@karrius: there’s a big difference though. Work gives people purpose, giving people some basic amount of money and then expect them to be happy doesn’t work. Sure, some artists might be happy to take the money and then make art, but that’s a minority of people. The idea is that at some point, 1% of people are working while the other 99% have to rely completely on the 1%. That will simple create a world where depression, drug abuse, and crime are exponentially worse than it is now. Think about it this way, all forms of expression and work by humans is obsolete because AI can do it far better than any person could; it’s already starting to happen.

@horseman6: Work gives people purpose? There are certainly people who derive meaning and purpose from their work, but that is by no means a universal truth. UBI isn't about making people happy. It's about making sure people don't have to die on the streets because they can't afford shelter or food.

The idea that humans won't want to create art because AI does it is simply absurd. People aren't going to stop creating just because other entities also create. Indie artists don't stop creating art just because other artists (or companies) create art worth billions of dollars.

It's an interesting idea for a dystopia, and may very well make sense within the game's fiction. That's not necessarily the same thing as making sense in real life.

I think you're missing the point. If I'm not mistaken, he's arguing that a minority of people are artists who would be happy to just create art, not that robots would create art. I also think he's referring to work giving people purpose as in a contribution to society that makes them valuable and useful, not that work makes everyone happy.

Either way, seems like an interesting topic for a game.

I'm going to support the game just because all the twitter hate and harasing towards the dude that made it. I dont care about his politics and stuff but my feed was overtaken by people attacking him.

defo interested to see how this turns out. kid's clearly got some shit he's working out (protip: maybe don't express potentially contentious opinions in a public setting if you plan on selling something to mass-market down the road).

but i'll wait to hear the critics' take once it's actually in their hands. if the commentary handled well, then i'm in. but if it comes off as amateurish, poorly thought-out or mindlessly incendiary- probably don't need to pick this one up.

If you feel a moral conflict buying this game, just pick up a copy of Read Only Memories to balance your guilt out.

(And Dan's in it. Basically playing himself. Only a lot greener)

@bladeofcreation: why do you think so many people work after they retire? They get bored. Sure, there are a lot of people that have no work ethic and would prefer to sit on a couch and watch TV all day, lazy people. UBI won’t be basic for long. There will be a point where humans will only do extremely menial jobs and that will end up being a catastrophe for the planet.

Here’s my view, maybe it sounds harsh, but everyone should strive to be great and work hard, if you don’t, you’re lazy.

I totally agree. This premise seems to based on a wilful misunderstanding of these ideals. I'm just trying to wrap my head around the notion of feminism and PC culture "going too far".

I presume "going too far" means we go over the hump of equality and arrive back at inequality, except the roles are reversed.

And the moral of that story is that inequality is bad. So the story just ends up being a critique of the current status quo.

@horseman6 said:

Right, but there's plenty of stuff to do, anyway, beyond slave yourself to some company that doesn't care about you. My dad retired and got into collecting and doing puzzles, as well as running an antique store. People can travel, spend more time with their family, work on art, etc. People will find some way to fill their time - there are LOTS of creative people who aren't allowed to be creative right now because just doing so involves starving to death for them. Insisting that if we don't FORCE people to do stuff they don't want to, they won't be able to find stuff to do is... really silly? People take up art because it's fun, not because they have any intention of being "the best at it". You're not the best message board poster in the world, yet you do it anyway, spending your time on it. Why?

One thing that I also haven't seen mentioned is the weird disability message. The character is "disabled" in his world unable to interact with computers and society like most people are. And this causes him to want to murder people. This strikes me as super ironic considering that the lead designer was part of a group that attacked a website for listing what games could be enjoyed by people with disabilities, and the group even insisted that epileptic people should "get off the internet" and that asking designer to cater to them was censorship. Again, the horrible distopia this guy images in the future is one that exists right now, and that he even helped maintain, yet he insists it's one that his political enemies are striving for. It's super bizarre and totally un-self-aware.

I also wonder how many people insisting they're going to buy this game to spite those horrible evil liberals who are committing the act of basic criticism have financially supported developers on the other side of the issue that were targeted, harassed, and threatened by gg...

@karrius: this is 100% idealist, not realist. Most people can’t live in this type of world. Some percentage can, but most people want to do some type of work. And if they aren’t spaces to corporations, they are slaves to the government or to AI or to some elite group. Let’s not say slaves too, I work for a corporation and I don’t feel like a slave, far from it actually. Sure, sometimes I need to work 70 hours a week, but I love it.

Going too far can also mean an unintended consequence sort of story, rather than whatever the hell those two examples are.

There the moral could be your standard fare that even the most well-meaning and righteous ideals could be warped by zealotry or some such vice, and that staying true to the spirit/intent of a principle requires constant vigilance and self-awareness. Pretty basic as far as road to hell is paved with good intentions stories go. As for how that warping would manifest, I guess that'd be the story, which we apparently know little about.

But isn't this thing also about computers dominating everything (creative and otherwise) so humans are completely free to do whatever, and some (the protagonist) end up not knowing wtf to do? Then guns and synths happen?

It doesn't sound like the most exciting premise, but it sure doesn't sound like anything hateful or intentionally obtuse. I'd wait to see the actual story before tearing it to shreds, rather than making up some boogeyman based off a handful of tweets. At least then the criticisms can have some fuckin meat to them.

I don't even know what the objective was with all that hubbub. Stop people who don't think like you from making games? What?

@sethmode: Irony is almost always lost in these cases.

@horseman6: Yeah, some people are happier if they continue working. Some people also work after they retire because they have to supplement their income. Do you consider people who retire and don't work to be lazy? I just find it weird to claim that people derive some personal meaning from work when so many people hate their jobs.

@horseman6: I feel like your criticisms of UBI are indicative of my reservations for The Last Night. Ok, so you and Soret have some problems with basic income. In that case, what is the alternative? You seem to presuppose that people are actively choosing UBI, when in reality there is no choice present. Thanks to automation, there are simply going to be less jobs available to people going forward, and currently the only idea I've seen that addresses this new reality is UBI. So yes, UBI may not be perfect, but what is your alternative? Unless The Last Night can coherently answer that question, I don't see how its criticism has any value to me.

I hope he doesn't change it either if that vision is his authorial intent, an artist has the right to depict whatever she/he wants to and join or sympathize with whatever group they want to even if I find said group/views to be odious.

I just want Microsoft to stop promoting it and do a much better job of vetting the games they highlight at E3.