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    The Elder Scrolls is a long-running franchise of role-playing games made by Bethesda Softworks. The series is known for offering much freedom to the player and many choices of how to play.

    Branding issue for ESVI: Is "Skyrim" more recognizable than "The Elder Scrolls?"

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    MiniPato

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    Edited By MiniPato

    Poll Branding issue for ESVI: Is "Skyrim" more recognizable than "The Elder Scrolls?" (337 votes)

    Skyrim 47%
    The Elder Scrolls 53%

    Anytime I talk to friends who have a surface level interest in games, they always refer to The Elder Scrolls: Skyrim as simply "Skyrim." They even refer to The Elder Scrolls Online as "The Skyrim MMO." I remember being really confused when my friend asked if PS4 players can play Skyrim with PC players when it doesn't have multiplayer at all. Then I found out they were talking about The Elder Scrolls Online.

    Is Bethesda going to have to pull a Modern Warfare 2 and somehow crowbar "Skyrim" into the title of their next Elder Scrolls game somehow? I think most people don't even know that "The Elder Scrolls" is even in the title of "The Elder Scrolls: Skyrim." It's easy to forget that outside of TES: Online, there has not been a new Elder Scrolls game since Skyrim. They have simply reinforced the Skyrim brand by constantly remastering it. I don't think "The Elder Scrolls" name has as strong recognition as the Skyrim name.

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    Jesus_Phish

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    People don't use those games full titles and everyone thinks their first one is what the series is, eg those who jumped on at Oblivion would only really talk about that one.

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    MiniPato

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    People don't use those games full titles and everyone thinks their first one is what the series is, eg those who jumped on at Oblivion would only really talk about that one.

    Sure, but Skyrim has been remastered so often with no new TES game being released since (except TES Online). Bethesda hit major gold with Skyrim, but has not used that opportunity to build the TES brand into the public conscious. They have simply remastered Skyrim over and over that that's the name that people know. If they released a new Elder Scrolls, I wonder if non-hardcore gamers would recognize it as relating to Skyrim. I had to explain to my friends that the series name is "The Elder Scrolls" and not "Skyrim." Skyrim was simply one entry in the series. They haven't pulled a Call of Duty or Assassin's Creed where it's a yearly release with new subtitles every year and everyone recognizes CoD as the overarching series name. Not that they have to, but it does propose a branding issue.

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    ShaggE

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    I'm sure they'll just take extra time to push "The follow-up to the hit game Skyrim" in marketing materials and the box art as much as possible. Maybe do like they did with the Arkham City GOTY box art and just fill every inch of empty space with "From the guys what made the Skyrims" and such.

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    mellotronrules

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    #4  Edited By mellotronrules

    skyrim is 1000% more recognizable than 'the elder scrolls,' not to mention it's just a better name. but that's always been the case, hasn't it? morrowind, oblivion, skyrim- these all are leagues better than the overarching series name.

    they don't need to crowbar 'skyrim' into their next title- they just need something equally remarkable. just slap a 'FROM THE MAKERS OF SKYRIM' on the box and yer good.

    might i suggest: The Elder Scrolls VI- Howarrowtodd's Fallwind Rim-ion.

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    splodge

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    If you talk to star wars fans, they don't call the movie "Star wars - Return of the Jedi". They call it return of the Jedi.

    Star trek fans don't talk about "Star Trek - The wrath of Kahn", they just call it wrath of kahn.

    The next game in the elder scrolls series will just be called whatever it is called in the same way.

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    MattyFTM

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    #6  Edited By MattyFTM  Moderator

    Skyrim is definitely more recognizable than TES, but I don't think that's an issue. Oblivion was far more recognizable too, and Skyrim didn't have any issues. They'll market the hell out of it, reference Skyrim a bunch and everyone will know that it is the follow up to Skyrim, whether you follow games closely or not.

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    OurSin_360

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    #7  Edited By OurSin_360

    Skyrim is way more popular than elder scrolls, maybe just because it was easier to say. Like the next elder scrolls(real elder scrolls) will probably be marketed as a Skyrim sequel and not just another number in the long running franchise.

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    MiniPato

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    #8  Edited By MiniPato

    @splodge:

    Star Wars is Star Wars though. In terms of series name recognition, I don't think "The Elder Scrolls" even ranks up there with "Assassin's Creed" or "Call of Duty." "Skyrim" rivals those names, but not "The Elder Scrolls." I'm not even sure most casual gamers know "The Elder Scrolls" is in the title of Skyrim or that "The Elder Scrolls: Online" relates to Skyrim. But this is just from anecdotal evidence of my friends asking about "Skyrim Online." No one calls "Return of the Jedi" "Empire Strikes Back 2."

    Like, if a new TES game came out called "Argonia", I guarantee most people would refer it to as "The new Skyrim game" and not "the new Elder Scrolls game."

    @mattyftm:

    Yeah, Bethesda has enough clout with Skyrim and Fallout that they can just put "From the makers of..." and find just as much success.

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    GERALTITUDE

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    Skyrim is more recognizable... by a pretty considerable margin.

    But, yeah, like others here have already said, really doubt that's an issue. There are many ways to get the point across in marketing materials I think.

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    TheFlamingo352

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    #10  Edited By TheFlamingo352

    Personally, Elder Scrolls, but there's just so many people I know that don't know anything about games but still recognize "Skyrim" as a word. I wouldn't be too surprised if the next Elder Scrolls had "the sequel to Skyrim" somewhere on the box.

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    cmblasko

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    Bethesda presents

    Skyrim 2:

    The Elder Scrolls:

    Elsweyr

    (part 4 of the Oblivion trilogy)

    coming 2028

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    hnke

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    The Elder Scrolls, that's that Mojang game right?

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    Justin258

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    Morrowind was a better known name when Oblivion came out, Oblivion was a better known name when Skyrim came out, and it will be the same case here.

    Would be cool to see something about Bethesda's next game, though. I hope it's as different from Skyrim as Skyrim was from Oblivion.

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    paulmako

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    They won't have a problem. Enough people know about the Elder Scrolls name to get hype enough for everyone else to wonder what the fuss is about.

    It's actually pretty crazy they didn't straight away make another. People gave Ubisoft credit for giving Assassins Creed one year off lol.

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    OMGFather

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    I think you're right. I doubt they'd remove the Elder Scrolls from the name however.

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    defordj

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    Skyrim is the better-known brand now, but nobody knew about Skyrim ... until Skyrim came out. I mean I know that's obvious, but assuming they don't want to just do Skyrim II (and I doubt they do), they'll do all the same work to get mainstream mindshare that they did for Skyrim, except likely with a significantly greater budget. If the game is good it won't be a problem; if the game isn't good, better brand recognition won't save them.

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    Bollard

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    Skyrim is definitely the bigger name but I have no interest in going there again that's for sure. If they don't go to a region that hasn't been done before I'll be super bummed. They've got loads of great locations to visit like Elsweyr, Valenwood or the Black Marsh.

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    lego_my_eggo

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    Skyrim is the more recognizable name, but they will be fine with just "The Elder Scrolls: something or other", and maybe a "from the makers of" in the reveal video and trailers leading up to release to catch the people who might have missed The Elder Scrolls in front of the Skyrim name, probably not on the box tho. The subtitles for the games have always been what people use to refer to them, its faster and less of a mouthful. I still refer to The Elder Scrolls Online as the Skyrim MMO just because, even tho nowhere on that game does it say Skyrim.

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    FrostyRyan

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    It's not an issue. People call it skyrim because that's the subtitle. subtitles are meant to differentiate between installments in a franchise.

    Same reason people call star wars movies by their subtitles. same reason people call captain america: civil war just civil war. People aren't stupid

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    SarcasticMudcrab

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    As long as they bring out Morrowind 2 sometime it's all good.

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    uhtaree

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    I can't wait til Oblivion 3 comes out....

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    MiniPato

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    #23  Edited By MiniPato
    @frostyryan said:

    It's not an issue. People call it skyrim because that's the subtitle. subtitles are meant to differentiate between installments in a franchise.

    Same reason people call star wars movies by their subtitles. same reason people call captain america: civil war just civil war. People aren't stupid

    It's not the subtitle though, it's bigger than "The Elder Scrolls" and a lot of people believe that Skyrim is the only title. "Guns of the Patriots" and "Phantom Pain" aren't bigger than "Metal Gear Solid." People aren't stupid, but they are forgetful. TES isn't a Star Wars where they can take a decade+ long hiatus and still remain in the public lexicon of pop culture. Captain America and Star Wars are all stronger franchise names that have had more consistent and frequent distinct releases than The Elder Scrolls. In fact, Captain America 1 came out the same year as Skyrim and has since has had 3 different films in the years since that Skyrim has been re-released over and over. Since Skyrim hit big, they have tried to keep the Elder Scrolls name in the public conscious with their MMO and card game, but I really have a hard time believing that casual gamers conflate the two. Sometimes even I forget that TES is in the title. I go to the "S" section in my library looking for Skyrim when I should be scrolling further down to the "T" section.

    I have no doubt the next Elder Scrolls game will do well, but I think they will absolutely have to leverage the Skyrim name because simply putting "THE ELDER SCROLLS" on the title isn't gonna get them as many views as saying "FROM THE MAKERS OF SKYRIM." Like, I could totally see some third party youtube trailer channel getting more views on a TESVI trailer over the official Bethesda channel because they put "FIRST TRAILER for the NEXT SKYRIM!" in the video title instead of just "The Elder Scrolls VI Official Trailer."

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    DanishingAct

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    Didn't they do a card game with no mention of skyrim in the title fairly recently?

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    ripelivejam

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    Ah yes, the Daggerfall games.

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    Marz

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    #26  Edited By Marz

    kids will be saying, what is Skyrim? when, TES: Elsweyr enters the world.

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    Jesus_Phish

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    @minipato: Skyrim got remastered so much because of the console cycle and then because they wanted to do paid mods. Everyone who started on Oblivion knew what Skyrim was going to be and knew they where related. Same as everyone who started on Morrowind new what Oblivion was. And Daggerfall and Arena etc.

    And as others have mentioned, there's no way that Bethesda don't mention the other games including Skyrim in marketing their next game.

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    ll_Exile_ll

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    #28  Edited By ll_Exile_ll

    I remember this exact same question coming up in regards to a potential TES V not being as recognizable as Oblivion. Remember when people were using the phrase "Oblivion with guns" to describe Fallout 3?

    Also, by the time TES VI comes out Skyrim will be a 10 year old game, probably older. The remasters will be half a decade or more in the past. It won't be an issue at all.

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    wardcleaver

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    @shagge said:

    I'm sure they'll just take extra time to push "The follow-up to the hit game Skyrim" in marketing materials and the box art as much as possible. Maybe do like they did with the Arkham City GOTY box art and just fill every inch of empty space with "From the guys what made the Skyrims" and such.

    Yep, most likely this.

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    BladeOfCreation

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    Skyrim is far more recognizable, but that was the case with Oblivion, too. You dont hear people talking about TES 3 or TES 4, they say Morrowind or Oblivion. This could be a problem, at least with people who don't follow gaming news, but I imagine "from the team that brought you Skyrim" will make up for that.

    Remember when Zenimax threw a fit over Mojang's Scrolls? That was fun.

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    Slag

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    RPG fans are gonna instantly know the Elder Scrolls name

    Even the Madden/CoD crowd probably knows the Skyrim brand

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    Rigas

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    @splodge said:

    If you talk to star wars fans, they don't call the movie "Star wars - Return of the Jedi". They call it return of the Jedi.

    Star trek fans don't talk about "Star Trek - The wrath of Kahn", they just call it wrath of kahn.

    The next game in the elder scrolls series will just be called whatever it is called in the same way.

    I Loved "Star wars - Empire Strikes Back: Return of the Jedi"

    Seriously though, every advertisement is going to start with "THE LONG AWAITED FOLLOW UP GAME TO SKYRIM, The Elder Scrolls IV: Elsweyr"

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    Corvak

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    #33  Edited By Corvak

    Its the same as the Shin Megami Tensei: Persona thing. A long subtitle is just too unwieldy so it gets shrunk down to the name that makes it unique. People know them as Morrowind/Oblivion/Skyrim and know the series is The Elder Scrolls, but the long title gets cut for ease of use.

    In Persona's case it is even more complex as the term Shin Megami Tensei itself is also assigned to an entirely different series of games, but they get identified by the beginning part of the name, as they don't have a consistent subtitle that works - some of them are numbered (Shin Megami Tensei IV), others are titled (Shin Megami Tensei: Nocturne).

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    Whitestripes09

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    The more I thought about it, the more I want to change my answer from Skyrim to the Elder Scrolls. There may be more versions of Skyrim out than Oblivion, but I remember that Oblivion during its peak was always known as just Oblivion and not, "The Elder Scrolls IV: Oblivion". Even the abbreviation is kind of awful... "TESIV:O" or "TES:O".

    From a marketing standpoint, having these shorter title names is actually pretty genius. For returning fans, they know what Oblivion and Skyrim mean. While for new comers, they feel that they are getting a completely new experience because there is no number in the title. These games are all pretty stand alone, so they really do feel like a new game IP each time.

    It will be the same experience with whatever the next game will be called.

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    FrostyRyan

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    @minipato: I don't really know why you made the thread if you're just gonna keep arguing with everyone who disagrees with you about it. Like, why even ask the question

    And yes, Skyrim is the subtitle even though it's bigger on the box. That's just the way it's stylized. Titles on boxes are stylized all the time. Resident Evil 4 isn't called 4 resident evil

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    Bonbonetti

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    #36  Edited By Bonbonetti

    There was a similar but brief discussion between the GB guys when Assassin's Creed Syndicate came out, where Jeff (I think) only used the word 'Syndicate' to talk about the whole game. He clarified that it wasn't the 2012 FPS game he was talking about. It's a natural thing to do when your audience is aware of what you are refering to. It's a risky assumption to make if there are plenty of obnoxious rectal retentive people around, as in the GOG forum, because then you'll never hear the end of it.

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    deactivated-61356eb4a76c8

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    That's the way people always talk about the Elder Scrolls games. They don't talk about TESIII: Morrowind or TESIV: Oblivion, they talk about Morrowind and Oblivion.

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    Qrowdyy

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    Skyrim is more recognizable because Bethesda was made up of like 5 people when they came up with the name in 1994. No marketing department, no branding worries. Thus the unholy nergasm "The Elder Scrolls". Not marketable, some PR person will tell you, but that's what they're stuck with.

    Elder Scrolls VI is gonna have "The Elder Scrolls" in tiny ass font above whatever the real name of the game is gonna be.

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    emprpngn

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    I don't think there will be much of a problem. I expect there will be some "From the makers of..." text in the trailer and that'll be enough for the general public to latch on.

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    deactivated-6321b685abb02

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    If the next game's set in Skyrim as well then I'm not sure I'm interested, if it's not then the name doesn't make much sense. They'll figure a good name for TESVI which relates to the story/world they're building.

    Skyrim is more recognisable but calling it Skyrim II or similar creates problems imo.

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    mikemcn

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    I hope they release another elder scrolls singleplayer game =(

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    The_Nubster

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    Skyrim is more recognizable but people aren't idiots. The box and all of the marketing and the game all say The Elder Scrolls. Just because people don't say it out loud, that doesn't mean they don't know it's part of the title. It'll be called The Elder Scrolls: Blank and people will just call it Blank and it'll sell like hotcakes.

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    ltcolumbo

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    The next Elder Scrolls game will be Morrowind IV to me. I also think this discussion came up before both Oblivion and Skyrim came out, and they both did okay. Turns out Bethesda is good at marketing games when they want to do so.

    And really, they have to announce it soon, don't they? Didn't Skyrim come out in 2011? Even with remasters, seven years between titles seems like a long time.

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    Ungodly

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    For as popular as Skyrim is, people that love the game know it’s part of the Elder Scrolls franchise. I know people who don’t really play games that got way into Skyrim, and they recognize the overall brand even though they only care about Skyrim. Bethesda will not have trouble selling the next Elder Scrolls game if it doesn’t say Skyrim.

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    mavs

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    Just because a game is a long-running series doesn't mean they need to market it like Call of Duty or Madden, or even Fallout. The hot new game is the hot new game no matter what it's called, if there's a long enough gap that people haven't played the last one in years.

    If you need to keep people buying it on a consistent schedule then that's probably a different situation.

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    tds418

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    #47  Edited By tds418

    Gamers will recognize the Elder Scrolls label and know it's the next big Bethesda RPG, and the marketing references to Skyrim will make it apparent to the more general audience that this is the follow-up to that game.

    I think the more interesting question is how the popularity of Skyrim will affect the game itself. Will dragons be prominently featured again? Is there a chance TES VI will actually take place in Skyrim again? Maybe Skyrim + Cyrodill or Morrowind, ESO online style? The Elder Scrolls geography is pretty well-defined: I believe there's only one or two territories/provinces that haven't been the feature of a game so far.

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    Sevith

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    I feel like this same argument was made for Oblivion and also for Morrowind before that. It wasn't a problem then, so I doubt it'll be a problem for the next TES.

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    craigieboy

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    I mean Skyrim has been released so many times it's practically it's own series at this point.

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