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OpusOfTheMagnum

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OpusOfTheMagnum

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@falconer: Totally reasonable haha.

I agree that it should be reasonable to unlock everything with reasonable effort, that's why I prefer things to be on a curve:slow for a healthy period early on and then ramp up the rate of progress over time until you can quickly collect vehicles and boost them up. I don't want the whole game to be a slow burn but I feel like that slow burn quickly disapears in more recent games (particularly after the backlash against 5) disappears. Even in Horizon 1 I felt it didn't last but I seem to remember a less significant upgrade mechanic than the Motorsport games had.

Keep in mind that we seem to have very different ideas of what pace the game should progress. I'm the guy who only plays Civilization at Marathon speeds, I enjoy very slow, uphill progression in some games, especially more technical or strategic games.

@shivoa: That gives me a bit of hope I suppose, but I can't shake how many credits Jeff had relative to the costs of things in the game.

Can you discard a car rather than sell it? I don't want to trade a bunch of free cars for excess cash flow, as odd as that may be. But if I can avoid the random free car stuff that would help a lot.

I plan on picking the game up and regardless will probably enjoy the hell out of it. Just want to see how the PC version irons out before making a platform decision.

Thanks for the info folks!

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OpusOfTheMagnum

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One thing that has me concerned about Horizons 3 is the trend the series seems to be starting by making the flow of credits TOO fast and preventing a feeling of "building" a collection of unique cars that I as a driver decided to invest in over other options and upgrading them over time with hard earned credits.

I fell in love with Forza Motorsports 2 back when I was a youngster in high school. My dad was a bit of a "petrol head," and it was something that mashed our interests together to let us bond a bit, and actually led to me caring much about vehicles beyond usefulness.

I really enjoyed the pacing that the game had to it. I spent a chunk of time racing in a particular car, buying a few of the mid range upgrades to try and improve it's handling and capabilities. I quickly realized how little I knew about how the components of a car could impact handling and drivability. I started out just trying to crank up the 'fast' meter. Bigger engines? Yup! Stock tires? Whatever it's just a bit of rubber under the car!

This presented me with a couple of genuinely enjoyable challenges: a car that was difficult to drive without skill and a need to gain understanding so I could fix my mistakes with my next investment in parts.

A car that was difficult to control was great for pushing me to learn about the physics and mechanics of racing a car. I'm no expert and I'm not great at Forza but I really enjoyed the learning process. I found the tuning options and read every detailed explanation of how it worked. This gave me valuable context and insight on why vehicles do what the do and handle how they do. It helped me learn to control acceleration during cornering, how important tires are (they are your interface with the road, of course they are important!), and a bunch of other lessons I've either forgotten over the years or simply internalized as instinct. After doing research I started to do track tests, experimenting with what I could make the car do. I looked at what I did and what happened and investigated until I found what I believed to be the underlying physics of it. I became a much better driver between the extra practice and the context I had gained. Essentially what happened was I had a car that was too hard for me to drive at my level of experience and it forced me to rapidly improve my skills and knowledge. While this first basic lesson (upgrade tiresearly on to take advantage of additional torque, horsepower, and prowess) was the most memorable, I learned plenty of other lessons along the way. It was a lot of fun and helped develop my cognitive abilities outside of the game.

The need to fix the problems I was experiencing was another fun lesson the game funneled me into. I needed to figure out what to upgrade and why. I needed to learn what the various components contributed to the overall ride and performance of the car. I even learned that sometimes the "best" upgrade was a myth and could be detrimental if it didn't fit well with my driving style and skill. I started to experiment and investigate some of the less exciting upgrades. Anti roll bars was one that I remember spending a lot of time investigating. I had little understanding about understear and oversteer or other mechanics involved with such components and experimenting with the tuning on them helped me find the style of ride I liked best and was most successful with. I read all of the detailed information in the upgrades menu as well as the tuning menu. There was a wealth of intel in those descriptions. I ran laps with varying tuning setups to see what the extremes did, what smaller differences did. Eventually I fine tuned it to fit my general driving style, until I was happy with the results. I did this with most of the upgrades, buying a couple at a time until I was all kitted out.

Over time I ended up with an Audi AA and Mini Cooper all souped up. The Mini Cooper excelled at maneuvering and cornering, unsurprisingly, and was a favorite of mine for tight courses. The Audi I built more for speed and stability, great for curvy but moderate courses. I also fell in with one of the classic muscle cars and turned it into a barely controlled monster. That one ended up being a favorite of mine for quite a while, due to the engagement level required to keep it going where I wanted.

As time went on I also slowly weened off most of the assists other than the racing line, which stayed at "braking only."

It gave me a nice boost of credits and allowed me to invest more rapidly in cars and parts without trivializing big investments. I liked this pace a lot. It suited me. I like to take my time and be given the opportunity to master something before moving on. I enjoyed the journey from stock car to racing legend. It was a mixture of pride at my work, satisfaction from the challenges I faced, and curiosity about the subject.

More recent games seem to be going well away from this kind of pacing, throwing credits at the player faster than they care to spend them. I think Jeff has commented on his lack of motivation to decrease assists or increase difficulty due to how fast credits are earned in both this game and the last Motorsports title. On top of that in the quick look he fully upgraded his Interceptor from stock to max (or close anyhow) for a handleful of credits.

The game also seems to have semi regular games of chance that might gove you some new exotic car. The last thing I want is to get a bunch of free Ferari's and Lambos dropped in my lap. I would much rather earn it over time so it feels like an investment rather than a purchase made on a whim.

Anyone else prefer the slow burn Forza used to take? Or am I the obly crazy person on this boat?

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OpusOfTheMagnum

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How long has the game been in development? Considering the scope of the project it seems surprising that so many are concerned by the pace of released content.

I'm not saying that the project is being managed perfectly or even all that well I just feel like there's too much we don't know as outsiders from the industry and just as much we can't know given the nature of the beast at hand. We all know that developing in "Early Access" is awkward and brings new challenges but we don't seem to acknowledge that in our stances on projects like this.

I'm definitely concerned with the feature creep issues but it seems that stuff has been curbed fpr the most part. Especially as the tech for the structure they want to provide starts to come together like with the recent reveal of planets and the like, I'm mot as on edge as a lot of people.

Remember, games like GTA take years and years and years of development and often have severe management issues behind them, but they still turn out to be quite good.

Personally I put a bit of money into the project so I could follow it casually and wait to see what comes of it. I won't feel betrayed if it all falls apart some day, because I feel the ride along the way will be interesting enough on its own.

Time will tell I suppose.

I haven't read into this yet, as a disclosure, I just feel people are too sure of their positions on the project without the right amount of context and big picture comprehension. I'll read this later for sure and maybe it'll change my views on the matter a bit.