Why do people like The Babadook and It Follows?

I'm genuinely curious. I haven't watched many horror movies, especially one that tick as much horror trope boxes as possible because I find that lazy and boring.

I watched both movies and thought they were totally stupid, Babadook especially. They both have a few good, scary scenes and ideas, but all in all, they completely don't deserve the hype and praise in my opinion.
But, considering how hard it is to find a good horror movie that's not a jump-scare-fest or gore porn, maybe horror lovers are starving for some alternatives and are easily satisfied.

I also recently watched The Blairwitch Project for the first time and let me tell ya, now that's a good, atmospheric horror movie that doesn't rely on chip tricks for scares. (although, that's maybe the one good thing I can say for Baba and Follows too, for the most part). I do like that they try and focus on the psychological horror in a somewhat interesting way.

I find the psychological aspects of horror to be more appealing and interesting, so sometimes psychological thrillers fill that horror spot a lot better, something like Hannibal or The Shining...

I'm also recording a Let's Play of Outlast (the only way I could force myself to play a horror game is to record it and have a semi obligation to do it regularly), but after I got used to the shock and got over my initial fear it's just a cheap lasagna of jump scares and gore... The interactivity certainly helps.

I also played through SOMA and that game was excellent! The psychological horror of the ideas between robots and humans and consciousness was amazing! (not a fan of the few drown out segments with the monster hide and seek tho)

I think I'll try Goodnight Mommy movie next, and if I don't like that, maybe horror is just not for me.

So, with all that being said, can you explain to me why you did or didn't like those 2 movies, and recommend some others to me, video games too? I really didn't watch many horror movies or played a bunch of horror games, so it shouldn't be to hard to recommend some good ones.

Because they aren't just horror movies, they are social commentary on grief, mental illness and sexuality.

I really liked The Babadook. I thought it had some effective horror and I liked the whole idea of the Babadook actually representing her grief.

It Follows on the other hand, was awful in my opinion. Don't get the hype about that film at all.

@jonny_anonymous: This. Add mortality and loss of adolescence to that list as well. Both films are great because they go so much deeper than standard horror tropes. I think there's only like one jump scare between both films.

Combine that with some fantastic cinematography and at least in the case of It Follows a stellar soundtrack and you've got two of the best suspense movies of the past decade.

It sounds like you just weren't into them, and that's fine. However "lazy" is not a fair criticism for either movie.

@choi: Goodnight Mommy is not a horror film in the normal sense. Its very slow to get to the "scary" parts and even then I feel like its not really something to base your feelings of horror movies on. Try We're Still Here or You're Next. Those were both more typical yet interesting films in the genre

God I hated The Babadook, that kid was so fucking annoying.

@jeremyko: @jonny_anonymous: Oh, I do get the social commentary, I just don't think that it's particularly deep or subtle. Especially when you look at movies as a whole(other genres), the horror genre and the themes it tries to tackle seem totally immature, lost and silly when trying to be "deep"...

I do agree that the soundtrack and cinematography of Follows is excellent, thou!

I'm sorry if I didn't word it correctly, I don't think those 2 movies were lazy and boring- I was referring to horror movies that are full of tropes in general.

I only watched The Babadook. I didn't think it was scary at all - there was only one scene in the movie that even came close to spooking me (the first scene where they're flipping through the book). There are certain parts of the movie that just felt disjointed or sort of needless and didn't really add anything to the story as a whole. For example, there's a male character that's prominent in the first half of the movie but vanishes in the second half with no real explanation why. Some scenes went overboard with the horror cliches in a way that made me laugh. For example, the flickering lightbulbs and the creaking floorboards at night - who the fuck is honestly scared by that any more? It came across as lazy more than anything. The main actress was great at portraying a dishevelled and frustrated single mother, but when it came to "okay, act scared/cry/scream", I wasn't buying it. The little kid put on the most convincing acting in the entire movie, I thought it was an excellent performance.

I appreciate that the movie attempted to comment on mental illness and grieving. I actually felt that I was the target demographic of this movie, considering I was raised in a household that has had to deal with those exact issues. That being said, nothing about this movie was moving at all. The only significant thought lingering around in my mind after watching the movie was "great, this seems like a good movie to show 15 year olds so they can write a paper about it in English class because the themes and symbols are so obvious and easy to write a paper about".

I realize that it was primarily about grief, but goddamn I'm finding it increasingly annoying how anything nowadays classifies itself as horror. The Babadook was not scary, at all. The Cabin in the Woods was not scary. It follows was not scary.

It's fine that these movies are exploring different ideas and concepts, but claiming that they're "more than just horror" is disingenuous. They're different compared to horror movies, they're not more.

That annoys me because if I want a horror movie, I want to see something scary. If I go to a restaurant and order a pasta, I expect a pasta. If I get a sandwich instead, it doesn't matter how good the sandwich is, it's not what I'm in the mood for.

I really liked Babadook. I found it tense and scary because it portrayed a very plausible descent into madness.

I don't watch horror movies but is it really that important to try to label it? It attempts to frighted the viewer and make them uneasy, that seems like a horror movie in my book.

because they are good movies

@sravankb: Are you saying that a movie about a woman who is suffering mentally to the point that she beats her child isn't horrifying?

I feel maybe the hype affected my enjoyment of both movies a little bit. I liked The Babadook, but didn't really find it scary. Maybe it's just a problem with the categorization of horror and what that entails.

Babadook to me was a really good movie, really well made. Kinda reminded me of 70s movies, a little bit of Polanski and such. I got really frustrated with It Follows and overall just underwhelmed. Photography was really awesome, though. That was a really fucking pretty movie at times.

@sravankb: You're assuming in the term 'horror movie' that the audience is always the one supposed to be scared. You wouldn't watch a romance and complain that you didn't fall in love. Horror films use fear as a means to convey a theme. Often times that fear is uncomfortable for the audience as well as the characters in the film, but that's entirely subjective. Nobody is wrong for being scared while watching It Follows, just as It Follows isn't less of a horror film because I didn't jump out of my seat.

I digress.

It Follows was well liked largely because it is aesthetically very well done. It's a small film that broke out of art theaters and entered the mainstream consciousness. I think people like to like that movie. It looks and sounds good. It's interesting that it approaches teen sexuality in a way that's a little more complex than "stab kids having sex." A little. I also think this film has a lot of problems with muddling its themes between sexually transmitted disease, sexual positivity, and romantic/physical attachment. There are times when it cares less about what it is saying than it does its slick aesthetic. It's an interesting movie, and fun to talk about, but I have my reservations.

The Babadook is pretty slavish to its theme of grief, right down to the way the monster behaves: Babadook never leaves, you just learn to live with it. I think horror audiences appreciate a film that intelligently conveys its message. So often that stuff gets muddled while trying to achieve an aesthetic, or cool kill, or just making a monster somebody wants to dress up as on Halloween. The Babadook isn't entirely innocent here, there are a few things that I don't know contribute at all to the greater narrative (the moment they show the monster felt out of place, the stuff with the dog doesn't make much sense to me), but for the most part it seems well constructed.

Yo, it's hard to actually be scared by a movie as an adult.

I thought both The Babadook and It Follows were great. Neither were particularly scary but I don't find many things scary these days, mostly thanks to watching so many scary films. I simply think they're well made films. Good cinematography, very memorable soundtracks, quality acting and interesting monster design. Both films weren't afraid of showing the viewer the monster, but done so in a way that didn't completely spoil how threatening they were. That said, if you're looking for other horror films to watch I'd recommend Coherence and Resolution. Both are fairly recent and quite good. I wouldn't go into either expecting to be scared, though, otherwise you'll likely find yourself disappointed.

I liked both, I don't think either stuck the landing though. Babadook had very good sound and that's something I found eerie that I particularly liked. Plus the kids' book was genuinely creepy to me.

It Follows had an even worse ending than Babadook. I mean the pool scene? It was hilarious.

But that said, I liked It Follows for the general idea of instead of a bunch of jump scares (which there were a few), I like the idea of seeing the threat in the camera very minuscule coming at the protagonists. This dredge of seeing it slowly coming - never speeding up - was neat to me, and that it eventually catches up. It's a nice change from 80's horror flicks where the protagonists runs super fast, only to have the killer appear next to them out of nowhere. The slow build was my favorite part of It Follows.

Watching The Babadook in the cinema was one of the tensest things I can remember doing in a long time. While I didn't find It Follows scary, I think it's a brilliant premise really well developed and is dripping in the right kind of style for me. I mean, the soundtrack was worth the price of admission alone!

I liked them both, but at the same time find them to be a little overrated.

Not really scary, but It Follows has great music (by Disasterpiece, he made the Fez soundtrack yo) and I like its style. It's kinda dreamlike. Yeah, the social commentary about innocence and death and childhood slipping away and growing up- not really subtle, but I dig it.

So in conclusion- you just have to like the feel of the movie. It's really unique and fun.

I did not like Babadook at all.

I never believed in child abuse until I saw the Babadook. I hated that movie and that kid so much.

As someone who liked both Babadook and It Follows, and really dislikes Blairwitch... I'm not sure I can make any recommendations you'll like.

Babadook deals with the tragedy and terror of mental illness. While It Follows is a new twist on the old teens-having-sex-and-getting-murdered trope. I think both are well liked because they are slightly different takes on old ideas. It doesn't hurt that they are well made movies either. Despite being smaller budgeted films they have good acting and slick production values. They don't fit into the typical gore-a-thons either and for me that's a plus. I always found gore to be a cheap trick in horror movies. Guts aren't scary... just gross.

I don't really think that all horror movies have to be a jump-scare fest either. Suspenseful thrillers with supernatural elements can easily fit into that genre as well. Horror is a pretty broad stroke to be fair. Honestly, I don't find many movies or games to be scary. If some form of media can leave me feeling somewhat unsettled then I feel like it did the job, but that's about as far as it goes these days. After watching Pet Cemetery and Poltergeist as a kid, the horror bar is set pretty high. The Shining is also an example of a great horror movie that I didn't find scary as much as disturbing. Especially if you read up on some of the hidden themes in the film that Kubrick worked in.

It Follows was enjoyable to me, Babadook was very disappointing. Maybe it's just overrated and had my expectations too high but I found the mother and child to both be extremely grating and it just made the movie a chore to watch.

Basically the modern horror genre bar is so low that merely competent horror movies end up getting a lot of attention.

I like It Follows a ton. I really like Maika Monroe. She's already been in It Follows and The Guest. it's almost like any movie she's in needs to have a banging soundtrack. She's just so fucking cool.

The Babadook is also great but I don't think I'll ever really want to see it again. That sound he makes is classic.

I've only seen It Follows and found it to be super overrated based on all the positive word of mouth it got. I don't get the hype about that movie at all.

It's all subjective. I found both those movies to be fairly scary. While most other recent horror movies I did not. Hence I liked them.

Mixed Feelings on the Babadook, did not really like how the story went and the conclusion is weird. Definitely scary at times though, although i'm talking less about the few genuinely good horror scenes and more about the adult kinds of fears it evoked in me like being the parent of an unlikeable noisy troublemaker or going crazy when stressed beyond the point of exhaustion.

It Follows was a great callback to 70ies 80ies Horror that was mostly beautifully shot and scored. Story was alright, and conceptually more creepy than scary.

As for geniunely smart and/or scary horror movies....hmm.

[REC] isn't really smart, and in a way somewhat predictable, but it uses the Found Footage format (of which i'm personally fan of, even though i easily admit it's a subgenre where like 95% percent of it all is really bad) to great effect and has really great timing and setups. I should be "to cool" for it, but i find it genuinely scary. (As for Found Footage, also check out V/H/S 1 + 2, anthology movies i initially had a bit of issue with due to being at times very very amateurish, but grown on me eventually for having some smart subversions in thier stories and a connecting theme per whole movie that lift the sums of thier parts into something more interesting that has interesting views on the genre as a whole. Stay away from V/H/S 3 though.)

Also, Alien (the first one, always the first one) is one of my all time favorite movies due to the (probably more than then now) more grounded take on a future with space flight and above all its intense atmosphere and designs.

(And talking about atmosphere, another one of my all time favorite movies is the 80ies Remake of the Thing, it can be a bit goofy at times, but the concept, the isolated setting and a John Carpenter score at its very best make this an absolute must watch.)

As for scary and smart, i really find the remake of the Fly a great source. It does not get you alot with jumpscares, and it's gross out factor is beyond intense, but there is something about the inevitability and gradual about what happens in the movie and how it is shown (both from the side of the Afflicted and his partner) that is pretty scary in a surprisingly relatable way.

Another great movie in that regard is Marebito, although i guess i should warn that the movie has some imagery of a...let's say sexual nature that is the wrong kind of creepy and may be a turn off for some. Yet, it's somewhat rambly narrative and the mixture between very sober imagery mixed with short moments that go into the surreal got under my skin HARD.

EDIT: That said, i really really don't like Blair Witch Project, even though it is one of the originators of the Found Footage genre as is (yea, i know it's preceded by some things, decades ago when taking Cannibal Holocaust into the mix, but you know). I thought it was kind of stupid and annoying since outside of the admittedly well made ending, it leaned too hard on dumb decision making and over-the-top hysteria for me. But well, to each thier own.

Because both of them have things for those people to like and then those people shout it out loud on the internet or whatever media they use.

Horror is the most subjective thing in media (next to, or directly above, comedy).

Those movies get so much hype because, for awhile, people who liked understated, subtle horror were being underserved by the found-footage craze, which recieved OODLES of praise after torture porn made it's return, which was heralded as the second-coming after slasher movies finally jumped the shark which were a breath of fresh air after creature features became ineffective, which were a spooky escape from the exploitation craze and on and on we go.

Movies appear to get so much hype, but what's actually happening is that a sub-set of horror fans who've been neglected finally have something to latch onto and are extremely excited about it.

well, it doesn't sound like you don't get why ppl like em, you just didn't like em yourself that much right? hype is always a dangerous thing to go into anything with so it could have played a part. i saw these right when they were released, i would say, before the hype reach its peak and i really liked both, especially It Follows.

The Babadook was the director's (Jennifer Kent) first feature and It Follows was only the director's (David Robert Mitchell) second and they were both incredibly confident and well constructed films that easily worked on multiple levels. They were also tiny movies, budgets estimating at only $2 million for each film (which is ridiculously low). The independent scene gets excited about young new filmmakers with obvious talent and exceptional potential. The thing is, these are small movies for niche audiences but the internet blows any hype out of proportion and a lot ppl come out disappointed because there aren't really meant for the general movie goers. the more you're into films, the more you'll appreciate these movies because you're judging aspects of films that most ppl either don't care or don't notice.

It sounds like what you want and you're expectations of what a horror movie is or should be is fairly narrow and these didn't land where you want them to.

This is not a horror movie but maybe check out The Gift which came out this year. It's mostly considered a thriller or mystery but it works also as a psychological horror.

My favorite horror movie is The Desent very claustrophobic and tense. Another good horror movie is House of the Devil it has a very old school feel and is about building tension instead of gore. Dead Silence is a great movie by the Saw people that is really creepy if you don't like ventriloquist dolls.

If you liked Blairwitch then you would probably like the Paranormal Activity movies.

I actually didn't know that both movies were so hyped and well-liked to the point where someone would say that either is overrated. Anyway, I saw both within one week. Personally, I liked and enjoyed It Follows, but was disappointed by The Babadook. I'm not a big fan of horror movies and I didn't watch either of them for the scares, and as such, I wasn't upset to find out that neither of them was particularly terrifying. Although, I found some of the early parts of The Babadook to be somewhat disturbing.

I liked It Follows because it uses and subverts horror genre tropes in unique ways. For example, I think not explaining the nature of "it" was a good decision. Also, somehow the movie resonated with me to some extent, mainly due to the the themes it explores. As for The Babadook, I thought the first half was promising, but I hated the back half when it devolved into a rather cliched symbolic struggle against grief. Also, bear in mind that unlike the majority of mainstream horror movies these days, It Follows and The Babadook were reasonably well-written and directed.

Edit: If you're up for a slightly different type of horror, I recommend watching Under the Skin, directed by Jonathan Glazer and starring Scarlett Johansson, who gives a great performance by the way. It's an arthouse sci-fi horror. It doesn't rely on jump scares (or any types of scare for that matter), but I found it be haunting, and I remember one scene being deeply unsettling. The movie is visually stunning and has a fantastic score.

I recently watched The Babadok and it was a suspenseful movie up till they actually showed the monster. Afterwards I think I would have enjoyed the rest of the movie a lot more if it was really just about a mom breaking under the pressure of life driving her crazy instead of a crazy monster possessing her. Overall it didn't impress me but it was a okay movie.

I know very little about horror movies so I can't really suggest any. Although I can say that Silent Hill 2 is a good game that relies on psychological horror.

I liked Babadook because it went in a totally different direction than what I was expecting, and the titular creature was fun to watch do its thing. I mean, it's not Oscar material by any means, but it was enjoyable and creative. Plus it was the director's first feature, which is always worth keeping in mind.

It Follows, on the other hand... it had some cool ideas, but I couldn't take the "sexually transmitted ghost" plot seriously. I still giggle every time I type "sexually transmitted ghost". That movie just did nothing for me.

The thing about horror is that it's an incredibly wide genre. If you're looking to dip your toes into it and find your niche, try Patrick's list over at Kotaku. It's not perfect, but it's a good primer that covers a decent percentage of horror subgenres.

Going by what you listed as liking, I'd suggest Lake Mungo, The Innkeepers, slow burn ghost stories like those. (and don't let Goodnight Mommy be your "horror enjoyment test". It's not what the trailers make it out to be. It's a horror movie, but barely)

@zombie2011: Kinda the point, you know.

New thread title: "Why do people have opinions?"

Bingo. A movie doesn't have to push further than other movies in its genre. The point of art is to provoke introspection, but the point of entertainment is to entertain. I found The Babadook to be really entertaining.

Why did I enjoy The Babadook? Well, you'd have to psychoanalyze me to learn that, find all of my memories, suppressed fears, subconscious desires. After everything, all you'd learn is that your life story is different from my life story. There's no shame or pride in disliking something another person likes.

Well, except Dan. He takes plenty of pride in that.

They're well crafted movies with more meat to them than you might expect of a horror movie.

Never seen The Babadook, but I completely agree with you on It Follows. The rape allegory was so heavy handed and the movie completely killed all its tension before the end. I do not understand how that film has so much love outside of the soundtrack and cinematography.

Not saying your interpretation isn't valid, as it's the obvious one, but the director has pretty much said that the film isn't a metaphor for STDs.

My interpretation, and the one the director hinted at, is that it's about the psychological trauma that follows sexual abuse. Think about the recurring motif of the creature appearing as people's parents - especially that its "final form" is the protagonist's father. The film is about how the trauma following rape or abuse "follows" the person for the rest of their life, the characters' reactions to the abuse, and the ambiguous ending hints how that despite the fact that she's moved on and is with a person who accepts her for what she's been through and that it's a legitimately loving relationship, that there's still possibly a ghost, a hint of trauma that will never entirely disappear.

Plus that soundtrack by Disasterpiece - dang son. Synths for days.

Babadook was terrible, IMO.

@zombie2011: that kid was annoying but for a good reason. Also he 100% redeemed himself when be used that shoulder mounted catapult.

I can't comment on The Babadook but It Follows is one of the most boring movies I've seen this year. I envy people that managed to be scared by the movie in any way. Then again, I claim to be a horror film fan, but I can't name a single horror movie in the last five years that I genuinely enjoyed, so I may just be wrestling with my own personal hangups with the genre.

@infamousbig: That's fair, and the other interpretation sounds great on paper. I just wish the movie itself earned that heavy of a subtext, and I don't feel that it did.

One really cool thing that I did like about it, though, so I don't come off too negative: That weird "alternate/anachronistic technology" thing going on in the background that had no bearing on anything but helped give it a more timeless(...-ish), ambiguous setting. It was entirely unnecessary, yet an awesome little touch.

I always get frustrated at the "I didn't like it because it wasn't scary" argument. That completely undermines what horror movies can do, and have been doing for many many years. The genre isn't called "scary movies," it's called "horror." Horror movies are meant to be horrific.

The Babadook explores ideas of grief, loss, and depression in disturbing, grotesque ways. Is that not horrific to you? Now, you can go on about the craftsmanship or say "the ideas weren't conveyed well" and that's totally fair so long as you explain your point. I also really don't get the "the kid was annoying" argument. That's the point. Without that, the movie doesn't work.

As for It Follows, that movie is clearly a throwback to 70s or 80s horror movies complete with a synth soundtrack. THIS is the one where the craftsmanship really shines and I'd have to strongly disagree and argue with anyone who says otherwise. The directing and cinematography in It Follows is absolutely masterful.

and for the record, I wasn't all that scared by these movies. The Babadook had me on the edge of my seat and tensed up a few times but I've seen much scarier. It Follows was more a creepy trance. This brings me back to the bottom line though:

Horror movies do not and never have to necessarily be that scary

i found the babadook hilarious even though i've alwas hated the stupid kid cinnected to the other side cliche i actually watched this one cause it kept me laughing haven't seen it follows but it sounds like it could be either awful or just good but not great

The Babadook is not a fun watch, which is why I can see people hating on it. It's actually one of my favorite films. Having the child and mother be "Grating" to some people is actually really realistic when it comes to mental illness, especially when grief is involved. It's also not supposed to be a transcendental experience, it's just a film that reminds us that grief is a serious problem that doesn't go away so much as gets suppressed.

I...didn't like It Follows either, tho. Soundtrack was good, everything else was mediocre. Call me crazy, I liked how The Babadook was more overt and less subtle in its goal and felt that It Follows was too subtle.

Blair Witch is one of my favorites too.

Just wanted to thank everyone for a wonderful thread and a few suggestions to movies I've missed.

I really enjoyed The Babadook for it's underlying themes even if I wanted to personally disembowel that kid through most of that film. Though as a labeler I go out of my way to try and properly categorize films with their genre and do not think Babadook should be just labeled as a horror film.

I think you can have a horror film without much suspense (which I don't like)and a suspense film without much horror and really wish folks would try and classify things more . I don't like folks saying it's a horror film that isn't scary just tell me it's a suspense thriller it something.

There was no other side. The kid wasn't connected to anything and there were no supernatural elements if you paid attention. The kid suffered from mental illness.