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OrangePylon

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Why I think it's hard for GB to diversify the staff.

It looks like Giant Bomb's new hires are turning into a bit of an issue, and not because of their unspellable last names.

So Dan and Jason are white dudes. Lots of folks were hoping that the new hire would be a woman or a member of a minority group. Patrick Klepek's interest in the polarizing "feminism and minority representation in gaming" debate has, in turn, cultivated a crowd of duders and duderettes who want to see more diversity in the Giant Bomb cast of characters. With all of the gaming diversity debate shitstorms on GB, it might seem hypocritical that they ended up hiring two white dudes anyway. Since this is a personality-driven website, it's natural for people to want someone they can identify with for the sake of discussions and reviews/quick looks, so I fully understand the desire to see a female or minority staff member. However, I also think this view is misguided and shows a lack of understanding of the range of abilities a person needs to have in order to do what Giant Bomb does.

Giant Bomb needed to hire people who are well-established, experienced, and skilled in this weird on-camera video game personality field. They needed people who can produce high-quality content without a long gestation period to learn the craft. Otherwise you're just asking for shitty, boring, awkward, meandering content. There are very very few people in the world who have that kind of experience, who have proven themselves capable of producing great off-the-cuff content and discussion about video game bullshit. Out of that already narrow pool, how many are women or minority? It's probably not a lot. That's a sad fact of this subculture, it happened to start with nerdy white dudes, then stereotyped as something that only white guys did for so long that the scene has become extremely protective of its demographic. In this kind of environment, it makes sense that the most able candidates for something like a Giant Bomb staffer would end up being white dudes. It's incredibly unfortunate, but that's the world we live in.

You could argue that maybe they could hire a less experienced or skilled candidate for the sake of an alternate perspective, and maybe grow their skills from there. I don't think Giant Bomb can afford to do that with its paid full-time employees. The value of this site's content rests in how well you know these people and their quirks, so the site needs to stay somewhat "small" in order to retain the audience familiarity. Because the staff needs to remain small, yet still consistently produce interesting and popular content, every single member of the staff needs to be at the top of their game. It's not the kind of place that can act as a proving ground for the inexperienced, unless CBSi wants to bring in some interns (which would be great!), but every paid full-time employee of this ramshackle operation needs to be pretty damn good, because every weakness will chase off subscribers and further polarize the community. Youtube and Twitch are the proving grounds, the place for the inexperienced to hone their skills and hopefully make connections. Giant Bomb just can't afford to take on an inexperienced unskilled candidate no matter how interesting their background might be, because an alternate viewpoint is worthless if the person isn't able to articulate it well on camera/microphone, or slows down the workflow behind the scenes.

Furthermore, I don't think you need someone with a particular skin color or sex organs in order to discuss and point out issues of gender or racial stereotyping or discrimination. I think you're gravely underestimating the intelligence and awareness of the GB staff if you think they're part of the gender or racial inequality problem in gaming culture. They're not just "white guys", they're also adult humans with fully-functional brains, and they work very hard to make this website and its content inclusive, so it can be enjoyed by everybody. For example, I think the way they react to stereotypical depictions of women in video games is the right way for this website: they mock it, they treat it with sarcasm and ridiculousness, with maybe brief discussion about what's wrong. They usually do not get too serious or overly "political" (for lack of a better word), because that is not the tone that brings people to Giant Bomb. Patrick catches a lot of shit for mentioning and discussing the issues, but that's mainly because the issues themselves are controversial, he doesn't actually focus on that stuff much more than the other serious topics he discusses. Anyway, the staff's race and gender aren't preventing them from keeping this site inclusive (Jeff's rap lyrics notwithstanding).

On a side note, I bet someone's gonna make the argument that a female or minority staff member would make the rest of the staff far too guarded and careful on anything involving gender or race, and the content would become more awkward and stilted as a result. That kind of thing only really happens with people you don't know very well, GB is close-knit by nature so I don't think that kind of guardedness would happen. You can cross certain barriers around friends that you wouldn't cross around acquaintances.

My point is, Giant Bomb can't just "hire a woman" or "hire a black guy" or "hire a genderless purple thought entity". Above all else, they need people with mastery of a certain rare combination of abilities, which gives them such a narrow pool to draw from that requiring a particular combo of genes would just not work. GB is still expanding, maybe in the future they can find someone who comes from a more interesting background and possesses the skills they need to grow the site into something even dumber.

I'm speculating a lot here, though. What do you folks think?

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BradBrains

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I hate hate hate this conversation over and over.

People need to stop being on the defensive when someone says it would be cool if they hired a girl or whatever.

How many people said if they didn't they would flip out? I mostly hear that from the other side who can't wait to tell people the obvious "they should hire who's best for the job"

Don't think Sean hannity is the voice of conservatives just like don't think some really vocal minority is what most people think.

Too many young guys thinking the world is against them.

Do we need the same people giving the same opinion thread after thread after thread?

I like dan and think he'll be great btw. It was a really safe hire but giant bomb probably needs to go with that as it took forever to get cbs to give them anything and they probably won't get another chance anytime soon

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Sil3n7

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@andmm said:

Cmon guys, we all want more feminism articles written by gay feminazis here on giant bomb... right?

Anyone?

No one? Damn.

99.9% of people who visits this site come here for the GB crew personality and video games. Dan and Jason are going to fit right in that category, they are great and know their shit. If you wanna read about the terrible misogynist world we live in go elsewhere.

But, we're all victims! No one can do anything about it! We have to come to this site to hear what MEN say about video games and have no choice in the matter! We think that what's between our legs determines whats in our minds, and somehow we don't consider this bigoted and nonsensical.

Ohhhh nooooooooo!

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sergio

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@andmm said:

Cmon guys, we all want more feminism articles written by gay feminazis here on giant bomb... right?

Anyone?

No one? Damn.

99.9% of people who visits this site come here for the GB crew personality and video games. Dan and Jason are going to fit right in that category, they are great and know their shit. If you wanna read about the terrible misogynist world we live in go elsewhere.

There's really no need for your first line.

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andmm

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@sergio said:

There's really no need for your first line.

What's wrong with my first line?

What the fuck happened to this website.

Internet happened.

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BradBrains

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@sil3n7 said:

@andmm said:

Cmon guys, we all want more feminism articles written by gay feminazis here on giant bomb... right?

Anyone?

No one? Damn.

99.9% of people who visits this site come here for the GB crew personality and video games. Dan and Jason are going to fit right in that category, they are great and know their shit. If you wanna read about the terrible misogynist world we live in go elsewhere.

But, we're all victims! No one can do anything about it! We have to come to this site to hear what MEN say about video games and have no choice in the matter! We think that what's between our legs determines whats in our minds, and somehow we don't consider this bigoted and nonsensical.

Ohhhh nooooooooo!

jerk posts like these are mainly what i see.

show me a bunch of posts here from the other side that are worded like this.

you hate tumblr feminists. we get. get over it.

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gaff

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While I'm excited about the new hires... God dammit, I kind of understand why some companies don't openly advertise job vacancies.

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IAmNotBatman

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@orangepylon: This is a huge waste of time, bringing attention to something which wasn't thought about like this in any way. This will just piss people off for no reason, well done, troll or not, you've done a good troll job.

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RedRoach

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Edited By RedRoach

Why the fuck is this even a thing. Giantbomb is a personality driven website. They hired the people that they felt were best for the position, whom they had the best chemistry with. Simple as that.

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BradBrains

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Edited By BradBrains

@darkstalker said:

jerk posts like these are mainly what i see.

show me a bunch of posts here from the other side that are worded like this.

you hate tumblr feminists. we get. get over it.

Stay offended. No one cares. Get over it.

lol@"we"

your the one that is going after all my posts to respond. you seem more "offended" than me

im just bored of the same points being made from the same people on both sides over and over.

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Sil3n7

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@sil3n7 said:

@andmm said:

Cmon guys, we all want more feminism articles written by gay feminazis here on giant bomb... right?

Anyone?

No one? Damn.

99.9% of people who visits this site come here for the GB crew personality and video games. Dan and Jason are going to fit right in that category, they are great and know their shit. If you wanna read about the terrible misogynist world we live in go elsewhere.

But, we're all victims! No one can do anything about it! We have to come to this site to hear what MEN say about video games and have no choice in the matter! We think that what's between our legs determines whats in our minds, and somehow we don't consider this bigoted and nonsensical.

Ohhhh nooooooooo!

jerk posts like these are mainly what i see.

show me a bunch of posts here from the other side that are worded like this.

you hate tumblr feminists. we get. get over it.

Is that it? Is that your argument, or do you have something intelligent to add?

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metalhammer

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Edited By metalhammer

I feel like this thread may have already run it's course...

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cassus

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No matter how intelligent, offering insight as a woman or a minority demands that you're a woman or a minority. Believing that white dudes can do this just as well because they're smart is silly. I've met a lot of smart people in my day, the only thing I can say for smart people is that hey are far less judgy, but the level they are able to relate to [insert anything] depends more or less completely on what they've experienced in their life and their empathy level.

A psychopath, for example, couldn't even grasp what it would be like to be his own brother, cause those tools are just not available. Not saying anyone on the GB team is a psychopath (far from it) but just flat out claiming that they can relate to pretty much anything and anyone is flawed. Especially seeing as how you mentioned how isolated and protective the gaming industry is. Most of these guys haven't had other jobs than this, they've lived among their own kin forever, that doesn't really indicate to me that they'd stand a good chance of winning a head to head gay-off vs George Michael or whatnot.

That said, I actually agree with you on every point. The pool really is freakishly shallow. I would love for there to be way more women involved in game journalism. In most aspects of everything I enjoy, actually.. But this isn't a Giant Bomb thing, it's a "insert all serious businesses that exist on the internet ever" thing. I would say that the interwebs in general is extremely white and furiously male. The only ones I can think of right now that don't care much about gender is the Yogscast guys. It's worked out really well for them.

Now that Vinny is gone.. Drew is in need of a wingman, time to hire a female with minority background as a simulator and grand strategy game correspondent, no?

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sergio

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@extomar said:

@excast said:

@extomar said:

Did I miss the uprising and uproar about this? Who, besides the thread starter, are the people concerned about this? I thought people were glad they were filling up the San Fransisco office again.

A number of women involved in "games journalism" in some manner have gone out of their way to be rather critical of Giant Bomb both for their E3 panels and for the recent hiring process.

But who? I am not questioning there is criticism but I was following the E3 chatter and didn't find anything jumping out.

Do I think GB would be better off with women in the office? Heck yeah. Teams with diverse backgrounds and view points often come up with way more creative and entertaining content.

Do I think hiring two more white guys is a problem? Not really. The team needs to expand!

Sure, but I think people have this misconception that because they're the same gender and race, that everyone at Giant Bomb will have the same opinions.

I was commenting to a friend that I share many of the same political and social opinions as my female cousin, more than my sister, and definitely more than her brother. Just because we're both heterosexual, male minorities, doesn't mean I share the same ideas as him. Just because we share the same background, doesn't mean I share the same ideas as my sister. Just because the new hires are white men, I don't assume they are all going to have the same opinions as the rest of the Giant Bomb crew.

It's too soon for me to say whether we will have diverse opinions which is different than a diverse workforce.

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terror_shart

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Giant Bomb has just become the NWO of the Internet Games Federation....this whole thing has just turned ludicrous

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Sil3n7

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Edited By Sil3n7

Yes. The woman who made a fool of herself in the company of Giant Bomb is a completely well reasoned and objective place to get your opinion.

Go home son. Bopped.

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TrafalgarLaw

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I don't have an opinion on the two new hires but dismissing them as just two new white dudes is the worst form of disrespect you can give to anyone starting a new gig.

I understand everyone wants a more diverse crew, maybe more women, racial diversity etc. but does it really matter when it comes to games coverage? A lot of the will of being more inclusive in videogames has unneccesarily leaked into the video game coverage media. I am trying to think if a female point of view would be that much different to a male's, as if there are strict inherent differences between how women and men enjoy and experience videogames. The answer is no. I just want good personalities on camera, not some quotum to check off.

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ghost_cat

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Oh yeah, I forgot this is what new people do the site.

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BradBrains

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Giant Bomb has just become the NWO of the Internet Games Federation....this whole thing has just turned ludicrous

excited for dan to create the wolpac to fight hollywood gerstmann

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TheHT

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I had hoped the new editor was a short asian woman, kinda pretty but mostly average, maybe with some tattoos or funky hair.

What's wrong with this statement?

All of it.

Why?

None of that shit matters.

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brandino

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Edited By brandino

Hopefully this ridiculous shit ends by the end of the week because this whole sexism/racism thing is some of the most absurd goddamn shit.

They hired 2 people who are a good fit for their team. Race, gender and sexuality wasn't a determining factor and the fact you people are trying to make that into a issue is racist and sexist in itself. Put your social justice badge back in your pocket and stop trying to make something out of nothing.

Have you people seen the diversity that fills CBSi? You act as if Jeff, the team or whoever was involved in the hiring was sitting in a room laughing, burning resumes that consisted of non-white straight males while smoking cigars and looking at playboys. I expect this kind of shit from GAF but i thought this forum would not fall into bullshit.

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EXTomar

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Edited By EXTomar

Some are blowing this way out of proportion. It is entirely possible to let someone have their opinion. There isn't anything particularly wrong with their opinion. And what is really nice is that you are free to ignore it.

At this stage, the mods should consider closing it because it already degenerating into echo chamber where no discussion happens and posters just get riled up.

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GaspoweR

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Edited By GaspoweR

@omghisam: Wow...she really did say "WASTED ON THAT COMMUNITY". That is just crossing the line. While I tend to have not minded her for so long since that last E3 afterhours was years ago this is really not cool.

Not cool at all.

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BlastProcessing

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Edited By BlastProcessing

Check your white cis-gendered male privileges, scum. Two "white males" were hired over women because of their demonic, disgusting white skin and male genitalia. Not at all because they were the most qualified specimens for the job. Jeff Gerstmann is totally patriarchal scum with the privilege of owning a copy of the Lizzie McGuire Movie Soundtrack, showing he is possessive of women and sees them as just a Trish Stratus doll you can manipulate in anyway you please. He does not what so ever have the utter best interest in his site, he just wants to hold women and people of other skin tones down. This is the utter truth because I'm a sheltered white kid (identify as Aqua Blue) from Palo Alto with a tumblr blog full of cute Chandler Bing gifs and my musings on social justice and how white men are the devil, like that Public Enemy guy says. Privilege: checked.

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terror_shart

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@terror_shart said:

Giant Bomb has just become the NWO of the Internet Games Federation....this whole thing has just turned ludicrous

excited for dan to create the wolpac to fight hollywood gerstmann

Does that mean Alex, Vinnie, and Robyn get to create the bWo?

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TheBluthCompany

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I was hoping for a hyper intelligent shade of blue.

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pr1mus

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Edited By pr1mus

Why'd you people had to link to Leigh's tweets about this and ruin everything?

Now you can be sure any potentially healthy discussion is over.

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deactivated-5a0917a2494ce

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Read through Samantha Allen's tweets. This is the kind of nonsense that really makes me dislike where games journalism is going. Most of the "feminists" on sites like Polygon are so damn fringe that they set back any potential changes that they are pushing for. These are people consumed by labels and checkboxes, it doesn't matter who you hire, as long as it meets their image of diversity.

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spraynardtatum

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@dharmabum said:

What the fuck happened to this website.

Patrick Klepek happened.

Horseshit horseman.

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deactivated-5a0917a2494ce

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andmm

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I'm laughing at the people saying this thread is going nowhere. What do you expect? This discussion is nonsensical (read dumb) to begin with.

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BradBrains

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@darkstalker said:

@terror_shart said:

Giant Bomb has just become the NWO of the Internet Games Federation....this whole thing has just turned ludicrous

excited for dan to create the wolpac to fight hollywood gerstmann

Does that mean Alex, Vinnie, and Robyn get to create the bWo?

big vinne cool

da alex guy

hollywood robyn

yea ok that works well enough

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Parkingtigers

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So, am I right in assuming that the vast majority (all?) of the people posting in this comment thread are dudes? Probably some non-white, probably a couple who are into guys themselves, but essentially a sausagefest right?

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BlastProcessing

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So is it safe to say Jeff will crack and finally hire Hip Hop Gamer?

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terror_shart

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In the end i just feel bad for Jeff, Drew, and Brad...this has been a real rough year for GB and bringing in Dan kinda feels like filling a giant hole in the site. Im sure they had absolutely no interest in causing controversy....these hires feel like getting the site back on track and preparing for the future of Giant Bomb. After all the shit these guys have gone through, it really sucks for others in the industry to sling rocks and arrows at the site.

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cbk486

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@parkingtigers:

I can only speak for myself. Young black/japanese man reporting in.

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deactivated-5a0917a2494ce

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So, am I right in assuming that the vast majority (all?) of the people posting in this comment thread are dudes? Probably some non-white, probably a couple who are into guys themselves, but essentially a sausagefest right?

So are you saying that the opinion of men is now unimportant or should be ignored? I'm an extreme minority so do I get more of a vote?

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Darth_Navster

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As a person of a minority background, I'd be over the moon if GB hired more minority voices. That said, I come to this site because it's run by some interesting folks whose opinions on games I trust. Frankly, reading the tweets of the people complaining about the hiring decision shows exactly why GB didn't hire them. I come here because this is one of the few sites that still engages games as *fun*, and not as some cultural/artistic medium that will change the world.

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truthtellah

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Well. That went south fast.

I may have disagreed with the OP, but man, I don't think he deserved to have his thread just become a bash fest representative of the worst elements around here.

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cbk486

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@darth_navster:

Yeah, their tweets showcase exactly why Giant Bomb shouldn't have hired them. In what other industry is such a public outcry over your personal hiring/not hiring acceptable?

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joshwent

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In the end i just feel bad for Jeff, Drew, and Brad...this has been a real rough year for GB and bringing in Dan kinda feels like filling a giant hole in the site.

All they need to do is make a press release!

"Giant Bomb never intended to make any form of social commentary with the hiring of Dan and Jason. This site represents a playful alternate world rather than a real-life simulation. We hope that all of our fans will see that Giant Bomb was intended to be a whimsical and quirky site, and that we were absolutely not trying to provide social commentary."

Wait... no. That might not go over too well.

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JBG4

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Just enjoy the site...