• 51 results
  • 1
  • 2
Avatar image for viking_funeral
#1 Posted by viking_funeral (2881 posts) -

I found something in my feed that seems incredible. Persona 5 was voted the best RPG of all time by Famitsu readers. NieR: Automata came in 4th. Even the Witcher 3 made it on the list at 20th.

What a difference 11 years makes. In 2006 Famitsu voted Final Fantasy X as the best game (not just RPG) of all time. Here it slipped down to 12th place.

Now, there are some catches. Apparently only 2,295 people voted in the most recent survey. That's a small number for a large magazine like Famitsu. It is large enough to be statistically significant if marginally inaccurate, but I am in no mood to argue statistics on the internet.

The second catch is that there are a lot of modern games on here. Apparently 45% of those surveyed were in their 20s or younger. This could account for the tendency towards more modern games. Though I will note that Dragon Quest III (from 1988) came in 2nd place. Even in Famitsu's poll from 11 years ago in came in as the 3rd best game of all time. The Japanese absolutely love that game. (An aside: It's a pretty damn good RPG for an NES game.)

Well, anyway, enough of my knee jerk analysis. Here are the results:

  1. Persona 5
  2. Dragon Quest III: The Seeds of Salvation
  3. Chrono Trigger
  4. NieR: Automata
  5. Final Fantasy VII
  6. Dragon Quest V: Hand of the Heavenly Bride
  7. Suikoden II
  8. NieR
  9. Persona 3
  10. Final Fantasy XV
  11. Xenoblade Chronicles
  12. Final Fantasy X
  13. Xenogears
  14. Persona 4: Golden
  15. Dragon Quest IV: Chapters of the Chosen
  16. Final Fantasy VI
  17. EarthBound
  18. Final Fantasy IX
  19. Final Fantasy VIII
  20. The Witcher 3: Wild Hunt

I'm glad to see Persona 3 so high. That game is underrated in the West, in my opinion. Final Fantasy VI and Earthbound also climbed up the lists from a number of years ago. Anyway, I found this interesting and thought I would share. I'd be curious to see if Persona 5 remained as popular in the future. It is a much more Japanese-centric game than the previous entries, but I think a recency bias might still play into effect.

Avatar image for jollywoggle
#2 Posted by jollywoggle (8 posts) -

FF XV above Persona 4 Golden haha, also no Elder Scrolls but The Witcher 3 makes the list. That's interesting.

Avatar image for thewildcard
#3 Posted by TheWildCard (693 posts) -

Seems like a lot recent releases on there, but there are some classics on there too. Surprised Persona 4 is below both P3 and P5, wonder if vanilla and golden votes were pooled or not.

Avatar image for buttle826
#4 Posted by buttle826 (281 posts) -

Huh... I like Persona 5, and admittedly, I'm only 3 dungeons in, but best RPG of all time? I imagine all the social commentary in that game hits way harder in Japan than it does in the west. I wonder if that can account for that reaction.

(Not to discount the overwhelmingly positive reaction in the States. I've heard several folks, both friends and press alike, calling it their #1 GOTY contender so far)

Avatar image for kingbonesaw
#5 Posted by KingBonesaw (1356 posts) -

Is this better or worse than Game Informer who named Skyrim their best RPG of all time?

Avatar image for zevvion
#6 Edited by Zevvion (5965 posts) -

Interesting. This obviously has some regional preferences into it, on top of the usual opinion stuff.

Persona is not my thing at all though. I'm not even sure what I would call my favorite RPG of all time. Every single one that I enjoyed also had some major drawbacks to the point that the best ever could release with each new one I play.

I really like Skyrim, but it isn't of very high quality in terms of polish and doesn't have great feeling gameplay. I love Final Fantasy X, but it doesn't have a lot of freedom, its endgame is rather poor and is surprisingly constrained in its armor and weapon customization (there are really only a 2-3 possibilities to spec into). I really liked the idea of Fallout 4, its setting for instance; but thought they didn't execute properly on most fronts that could have made it great.

I truly like The Witcher, as in the first one, for its more complex approaches and systems towards combat and the way it connects lore into the actual gameplay. Drinking potions before battles and such made it stand out and very interesting to play, but it felt too segregated in zones instead of a living world and the gameplay wasn't actually that good at all. I admire parts of The Witcher 3, specifically its story telling during most quests, but that gameplay is too floaty and inconsistent. On top they removed some of the best parts of The Witcher, like drinking potions and such before battles. They don't even have a drinking animation anymore. I'm also one of the few people on these boards that actually loves Andromeda, though I guess I do not have to explain that game has drawbacks as well.

I don't know. Feels like the best RPG of all time is yet to come. When it gets here, it won't really bump anything else from the throne for me either.

Avatar image for savage
#7 Posted by Savage (781 posts) -

Interesting that there are no Japan-only games on the list.

Most of the games on the list would not be surprising to see Western gamers vote for. There's a remarkable amount of similarity in taste displayed here between Japanese (RPG) players and Western (JRPG) players.

Avatar image for fredchuckdave
#8 Edited by Fredchuckdave (10824 posts) -

And Famitsu loses even more credibility. Every Dragon Quest is garbage except for VIII. You fly a fucking Whale to the moon in Final Fantasy IV, what more do you want? Note: The actual two best JRPGs are Vagrant Story and Valkyrie Profile 2, Tactics is probably the best Final Fantasy because of the story. RPG is vague enough to include Nioh/Bloodborne etc.

Avatar image for mikelemmer
#9 Posted by MikeLemmer (1533 posts) -

This list feels off to me. Dragon Quest 3 over Dragon Quest 4? Final Fantasy 15 over Final Fantasy 6? Persona 3 over Persona 4?

Avatar image for luchalma
#10 Posted by Luchalma (537 posts) -

Pretty cool to see The Witcher 3 on the list, even if on the very bottom. If any WRPG is on the list it should be that one.

Avatar image for spaceinsomniac
#11 Posted by SpaceInsomniac (6354 posts) -

03 - Chrono Trigger

04 - NieR: Automata

16 - Final Fantasy VI

17 - EarthBound

What in the actual fuck?

Loading Video...

Avatar image for imhungry
#12 Posted by imhungry (1100 posts) -

That is the correct ordered ranking of Personas 3 through 5.

Avatar image for forkboy
#13 Posted by forkboy (1650 posts) -

And Famitsu loses even more credibility. Every Dragon Quest is garbage except for VIII. You fly a fucking Whale to the moon in Final Fantasy IV, what more do you want? Note: The actual two best JRPGs are Vagrant Story and Valkyrie Profile 2, Tactics is probably the best Final Fantasy because of the story. RPG is vague enough to include Nioh/Bloodborne etc.

Can Famitsu really lose credibility because of what their readers like?

The phrase "recency bias" comes to mind. I dunno, my list of best RPGs is way heavier in western D&D type things, your Planescape: Torment & Baldur's Gate, Dragon Age Origins, along with other Bioware & Interplay jams like KOTOR & Fallout. But of course Japanese people play more JRPGs & like them more. It's at least nice to see The Witcher 3 creep on there so it's not all JRPGs.

Avatar image for gunslingerpanda
#14 Edited by GunslingerPanda (5263 posts) -

It's not even the best Persona game lmao.

Avatar image for grandcurator
#15 Edited by grandCurator (229 posts) -

@imhungry: This guy has the right idea.

That said, this list is still a little strange all things considered. Like, I LOVE Nier: Automata but it's more of a basic character action game than an RPG.

Avatar image for obcdexter
#16 Posted by obcdexter (969 posts) -

You read these from bottom to top, right?

Avatar image for artisanbreads
#17 Edited by ArtisanBreads (9107 posts) -

Loading Video...
Avatar image for artisanbreads
#18 Posted by ArtisanBreads (9107 posts) -

You read these from bottom to top, right?

hahah it's a better list for sure.

Avatar image for matiaz_tapia
#19 Posted by matiaz_tapia (637 posts) -

I imagine all the social commentary in that game hits way harder in Japan than it does in the west. I wonder if that can account for that reaction.

I think this might have a lot to do with it, they did go all in and referenced some real people directly, short of using their real names and likeness. Might be the reason some folks where disappointed in the west as well, as it does not reflect western issues as directly and does not touch current western social problems. Tho there are some parallels.

Avatar image for cmblasko
#20 Posted by cmblasko (2905 posts) -

Even Japan doesn't like FF13.

Online
Avatar image for doctordonkey
#21 Edited by doctordonkey (1799 posts) -

Their not wrong. The flack P5 seems to get on GB is some strange bubble. Game is almost universally praised.

Avatar image for oldenglishc
#22 Posted by oldenglishc (1544 posts) -

My top two, and a few other games in my top 20, didn't even make the list.

Apparently the Japanese have terrible taste in Japanese role playing games. I'm a little shocked that there's no idea factory/compile hearts garbage on the list. I'll give them a little bit of credit for that.

Avatar image for blackichigo
#23 Edited by blackichigo (433 posts) -

@doctordonkey: I don't think anyone's arguing that Persona 5 is a good game. But best RPG of all time? Come On Son. Um saying this as a guy who has Last Surprise as his ringtone.

Unfinished Final Fantasy 15 is above Witcher 3. What kind of bullshit is that? None of this Soulsbournes or Zelda are on this list.

I've always hated lists like these. No one is ever really satisfied with them. Of all the RPGs that have come out in all of time, how is it remotely possible to narrow down that list to 20? There are just so many different varying tastes between game players. Some like a great plot. Others like great characters. Some value choice and being able to build a character the way they want. Most are looking for fun and engaging gameplay. And to some, not having great gameplay isn't even that much of a factor as long as you have some of the other things I've listed.

With all that in mind, even a list of hundred games would be hard. So inherently these lists always end up being "false" because they're so hyperbolic. A better title would have been "Famitsu's 20 must play RPGs".

That is much less hyperbolic and less likely to be "wrong".

Avatar image for dixavd
#24 Edited by Dixavd (2888 posts) -

Glad it clicked so well of there given its focus on Japanese culture. Persona 5's fantastic and most of this list fits my thoughts of the readers of Famitsu. These lists are always going to favour new games, and games that have yet to be recently remastered/remade (which breaks the nostalgia factor). Interesting that no Pokemon game is on this list - I wonder if they don't think of them as RPGs.

As it was a plurality voting system (with 2,295 entrants), 256 votes crowned P5 the winner. I'd expect the result to be very different were it a list-ranking. You can see how this change can result in differences in places from our very own Giant Bomb Community 2016 GOTY Voting. With more (5,795) entrants, and a smaller pool of games (just 2016 titles), and up to 10times per entrant for a game to get a vote, there were still differences with the Plurality and the Weighted List rankings. Famitsu have less entrants and a much larger number of games to choose from with All Time RPGs, ranked list voting would changed a lot.

On the other hand, Persona 3 above Persona 4: Excellent (the only true ranking)!

Avatar image for xanadu
#25 Posted by xanadu (2032 posts) -

Final Fantasy X the best game of all time in 2006. What?? Famitsu sounds like the Forbes of video game journalism.

Avatar image for fezrock
#26 Posted by Fezrock (714 posts) -

Its not just a recency bias there, its a complete lack of non-Japanese RPGs (other than Witcher 3 at the bottom). Where's Baldur's Gate I or II, Planescape: Torment, Fallout: New Vegas, Mass Effect 1 or 2, Morrowind, Vampire: The Masquerade Bloodlines, System Shock 2, Dark Souls, Dues Ex (the original), etc., etc., etc.

Avatar image for teddie
#27 Posted by Teddie (2110 posts) -

Damn, and people complain about GB's top 10 lists being off...

Avatar image for tobbrobb
#28 Posted by TobbRobb (6568 posts) -

@doctordonkey: Persona 5 gets flack here? I haven't really read any threads on it since lul spoilers. But that seems a little weird. It's definitely my personal favorite Persona by a long shot. I could see people liking 3/4 over it just on tone and setting, but is anyone actually arguing P5 is bad?

Avatar image for slag
#29 Posted by Slag (8155 posts) -

Recency bias, kids today :)

eh whatever. Just amazed it wasn't a dragon quest game.

Avatar image for hippie_genocide
#30 Posted by hippie_genocide (2417 posts) -

You read these from bottom to top, right?

Yeah, you might be onto someth.... 2. FFVIII NOPE NOPE NOPE

Avatar image for vincentvendetta
#31 Posted by VincentVendetta (521 posts) -

I feel like there should be a cut-off year for any "best game of all time" poll there, just so people can take a step back and actually ruminate instead of constantly being stuck on the flavour of the month and the technological race.

Avatar image for themanwithnoplan
#32 Posted by TheManWithNoPlan (7829 posts) -

I don't hate it I suppose.

Avatar image for teddie
#33 Posted by Teddie (2110 posts) -

I feel like there should be a cut-off year for any "best game of all time" poll there, just so people can take a step back and actually ruminate instead of constantly being stuck on the flavour of the month and the technological race.

I dunno about that even, the first Nier is on there at #8 and there is no way that'd be on this list if Automata wasn't so popular recently, let alone in the top 10.

Avatar image for liquiddragon
#34 Posted by liquiddragon (3281 posts) -

People get enthusiastic about good new games! Yay! Forget best RPG, at one point Famitsu readers voted FF13 as the best game of all time.

Avatar image for marokai
#35 Posted by Marokai (3711 posts) -

Suikoden II being up there makes me feel warm and fuzzy inside.

Avatar image for nnickers
#36 Posted by nnickers (495 posts) -

The internet has a short memory span and will always over-emphasize recent releases in these kinds of rediculous polls. Remember the hubbub around Undertale being crowned GOAT on Gamefaqs a while back?

Avatar image for shadow
#37 Posted by Shadow (5356 posts) -

With Neir on the list, Persona isn't even my top RPG this year, let alone ever. They're both still too fresh I think and people are putting stuff from this year above games that a few years from now, they'll remember as much lower on their own personal top-whatever lists

Avatar image for teddie
#38 Posted by Teddie (2110 posts) -

Just for comparison, 5795 people voted in the GB community GOTY last year, as opposed to the 2295 people that voted in the Famitsu thing, if the number didn't seem low enough already.

Avatar image for stordoff
#39 Posted by stordoff (1361 posts) -

I'm glad to see Persona 3 so high. That game is underrated in the West, in my opinion.

Underrated, sure, but I'm not sure it should be so high up either (Portable? Let's talk :p). The lack of direct party control plus terrible[0] AI makes the combat FAR more frustrating than it needs to be (Mitsuru casts Marin Karin.........), the menus are convoluted, and the lack of party S. Links significantly reduces the emotional pull of the narrative.

Still a terrific game, but 9th best RPG of all time feels like a stretch.

BTW, do you know if/how the votes were pooled? Seems a little strange to have Persona 3 (not FES) but P4 The Golden, with no sign of the other versions.

[0] By the series standards. I'm sure other games do it way worse.

Avatar image for bradbrains
#40 Posted by BradBrains (2257 posts) -

@savage said:

Interesting that there are no Japan-only games on the list.

Most of the games on the list would not be surprising to see Western gamers vote for. There's a remarkable amount of similarity in taste displayed here between Japanese (RPG) players and Western (JRPG) players.

Sony has stepped up their game when it comes to releasing jrpgs here. Im shocked at the amount of games that comes to vita that would have NEVER made it a decade ago.

Avatar image for frostyryan
#41 Posted by FrostyRyan (2898 posts) -

Who cares about lists like these??? Seriously

Persona 5 is an amazing game. End of.

Avatar image for zevvion
#42 Posted by Zevvion (5965 posts) -

@xanadu said:

Final Fantasy X the best game of all time in 2006. What?? Famitsu sounds like the Forbes of video game journalism.

Different people like different things man. I would actually put Final Fantasy X in my top 10 of all time, most likely.

People get enthusiastic about good new games! Yay! Forget best RPG, at one point Famitsu readers voted FF13 as the best game of all time.

There is probably some truth to that, but as someone who routinely manages his ordered lists because I am a madman, I can honestly say that the type of games that truly resonate with me are just getting better as time goes on. It's not that I do not remember the games I used to like, it's that I can say in full honesty that I am enjoying games way more now because they are better designed and more fun to play.

Avatar image for chrispaul92
#43 Posted by chrispaul92 (149 posts) -

This is like when Undertale came out and its fans were voting it as the greatest game ever made. Pay it no mind.

Avatar image for thewildcard
#44 Edited by TheWildCard (693 posts) -

@kingbonesaw said:

Is this better or worse than Game Informer who named Skyrim their best RPG of all time?

I'd argue worse, the fact that Skyrim still has the mind share it does years later is a point in it's favor (Not that P5 isn't a great game).

@tobbrobb said:

@doctordonkey: Persona 5 gets flack here? I haven't really read any threads on it since lul spoilers. But that seems a little weird. It's definitely my personal favorite Persona by a long shot. I could see people liking 3/4 over it just on tone and setting, but is anyone actually arguing P5 is bad?

No one is really, just some "mehs" which confounds people who are head over heels with it.

Also:

10. Final Fantasy XV

12. Final Fantasy X

16. Final Fantasy VI

18. Final Fantasy IX

Wow!

Avatar image for arbitrarywater
#45 Edited by ArbitraryWater (15666 posts) -

Recency bias and small sample sizes sure are things, I guess. I dunno why people get incensed about lists like these, unless we want to get up in arms about Undertale being crowned "Greatest Game of All Time" by GameFAQs the year it was released again.

Avatar image for theht
#46 Posted by TheHT (15797 posts) -

Holy shit, Witcher 3!

Avatar image for gargantuan
#47 Posted by Gargantuan (1906 posts) -

Wow! RPGs are my favourite game genre and I haven't played a single game on that list. Where's Fallout 1 and Planescape: Torment? Didn't know JRPGs were so popular.

Avatar image for kingbonesaw
#48 Edited by KingBonesaw (1356 posts) -

@gargantuan: Famitsu is a Japanese magazine so based on past history I can see why Fallout might be something that doesn't appear on this list.

Neat to see that Dragon Quest is still as popular over there when several Famicom/Super Famicom games can get named as the best of all time. Now how many Dragon Quest games do I have to buy for them to release Dragon Quest XI in the west.

Avatar image for omgfather
#49 Posted by OMGFather (1027 posts) -

A wild Witcher 3 appeared!

lol at Final Fantasy XV. It's only because it's fresh in peoples' minds, same could be said for Persona 5 actually. Give it time and I doubt FFXV would even make the list, P5 probably just top 5.

Avatar image for sinusoidal
#50 Posted by Sinusoidal (3608 posts) -

Guess I've got to play Dragon's Quest III. I love the heck out of 4, 5, 6 and 8, but never got around to the others. (Aside from 1 which I played as a kid.)

Final Fantasy VIII better than The Witcher 3.