Introducing others to hard(er)core games

I've been really trying to get my girlfriend into gaming (that's not the Sims). We played Scott Pilgrim for a little while, and that was fun. I even got her into Fable II. I tried getting her into Saint's Row II, but she couldn't handle the camera. I have just recently gotten her to start playing Knights of the Old Republic II on my 360. Good news: she is really getting sucked into it. Bad news: I cannot stand to watch her play.

That's a big thing I've started to notice about non-gamers. If they play Tetris, or the Sims, or something similar, they don't have to use what I have started to call 'Gamer Logic'. However, when a non-gamer goes to play something a little more hardcore, they exhibit a completely different brand of problem solving that I am used to. I have been playing games since I can remember (I've been a hardcore gamer since '99), so if I have to solve a problem by, say, sticking a pulley in a rubber chicken, I just slap my forehead because I didn't think of it sooner. My girlfriend doesn't work like that, and neither do people that haven't been ingrained by this. When my girlfriend played Saint's Row II, she fell off the roof of the prison and died within minutes of starting because trying to manipulate the camera with the right stick was an inconvenient and alien idea.

Things like directing the camera, navigating menus, and solving nontraditional puzzles are things that I've been doing for years, and just seeing someone struggling to do any of this has got to be one of the most frustrating things I have ever. I want to help my girlfriend out, but me hovering over her just makes things more frustrating for her. So, I sit back and try to prevent myself from developing an ulcer. In the meantime, she is picking it up like a pro.

Has anyone else run into this?

I've been really trying to get my girlfriend into gaming (that's not the Sims). We played Scott Pilgrim for a little while, and that was fun. I even got her into Fable II. I tried getting her into Saint's Row II, but she couldn't handle the camera. I have just recently gotten her to start playing Knights of the Old Republic II on my 360. Good news: she is really getting sucked into it. Bad news: I cannot stand to watch her play.

That's a big thing I've started to notice about non-gamers. If they play Tetris, or the Sims, or something similar, they don't have to use what I have started to call 'Gamer Logic'. However, when a non-gamer goes to play something a little more hardcore, they exhibit a completely different brand of problem solving that I am used to. I have been playing games since I can remember (I've been a hardcore gamer since '99), so if I have to solve a problem by, say, sticking a pulley in a rubber chicken, I just slap my forehead because I didn't think of it sooner. My girlfriend doesn't work like that, and neither do people that haven't been ingrained by this. When my girlfriend played Saint's Row II, she fell off the roof of the prison and died within minutes of starting because trying to manipulate the camera with the right stick was an inconvenient and alien idea.

Things like directing the camera, navigating menus, and solving nontraditional puzzles are things that I've been doing for years, and just seeing someone struggling to do any of this has got to be one of the most frustrating things I have ever. I want to help my girlfriend out, but me hovering over her just makes things more frustrating for her. So, I sit back and try to prevent myself from developing an ulcer. In the meantime, she is picking it up like a pro.

Has anyone else run into this?

I'm very patient with these cases, so that doesn't bother me. That's why i teached my six year old sister to play Dark Souls. The first time she fought a boss, she got all Kratos on that shit. She died. So i needed to explain the more complex parts of the fighting, and well, that became her GOTY 2011. 
My girlfriend started playing Saints Row: The Third, and she loved that. 
Maybe you just need patience.

Back seat driving is the surest way to turn anyone off of anything. The best thing you can do is to be doing something else in the same room while she's playing. If you have a laptop, be on that or something similar. That way, you are available to help if she asks for it, but when she doesn't your attention is else where, which lessens the frustration on both of you.

The important thing to bear in mind with new gamers is that the entry point these days is actually very high. The first controller I used was for one of these (yeah, yeah I'm old). Put an Xbox 360 controller in my hand back then and I wouldn't have known what to do with it. I've since had twenty-five years to get using a gaming controller burned into my muscle memory so it's not something I consciously think about. When you've never played games before, every button press and stick movement is a conscious effort.

I second what SoldierG654342 says. Leave her to find her own way. That she's even trying to do something she's unfamiliar with for you suggests that this is something she wants to do with you and that's great. If she feels you're putting pressure on her, or made to feel stupid (whether you're aware that you're doing it or not), then she might be put off completely.

hardcore gamer

Ugh

@cotubbs said:

I've been really trying to get my girlfriend into gaming (that's not the Sims). We played Scott Pilgrim for a little while, and that was fun. I even got her into Fable II. I tried getting her into Saint's Row II, but she couldn't handle the camera. I have just recently gotten her to start playing Knights of the Old Republic II on my 360. Good news: she is really getting sucked into it. Bad news: I cannot stand to watch her play.

That's a big thing I've started to notice about non-gamers. If they play Tetris, or the Sims, or something similar, they don't have to use what I have started to call 'Gamer Logic'. However, when a non-gamer goes to play something a little more hardcore, they exhibit a completely different brand of problem solving that I am used to. I have been playing games since I can remember (I've been a hardcore gamer since '99), so if I have to solve a problem by, say, sticking a pulley in a rubber chicken, I just slap my forehead because I didn't think of it sooner. My girlfriend doesn't work like that, and neither do people that haven't been ingrained by this. When my girlfriend played Saint's Row II, she fell off the roof of the prison and died within minutes of starting because trying to manipulate the camera with the right stick was an inconvenient and alien idea.

Things like directing the camera, navigating menus, and solving nontraditional puzzles are things that I've been doing for years, and just seeing someone struggling to do any of this has got to be one of the most frustrating things I have ever. I want to help my girlfriend out, but me hovering over her just makes things more frustrating for her. So, I sit back and try to prevent myself from developing an ulcer. In the meantime, she is picking it up like a pro.

Has anyone else run into this?

Just let her do her thing. I doubt any of use were great at new styles of games right away. I remember having a hard time working the camera in Mario 64 because I had never played a game where I had to do that. She'll get it with time. You've touched on this but if you bug her about what she's doing and everything else she'll just get bugged at you. The biggest reason she's playing these games is probably to be around you. So if you're bugging her the whole reason why she's playing the game, i.e. 'you', will be gone.

By the way, I know you didn't mean it this way but the whole Gamer Logic thing, perpetuated further by your proclamation of being a 'hardcore gamer', sounds really shitty and pretentious. Just thought you should know.

Yeah well over the years of playing games, you just sort of become intuitive with them because you can put yourself in the mind of the designer and have knowledge of the inner workings of game-logic. You're used to the fact that if you see a locked door, you instantly know there's either a key to pickup, or a cutscene or scripted event to trigger. Even by looking at the detail of the textures or the design of the door itself you'll mostly be able to tell whether you could open it at all.

Regular people don't have that developed, so if they see any door of any kind, real life logic states that it can somehow be opened, when it might just be background decoration, but they're not trained to tell the difference. That's why you need to be patient, and yeah as someone mentioned earlier, just surf the web or something while sitting on the couch with her, and offer help when asked.

I recently let me girlfriend have a quick go on Skyrim when we were waiting to go out. I encountered the same thing as you, then entire control scheme was alien to her and she had difficulty controlling the camera, but she had fun trying to kill General Tullius and the rest of the Imperial Legion haha! However, she has a DS and games with a simpler control scheme, one being Mario Kart DS, she loves and  can kick my ass on it almost every time! I don't think I'll ever be able to get my girlfriend to play the more 'hardcore' games out there but I'm fine with that. I need to sharpen up my Mario Kart skills though haha!

@Hargreaves93 said:

I recently let me girlfriend have a quick go on Skyrim when we were waiting to go out. I encountered the same thing as you, then entire control scheme was alien to her and she had difficulty controlling the camera, but she had fun trying to kill General Tullius and the rest of the Imperial Legion haha! However, she has a DS and games with a simpler control scheme, one being Mario Kart DS, she loves and can kick my ass on it almost every time! I don't think I'll ever be able to get my girlfriend to play the more 'hardcore' games out there but I'm fine with that. I need to sharpen up my Mario Kart skills though haha!

You Let Her play Skyrim huh? Do you "let her" out of the house too?

...fucking men.

@Hargreaves93 said:

I recently let me girlfriend have a quick go on Skyrim when we were waiting to go out. I encountered the same thing as you, then entire control scheme was alien to her and she had difficulty controlling the camera, but she had fun trying to kill General Tullius and the rest of the Imperial Legion haha! However, she has a DS and games with a simpler control scheme, one being Mario Kart DS, she loves and can kick my ass on it almost every time! I don't think I'll ever be able to get my girlfriend to play the more 'hardcore' games out there but I'm fine with that. I need to sharpen up my Mario Kart skills though haha!

You Let Her play Skyrim huh? Do you "let her" out of the house too?

...fucking men.

KOTOR 2? KOTOR 1 is better, dude.

The last time I tried to get some one who wasn't a gamer to play a hard core game was 1990 with super mario. I soon realized that my mom had no intrest in playing and if she wanted to play she would invest the time.

Yeah, don't teach her, just let her discover the things on her own. It's going to take long but that's the best way for her to learn the mechanics of modern gaming. Try to be more patient and show her different genres.

My girlfriend just started playing KOTOR on PC. She's an ace at Street Fighter II & Civ. but never played a 3rd person shooter or FPS. She's a therapist so she tends to love the dialog sequences but lets me help on the battles. What I'm loving so far is that she's getting better at the wsad and mouse look because she doesn't have to deal with the looking at the ceiling/floor and running in a corner, issues that new players experience. The simplified 3rd person really has helped her. If she likes it enough she said she might we willing to try the MMO. Myself I never got around to playing KOTOR II so I just started that. Installed the extended content due to complaints about the ending plot sucking. I hope it's better with the missing content back in but we will see.

@SoldierG654342 said:

Back seat driving is the surest way to turn anyone off of anything. The best thing you can do is to be doing something else in the same room while she's playing. If you have a laptop, be on that or something similar. That way, you are available to help if she asks for it, but when she doesn't your attention is else where, which lessens the frustration on both of you.

This. Just let her do her thing.

As for dual stick controls, i.e. moving the camera and the person independently of each other? I was first introduced to that in the PS2 era. I had been gaming since the Game Boy, and I had a hard time getting used to it. I've long since done so, but damn was it hard in the first place. It's hard to imagine someone not knowing them now. Maybe you should attempt to play something that uses these types of controls co-operatively? Think Halo 3/Reach or Modern Warfare 3's Survival mode, both relatively simple games to learn those kinds of controls on.

Anyway, these days there is a steep learning curve to the "hardercore" games. Imaging not having the first bit of knowledge about video games and how they control and work, and being asked to play Saints Row 2 or 3 as one of your first games. Hard to do, isn't it?

What the hell is a "Hardcore Gamer"? Like a guy who plays video games while choking himself?