Musai

It's such a bummer that the majority of hardcore gamers are mostly men though! Don't you think? I really want that number to change, but that hinges more on society's expectations that teenage girls shouldn't like stuff like D&D or tabletop games or cRPGs or grand strategy. That's an entirely different discussion.

Don't let it dishearten you. There's a lot to be encouraged about.

It's certainly toxic because it matters. Since it matters, people are rather invested in it. The more people get invested in something, the more potentially toxic to discussion it becomes.

But in this case, there's a lot of reason for hope. Don't let the toxicity worry you too much. All worthwhile efforts to improve things have resistance, but no matter how much anyone yells or denies it, sex and gender will continue to grow as a topic within gaming.

I have at times lamented how topics like this can bring out truly terrible comments, and it unfortunately brings out the worst in some usually decent people. But that's the very nature of long-standing issues only seeing more light in recent times. There's a massive understanding gap, and most of those pushing for improvement are still new to the effort. So you face entrenched resistance with an imperfect challenge, and things can get messy. But that's because it's young, at least in videogames. Heck, even the larger modern effort for improvement regarding sex and gender within much of the world is still young in the big picture, and so, it is an uphill journey that is fortunately already showing signs of improvement. What was once an if is now more of a when.

And as far as around here, as some have brought up, I think there are changing tides. More and more people seem to understand, and many more are opening up to it at least having a discussion. We do have a few main commenters who bring down topics like this and add to general toxicity, but they will get tired. Even some moderators are rather resistant to topics such as this, and they help hold back efforts to improve Giant Bomb for everyone. But even they will tire. Because as long as people care, and as long as more people are open to understanding all of this, it won't just go away. It will still be here and elsewhere, and no efforts to keep it down or stamp it out will succeed in the long run.

The staff have rather openly grown on this over the years, as well, and with them, so too goes Giant Bomb. Some people around here may put up a good fight, but those of us who care about gaming and all of the different gamers who enjoy it will not just lay down because it's difficult. It's tiring; no doubt. And I lose heart at times because some people make it especially frustrating. But then I am encouraged by others who stand up against the more destructive elements here and elsewhere. And I remember that no matter how loud or strong some people may fight to the bitter end, this is something worth talking about and improving on.

Because it matters, it will often be a toxic topic. But because it matters, we can't give up on it.

@theht said:

Definitely agreeing with this sentence here.

I'll be the first to admit that I don't like it when people are attacked as being sexist just for trying to create a cool looking character, or trying to tell an interesting story, or (heaven forbid) giving a character believable flaws.

When Carolyn attacks the creators of Persona 4 for being 'homophobic,', I get upset. That game does a great job of developing characters who have conflicting feelings regarding sexuality, and how they respond to them. It's crazy to suggest that the creators have an irrational hatred for gay people.

When Patrick attacks DanganRonpa for 'not handling gender issues well, because there's a character who (spoilers),' I get upset because he makes it sound like (spoilers) is a negative or bad thing, and it's one of the best portrayals of a character like that in a game, especially considering all the other characters treating that person with respect.

When pretty much anybody attacks the creators of Tomb Raider because "a woman with a large bust only exists to titillate men" and that she "can't be taken seriously as an archaeologist," it upsets me. Putting it bluntly, I have some big ol' tits myself, and it feels kind of personal when everyone associates a busty character to 'only exist as male fantasy' and implying that women who naturally have that kind of body can't be seen as anything other than a sex object.

And when Anita calls Miyamoto 'a serial misogynist' for making a series about two brothers who save the land, by dunking a dinosaur in lava so that the princess can get back to ruling the kingdom, I get upset because that kind of thing is a serious accusation. You don't just casually insist that someone has a genuine hatred for all women just because he goes for the 'unlikely plumber/elf boy saves the world so that the ruler can rule it again' storyline. The amount of people who claim that Miyamoto is a misogynist after hearing her say that is shocking.

So yup. From my viewpoint, there's a lot of attacking from journalists about fictional and creative games. There's also a lot of 'speaking on behalf of all women' which I don't tend to approve of, either. I just want to play games with a lot of creativity, y'know? Not be branded a misogynist homophobic scumbag every other week just because I think the costumes look awesome in Soul Calibur, or that Kerrigan in Starcraft looks awesome, or because I don't see anything wrong with characters that look visually attractive, or because I like playing some games that have male characters. Those kinds of accusations on gaming sites tend to feel pretty personal, and it weirds me the heck out when I say something like "Oh man, I loved DOA2 on the Dreamcast!" online, and a bunch of people suddenly rush to call me a gross disgusting misogynist, even though I'm a girl (as irrelevant as it may be). I just like stylish fighting games, and I don't see anything wrong with characters that look stylish within it. D:

I don't know why people keep beating this drum, because it's just wrong. A while ago, I remember seeing a news story about this woman's kid who wanted to play with a neighbor's dog, and the dog ended up biting the kid. The woman didn't like that, so she went next door and lured the dog out with some food, then poured gasoline on the dog, and then set the dog on fire. Then she went inside and tweeted about it using a twitter account tied to her real name. She was proud of what she did, laughed about it, and closed one of her tweets with "#notalldogsgotoheaven"

People will actually admit to felony animal cruelty using their real life name over the internet. Telling a random stranger that you don't agree with to go fuck themselves is nothing in comparison, and real life names wouldn't change that.

The issue for articles at least is that topics that are bound to cause a lot of discussion require a more subtle approach and that can get lost in writing. Commenters on the internet then often respond immediately with statements that are not fully considered because they didn't take the time to really stop and reflect.

Then writers respond to the vitriol in a way that welcomes trolls and more snap, immediate responses. You see this a lot with people who call out commenters that yell about reviews. The writers feel better in the moment because they call out bad users and the bad users are reinforced to do bad because they were mentioned. It's all just a viscous cycle.

I don't know why people can't handle women who are in roles other than where they are assumed to typically be (I suppose?). I saw this happen first hand with the many female bosses I've had over the years. From that experience I've learned that most assertive female women are inevitably going to be called a 'bitch' because they make demands and have high expectations. I never got it. It's amazingly juvenile.

Damn all these discussions and so few hit in on the head imo. "People are assholes!" men or women. I grew up with 4 older sisters, and I was raise by my mother basically by herself. I have seen sexism in its worst form happen to my own families. Where my sister's boss basically told her to take off her cloth in the middle of the office as to "lighten the mood". As a child, I love to cook. I was the only boy in the cooking class in high school, you guys think some men in gaming are monsters? The level of harassment I went through just because I took a fucking cooking class was disgusting and the harassing was done by women.

People are fucking assholes, men and women. Call them out, ignore them or take legal action are all you can do as a person. An internet discussion is great, I especially love this community but lets not be ignorant idealist and think that just by talking about it a lot the problem will go away. The only reason people are not constantly murdering each other is because it is illegal and there are actual consequences for that. Until there is a way to bring actual real world consequences to internet assholes, this will continue to happen.