Did you get the bad ending? Is it just me or is it quite stupid?

Obvious spoilers for The Witcher 3. So you get the bad ending if you do three out of these five.

• Say “Relax, you don’t have to be good at everything,” when comforting Ciri during Blood on the Battlefield.
• Missable: Choose to visit the Emperor during Blood on the Battlefield, and say “Definitely need it more than you” to accept payment for bringing Ciri to him.
• Accompany Ciri to the meeting with the Lodge of Sorceresses during Final Preparations.
• Say “Calm down” when Ciri loses her temper during The Child of the Elder Blood.
• Say “No time” when Ciri asks to visit Skjall’s grave at the end of The Child of the Elder Blood.

Now, 2 and 5 are obvious dick moves. But the rest of these are fair and defining them as a lose condition is ridiculous. Moreover, it makes Ciri seem like an overly sensitive child who loses the will to live because I also wanted to attend the Sorceress meeting.

Yeah, not the best handled part of the game. It definitely should have hinged on something else (or, you know, they could have just left out an ending where Ciri dies).

I dunno, I liked the endings and how they were dealt with. They were more about a characters growth and Geralt being there to support said character rather than you making amazing big deal decisions to save the world.

I didn't get the bad ending because all the options I saw to give you the bad ending seemed like poor choices at the time so I guess I can't sympathize. I would be gutted if I did get the bad ending on first try though it's pretty depressing.

I'm pretty sure I did the three that don't seem bad, because I couldn't understand why I got the bad ending. I was especially pissed off because the game took me 5 goddamn months to finish and I was incredibly invested in the characters and world at that point. I felt like I did all good things, but then the payoff is the worst ending in the game. And it's not even well done, apart from the closing shot of all the beasts closing in on Geralt. Absolutely no closure for any of the characters whatsoever. I absolutely loved the game but I felt really screwed over at the end.

I dunno, I felt like it was a pretty logical extension of the whole father-daughter thing. When you think about it, it all kinda goes to the push-pull between wanting what you think is best for Ciri as her father vs. realizing she's an adult and letting her grow up on her own terms.

Also, do you have the DLC installed? If you side with Gaunter O'Dim, he'll offer you a gift at the end. If you choose to know of Ciri's whereabouts, the game'll pretty strongly hint what you need to do to achieve a non-bad ending.

It's definitely handled poorly, but I preferred it over just giving you a binary choice that doesn't take anything you've done previously into account (ala Mass Effect 3, Life is Strange-- hell I'm pretty sure they even just did this in the recent Witcher 3 expansion).

Have any recent games really done a good job with this kind of ending before?

I appreciate the intent behind the Bad End, if not every aspect of its execution. Basically, Ciri's triumph over the White Frost is dependent on her self-confidence, and that's directly related to Geralt's treatment of her. To that end, the game wants you to treat Ciri like a capable adult able to make her own decisions, rather than being an overprotective Witcher dad who wants to do everything for her. However, not all of those inflection points listed above really illustrate that conflict well.

Some do it better than others. For instance, I opted to let Ciri speak with the Lodge by herself, and actually felt proud when Yen told me our pseudo-daughter stood toe to toe with Phillipa fucking Eilhart. At the same time, Choice 1 and 4 are pretty huge whiffs, in my opinion, and I ended up making the "right" choice mostly based on luck, as it's not at all clear what each dialogue option will lead to when you're presented with them.

I happened to get a bittersweet ending that I'm quite happy with, so I wasn't personally slighted by the game, but I do understand where you're coming from.

You ended poorly........

Maybe I lucked out and got a better ending but Ciri is still very much alive in my game. I don't remember exactly but I'm pretty sure I picked all the good sounding choices if not there was a canon (my canon) reason why I wouldn't. Though I found the "Ciri is actually alive" part to be a little handfisted and wrapped up a little too nicely. I enjoyed the ending just fine.

I honestly don't think I've been madder at a game. I put in my six hours today to finish it and the game told me to redo the last three or accept the failure of the last sixty. Because I told her to calm down.

A hint from the game would have been great. Yennifer could take me aside and says "Ciri is an adult now, we need to treat her like one." If anything, the game teaches you that it's all about alliances and difficult choices because that is the rest of the game. Maybe there is a certain amount of dramatic irony in it all coming to down to your relationship with your daughter. But they had a good relationship and I think I treated her like an adult outside of these three choices.

I was like one decision away from getting that ending. The one I got was perfect, and I definitely would have felt cheated if a few seemingly unimportant decisions had screwed that up for me. I don't mind negative consequences to my actions, but negative consequences to a few words imprecisely chosen through a dialogue wheel is asking too much of a pretty clunky mechanic.

On the Lodge thing... what if a player thinks "I should attend the Lodge, there might be valuable information there". Even if there isn't, that's the kind of thing that players very interested in the lore would want to participate in. The Lodge of Sorceresses, this organization that has had so much impact on two games, is finally gathering in one room? Cool! Oh, wait, I got the bad ending in part because I attended it? It's obvious why you shouldn't attend after the fact, but not really beforehand, and I don't think the game does the best job of communicating to you what these options really mean. (the rest of this post is just a general response, not aimed at you).

Someone might argue that communicating something like that would rob the decisions of their significance, but I don't want a game that's at least fifty hours long, usually way more, to give me a bad ending because I decided to tell Ciri that she doesn't have to be good at everything (a reasonable response, I think), because I decided to attend the Lodge of Sorceresses (again, a reasonable decision), and because I tried to get her to calm down instead of trashing that room (also, totally reasonable, also also, trashing a room to get back at someone is very childlike).

I actually looked up "how to get the good ending" a little while after I met Ciri precisely because I was afraid I'd get the bad ending. Games should get themselves into a habit of having multiple endings that are all, in some way, satisfying. I think the only time you should have a bad ending is if you're just reckless and selfish throughout the game. In the case of The Witcher 3, it's especially disappointing because Ciri's other fates are way more interesting and satisfying and memorable, and it would only take a little bit of adjustment for "the bad one" to just not be in the game.

For the record, I couldn't see myself even going for any ending other than the one I got. Ciri became the Empress of Nilfgaard, Cerys rules Skellige, Temeria was restored and Djikstra was killed, and Geralt and Yennefer went off to live in solitude and make love all day. Out of all the endings, it's the one I'd consider best for everyone involved and the one I'm most satisfied with. Spoiled in case you don't know what the other endings are - presumably, everyone in here has finished the game or is OK with being spoiled on general knowledge of how the ending works, but might not want a potential ending spoiled.

I didn't think it was that hard to avoid the bad ending. I only ended up with 2 out of the 5 against me (I sat in on the lodge and told ciri to calm down). 1,2, and 5 all seemed like pretty obvious ones to avoid.

Maybe it's a bit of a dick move to base possibly the saddest result in the game based on whether you treat Ciri like an adult or not, but really how else would they do it? You can't go in yourself so you have very little impact on the white frost. Likewise the most significant years of you being her parent are already done in the books, and most of her training is already done in the books or not lead by you in the game (rather by Avaloch). Other than making it completely out of control they have to gauge somehow how you as a player treat Ciri. They also can't make it obvious and heavy-handed because that's way too cheesy and Geralt should have no idea he is mentally preparing her for a suicide run. So they have to choose subtle events to check how the player treated her.

Most of them are obvious and a couple are not. I think they handled it well, but I guess I'd be annoyed by the system too if I had messed up one more and got the bad ending. It's not perfect but it's acceptable compared to how bad it could be in my opinion.

I was fine with the way they did it and every single ending had a nice emotional impact.

I like the way they did. I got the "good" ending but never felt like I was choosing because I want happy end, nor did I knew what choices mattered until very end. I am really glad there were no R/B/G clear cut decisions . Because of that I chose stuff because it felt organic and because I did not try to game the dialogue.

I really hope Andromeda will not include Paragon/Renegade. But then again it is one of the defining features in Mass Effect games. It is a lose-lose for them.

I was pissed because I got the bad ending for the relationships. I specifically only romanced Triss and never made any moves on anyone else yet in my game Geralt still ends up alone.. for some reason? That was the one thing that kind of ruined the ending for me cause after that emotional goodbye to Ciri all of a sudden I was like "hey wait a minute.. what why??" I think it was a bug.

I agree that Ciri's fate could've been handled a little better. I feel like if Ciri's willpower to save the world is hingeing on a handful of moments, then these moments better be poignant. That is, unfortunately, not the case with two or three of those. For me, it's not that these choices were unreasonable, because I didn't think that they were. It's just that they weren't meaningful enough. In any case, I believe the game still ends on a high note, because all three epilogues are very well-done.

@humanity: That's what you get for choosing Triss.

I don't think the game should warn you about the choices you are making and I definitely don't think that every ending should be in some way rewarding for the player. If you want games to be able to tell more interesting stories then you have to move away from the obvious and be more nuanced.

@baronsamedi: She's way better than Yennefer! She doesn't boss you around and act all moody constantly. She's fun to be around.

@humanity: I never got the vibe of Yennefer bossing you around or being moody. She just seemed strong headed and I felt there were plenty of endearing scenes between her and Geralt. I also just think she has a significantly better voice actor.

@baronsamedi: Hey I mean different strokes (hey-oh!) for different folks. Thats the beauty of these games that there is a different flavor for everyone.

@humanity: Too true. You're still wrong.

I wasn't really thinking about my actions in the long term (hence killing that one witch who wanted to cure the plague, oopsie doops), and apparently I did only one of these things, attending the meeting with the sorceresses. So I dunno, man. If I could stumble my way into the good ending without really thinking about it, that doesn't seem too unfair to me. When it came to Ciri, the only thing I concerned myself with was being a Cool Dad, and I guess that got me the good ending.

Hi, at least you finished it. I broke after I got back to Kaer Morhen.

I agree actually. Liked the ending themselves but the moments to trigger them were super fiddly. The one about trashing the lab is the worst one logic wise.

Like really the right move is not to comfort someone? I don't see that as controlling at all and the destruction is not productive at all.

My first time that was the one that swung me the bad ending actually so that was annoying (not that the bad ending isn't interesting). But I redid it and fixed the issue. Just seems illogical.

To wind up with Triss you have to kiss her during the fireworks scene, immediately help her with the Now or Never quest as soon as it's available, and tell her you love her at the end of that quest. Then, you have to tell Yen that you don't love her anymore at the end of the Last Wish quest. If you did all that, then yes, perhaps it was a bug.

@spaceinsomniac: Yup did all that, was real careful to never even flirt with Yen, still didn't get that ending. Maybe I didn't go do that quest right away but I honestly can't remember. At that point I was mainlining Novigrad quests so I must have just done it as it became available.

I like the bad ending. Also i was lucky to get the perfect Ending without even looking up all this stuff.

In my ending Ciri became a widely known monster hunter, while Geralt and Yennefer retired happily to some secluded cottage. Couldn't have been happier with it. I didn't realize that it was so easy to back into the worst ending though, I kinda just went with my gut and chose whatever I thought would be best for Ciri.

I had no problem with how Ciri's fate in the ending is decided, though I guess that's easy for me to say since I didn't get the bad ending. I appreciate that the game actually attempted to construct the ending through a series of small decisions instead of some "PRESS A TO KILL CIRI, PRESS B TO SAVE HER" thing.

Same for me, and I think this is the main point. That whole part of the ending (which isn't even the whole ending, merely one part of it) hinges on whether or not you/Geralt was there to support her. Don't support her and she doesn't believe in herself and then the 'poor' ending happens.

It's the dumbest part of the game for sure.

And then there are people that say "oh wow, you got the bad ending? Geez, you must have been a complete asshole to Ciri"

FUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUCK OFF.

I agree that a couple of the choices are a little weird or at least presented a little ambiguously, but also think the bad ending is still impossible to get if you're a cool Witcher dad. The only thing I disliked about the ending was not getting to play as Ciri all the time, but I didn't know there were multiple endings then.

I guess if you break down the choices like that it can feel ridiculous. I generally let Ciri be her own person, make her own mistakes and supported her decisions. I got a good ending and was happy with it.

Witcher is my GOTY and the story is incredible but the way that they decide the ending is laughable. And I got a good ending.

I mean seriously, some rando woman that Ciri doesn't even know tells her that Avallach -- who has literally been risking his life for her for the entire game -- hasn't been completely honest with her and Ciri's reaction is to throw a temper tantrum in his lab without even waiting for his side of the story instead of.... oh I don't know... acting like a fucking adult and confronting him about it first? And you're supposed to tell her that's okay? Sounds like phenomenal parenting to me. Telling her to go ahead and act like a spoiled rotten child = good ending. Got it.

It doesn't necessarily need to be rewarding. However, I spent half a year playing this game, as did many others. I don't think the game should have jumped outright and said "HEY YOU COULD GET THE BAD ENDING IF YOU DON'T TREAT CIRI (IN THE WAY THAT WE THINK IS) RIGHT". That would have been worse than what we've got. However, someone above mentioned that the game could have had one or several characters rebuke Geralt for treating Ciri like a child before getting to any of the choices and the choices themselves could have been far better thought out. If a player spends a hundred hours in this game and then decides that they want to attend a lodge and aren't too fond of tearing up some guy's room and would rather avoid meeting the Emperor of Nilfgaard again... well, there you have it, bad ending.

It's not so much a problem with their idea, it's just that what decides Ciri's fate could have been far better communicated. Man, I cannot imagine how angry I might have been if I had watched Ciri die after spending so much of the game trying to find her, only to turn around and watch Geralt die. A game doesn't have to reward the player at every turn and for every story beat, but it must respect a player's time and dedication.

As I've said above, I also don't think it makes that much sense to include such a terrible fate for Ciri. Wouldn't it have been far better if Ciri had survived, but left Geralt to live a more meager path on her own? Have an ending where she doesn't want anything to do with Geralt anymore. That's still a bad ending, because you were not a good father or whatever, but people who get that ending won't feel totally burned, like eighty or a hundred or two hundred hours of gameplay went to waste, but they're also not rewarded. Ciri's still found, still alive, and still has a chance to live a decent life.

Also, developers have to be very careful of how other people think. Case in point, this post:

@pilgore: oh wow, you got the bad ending? Geez, you must have been a complete asshole to Ciri.

That was apart of the point, she isn't perfect she acted in the heat of the moment she was mad with things that she had heard. That's what a lot of people do (yes even adults) it's one of the reasons TW3's characters were so much more convincing to me. Geralt also being an outside factor having known of Avallach and not particularly trusting him from the beginning is naturally going to side against him.

Also if you read the books, Avallac'h's history with Ciri (and by extension the King in Avlalac'h's world) is kind of fucked up.

Anyway, that act alone doesn't give you a good ending by the way, you can still try to calm her down (and fail since she'll remain upset) and then just do the other things (e.g. snowball fight, not accepting the money, burying Skjall, etc.) and still get an ending where she survives. I mean you can be pissed about the way characters handle things but that's about it. We can say it's illogical but we shouldn't really be trying to insert what should have been the ideal thing to do and expect it to have the outcome that we want anyways.

Exactly, the ending isn't about you getting the ending you want or the ending you deem would be satisfactory based on your choices. It's an ending based on how the creators CDPR wrote their characters. The Witcher has never been about you crafting your own story.

@teddie: maybe Fallout NV?

I hate that there's a "fail state" stigma associated with games that don't end with ear-to-ear grins.

The bad ending just kind of confused me, because I guess I didn't let Ciri break a table one time she gave up on life? Dinnae. But the "bad" ending was still cool at the time, even if like...you're left completely confused at what the fuck happens at the climax at the tower thing Ciri steps into.

It is mostly a question of being emphatic to ciri and letting her make up her own mind about certain things that are happening in her life.

Like visiting a certain grave
Doing the snowball fight with ciri
Helping ciri to steal the horses for her friends who are in trouble

...and so on (cant remember all of the stuff that clearly anymore since it has been a few months since i last played the main game)

These things help ciri to survive in the end and enable the better endings.

I was in a vacuum when it came to this game's story, so I didn't even know how the endings were going to be handled. I was just picking the choice that made the most sense as I played. Turns out I got the bad ending. I wasn't mad really though. It's a dark series where bad things happen constantly.

There is no "bad" ending.

Sad perhaps? Tragic? Bitter-sweet even. But not bad.

Yeah, when I did a different play through and made different decisions from that point when you're reunited with Ciri, I pretty much ended up with this conclusion.

I knew I fucked up when I got that drinking scene and when I told her to calm down, dam

Honestly the worst part of the end for me is the portrayal of love between Triss, Yennifer and Geralt. I disagree with, but I understand society's notion of if you love two people you're a bad person, you can only love one person. That's a much larger debate, but that's not what I have a problem with here. So, to set this up, I will first say that there is a justification that Geralt loves these two women, because of the amnesia he has no memory of Yennifer and falls for Triss with fresh memories. He eventually remembers Yennifer, which makes the situation confusing emotionally as he's combining his two lives he lived. Now you have to make a choice and that's fine and completely valid.

Here's where the problem starts. I chose Yennifer and made it clear to both of them that I wanted to be with Yennifer, in which they both seemingly understood and were cool with the situation. There were apologies and the dialogue and sequences that follow make it clear that I'm now faithful to Yennifer. But then in a weird moment at the end, they both cut all ties with you and think that you're trash in a way that was really sudden and surprising, undermining all of the thoughts and sentiments that they were sharing previously, their history with Geralt, and added by the fact that my Geralt was never an asshole about anything.

True love is such a weird and complicated force that it just felt like these writers had a very specific thought process of how they interpret love and it their view of it was forced down my throat. It made me dislike my time with those characters in a huge way, BUT, it also made with connect a lot more with Geralt as a person and made it that much harder that Ciri can't be a regular thing in his life either.