With the Deadly Premonition Endurance Runs both having reached their conclusion, I did a little thinking on a subject that I've considered before, but with Francis York Morgan's adventure in Greenvale at the front of many of our minds, it's one that's worth revisiting. Sometimes, we get so hung up on reviews, review scores and popular opinion that we end up missing out on something that's special in its own little way. Not necessarily "short bus" special, though that can sometimes be the case, but those special games that feature touches or elements that make them stand out in a good way.
Agent Francis York Morgan is one colorful dude. Deadly Premonition is one such game. It's clunky; there's no getting around that. Yet, it's not so clunky that the game becomes unplayable. Its poor enemies, overlarge world layout, too-slow cars and generally substandard graphics compared to other games of this generation don't paint a good first impression. Some users on this site were even annoyed that the game was receiving as much attention as it did under the argument that "Hey, the game obviously sucks, you idiots." Well, no one is going to mistake it for Red Dead Redemption, but why do we seem so focused on limiting ourselves to only playing the top-shelf titles with near-perfect metacritic averages? Granted, there are games out there that are unmistakably huge, smelly, godawful pieces of shit, and we'd all do well to avoid them when possible. Very few people have had the patience for something like Superman on the Nintendo 64, and the ultimate payoff for actually besting that game is minuscule.
A game doesn't necessarily need to be the best in show in order to be fun. Compared to the bottom of the gaming barrel, how bad is something like Deadly Premonition? Honestly, not very. For all of its clunkiness, the game is playable, and depending on how much clunk you're willing to put up with, the act of playing the game could conceivably be enjoyable without intention for irony. In a similar case, I enjoyed my time with Dirge of Cerberus, the Final Fantasy VII shooter for the PS2. For a shooter, the controls in the game were pretty darn clumsy. Some of the bosses were simple to fight; the final boss being no exception. For all of the flash Square Enix put into the visuals and sound, it is, compared to other games of its era, mediocre. However, despite the clunky feel to the controls and gunplay, I honestly still enjoyed playing it. But if I had heeded the advice of most reviews, I wouldn't have been compelled to give it the time of day.
Dante's Inferno may be more technically capable, but it lacks Deadly Premonition's creative heart. And while Deadly Premonition is certainly deficient in aspects of its design and presentation, there are still things about it that make it attractive. The quirky, memorable cast. The crazy plot twists. The strange, pseudo-Twin Peaks vibe that the game exuded before Alan Wake came along to do the same thing. While the crew at Access Games might lack technical prowess and can't quite reach the heights they're aiming for, they're still aiming high, and while maybe they can't reach Mars, they can at least land on the moon. In a world where larger companies spend more money to develop derivative gameplay clones with horribly generic characters and stories, Deadly Premonition goes places that others don't. Yet only those that aren't bound to the will of obtuse review score metrics or the simply curious with an extra $20 to spend are really the only ones that will ever give the game an honest shot. And really, that's the most disappointing thing about Deadly Premonition. The prejudice toward any game that isn't an immediately obvious "AAA."
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With the Deadly Premonition Endurance Runs both having reached their conclusion, I did a little thinking on a subject that I've considered before, but with Francis York Morgan's adventure in Greenvale at the front of many of our minds, it's one that's worth revisiting. Sometimes, we get so hung up on reviews, review scores and popular opinion that we end up missing out on something that's special in its own little way. Not necessarily "short bus" special, though that can sometimes be the case, but those special games that feature touches or elements that make them stand out in a good way.
Agent Francis York Morgan is one colorful dude. Deadly Premonition is one such game. It's clunky; there's no getting around that. Yet, it's not so clunky that the game becomes unplayable. Its poor enemies, overlarge world layout, too-slow cars and generally substandard graphics compared to other games of this generation don't paint a good first impression. Some users on this site were even annoyed that the game was receiving as much attention as it did under the argument that "Hey, the game obviously sucks, you idiots." Well, no one is going to mistake it for Red Dead Redemption, but why do we seem so focused on limiting ourselves to only playing the top-shelf titles with near-perfect metacritic averages? Granted, there are games out there that are unmistakably huge, smelly, godawful pieces of shit, and we'd all do well to avoid them when possible. Very few people have had the patience for something like Superman on the Nintendo 64, and the ultimate payoff for actually besting that game is minuscule.
A game doesn't necessarily need to be the best in show in order to be fun. Compared to the bottom of the gaming barrel, how bad is something like Deadly Premonition? Honestly, not very. For all of its clunkiness, the game is playable, and depending on how much clunk you're willing to put up with, the act of playing the game could conceivably be enjoyable without intention for irony. In a similar case, I enjoyed my time with Dirge of Cerberus, the Final Fantasy VII shooter for the PS2. For a shooter, the controls in the game were pretty darn clumsy. Some of the bosses were simple to fight; the final boss being no exception. For all of the flash Square Enix put into the visuals and sound, it is, compared to other games of its era, mediocre. However, despite the clunky feel to the controls and gunplay, I honestly still enjoyed playing it. But if I had heeded the advice of most reviews, I wouldn't have been compelled to give it the time of day.
Dante's Inferno may be more technically capable, but it lacks Deadly Premonition's creative heart. And while Deadly Premonition is certainly deficient in aspects of its design and presentation, there are still things about it that make it attractive. The quirky, memorable cast. The crazy plot twists. The strange, pseudo-Twin Peaks vibe that the game exuded before Alan Wake came along to do the same thing. While the crew at Access Games might lack technical prowess and can't quite reach the heights they're aiming for, they're still aiming high, and while maybe they can't reach Mars, they can at least land on the moon. In a world where larger companies spend more money to develop derivative gameplay clones with horribly generic characters and stories, Deadly Premonition goes places that others don't. Yet only those that aren't bound to the will of obtuse review score metrics or the simply curious with an extra $20 to spend are really the only ones that will ever give the game an honest shot. And really, that's the most disappointing thing about Deadly Premonition. The prejudice toward any game that isn't an immediately obvious "AAA."
So what you're trying to say with those several hundred words is "Deadly Premonition might not be great, but it's not terrible either, and it's unique." Well, you know what? "Not great, but not terrible" is "mediocre", and I don't want to spend time and money on mediocre games. I enjoy the Endurance Run for three reasons:
It's free.
The commentary is entertaining.
Since the staff play the game for me, I can enjoy the good parts -- the story, the characters and the music -- without having to suffer through the terrible gameplay.
If I had actually went out and bought Deadly Premonition and played it for myself, I would probably have hated it. Because it's not a good game. In fact, it's not even an okay game. It's mediocre.
@Icemael: It's interesting how you can judge a game's quality by not playing it yourself. You can say it "looks" like a mediocre game, but I don't really think you can say it IS one.
I've played the game, and I'll say it's an okay game. Especially for 20 dollars.
@Icemael: I'm just gonna say that there's much more to the game than what was shown in the Endurance Run. I'll also say the controls aren't as bad as people say. :P
" @Seroth: I've seen the story, the characters, the graphics and the gameplay. I've had the controls described to me. I think I have a pretty good idea of what the game's like. "
I'm with you i haven't played the game, but i can tell it sucks, so much so that i couldn't even watch the ER. The worst part about GB ER's are the fanboys that come with it. God forbid you say anything bad about Persona 4 and DP.
Personally, I've never been against enjoying a game with bad and occationally buggy gameplay as long as it has an interesting narrative. Some examples of such games I've played and enjoyed are Galerians: Ash and Legacy of Kain: Defiance.
Before the Endurance Run ended, I was pretty interested in I playing DP, but now that I've seen all of the main storyline it would feel like a bit of a waste of time.
I'm just gonna say I agree with you. This game looks really interesting and unique, and most of all, fun. I loved how they put bossa nova and jazz tunes in serious situations, how they really tried to build a complete sandbox world with attention to some minor details, and you gotta say it regardless of the technical stuff a good story is always a good story. And so are the characters.
I had not played a single Final Fantasy game or possibly even Square Enix game when i played Dirge of Cerberus and that was still a horrible game, i would rather pull my own hair out, hell i would rather play FF12 and i find that game to be a complete borefest.
On topic though, i do love the characters in Deadly Premonition.( Much more then those of FF12 -_-)
" I had not played a single Final Fantasy game or possibly even Square Enix game when i played Dirge of Cerberus and that was still a horrible game, i would rather pull my own hair out, hell i would rather play FF12 and i find that game to be a complete borefest. On topic though, i do love the characters in Deadly Premonition.( Much more then those of FF12 -_-) "
Not every game is going to be everyone's cup of tea, but when you say that you didn't like Dirge of Cerberus, you can at least say that you did play it, as opposed to everyone that chimes in about how bad the game is despite never taking it for a spin. (And I agree, the characters in FFXII weren't particularly memorable, outside of Balthier.)
@Icemael said:
" @Seroth: I've seen the story, the characters, the graphics and the gameplay. I've had the controls described to me. I think I have a pretty good idea of what the game's like. "
Having something described to you and actually experiencing something for yourself are two different things.
Dirge of Cerberus is a strange game to mention here. I found that it wasn't that bad, but i can't say i particularly enjoyed it that much. Sure, it was decent, but it wasn't memorable enough for me to say anything about it.
The problem is that most people on here will look at a game and see that it's not Halo, or MW2, or doesn't have super awesome Crytek engine graphics, and instantly decide it's a piece of crap. Much like their opinions on the Wii and its games.
@Hailinel: But to say you enjoy having shitty controls is a dumb thing to say. I'm not saying anything about the quality of the game, I'm just saying that's an hilarious comment to make.
@jos4: Address the guy that said it then, for I did not. But just saying, he's watched people play through the entire game, he's listened to people who have played the game, he's read write ups about the game -- He's entitled to an opinion. It's not like he's an over zealous fanboy who hates anything with Halo written on the cover with no actual knowledge of the product for example.
" @Seroth: I've seen the story, the characters, the graphics and the gameplay. I've had the controls described to me. I think I have a pretty good idea of what the game's like. "
Having something described to you and actually experiencing something for yourself are two different things. "
If Deadly Premonition was some kind of novel, super-innovative game, sure, simply having it described to you might not have been enough. But combat-wise, it's essentially Resident Evil 4. I've played Resident Evil 4. I've had Deadly Premonition's controls described to me. I've seen what the combat is like.
" @Icemael: I'm just gonna say that there's much more to the game than what was shown in the Endurance Run. I'll also say the controls aren't as bad as people say. :P "
You use the right trigger to aim and the A button to fire your gun. Even if it was responsive that is the most insane thing I've heard since either Dead Rising or the first Resident Evil.
I can agree that Deadly Premonition gets an advantage from being unique and insane. But what you don't understand is that that's where it gets those 2 points from. I think this game is the video game equivalent of Evil Dead. Technically, a very deficient film that gets by somehow, as if by sheer will to be unique and crazy, and is beloved because of it. That makes SWERY into video games' Sam Raimi.
I suppose that makes Miyamoto into Spielberg, Kojima into Kubrick, and Houser into Tarantino.
" @Hailinel: Because I've seen how it plays, and heard how it plays. And it doesn't play well. "
I for one, enjoy the terrible controls. "
That's the dumbest thing I've read all day. "
"Because I've seen how it plays, and heard how it plays. And it doesn't play well. " Now, THAT'S the dumbest thing I've read all day! "
Hey, why not cut your arm off with a rusty saw. You might think you've got a pretty good idea of what it feels like, but really, it feels great! What do you mean, you won't try it? That's the dumbest thing I've heard all day!
" @Icemael: I'm just gonna say that there's much more to the game than what was shown in the Endurance Run. I'll also say the controls aren't as bad as people say. :P "
You use the right trigger to aim and the A button to fire your gun. Even if it was responsive that is the most insane thing I've heard since either Dead Rising or the first Resident Evil. "
Wait, isn't that essentially how Resident Evil 4 played? Shoulder button to bring out gun, face button to shoot dude in face? What's weird about that?
Wait, you're complimenting Dirge of Cerberus? That game sucked! Granted, it had serious potential, both in terms of story (Vincent was always an interesting character) and gameplay (see story), but they fucked it up on both fronts.
" @Hailinel: But to say you enjoy having shitty controls is a dumb thing to say. I'm not saying anything about the quality of the game, I'm just saying that's an hilarious comment to make.
@jos4: Address the guy that said it then, for I did not. But just saying, he's watched people play through the entire game, he's listened to people who have played the game, he's read write ups about the game -- He's entitled to an opinion. It's not like he's an over zealous fanboy who hates anything with Halo written on the cover with no actual knowledge of the product for example. "
Anyways, it's hard for me to understand how someone can say a game is mediocre withouth playing it at all, no matter how many videos you may have seen. You can actually be discouraged to play it, but how on Earth can you tell someone who actually played it "No man, the game is mediocre!" and keep a smile on your face?
" @Icemael: I'm just gonna say that there's much more to the game than what was shown in the Endurance Run. I'll also say the controls aren't as bad as people say. :P "
You use the right trigger to aim and the A button to fire your gun. Even if it was responsive that is the most insane thing I've heard since either Dead Rising or the first Resident Evil. "
Wait, isn't that essentially how Resident Evil 4 played? Shoulder button to bring out gun, face button to shoot dude in face? What's weird about that? "
Because Resident Evil 4 has bad controls. Even for it's time they weren't great, but especially years later it's impossible to play it and not be frustrated (Wii version excluded). And Deadly Premonition looks like it has very similar controls that are just less responsive plus a lot of glitching. That being said, I loved the endurance run, and I think I would've enjoyed playing it despite all of it's shortcomings, but I don't think I'll attempt it now after watching all of the parts that interested me.
" Wait, you're complimenting Dirge of Cerberus? That game sucked! Granted, it had serious potential, both in terms of story (Vincent was always an interesting character) and gameplay (see story), but they fucked it up on both fronts. "
Yep, I am. I didn't have the highest expectations for it, and when it came out, I was not particularly a fan of Final Fantasy VII in general. But I actually found the story fun and the gameplay was okay. Game of the Year material, no, but I'll still say I liked it, even though it does result in the occasional "What the hell are you smoking?" response. Otherwise, I'd be lying.
" @Hailinel: But to say you enjoy having shitty controls is a dumb thing to say. I'm not saying anything about the quality of the game, I'm just saying that's an hilarious comment to make.
@jos4: Address the guy that said it then, for I did not. But just saying, he's watched people play through the entire game, he's listened to people who have played the game, he's read write ups about the game -- He's entitled to an opinion. It's not like he's an over zealous fanboy who hates anything with Halo written on the cover with no actual knowledge of the product for example. "
Anyways, it's hard for me to understand how someone can say a game is mediocre withouth playing it at all, no matter how many videos you may have seen. You can actually be discouraged to play it, but how on Earth can you tell someone who actually played it "No man, the game is mediocre!" and keep a smile on your face? "
" @Hailinel: Because I've seen how it plays, and heard how it plays. And it doesn't play well. "
I for one, enjoy the terrible controls. "
That's the dumbest thing I've read all day. "
"Because I've seen how it plays, and heard how it plays. And it doesn't play well. " Now, THAT'S the dumbest thing I've read all day! "
Hey, why not cut your arm off with a rusty saw. You might think you've got a pretty good idea of what it feels like, but really, it feels great! What do you mean, you won't try it? That's the dumbest thing I've heard all day! "
Good thing it was you who said that! ;-) Come on man, go try Deadly Premonition! What if you fall in love with its gameplay??
I get your point, but one issue I have is with the title. I highly doubt under ANY circumstance, that a game that is widely recognized as a 10 would be less worthwhile then a game recognized as a 2.
" I get your point, but one issue I have is with the title. I highly doubt under ANY circumstance, that a game that is widely recognized as a 10 would be less worthwhile then a game recognized as a 2. "
The title is actually in reference to IGN's review score for the game. As a title, I thought it was at least eye-catching.@masternater27 said:
" @Hailinel said:
" @Brodehouse said:
" @Seroth said:
" @Icemael: I'm just gonna say that there's much more to the game than what was shown in the Endurance Run. I'll also say the controls aren't as bad as people say. :P "
You use the right trigger to aim and the A button to fire your gun. Even if it was responsive that is the most insane thing I've heard since either Dead Rising or the first Resident Evil. "
Wait, isn't that essentially how Resident Evil 4 played? Shoulder button to bring out gun, face button to shoot dude in face? What's weird about that? "
Because Resident Evil 4 has bad controls. Even for it's time they weren't great, but especially years later it's impossible to play it and not be frustrated (Wii version excluded). And Deadly Premonition looks like it has very similar controls that are just less responsive plus a lot of glitching. That being said, I loved the endurance run, and I think I would've enjoyed playing it despite all of it's shortcomings, but I don't think I'll attempt it now after watching all of the parts that interested me. "
Actually, I recall the prevailing opinion of the game's controls as being fairly positive. I mean, sure, you couldn't move and shoot, but that's generally how real life works. You can't expect to be able to be on the run and firing multiple headshots while also managing the gun's recoil as though it doesn't exist.
My guess is that the controls are horrible, but I'm not going to try to say I know for sure, because I don't. I haven't played it, and probably never will, but I trust the generous number of people that I've heard that very same judgement from. Maybe I'm in the minority, but I don't ever come to a game for good story, I come to them to have fun physically playing them. If I want a story, I'll watch a movie, or some TV. Don't get me wrong, a good story is welcomed, but sometimes I'd rather not even have to sit through the cutscenes that lay, even a good story, out. I think it's the reason I've never gotten past the first 20 minutes of Bioshock.
" @Icemael: I'm just gonna say that there's much more to the game than what was shown in the Endurance Run. I'll also say the controls aren't as bad as people say. :P "
You use the right trigger to aim and the A button to fire your gun. Even if it was responsive that is the most insane thing I've heard since either Dead Rising or the first Resident Evil. "
Wait, isn't that essentially how Resident Evil 4 played? Shoulder button to bring out gun, face button to shoot dude in face? What's weird about that? "
Resident Evil 4's controls are dated. They worked fine last generation, but that style of gameplay has been refined to the point where going back to Resident Evil 4 is hard as hell. Add to that the fact that Resident Evil 4 required more strategy that "shoot everyone in the face" -- making enemies stagger and using melee attacks was just as important -- and that Deadly Premonition has the most boring enemy design I've seen in a long, long time, and you have... a steaming pile of shit.
" @Icemael: I'm just gonna say that there's much more to the game than what was shown in the Endurance Run. I'll also say the controls aren't as bad as people say. :P "
You use the right trigger to aim and the A button to fire your gun. Even if it was responsive that is the most insane thing I've heard since either Dead Rising or the first Resident Evil. "
Wait, isn't that essentially how Resident Evil 4 played? Shoulder button to bring out gun, face button to shoot dude in face? What's weird about that? "
Resident Evil 4's controls are dated. They worked fine last generation, but that style of gameplay has been refined to the point where going back to Resident Evil 4 is hard as hell. Add to that the fact that Resident Evil 4 required more strategy that "shoot everyone in the face" -- making enemies stagger and using melee attacks was just as important -- and that Deadly Premonition has the most boring enemy design I've seen in a long, long time, and you have... a steaming pile of shit. "
Really, you find it that hard to go back to that? I can't say I feel the same.
" @Icemael: I'm just gonna say that there's much more to the game than what was shown in the Endurance Run. I'll also say the controls aren't as bad as people say. :P "
You use the right trigger to aim and the A button to fire your gun. Even if it was responsive that is the most insane thing I've heard since either Dead Rising or the first Resident Evil. "
Wait, isn't that essentially how Resident Evil 4 played? Shoulder button to bring out gun, face button to shoot dude in face? What's weird about that? "
Resident Evil 4's controls are dated. They worked fine last generation, but that style of gameplay has been refined to the point where going back to Resident Evil 4 is hard as hell. Add to that the fact that Resident Evil 4 required more strategy that "shoot everyone in the face" -- making enemies stagger and using melee attacks was just as important -- and that Deadly Premonition has the most boring enemy design I've seen in a long, long time, and you have... a steaming pile of shit. "
Really, you find it that hard to go back to that? I can't say I feel the same. "
It's... playable, but not very enjoyable. Not after playing Dead Space, and Resident Evil 4: Wii Edition.
Actually, I recall the prevailing opinion of the game's controls as being fairly positive. I mean, sure, you couldn't move and shoot, but that's generally how real life works. You can't expect to be able to be on the run and firing multiple headshots while also managing the gun's recoil as though it doesn't exist. "
Realism doesn't necessarily mean it's fun, or even good.
Actually, I recall the prevailing opinion of the game's controls as being fairly positive. I mean, sure, you couldn't move and shoot, but that's generally how real life works. You can't expect to be able to be on the run and firing multiple headshots while also managing the gun's recoil as though it doesn't exist. "
Realism doesn't necessarily mean it's fun, or even good. "
@Hailinel: I always thought DoC had an interesting soundtrack, which can sometimes make an okay game into a great one (Valkyrie Profile 2). How was the sound quality in the actual game? I imagine it's not easy to get Hamauzu's compositional style onto a DVD without quite a lot of compression.
It was actually not the gameplay that put me off of DoC, but the story. Could never get on board with the FFVII compilation. And as I understand it, Vincent pines over Lucretia, stops a digitized Hojo from resurrecting...something, then hooks up with a loli? Am I even close?
" @Hailinel: I always thought DoC had an interesting soundtrack, which can sometimes make an okay game into a great one (Valkyrie Profile 2). How was the sound quality in the actual game? I imagine it's not easy to get Hamauzu's compositional style onto a DVD without quite a lot of compression.
It was actually not the gameplay that put me off of DoC, but the story. Could never get on board with the FFVII compilation. And as I understand it, Vincent pines over Lucretia, stops a digitized Hojo from resurrecting...something, then hooks up with a loli? Am I even close? "
Well, to summarize, a good chunk of the plot involved flashbacks to Vincent's relationship with Lucrecia, whom he is finally able to let go of in the end. As for Hojo, he had actually uploaded a copy of his mind to the network, which eventually took over Weiss's mind while he was in stasis. He planned to use Weiss for his own gain, but in the end the Hojo memory copy was erased when Weiss regained control of himself. As for the "loli," Shelke was drafted into Deep Ground when she was nine. The experiments that Shinra ran on her stopped her age progression, so by the time of Dirge of Cerberus, she's actually a nineteen-year-old in a child's body. She also had a copy of Lucrecia's personality uploaded into her mind, allowing her to predict what Vincent would do, but the emotional backwash, as it were, from Lucrecia's memories make Shelke sympathetic to him. Vincent never "hooks up" with her, but rather, the two form a friendship based on their odd sort of understanding of each other. At least, this is how I recall the story, as it's been a couple of years since I last played it.
Resident Evil 4's controls were fine before, but now they're not? How does that happen? Sounds like this is the fault of the people playing games and not the game itself.
@LordAndrew: A lot has changed in the realm of third person shooters in the past 5 years. It's probably been the most actively evolving genre of the latter half of the 00s. Those controls aren't ideal in 2010, not to mention that the combat looks flat as hell in DP.
How is Resident Evil meant to distinguish itself from any other shooter on the market if it didn't play mechanically different? Same goes for Deadly Premonition, although admittedly they didn't accomplish it as well. However, I will say this, if DP''s controls actively made it hard to play and prevented the player from progressing, I could see Icemael's point. Although it's better for controls to be great, I can still go back and play the original RE/ Silent Hill. They're clunky but it's not a big deal. And watching VJ they played for the most part very well indeed, able to do most things with ease, so what I saw were controls that were definitely playable. Also, the writing and voice-acting in Deadly Premonition is better than any of the core Resident Evil or Silent Hill games that I've played or witnessed, an achievement in-itself for a budget game. It has a better narrative and concept as well imo, with some symbolism thrown in for good measure. I endorse Haillinel's point, Gamerankings and Metacritic are not an infallible yardstick of what's worth playing. If you buy a game only because of score then you will miss the variety and enjoyment gaming can provide.
" So what you're trying to say with those several hundred words is "Deadly Premonition might not be great, but it's not terrible either, and it's unique." Well, you know what? "Not great, but not terrible" is "mediocre", and I don't want to spend time and money on mediocre games. I enjoy the Endurance Run for three reasons:
It's free.
The commentary is entertaining.
Since the staff play the game for me, I can enjoy the good parts -- the story, the characters and the music -- without having to suffer through the terrible gameplay.
If I had actually went out and bought Deadly Premonition and played it for myself, I would probably have hated it. Because it's not a good game. In fact, it's not even an okay game. It's mediocre.
Actually, I recall the prevailing opinion of the game's controls as being fairly positive. I mean, sure, you couldn't move and shoot, but that's generally how real life works. You can't expect to be able to be on the run and firing multiple headshots while also managing the gun's recoil as though it doesn't exist. "
Realism doesn't necessarily mean it's fun, or even good. "
It doesn't necessarily mean bad, either. "
But in this case I, and many others, would argue it IS bad. That's why you don't see games that control like that anymore. Except RE5, which I couldn't play because I thought it controlled poorly.
" @LordAndrew: A lot has changed in the realm of third person shooters in the past 5 years. It's probably been the most actively evolving genre of the latter half of the 00s. Those controls aren't ideal in 2010, not to mention that the combat looks flat as hell in DP. "
But if a game was playable five years ago, how is it suddenly unplayable now? Aspects may be changed or improved, but that doesn't invalidate the inherent playability of the mechanic as it existed once upon a time.
Actually, I recall the prevailing opinion of the game's controls as being fairly positive. I mean, sure, you couldn't move and shoot, but that's generally how real life works. You can't expect to be able to be on the run and firing multiple headshots while also managing the gun's recoil as though it doesn't exist. "
Realism doesn't necessarily mean it's fun, or even good. "
It doesn't necessarily mean bad, either. "
But in this case I, and many others, would argue it IS bad. That's why you don't see games that control like that anymore. Except RE5, which I couldn't play because I thought it controlled poorly. "
If it's so bad and no one does it anymore, where do you think that the gunplay in Gears of War evolved from?
" @LordAndrew: A lot has changed in the realm of third person shooters in the past 5 years. It's probably been the most actively evolving genre of the latter half of the 00s. Those controls aren't ideal in 2010, not to mention that the combat looks flat as hell in DP. "
But if a game was playable five years ago, how is it suddenly unplayable now? Aspects may be changed or improved, but that doesn't invalidate the inherent playability of the mechanic as it existed once upon a time. "
It certainly isn't unplayable, that shooting structure just isn't the ideal form from a gameplay perspective. It can certainly be fun when implemented in a well constructed game like RE4 or RE5, but DP doesn't get that pass because the combat is bootsy as all hell.
@masternater27:Resident Evil has never controlled like other games, and to expect it to is rubbish. Both RE4/5 have great control schemes that revolutionised the survival horror paradigm. Arguably they're no longer survival horror but they still play well, if not for everyone's taste - there's a bunch of other action games to accomodate you.
@masternater27:There was alot of stuff that RE5 did wrong, alot of stuff....
But on topic, I don't see why people are complaining about the controls in RE4. I popped it in a few days ago and played it for a good while. You have to remember that unlike Gears or Uncharted, the game isn't based around cover. Outside of the over the shoulder camera, almost nothing about the combat is the same. For the most part the Villagers don't have projectiles, and even when they do, they aren't constantly shooting. Another major difference between them is, that the villagers just swarm Leon, unlike most Third Person Shooters where they take cover, so in my opinion, it works fine for the game. It's the same with DP, except DP has some other stuff wrong with the shooting that doesn't just pertain to the controls.
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