Should I go to college, or should I master a trade?

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tharlew

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#1  Edited By tharlew

Hey guys, this is my first post. I'm in a strange situation. I'll try to tell you my life as quickly as possible.

I moved from Baltimore, MD, to Mobile, Al, about 8 years ago. I moved with my mom, while my dad stayed in Maryland. As far away as we are, my sister and I have maintained a perfect relationship with my father, as well as my other family up north. We would visit every summer for three months, and recently my dad visited for 3 days for my high school graduation. By recently, I mean 10 months ago. Currently I'm 18 years old, I'll be 19 in July and this is where my dilemma comes in, bare with me.

My whole life I have always been the kid who was going to go to college and make everyone proud. I never struggled in high school, but it really just wasn't my thing. Well, I never really was excited about going to college. My mom insists that I stay and get my degree in what I want and stay in Alabama. My dad, however, wants me to move with him and learn a trade. He has SO MANY CONNECTIONS AND CONTACTS. He didn't finish high school, and it isn't like my mom has her masters, she only graduated high school, but my dad has been in Baltimore his whole life as apposed to me and my mom only being here eight years and not really meeting anyone important.

Here's my question ( and if you've read it all and you're here, God bless you, because i'm stressing. ) Is it worth it to go to college like I'm doing and have the student loan debt under my belt when I graduate and maybe not have a job? Or should I go to Maryland and learn a trade and make money in those four years I would be in college?really got me thinking.

Overall question, I know making money is never a problem. But will I regret not going to college at such a young age? Would love some valuable insight on this topic. Thank you guys so much!!

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Justin258

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#2  Edited By Justin258

My whole life I have always been the kid who was going to go to college and make everyone proud. I never struggled in high school, but it really just wasn't my thing. Well, I never really was excited about going to college. My mom insists that I stay and get my degree in what I want and stay in Alabama. My dad, however, wants me to move with him and learn a trade. He has SO MANY CONNECTIONS AND CONTACTS. He didn't finish high school, and it isn't like my mom has her masters, she only graduated high school, but my dad has been in Baltimore his whole life as apposed to me and my mom only being here eight years and not really meeting anyone important.

Hmmm... I guess it's possible but something about this feels wrong. Empty. Made-up.

GoBuildAlabama.com really got me thinking.

Ah. There it is.

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tharlew

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#3  Edited By tharlew

@believer258: Right so that didn't help me. Can I report you or something?

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bacongames

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My hang up with the story so far is the "learning a trade" bit. What kind of trade are we talking? Is it a growth sector in the economy at the moment, is it something you can grow as a skill or just do as a service for the rest of your life? There is always the cynical cloud surrounding these kinds of questions about how "college is bullshit" and for some it wasn't maybe the best use of their money but it shouldn't be an excuse to reject it either. If the trade is something that you know you can enjoy, jump into, and get interested in doing then go for it, particularly if its creative.

I could list off statistics that those with college degrees tend to get higher wages and have less unemployment but qualitatively college is a great opportunity to learn who you want to be, what you want to do, explore socially and be surrounded by cool and/or smart people. It's certainly not for everyone and particularly if you half-ass it then the investment wouldn't be worth it but I've also heard from friends who did not go to college after high school that they wish they did.

This is a hard question and good on you for taking it seriously but without specific interests or further details about said trade, then it might be hard to recommend one way or another. Certain professions, like the sciences, education, engineering, medicine, law, and the humanities overwhelmingly benefit from a collegiate track but others like art, making/handcrafting, mechanics, and others that aren't coming to mind can be hit or miss. I don't know, I feel like for a young person the social environment might be worth it anyway even if the return on investment isn't as obvious but that obviously privileges certain tracks. Then again, there's nothing wrong with doing what you can for scholarships and grants.

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tharlew

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@bacongames: We're talking, working with fiber optics, plumbing, electrical work. My options in terms of trade work is doubled with my father.

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Spoonman671

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#7  Edited By Spoonman671

If college is an option, then take it. Your degree will never go away, and trades will still be around when you graduate. This is coming from a college grad who has worked as an electrician for the last three years. No regrets about getting my degree.

Also, college is way more fun than trades, and you'll have the opportunity to make a ton of friends and form your own connections with people.

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tharlew

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#8  Edited By tharlew

@spoonman671: If only it were that easy. I just don't want all the debt, while a $20 p/h job is staring me in the face at a young age. That's the real problem I have.

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bacongames

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@tharlew said:

@bacongames: We're talking, working with fiber optics, plumbing, electrical work. My options in terms of trade work is doubled with my father.

Certainly it is the case that trades and particularly experienced trade workers are declining in the US so the economic need is there. For me the real question is what you're interested in doing personally. Forget the cost of college and forget the advantage your dad gives, what is it that you want to do? It's a hard question that I think just gets foisted onto millions of youth in the US without much assistance or clarification but it is still a core one that is important to wrestle with.

Also I want to say that non-traditional students, that is ones that come back to college years and years later, are only keeping steady if not growing so it's entirely fine to work a trade for a few years and then decide college is for you. No one is going to begrudge you for saying no to college and working a trade but it is harder by most accounts to get back on the saddle and do the college thing (although it obviously gets easier the longer you do it) after a few years. Although again, the best advantage is for someone just out of high school if only to maximize the social situation of being with those of your age.

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Justin258

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@tharlew said:

@believer258: Right so that didn't help me. Can I report you or something?

Legitimate answer, then.

I'm about to graduate college. As one of the older, quieter, and more book-ish kids of my generation in my family, I was always expected to go to and graduate college. You know, be the success story of the family. I'm not going to say don't go to college, that's dumb. But I am going to say that expectations and influences steered me in a direction toward college. But I entered without knowing what I really wanted to do, and now that I'm almost finished, I'm not a hundred percent sure that all the stress, late nights, work, reading things I didn't care about, and doubt were really worth it. Oh, and there's the mountain of debt that I'm now going to have to manage for the next few years. That's going to be on my back for an unfortunately long amount of time.

If you're a legitimate person and not a bot or a shill, then I think the best course of action would to use your father's connections and "learn a trade" now, get settled into a job, and if you're still interested in getting a degree, start one then. That way, if you find yourself despising college and you don't think that a degree would improve your life, you can drop out of it and pay off the debt long before it builds up to a level so high that you'll still be paying it off by the time you've settled, married, and had a kid.

Oh, and remove the URL from your post. Seriously. It's ugly. I posted the above mostly because I just needed to let out the idea that maybe encouraging college for every person in America isn't a good idea. I certainly wish I had at least waited a few years to start so that I could have a better idea of what I wanted to do with it. It's not a key to success like many (including my family) seem to be convinced, it's a certificate of an accomplishment.

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tharlew

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@bacongames: I have a passion for sports, I want to be a play by play announcer or analyst. I know I could do it, it's just my mindset is as simple as this: Go for my dream job that is scarce in the economy -- Go for the job that pays the most and that will more than likely be available. I just don't want to be in the situation that my mom was in. My whole life we've struggled and I want the best for me. I'm not looking for sympathy, I'm just telling you what my mindset is. Or at least I'm trying to.

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tharlew

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@believer258: I hear you. That link is encouraging kids that maybe college is not the only way. It encourages learning a skill for America. And I'm not a bot -.-. A fresh adult looking for opinions is all haha.

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Vahleticar

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I would advise getting a job however menial at first but we all have to do shifty jobs, it's just part of being young. You learn from it. Focus on being a good person, don't be a jerk cause that will hold you up in life, it's tough to be young nowadays. Go take up a hobby at college, something you enjoy and to learn to perfection, then take what you learnt and find a way to get paid for it. At least that's my opinion, I'm 25

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mosespippy

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What would you plan on taking in college? It's not like a Journalism, English, Business*, Education, Music, History, Archaeology, Arts or Theology degree would get you a job. Those all produce way more graduates every year than the job market can bare. Electricians and plumbers though? Never enough to go around. Mechanics and welders? Jobs everywhere. As far as I can tell the only university degree that is landing jobs these days are engineers, geologists, doctors, accountants and lawyers.

*Maybe it's different now, but when I was finishing up my business degree the economy was collapsing and everybody was laying off their business graduates.

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Justin258

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@tharlew said:

@believer258: I hear you. That link is encouraging kids that maybe college is not the only way. It encourages learning a skill for America. And I'm not a bot -.-. A fresh adult looking for opinions is all haha.

Then I sincerely apologize. We get a lot of bots and links 'round these parts and at first I couldn't help but think that your post was just a clever one of those.

Just make sure that college is what you want, and that you know what you want of college. Not much is worse than getting to the end and not knowing exactly what you've gone through this for. Even if you find yourself hating your job, you're making money, and moving on from that job is not a decision that is out of your hands.

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bacongames

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#16  Edited By bacongames

@tharlew said:

@bacongames: I have a passion for sports, I want to be a play by play announcer or analyst. I know I could do it, it's just my mindset is as simple as this: Go for my dream job that is scarce in the economy -- Go for the job that pays the most and that will more than likely be available. I just don't want to be in the situation that my mom was in. My whole life we've struggled and I want the best for me. I'm not looking for sympathy, I'm just telling you what my mindset is. Or at least I'm trying to.

I'm only saying this as an example but by that logic you could bust your ass for an engineering degree and make more money than you ever could as a tradesperson. If you're interested in being a commentator, there are a number of ways to approach it, including doing it at the college radio station, doing it by yourself and perhaps building a portfolio, or getting an internship at a local radio or TV station to do that. By that point though, I would imagine a number of establishments look to a communications degree or something similar. Not the most collegiate-necessary tracks out there but one to think on.

As I said, there's nothing wrong with taking a job right now but don't forever deny yourself the opportunity do what you want if that's your fear because going safe is not a guarantee either. That and who knows, you might end up hating all this trade stuff and wish you went to college and your answer is right there. Sometimes it takes the right time for someone to take advantage of college.

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#17  Edited By wizzywinkles

It seems like the problem you have is that you have several options and none of them are the wrong answer. That makes a decision very difficult. Here's my stream-of-consciousness advice. Take it for what it's worth:

  • Go to college. If you are concerned about student loan debt, go to an in-state school. Tuition will be much lower. Live in the dorms 1 year, maybe 2 if you like it or don't meet people you want to live with your 2nd-4th years. 2nd-4th years, move into a house or apartment near campus with a bunch of roommates to save money. Start looking for a house or apartment in Feb/March of the 2nd semester.
  • Fill out a FAFSA application and get some grants from the US government to help pay for school. That is free money for school.
  • Pursue a degree in a specific field like computer science or engineering (get a BS degree, not a BA). There will always be jobs in fields like those. Poly-Sci and other BA degrees are good, but employers don't seem to specifically target degrees such as those; they are just very general degrees (which could be a good thing since you aren't tied to one field). Even is you don't pursue a BS, taking some math/statistics classes could give you an edge in sports analysis
  • While at school, get involved with clubs/groups that focus on your passions. For you, this is likely a radio/tv club, broadcasting or fantasy sports club. There are tons of clubs on campus and you should dive in. College is a great opportunity to get into sports broadcasting even if you aren't getting a broadcasting degree.
  • When you graduate, no one can ever take your degree or experiences away. A steady job could give you both the income and free time to do other things that you enjoy.

A little about me so you can add weight to or dismiss my opinion: I'm in my late 20s, went to a state school, have a BS and MS in mechanical engineering and I work at a large consumer electronics company.

I hope this helps. Good luck!

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Hunter5024

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If you're worried about debt then you could go to a community college for 2 years and then transfer into a University. Saves a ton of money for the exact same degree.

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Everyones_A_Critic

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From your post it seems that you're not really that into school in general. This isn't a bad thing by any stretch, I have plenty of friends who are the exact same way. They're all in the trades now making bank. College isn't for everyone, and the trades are a great alternative, especially if your Dad is as well connected as you say.

On the other hand, if you see a major you can stick to, go for it. Just make sure it's something that can get you a job. Unfortunately, most people's passions don't translate into a high paying gig that'll make your degree worth it.

I'd recommend trying the trades for a year and seeing how you like it. Worst case scenario, you save up a ton of money that you can use to help pay for school should you choose to go that route. If you go to college out of pressure and just "having to go to college" you run the risk of pissing away a ton of money for something you never really wanted in the first place. If you end up liking the trades, you'll be making great money and have a secure job because shit is always gonna break and people are always gonna need their shit fixed.

Don't worry about going to college late, either. As long as you know what you want and that you can commit to it it'll work out for you.

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A college degree is the high school diploma of our parent's generation: without it, it's really tough to get your foot in the door in the job market. But I have a different reason why I recommend you go to college (statistics are boring, yo):

I can only talk from my personal experience, but getting an education was amazing. The people in my small college were some of the best people I had ever met, helped me develop a broader perspective on the world and my interests, and exposed me to career plans and modes of success that don't show up at your everyday career day at high school. I didn't realize how closed-minded I was until someone in college challenged my perceptions, and forced me to reevaluate a lot of ideas about what I'm doing with my life. I walked out of college into a struggling economy, but I worked two jobs through it, have little debt now, and am slowly moving my way up an annoyingly convoluted career path. I never would have known that I could do what I am doing now if it wasn't for a professor at my college giving a talk that blew my mind and opened my eyes to a career option that appealed to me way more than "business" and "engineering" (my original plans).

I realize that college is not for everyone. I had a lot of down moments, I needed a lot of help to get through it. But getting an education (going to lectures, talking to professors, meeting other students, socializing, cranking on papers, playing Katamari Damacy on a giant projector in a lecture hall in the middle of the night with the music blaring....) is something I would never trade away. My school gave me the opportunity to travel. Summer and break internships sent me all across the globe, from Texas to California to Hawaii, to London and Paris. I now have access to a giant alumni directory full of people who were willing to help me get started.

Could I have just followed in my father's footsteps, taken up his trade? Totally (and he still hopes I will). But the fact I took my time to be an "adult" and get a real job, is the best decision I ever made.

Best of luck man.

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TyCobb

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I am a firm believer that if you can master a trade, enjoy it, and confident you will always find work, then that trumps college.

I did a semester of junior college after high school and never went back. There are times I think, "what if I continued to go...", but each time I just realize how much I hate learning in a school environment. I prefer to learn in the real world or on my time. As someone who continued with their trade and sucked it up for 5 years of shitty-to-okay pay learning in the real world, I have no regrets of not going to college.

Now don't take the above as me telling you what you should do. There are certain fields/trades that do require school and depending on what you really want to do, you may want to look into whether that field/trade allows for equivalent work experience or not. If not, then stay in school.

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Mike

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#22  Edited By Mike  Moderator

For what it's worth, I thought this was a spam post as well.

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PimblyCharles

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#23  Edited By PimblyCharles

@tharlew: I have two college degrees and it took 8 years of my life. Great times; hard work. When it really comes down to it, they matter on a resume. However, if you are truly talented, they don't matter much during an interview.

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tourgen

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#24  Edited By tourgen

If you can handle a STEM degree you can make money fairly easily right out of school with a 4yr degree. If you can't handle it and you have opportunities for a good trade leading to journeyman then do that instead. MBA could work too but fuck those guys. Other BA degrees require really good connections in their field to get something worthwhile.

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EthanielRain

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The best answer is to do both...learn a trade, then go to college and pursue your dreams.

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deactivated-5d7530f19fbe4

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From your post it seems that you're not really that into school in general. This isn't a bad thing by any stretch, I have plenty of friends who are the exact same way. They're all in the trades now making bank. College isn't for everyone, and the trades are a great alternative, especially if your Dad is as well connected as you say.

On the other hand, if you see a major you can stick to, go for it. Just make sure it's something that can get you a job. Unfortunately, most people's passions don't translate into a high paying gig that'll make your degree worth it.

I'd recommend trying the trades for a year and seeing how you like it. Worst case scenario, you save up a ton of money that you can use to help pay for school should you choose to go that route. If you go to college out of pressure and just "having to go to college" you run the risk of pissing away a ton of money for something you never really wanted in the first place. If you end up liking the trades, you'll be making great money and have a secure job because shit is always gonna break and people are always gonna need their shit fixed.

Don't worry about going to college late, either. As long as you know what you want and that you can commit to it it'll work out for you.

This seems most in tune with my thoughts. Only, the option I'm thinking of is that you could go to college and spend time during the summer learning a trade and building a rapport with your dad's contacts. If any of the trades have anything to do with what you would take at college, all the better. If that's not the case, a trade that shows that you can interact with people can be helpful. Even if whatever trade you end up going with doesn't fit those criteria, job experience is good on a resume.

High school wasn't my thing either, although I was a considerably worse student than it sounds like you were, and even though I had the same bad habits when starting college, the experience was so vastly different that I ended up enjoying it and , eventually, performing better.

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white

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#27  Edited By white

I strongly encourage everyone to at least get a degree (from a well accredited University of course, not some shit p2w degree). It's a safety net that will at least allow you to more easily get a job with just pure credentials alone. Assume you are an employer going through resumes of potential employees. Assuming their work experience are equivalent, wouldn't you want someone who has a degree as opposed to someone who doesn't? Unless, of course, you're a start-up who can't afford to pay that much.

Your parents not having degrees is the norm in their era because the standards back then were different. However, society has changed since then. Looking at today's society, our education system has vastly improved and more people are receiving education and getting more intelligent. While that is definitely a good thing for humanity, for the individual it's tough because you have to keep up with the times. In the future, everyone having degrees would be the baseline, and unless you have extraordinary working experience and other non-academic credentials, it's going to be hard to compete with other potential employee candidates.

You can definitely try your hand in a trade if you have the capital for it, but note that you are taking a risk. It'd be wiser to spend that money on a safer path to a better future, but you might be the kind who like to gamble and prefer high risk high reward scenarios.

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JasonR86

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Find a job you think you'd enjoy doing and then do what you need to do to get it. If that means going to college then go to college. The money will come eventually. But there are a lot of people who are paid well but hate their job. That doesn't sound fun to me at all.

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MikeinSC

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Also, college is way more fun than trades, and you'll have the opportunity to make a ton of friends and form your own connections with people.

Unless you can do it without debt, college is a terrible idea. Easily as bad an idea as exists. The traditional idea of what college is has been dead for decades. It's now intellectually stifling, socially stifling, and just a bore if you have any opinions in conflict with the "student body" as a whole. There is no benefit to it any longer and the bubble will eventually burst.

I have a passion for sports, I want to be a play by play announcer or analyst.

Odds of success in that field are virtually nil. If you have no pro or college sports playing experience on a high level, it is basically not going to happen. Chasing a dream makes sense only if you can support yourself.

  • Pursue a degree in a specific field like computer science or engineering (get a BS degree, not a BA). There will always be jobs in fields like those. Poly-Sci and other BA degrees are good, but employers don't seem to specifically target degrees such as those; they are just very general degrees (which could be a good thing since you aren't tied to one field). Even is you don't pursue a BS, taking some math/statistics classes could give you an edge in sports analysis

Computer Science jobs are outsourced all of the time. That is hardly a good idea at this point. And humanities/liberal arts degrees are utterly useless and have been for years. If a college tells you otherwise, they are lying to you. Employers aren't going to spend a ton of time or money in training, so those degrees are albatrosses.

You have a shot at $20/hr right now? College isn't going to give you that anytime in the foreseeable future.

The belief, starting in the 1970's, that college is required to have a good job is a crime committed against the young. A BA in any field is, literally, a dime a dozen. Bachelor degrees are meaningless. A trade gets you a job immediately. Unless you wish to pursue post-grad work and have great connections, then save your money and visit bars after your workday is over. You'll get the social experience at far less a cost.

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JasonR86

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@mikeinsc:

My first job out of college was over $20/hr.

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GiantLizardKing

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#31  Edited By GiantLizardKing

@mikeinsc said:

Computer Science jobs are outsourced all of the time. That is hardly a good idea at this point.

This is really bad advice. Like seriously terrible. Processes in the future are only become more automated and information is only going to become more digitized. The outsourcing of programming jobs scare probably peaked like 7 or 8 years ago. The experiment was...less than successful in many cases. My friend is a project manager for a development consulting firm and they changed their model from outsourcing development to India to hiring devs in Austin Texas because the quality gap is just so huge. Not to mention the logistics of working with somebody on a project that is always awake when you are asleep and vice-versa. It really isn't worth it. There profitability is way up even though they are paying the programmers much more.

Take it from me as well: I'm a fairly well paid software developer and I feel like I can quit any job I want at any time and another well paying job will be waiting for me elsewhere. I have more job security than anybody I currently know and the trends are only moving farther in that direction. I don't know anybody with my level of experience (roughly 7 years) who isn't making at least 6 figures, and that's in the Midwest where housing is cheap. If this is a field that may interest you then DO NOT LISTEN TO THIS MAN. I might have to actually mail the Bombcast to start a beef over this.

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D4RKSH33P

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This was my thought. Go to a decent state school for a four year degree and do some hard labor in the summer with your dad. While going to college, I worked in a distant cousin's factory making boxes, stuffing bags, and other general tasks. It taught me just how important my degree was going to be. You might end up learning the opposite, and that working with your dad is exactly what you want to do. The important thing is that you made the decision based on your educated opinion, and not what any one else thought was right for you.

Only, the option I'm thinking of is that you could go to college and spend time during the summer learning a trade and building a rapport with your dad's contacts.

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Kevin_Cogneto

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#33  Edited By Kevin_Cogneto

While I think @mikeinsc's post is perhaps just a tad hyperbolic and I don't think bachelor's degrees are completely meaningless, I do believe he's onto something in the that sense that bachelor's degrees have never been more expensive and have never been less valuable. But that doesn't mean a bachelor's has zero value. In the end, everyone has to decide for themselves whether they believe they'll get their money's worth.

The outsourcing of programming jobs scare probably peaked like 7 or 8 years ago.

Not where I work. Or at the previous company I worked, for that matter.

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MonkeyKing1969

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#34  Edited By MonkeyKing1969

To be honest you don't seem to like school, then again that could have been the schools your were in didn't peak you interest, so I'm not sure college woudl be 'for you'...you might be pretty smart already but not find the academic life very enjoyable.

As far as a trade that is always a good choice as long as job prospects in the field are high. I would warn you however, manual labor in construction over the next two decades will be taken over modular prefab construction techniques, system that snap together that framers or robots can put in place.

Two hundred years ago, seventy percent of American workers lived on a farm doing manual labor. Automation has eliminated all but 1 percent of those jobs, replacing them (and animals) with machines. But the displaced workers did not sit idle. Instead, automation created hundreds of millions of jobs in entirely new fields....but less hands on fields. Those who once farmed were now manning the legions of factories that that made industrial products. Ever since then, wave upon wave of new occupations have arrived—appliance repairman, printer, chemists, photographer, etc —each building on previous automation.

It may be hard to believe, but before the end of this century, 70 percent of today’s trade occupations will likewise be replaced by automation. In other words, robotic/automation replacement is just a matter of time. This upheaval is being led by a second wave of automation, one that is centered on machine cognition, inexpensive sensors networks, machine learning. This deep automation will touch all jobs, from manual labor to service industries. If you go into a trade, be the guy on the job who knows the automation side - be the guy selling, fixing, and using those robots.

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oldenglishc

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You should sell drugs.

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UncleBenny

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#36  Edited By UncleBenny

We can rail against colleges all we want, but the thing is that a college degree, regardless of the usefulness of said degree, is almost a requirement for most standard jobs out there. I've often regretted not spending more time at the college campus myself (I lived with my parents then, so I go to class, then go home), not for the education, but for the experience. However, I would suggest taking a break from school though and try the trade thing for a year and save up some money. Afterwards you can think about going to college.

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JasonR86

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#37  Edited By JasonR86

@kevin_cogneto:

Well, it depends a lot on what field you're going into too. In psychology, a BA is practically worthless. But an AA/AS is everything for someone who wants to be a nurse in a hospital. It all comes down to deciding what field interests you and what degree, if any, is required.

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GiantLizardKing

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@kevin_cogneto: The programmers where you work/worked should go find some place better to be then.

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TreeTrunk

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don't go into debt for something you don't really want to learn, if that's what you're considering.

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Kevin_Cogneto

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#40  Edited By Kevin_Cogneto

@kevin_cogneto: The programmers where you work/worked should go find some place better to be then.

Well they already did, presumably. They didn't have much choice, after all. All I was saying is that your experience didn't even remotely match mine, in the past five years I've seen two major corporations decimate their domestic IT departments, which seems like enough to me to make a trend. But anyway this isn't what the thread is about, so...

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Kevin2306

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It sounds like you'd want to go to college for Journalism (or Broadcast Journalism if the university of your choice makes the distinction). That's a real tough field with pretty low turnover. You'd HAVE to get an internship or work at the local college radio station to get experience and connections before landing a well paying gig. It would help a lot if the college/university you choose has a big sports presence. That may actually be a more important factor than how good the Journalism school is at that University. In this particular instance, I would advise against going to a "Community College" for 2 years, as that's two years of networking at your Uni's radio station you will be missing out on.

On the other hand, a trade school to learn a trade is a good profession that pays well right out of the gate. My friend is an experienced Welder and I have my bachelor's in Accounting and we make about the same. The big difference here is that he works nights/weekends and he can have some real rough 60 hour weeks at times, but I'm a much more steady M-F 8-5, which is important to me as I have an 8 month old son at home and I'd hate to miss out on seeing him.

Anyway...Please pick at least one or the other. I've seen people get caught up in this decision and eventually said "I didn't know which one to do, so I did neither". That's a real rough spot to put yourself in.

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DodoBasse

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I realize a bot necro'd this, but now I'm curious what happened to this person.