accordingly when it actually happens? I bet I'd be scared shitless. And I bet he was, too. He somehow managed to keep his calm and pulled a smart maneuver during maybe the only opening he had. Ballsy, clever, heroic - just impressive. Who knows what the headlines would read had it not been for Meis? 10, 20, 30 dead?

Avatar image for bmccann42
bmccann42

549

Forum Posts

11

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#32  Edited By bmccann42

@believer258: Most definitely agree with that, those bullets do the same damage regardless of who is holding the gun. Read any story, any week where some 4 year old shoots another 4 year old.

That kid is some kind of brave, pepper sprayed and detained a nut with a gun. I hope he never has to buy another beer on that campus again.

Avatar image for deactivated-60dda8699e35a
deactivated-60dda8699e35a

1807

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

It makes me so unbelievably happy that he was captured alive, instead of killing himself. It's sad that he still managed to kill someone.

I can't wait for the NRA's excuse for this one.

Avatar image for chocobodude3
Chocobodude3

1338

Forum Posts

27

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 7

User Lists: 18

@sanj said:

Fucking hell.

The man who tackled him, Jon Meis, is a hero in the truest sense of the word.

Avatar image for spraynardtatum
spraynardtatum

4384

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 1

User Lists: 1

Round of applause for Jon Meis, we have no idea how many lives he saved. My thoughts go out to the family of the wounded and killed.

Avatar image for epicsteve
EpicSteve

6908

Forum Posts

13016

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 89

User Lists: 11

#36  Edited By EpicSteve

What does it say about this whole gun thing that reading about mass shootings (we can define mass shootings later, but you know what I mean) just isn't interesting anymore? That's how bad it has gotten.

Avatar image for deactivated-60dda8699e35a
deactivated-60dda8699e35a

1807

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

@leebmx said:

@unclebenny said:

Man, even as an apathetic gun enthusiast it's hard to argue that we don't need gun control. We are obviously not responsible enough to make sure this shit doesn't happen anymore.

That's the kind of thing I don't understand about guns in America. I get that as a nation you might want to decide that people should have access to guns, but surely you don't get to have access to something dangerous until you have proved you are responsible enough to handle it.

These shootings are not just caused by access to guns, but until US society has solved the problems that make people want to mow their class/workmates down it might be a good idea to make them harder to obtain, or at least reduce the power of those on the market.

But who am I kidding, the whole problem is so wound up in horrible culture wars politics that it will never be solved, there will just be more and more grieving families, injured victims, and paranoid classrooms.

A few things to note:

There's hardly any regulations on guns because of briber - Oh, I'm sorry, let me use the 'proper' term - lobbyist. The NRA has a lot of money, and due to that they can shut down a lot of laws and regulations that are attempted to pass after every single one of these stupid shootings.

Thing is, shootings in general have been going down steadily over the years, it's only due to the huge media exposure that it seems like it's not improving at all.

I think a huge reason people do shit like this is BECAUSE of the huge media exposure they get. They want people to see what they've done, and they want people to feel their wrath. If we NEVER named these kids, threw them into an ocean somewhere, and never talked about them again, I bet this wouldn't happen as often.

Avatar image for spraynardtatum
spraynardtatum

4384

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 1

User Lists: 1

#38  Edited By spraynardtatum

What does it say about this whole gun thing that reading about mass shootings (we can define mass shootings later, but you know what I mean) just isn't interesting anymore? That's how bad it has gotten.

These kinds of tragedies are emotionally draining and numbing.

Avatar image for detectivespecial
DetectiveSpecial

472

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 1

#39  Edited By DetectiveSpecial

@fredchuckdave said:

@hunkulese: Well you should be decrying this guy for his lack of courage or something then. Of course it's possible to sneak up on people; but ultimately if you can just get to closing distance (~10 yards) only a combat-trained person is going to be able to react in time. Most of the crazies aren't big imposing people so just getting there should be enough.

10 yards is not closing distance. Closing distance scales with the weapon.

People who undergo training for this situation spend years learning how to properly move in on an armed subject, and the majority of that time is spent dealing with the psychological aspects of it. Even then, that maneuver is considered a last resort. The person in Seattle did (I assume with no training) what LEOs are trained to do - wait for a reload and incapacitate from beyond closing distance before moving in.

I truly hope the kid who stopped this gets all the recognition in the world. Also, I enjoy the absurdity of anyone being able to purchase a firearm, while civilians can't purchase chemical based sprays. Pepper spray is hit or miss.

Avatar image for mike
mike

18011

Forum Posts

23067

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: -1

User Lists: 6

He's got tackling armed gunmen down, but this kid isn't prepared to defend himself from the hordes of college girls who will be wanting to tackle him...for a LONG time.

Avatar image for rachelepithet
rachelepithet

1646

Forum Posts

1374

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 3

User Lists: 11

How many PS3s will my taxes buy him in prison?

Avatar image for nasp
nasp

652

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

@zolroyce said:

I think my cynicism peek level has been achieved. The people are going to get upset for a while, some will make good points, most will want to use the tragedy to further their own agendas. The politicians will only use it to further their agendas or release a message about how terrible it all is and how sorry they are but wont actually do anything about it.

The media will froth at the mouths and trip over each other to achieve the best "story" they can get out of it which will involve the saddest/most gruesome image they can muster up.

Everyone will move on, then it will happen again and rinse and repeat and rinse and repeat and rinse and repeat and nothing will change and no one will do anything meaningful and psychos will be psychos and people will be people and politicians will be politicians and the media will be the media and fuck it all.

Anyone wanna build a secret underwater city with me? We could just live there instead, away from everyone, I don't foresee anything going wrong with it at all.

i hate to say it but all of this is true.the sad part is this has happened so many times im not shocked anymore.now when i see another shooting report im thinking"oh another shooting how surprising"and go do something else.thats how bad its gotten.whats worse is like you say nothing will change.it will all keep happening again and again until everyone is so numb to it happening that we dont care anymore.i hope it doesnt get to that point but its already starting to get there.

Avatar image for gaspower
GaspoweR

4904

Forum Posts

272

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 1

User Lists: 2

@mb said:

He's got tackling armed gunmen down, but this kid isn't prepared to defend himself from the hordes of college girls who will be wanting to tackle him...for a LONG time.

Eh, just thinking about IRL makes it sound more disturbing.

Maybe I've been watching too many fucked up stuff. :/

Avatar image for pr1mus
pr1mus

4158

Forum Posts

1018

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 4

User Lists: 4

What does it say about this whole gun thing that reading about mass shootings (we can define mass shootings later, but you know what I mean) just isn't interesting anymore? That's how bad it has gotten.

The way the media cover these events is a big part of that. I read the thread title and just shrugged because at the same time in New Brunswick we had a crazed gunman on the loose who killed 3 cops... These things being covered as if this was entertainment for years will do that.

Avatar image for pweidman
pweidman

2891

Forum Posts

15

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 4

These stories seem to be almost daily these days. How fucking much will it take for fundamental gun law changes to be made is my redundant question.

On another note, god bless that brave young man who pepper sprayed him and tackled him. I bet he says he was just acting on instinct trying to help the innocents around. Too bad someone still died. Thoughts and prayers to the family.

Avatar image for kcin
kcin

1145

Forum Posts

9

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

This thread makes me realize how outdated the term "armchair expert" is. It should be permanently changed to desk chair expert.

Avatar image for hollitz
hollitz

2398

Forum Posts

5

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 1

User Lists: 12

@random45 said:

I think a huge reason people do shit like this is BECAUSE of the huge media exposure they get. They want people to see what they've done, and they want people to feel their wrath. If we NEVER named these kids, threw them into an ocean somewhere, and never talked about them again, I bet this wouldn't happen as often.

Yeah, I don't know. Seems like most gunmen kill themselves afterward. Not really sure that media exposure is their goal. But it is an easy way to pass the buck.

Avatar image for kcin
kcin

1145

Forum Posts

9

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#48  Edited By kcin

@hollitz: You're mistaken for thinking fame in life is the only type of fame to be had. Several of these killers expect to live on after death, on the tongues of news reporters and in the words of the printed page. Elliot Roger explicitly intended to be examined, for his motivations to be ultimately understood. Christopher Dorner did, as well. These were acts of intention and purpose in the minds of those who committed them. And look at that: I remembered both of their names on my own. It worked.

Avatar image for video_game_king
Video_Game_King

36563

Forum Posts

59080

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 54

User Lists: 14

@random45 said:

I think a huge reason people do shit like this is BECAUSE of the huge media exposure they get. They want people to see what they've done, and they want people to feel their wrath.

This has to be fourth fucking time I've referenced this, but:

  • There is not a “profile” of a school shooter-instead the students who carried out the attacks differed from one another in numerous ways.

  • 24% motivated by desire for attention or recognition.

Avatar image for jazz_lafayette
Jazz_Lafayette

3897

Forum Posts

844

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 14

#50  Edited By Jazz_Lafayette

@kcin: It's worth remembering they were also mentally ill murderers. Not to say it isn't worth debating, but I don't know if letting the stated objective of mentally ill murderers determine the course of public discussion is the most reasonable thing to do.