Terramagi

@TruthTellah said:

@Terramagi said:

@Grasu said:

@Terramagi: have you played this game?

I tell people why the gameplay mechanics are inferior. I tell them why the ranking system is broken. I tell them why the weapon system is broken. I tell them about the differences in difficulty settings. And still they think they can dismiss it with something as trite as "well have you dropped 60 dollars yet?"

YES, I have played it. It's a BAD DMC game.

@TruthTellah said:

@Terramagi said:

@TruthTellah said:

@Terramagi said:

Yes, they probably would have, because the numbers were there from DMC4's sales to prompt a sequel in the form of this.

Even if they didn't, it WOULD have been better to just let the series end on a relatively high note, as opposed to pulling a Buffalo Bill and parading this skinsuit around distraught family members.

You have to admit that's a pretty hyperbolic thing to say.

If you would cut down on the hyperbole and odd sense of disbelief in every comment, you might actually be able to help someone else understand your concerns. I know you're somehow distraught, but if you care about the series, pull it together. Reasonable criticisms should be enough to convince people without resorting to endless exaggeration and wailing. Just calm down for a second, make a clean slate, and be nice as you help others understand your points about the game.

Devil May Cry sold MILLIONS of copies. It was not in need of a "re-imagining". It wasn't dead, Brad is (admittedly) ignorant when he said that, and yet here you are pretending like it was true. It was not in need of being "saved". People already loved the series, I am NOT alone in that like you seek to make it appear. This is not some niche ass title, stop pretending like it was to invalidate everybody who points out the numerous flaws in this game's design.

You're boxing with phantoms, Terramagi.

I haven't said anything on the game or whether it needed to be saved. I haven't mentioned invalidating anyone pointing out flaws in the game or anything else. Actually, my entire point is to make the discussion be -about- the perceived merits and flaws of the game. But that isn't the case right now, because you're not arguing with anyone. You're lashing out at everyone here with hyperbole and nonsense. Just calm down for a second and think about what you're saying.

As I said to Nettacki, people often betray their point when they make their rage the center point. Your whole crazy schtick is distracting from real criticism of the game. You have been actively giving concerned fans of the series a bad name with this manic response.

Relax. If it's really egregious, you can calmly and rationally explain why people should be concerned by this. Don't let your outrage distract from your intended point. Just be cool and talk to everyone here like fellow gamers. We're not all out to get you. In fact, no one is out to get you. Be better than this and be the voice of reason. That doesn't take hyperbole or accusations. All it takes is calmly helping others understand your concerns and nicely encouraging people to share in expressing displeasure over the game. If they don't agree with you, there's no need to flip out or insult anyone. Just move on and maintain a focus on your point. If there is merit to what you are saying, people will listen.

Somebody pick up that phone, because I fucking CALLED IT.

I have explained time and time again what is wrong with this game. You are not interested in listening to why this game is bad. I know, because I've already explained why it's a bad DMC game, and an average any-other-game. You are interested in cutting out snippets of this dialogue and bringing it into your psych 101 class tomorrow. At least, I hope that's what you're doing, because otherwise you're just as crazy and self-deluded as you think I am.

I don't think you're crazy at all.

I think you're making yourself sound crazy, marginalizing your points.

No one here is -making- you seem crazy. You're the one using hyperbole and acting manically. Other people in this thread have shown the ability to calm down and talk about the game, and I am suggesting that you can do the same. Because you're -not- insane. You're just making yourself look like it.

Don't waste your time. Calm down. Step back for a second. And then talk to us like a human being. Please do still dislike the game if that's how you feel. I think it's reasonable for someone to feel differently on a videogame. But when talking about it, we don't have to freak out. Just state your case calmly and clearly and leave it at that. Let your argument speak for itself.

I know that in your head I sound like a fucking lunatic. I have a couple theories why. Possibly the cursing. Perhaps as you were raised, people didn't curse around you very much, and in your mind people only swear when something is wrong or they're distraught. Not so everywhere. Sometimes people are just raised differently, and cuss like fucking sailors.

Re-read my post in the most deadpan, tired, bitterly sarcastic tone you can. Especially this next part.

I am aware that bringing up the words "appeal to the masses" in the state I do makes me seem absolutely fucking insane and like I'm typing this shit from in a bunker next to 50 years of food. It doesn't make it any less valid when that's what's actually happening, whether intentional or not.

@Grasu said:

@Terramagi: I still dont believe you. But whatever, keep hating on the game. Clearly everyone that liked it is wrong.

If it wasn't named DMC, there would be no problem. How do you not grasp this. How do you keep attempting the exact same pedantic appeal to the masses?

@Salbert said:

@CityHunter: But part of my point is that oldschool Devil May Cry still exists. It's just not CALLED that anymore. It's called Bayonetta. And guess what, they're making another one.

And before you say "it's not the same", I know that, but I bet you would have accepted Bayonetta as "DMC 5" if it had Dante as the main character and in the DMC universe, but with the same gameplay mechanics. Labels mean nothing. Look past the labels to see the game behind them.

Man Bayo 2 is gonna be great.

At least Platinum never lets me down.

I mean, I won't be able to play it, but... y'know.

@thabigred said:

@Terramagi: I don't actually dislike the previous games in the series, I just don't accept your premise that this game is as terrible as you're saying it is. Those things you list are not fundamentally important, and what you get from changing it clearly has come out to a fully featured product.

Gameplay is the most fundamental thing this medium has going for it. Saying "oh it doesn't matter that it's a button masher" when the previous games clearly were not even on the lowest difficulty settings is ignorant at best, malicious at best.

@Demoskinos said:

@NinesSC2 said:

It's fucking hilarious. I love when far out conspiracy theory gets injected into the debate as well. It's just fun to follow, all though I do feel bad for Brad. But I think by this point in his editorial career he's learned to ignore CRAZY criticism.

FOLLOW THE MONEY. ALSO, CHEMTRAILS.

Jesus christ, can I call it or what.

@Vashyron said:

@Terramagi said:

@TruthTellah said:

@Terramagi said:

Yes, they probably would have, because the numbers were there from DMC4's sales to prompt a sequel in the form of this.

Even if they didn't, it WOULD have been better to just let the series end on a relatively high note, as opposed to pulling a Buffalo Bill and parading this skinsuit around distraught family members.

You have to admit that's a pretty hyperbolic thing to say.

If you would cut down on the hyperbole and odd sense of disbelief in every comment, you might actually be able to help someone else understand your concerns. I know you're somehow distraught, but if you care about the series, pull it together. Reasonable criticisms should be enough to convince people without resorting to endless exaggeration and wailing. Just calm down for a second, make a clean slate, and be nice as you help others understand your points about the game.

Devil May Cry sold MILLIONS of copies. It was not in need of a "re-imagining". It wasn't dead, Brad is (admittedly) ignorant when he said that, and yet here you are pretending like it was true. It was not in need of being "saved". People already loved the series, I am NOT alone in that like you seek to make it appear. This is not some niche ass title, stop pretending like it was to invalidate everybody who points out the numerous flaws in this game's design.

He wasn't doing anything you said. All he said was that you should step back, clear your head and calm down.

I'm not stupid. I know full well when somebody is trying to marginalize a point by resorting to an appeal to the masses.

"Well clearly they're wrong, because EVERYBODY WHO ISN'T INSANE likes the change."

It's the same thing people resort to when they say "well Dark Souls would be made better by putting in an easy mode". You can tell them "no, you don't understand the importance of a unified difficult experience" but they always resort to the "well think about how many MILLIONS more they could get if they violated the series' fundamentals!" This is exactly what's happened here, and is attempting to be invoked. It SHOULDN'T work because Devil May Cry (just like Dark Souls) sold millions of copies and was a mass success just as it was. DMC was successful because of high speed combo oriented combat. DmC is a fucking button masher.

I am not stupid. I know what you are trying to do, and I know full well the next thing in your mind is "well let's imply they're crazy and seeing a conspiracy where there isn't one". I took Psychology 101 too, you're not clever.

@AyKay_47 said:

@Terramagi said:

@AyKay_47 said:

@Terramagi said:

@AyKay_47 said:

@Terramagi said:

@AyKay_47 said:

Make a new IP if you're not going to follow the conventions of the franchise.

Don't ruin things people love for fucking brand recognition.

What does that accomplish other than angering the old fans? Destroying the trust they put in you over the previous thr...four games.

Make new things if you want to. Don't steal shit people love and deface them for your own amusement. You're not Sid from Toy Story, stop pretending to be Frankenstein and making these abominations.

Here's a question then.

Do you feel like the existence of this new DMC is in the way of a proper DMC 5? As in do you think they would have eventually made a proper DMC 5 if not for this?

Or, do you concede that there was almost no chance of them continuing the series as it was, and you (maybe not you personally, but all the people ripping on the positivity) are not only stressing yourself out with all the arguing, but also personally attacking a reviewer over some petty sense of disappointment and bitterness?

Yes, they probably would have, because the numbers were there from DMC4's sales to prompt a sequel (unfortunately in the form of this).

Even if they didn't, it WOULD have been better to just let the series end on a relatively high note, as opposed to pulling a Buffalo Bill and parading this skinsuit around distraught family members.

I dunno man. I can almost empathize. I mean I can envision my personal worst case scenario where they make Persona 5 into a fuckin block sliding puzzle game, and then people start giving it 5 stars. Sure i'll be pissed, but if it's a 5 star review from someone I believe usually knows wtf they're talking about, then the game has to have some kind of merit. Yeah I'd be pissed that I didn't get to fuse personas anymore and whatnot, but fuck me if I go around calling people shiteaters for liking the block sliding. I mean I'd probably do it at first, but goddamn.

Imagine Persona 5 was reviewed by a person who hadn't played P3 or P4 (or P1 or P2, but we both know the people who loved those games are already fucked) pretended Persona was a dead series and that the new version was better than what came before.

Because that's basically what's happened. People with no idea what the series was coming in and bulldozing things a LOT of people liked. It's what I fear will happen to Dark Souls, ultimately.

@Demoskinos said:

@Terramagi: Dude, your acting like the ability to like this game and the old trilogy are mutually exclusive things. Its not.

I know it's not. I enjoy a dumb button masher from time to time too.

The problem is that IT'S NOT DEVIL MAY CRY, so don't fucking CALL it Devil May Cry. Call it something else.

@AyKay_47 said:

@Terramagi said:

@AyKay_47 said:

@Terramagi said:

@AyKay_47 said:

Make a new IP if you're not going to follow the conventions of the franchise.

Don't ruin things people love for fucking brand recognition.

What does that accomplish other than angering the old fans? Destroying the trust they put in you over the previous thr...four games.

Make new things if you want to. Don't steal shit people love and deface them for your own amusement. You're not Sid from Toy Story, stop pretending to be Frankenstein and making these abominations.

Here's a question then.

Do you feel like the existence of this new DMC is in the way of a proper DMC 5? As in do you think they would have eventually made a proper DMC 5 if not for this?

Or, do you concede that there was almost no chance of them continuing the series as it was, and you (maybe not you personally, but all the people ripping on the positivity) are not only stressing yourself out with all the arguing, but also personally attacking a reviewer over some petty sense of disappointment and bitterness?

Yes, they probably would have, because the numbers were there from DMC4's sales to prompt a sequel (unfortunately in the form of this).

Even if they didn't, it WOULD have been better to just let the series end on a relatively high note, as opposed to pulling a Buffalo Bill and parading this skinsuit around distraught family members.

(but really how many people have even played DMC 3 let alone finished or enjoyed it to justify a developer spending millions of dollars to make a spiritual sequel to that?)

A LOT. It sold extremely well. It wasn't a niche title. DMC4 was one of the biggest releases of 2008.

Why can't we just be happy with the audiences we have. Let the people come to you. If you build it, they will come. Don't uproot the stadium and slap shitty bumper stickers calling everybody who used to go to it assholes.

Like, you could just not play spectacle fighters, because they're clearly not your thing. I don't play CoD, because I think it's dumb. I don't play racing games, because I dislike them. I don't play fighting games or RTS, because I'm bad at them. But I leave them be. They're not my thing. I let those audiences have their fun, because who the fuck am I to say what they should like?

Am I having a seizure? Am I speaking in Korean right now? How do I live in a world where a beloved franchise being gutted for the lowest common denominator in a market already FLOODED with lowest common denominator action games is a GOOD THING? Am I dead? Is this my eternal punishment for being a bad person?