The Surge - opinions? opinions.

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Tennmuerti

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#1  Edited By Tennmuerti

So I've beaten the Surge yesterday and had some thoughts/impressions I wanted to share. And since there are no proper full threads for what people think of the game, might as well start one.

First of all I do think that overall it's pretty good. Something like a 4/5 for me. Like I've mentioned in another post it's not quite up to par with Souls games imo but it is a marked step up from Lords of the Fallen. The developers have clearly improved on the most important area, the combat (the actual main gameplay), which is a pleasant surprise in this day and age (to see a studio progress so well) I mean that seriously.

So pros:

  • It was good enough to binge on for 3-4 days straight (I did do most if not all of the content and exploration).
  • The limb system is a really interesting and a welcome addition. The choice to go for easy kills or try to gather resources from tougher armored and less "staggerable" body parts is neat.
  • The combat as mentioned is well executed for the most part. It does have some kinks tho when fighting non humanoid enemies. But overall feels good.
  • The change of setting works to it's benefit (but it's not all gravy) to set it apart.
  • The PC options are really good, as someone who likes to disable or change certain things in my games, I loved that this game was smart enough to offer those choices in a well thought out way. (i disabled motion blur, chromatic aberration, and camera bob when walking for example)
  • On that note I know this is a bit subjective on PC but 99.9% of the time the game runs great, it feels smooth and really well optimized. A huge improvement over the mediocre performance of Lords of the Fallen. I was running it at around 120fps at 1440p on a 1080 card. It also looks good (again better then LotF). So gold star to the technical team for this game.
  • Contrary to my belief the slo-mo of cutting dudes apart with various implements did not get old, ever. I thought I would eventually tone down their frequency and remove the slowdown via options (again great that that option is there), but I never did since I didn't tire of it throughout.
  • Progression system. Adventures in homemade progression systems that deviate from the industry norms where the developers try to spin their own yarn 9/10 times end in mediocre failures. This is that 1/10 game, where the developers put their own spin on a soulslike progression system by going with implants you can mix and match that have various functions from estus flasks to your life and stamina amounts (kinda like Nier: Automata actually but more robust), and your "level" dictating how much and what quality of armor and implants you can sodder on in total. It works, well and is quite engaging.
  • Opening cutscene is grisly and effective, it punched me and I liked it. Not gonna spoil more.

However I do have some bones to pick with it, the game is not without it's share of flaws major and minor:

  • The storytelling, the main plot, the narrative weave, the side threads. It's still bad. Mind you it's not Lords of the Fallen levels of abysmal failure; but it's not good either; imo it's below average. This game would make the Fast and the Furious movies blush with it's plotholes. This is especially glaring when recent games like Horizon Zero Dawn and Prey have both executed well on their central premises and have certain themes that are similar to what is in this game. Where the above 2 games are examples of how to properly execute on their concepts respectively, The Surge is most definitely not. The side threads in this game rather then propping up the main narrative serve more as distractions, most of which lead to nowhere and only serve to open up questions to which the game never bothers with answers; but it doesn't even feel like they are deliberate good mysteries, just that the writers had no fucking idea where to take those threads in the first place; it's all fluffy setup with no real follow through. I shit you not the last boss felt like I had no narrative point to fight it. The only meaningful thing you manage to do in the entire game happens before the last boss fight and is a totally left field opportunity dropped on you on the spot with little to no build up that your character doesn't even remark on, a literal button that may (or may not) do something, it's bizzare. Even the post boss fight credits sequence stingers felt like they had no point or purpose, I was just watching them with the only thought being: "who cares".
  • Whew... sorry for that rant. It's just that these guys either need to hire better writers or at least consider their narratives more. In this day and age games have improved, the standards have risen. The Surge narrative feels like a C-B grade game from the 00's and not in a good cheesy way. I mean for fucks sake it has a goddamn scientist, who while theoretically is very smart and is a head of a department spouts his justifications and ideas at you that are just idiot-nonsense-garbage-shit, how bad can you get game. Here I go again, sorry.
  • The level design. A - has issues with the above narrative badness. Some layouts and places where things happen make no fucking sense. This corporation literally has a black ops grisly project on human "volunteers" (shocker!) that is right through a door off of the main exhibition plaza WHERE GUIDED TOURS HAPPEN... FUCK.
  • Level design part dos. A couple of levels suffer from a maze like structure. The last level especially is just a warren of service tunnels, cramped lifts, etcetera. It's at some point no longer fun smart level design that interconnects and is a lazy orgy of same looking bullshit ducts and cabling.
  • Not so much a flaw but a design choice that I prefer a different take on. The game consists of very discrete levels you travel to and from. Where I prefer a more DarkSouls 1 type of approach where the world is more cohesive and singular (even if yes it's technically not all one zone)
  • Some clunkiness in combat imo when fighting non humanoid enemies.
  • Enemy variety leaves a lot to be desired. After the first two levels, the introduction of new enemies slows to a crawl. I don't think there is even one new enemy type introduced in the entirety of levels 4 and 5. For a very big chunk of the game you are fighting the exact same enemy types over and over. Only in the last level do you finally get introduced to 2 new types of enemies.
  • Boss fights could have had more oomph. For me the most memorable boss fight was the first boss. The rest are just forgettable. One of the later bosses is literally a tougher standard enemy that summons a first boss once in a while, and there are only 5 boss encounters in total, come on you can do better.
  • The way to get advanced versions of boss weapons is very arbitrary. If you did not know or read up on how to do the specific things you need before hand you're shit out of luck for the most part. In all but 1 case it's not intuitive at all.
  • I do not like the design of the final "endgame" weapons. They basically had a carte blanche with those to come up with the best most badass looking shit and they instead look like puny fiddly sticks (with the exception of the axe type that one looks dope but you get it like 5 mins before last boss, so). My personal nitpick.

All in all the main reason I think it's a good game and a decent souslike is because it gets the biggest most important parts right the combat and the rpg aspects, which for game like this (call it a soulslike or and action rpg) are in my book the two main things. Yes the story is dismissable and the exploration/level design is touch and go, but those are survivable weak aspects. The meat of it is on the stick and it smells like good cookin.

Watcha all think so far?

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RetroMetal

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After reading your post, thank you by the way, I've been waiting for a non-journalist opinion on this game, I must say you've made my decision on paying $60 for the game now or say $30 for it later a no-brainer.

Thanks!

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bybeach

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After reading your post, thank you by the way, I've been waiting for a non-journalist opinion on this game, I must say you've made my decision on paying $60 for the game now or say $30 for it later a no-brainer.

Thanks!

The Surge is fifty bucks at steam. I bought it for $43.00 by buying it before it came out, the QL having convinced me for the price this time around. We'll see, too involved in Nioh right now around that fucking cave system where I keep falling off of ledges......

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tatsuyarr

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Started it yesterday evening on Xbox One and was surprised by the good frame rate. I'm also playing the second DLC of Dark Souls 3 at the moment and it's day and night in this department. For now I just have one basic weapon and not even a complete armor set but from I've already played I'm enjoying it. Some details are lacking like a few distinct sounds when you pick up scraps for example and the hits seem to lack impact but every game can't be Dark Souls so I don't mind too much for now.

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boysef

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I love elysium so playing this game in that sense has been amazing for me, especially building a character off Sharlto Copley

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OurSin_360

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I wonder if they would just be better off not having story like the souls games and just have a bunch of vague allusions to the game world to build atmosphere. I forget they charge 60 bux for all console games regardless of quality, but 35-40 seems about the sweet spot for this game which has been what it's been available for on the pc. I will probably grab this at some point, but ended up getting injustice for console so probably wait till later this year with heavy discounts.

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Humanity

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@tennmuerti: I see your complaints about level design and bosses, but I'm curious if you can further exemplify what makes it "not as good as a Souls game" specifically? I've seen this thrown around a lot recently because it will obviously be compared to the material it so heavily leans on. At the same time, are we at a point where this is now a genre that different games occupy, instead of every new game being labeled as a "copy cat" ? I ask because while I enjoyed the Souls games quite a bit, I was always annoyed by the technical issues that were present within basically each and every one of those games. Wonky camera, weird geometry issues at times, hit boxes, framerate.. While the Souls games came first, they didn't really get better with time, we just got more of them. So when the Surge came out, and I saw all these cool new systems that they added onto the existing "Souls" framework I got pretty excited. Personally the level linearity never bothered me because I really preferred the Demon's Souls hub-world approach and Dark Souls 1 was always a broken mess with a ton of "dead zones" interconnecting one place to the other. Neat idea, not all that practical in the long run. As for story, well to be honest I was never an obsessive enough fan to dig into the Souls games for it. During one of those games I made a very conscious effort to read all the descriptions and pay attention during all NPC chatter, and still I came away as baffled as ever. So I can't honestly say the story of any of those games was a big draw for me.

Thats a lot of rambling but I guess I'm just curious if were really judging these games against Souls games or against the genre that they've created?

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Tennmuerti

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#8  Edited By Tennmuerti

@humanity:I feel like there's a few threads of thought here, so I'll parcel them down separately.

The genre thing. Personally I don't really care how people define these games, I myself don't get hung up on that. Is this game a copy cat? Sure. The developers were very straightforward about that when they started down this path with LotF. Is that a bad thing? For me - no. For me that's a good thing. This developing sub genre or whatever it still pretty small all told, and as someone who really likes it, every game that wants to occupy this space is welcome in my book, I can consume these for what feels like indefinitely (for now at least). And while LotF didn't bring much new to the table except being mediocre, in the Surge I feel like we are finally seeing the developer: A - get their sea legs and figure things out and get comfortable in their chosen arena (which for a fan of the genre is super uplifting to see, since I hope they will go on to do more of these games and keep improving too); B - bring their own spin to the table, which is always interesting to see especially when it works out well (see Nioh).

How do we judge these games? Well while I'm not a reviewer or anything but. Yea we absolutely judge them against the genre the Souls games have created, it's just that at this very moment this genre is yet relatively small, and the Souls games themselves are a still a recent (last DLC was this year) and most prominent measuring stick in it, so just by inevitability we measure them against the Souls games themselves too.

OK onto the story. That's the thing imo about the DarkSouls games story. Since it's so indirect and most of it is told vaguely through item descriptions you can safely ignore it and be totally fine playing the games without it. Or get deep and sink into the lore. The problem with LotF and with The Surge is that the story is told very traditionally through dialogue and exposition, so when the developers clearly don't have the chops to make a decent one of those it becomes more noticeable and not so easy to ignore. That said I think it's a testament to the general baseline solidity of the Surge that I was compelled to keep consuming it (and enjoying it) despite the bumfuckery of the narrative bits.

What makes it not as good as Souls? Well to start off all those things I've mentioned in the main post :P. If I was asked to be more specific on other topics besides those above it would be the combat and the enemy variety. But before I get to that I would like to emphasize that yea bosses are a significant enough part of it, they really don't have a thing on Souls bosses; not numerically, not in terms of crazy unique designs (1 boss is kinda neat), nor in terms of the depth and complexity of their move sets and mechanics. The atmosphere of the Souls games is a big part of it for me as well, which is why I love DS1 above all else as it's oppressive nature and worlds uncaring attitude towards you made me love it, I loved that you didn't have a hub or a proper base to return to (something later games lost imo) and that firelink was open to the elements and that people came and went from it. They made me feel like you're getting into an epic sandblast that is both harsh, yet purging and makes you tougher and better sort of cool moments. But I can wax on about DS1 atmosphere for hours heh.

Ok ok. The combat lets get a bit more in depth, yes it feels better then LotF, meatier, better hit feedback, but not as sluggish, yet appropriate for the getup. But it only works properly well when you are fighting humanoid enemies whose bodyparts you can target. As soon as you start fighting non humanoid enemies, it's not as good, the bodypart system is kinda there but not really, they don't have executions (which are a big draw both mechanically and visually). They require a very different approach unlike what the game teaches you for a significant part of it, which is a bit jarring. Secondly weapons and movesets. There are five categories of weapons and they share the same moveset for all of them within that category. Not a big deal by itself; Souls weapons while many are not super different from one to one, and Bloodborne pulled off quality over quantity. But instead of light/heavy attacks Surge went with horizontal/vertical approach for two buttons and while good in theory mashing either one works perfectly, with very little difference between the two. This means that you don't really need to ever learn movesets aside from: what do basic attacks of this weapon type look like, that's it. Which in the end means there is just less depth in the combat overall. Personally I feel like this can be it's own topic you could write a few paragraphs on if someone wanted to reeeealy take the time to break it down. Finally a big part of these types of games for me is the enemy variety against which you apply said combat. Which is where the Surge again kinda falters a bit. Compared to it's contemporaries like Souls, Bloodborne, Nioh, there is just less enemy variety plain and simple cut and dry. There are only 3 main enemy types you fight through ought 90% of the game. There are about 3-4 more ancillary ones and that's it. Of those 3 main ones only the 1 type the humanoid dudes feel real real good to fight; thankfully they are you meat and potatoes and they have their own minor variations. The drones are super throwaway. And the agile robotic enemies are total dickbags when you start going up against them that you feel the combat was just not designed in mind with, eventually you do get used to them, but they still feel really awkward as fights even when you are manhandling them later on, because of the way the combat flows with them or rather doesn't flow, because of in order to fight them well you need to keep waiting for their attacks that they can take their time with and then some; It's not terrible, it just doesn't feel as dynamic or well paced as humanoid fights. Anyway that's one of the main appeals to me from these types of game, the games introducing you to new stuff as they go on that you have to keep figuring out. The Surge doesn't do enough of it. You have to think about a new encounter variation 2-3 times tops by the end of it, and it's plain not quite as interesting or engaging as a result, the variety just isn't there.

That said, I also personally see no reason for someone not to like the Surge more then the Souls games. It can be the setting. A more direct narrative (as flawed as it is). The gory body targeting system. The different take on the level up system. Me I just like these types of games it turns out, I want to consume them, gobble them up. They appeal to the super rpg nerd in me in terms of progression systems and loot, and they appeal to the part of me that like action games like Bayonetta or Darksiders or GoW; all in one package.

Sry for the walls of text ^.^

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JosephKnows

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#9  Edited By JosephKnows

How you elaborate on your opinions make it sound more like a 3/5 than a 4/5 game to me. But yeah, thanks anyway for sharing your thoughts and feelings on the game! Been getting more and more interested in the game after seeing the Quick Look and getting more impressions around the internet.

I think I will get this eventually when it goes on sale later this year. Sounds like a fun time, but with all the stellar games out there right now, it's probably better for me to get on stuff like Nier and Horizon before this one!

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Tennmuerti

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#10  Edited By Tennmuerti

@josephknows: Keep in mind I was asked to elaborate specifically on what I felt like the negative bits were so that last part would definitely sound more negative then what I actually felt like overall on the game. Especially when it's pretty easy for me to get all ranty about it :)

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Ares42

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#11  Edited By Ares42

Gotta disagree with you on the progression system. Firstly, the proficiency system is garbage. It discourages experimentation really badly in a game where you already have to invest time and resources into new weapons to make them useful. If you focus on a single weapon type you will quickly do 30+% more damage with those weapons than weapons in other classes. (also, as a side note, the weapons do have different movesets. Maybe not all of them, but some do.)

Secondly, while I do enjoy the Monster Hunter style loot progression the actual balance of it is not great. You never feel like you're actually making any progress, if anything it always feels like you're falling further and further behind and when you're finally able to upgrade it's not even close to impactful enough to give any sort of elation. I also spent a bunch of time grinding out mats to change up my full armor set from an upgraded light armor to heavy armor, and the difference was damn close to unnoticeable.

Overall I've not been very impressed by the game. In my book this is very much a game that illustrates how so much in Souls games works because it is done well. It's like someone playing violin, if they're good it's enjoyable, but if they're bad you just want them to stop. The more I've played the game the more I just feel annoyed by their spin on the genre.

Oh, and I almost forgot, while the implant system is pretty good the design on that UI is fucking terrible.

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Tennmuerti

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#12  Edited By Tennmuerti

@ares42: Yea the proficiency stuff isn't a good way to go, I totally agree with you on that actually. That said neither is the Souls weapon upgrade systems. Either way you slice it those types of systems always discouraged significant experimentation in the end. Which is why I use an amazing tool like Cheatengine to say fuck that and raise the proficiencies of weapon types I want to experiment with to the main one I was currently using. >.> I still ended up using a single mount weapon type for most of the game tho as it just felt the best fit for me. The mat upgrades I found super generous (I did slice a lot of right arms off in my playthrough however).

What I really liked about the progression is having to balance the implants choices vs. the implant strengths vs. the armor core usage vs. the implant slots.

Don't feel you on the armor tho. It's essentially the DS system of keeping all options viable and competitive, or at least relatively so. And upgrading them via mats is just upping their numbers. But there are also not really that many armor sets. I think I've used 3 sets total in the game due to their combo of looks+set bonuses (lynx->security->bloodied proteus). Heavy armor does make a big difference in terms of stability for sure, you will be able to keep attacking and not get staggered by most standard blows while in heavy armor.

Not sure what you mean by implant UI design being terrible I found it extremely fast and easy to use to the point where I swapped and upgraded things all the time and barely thought about it. I did keep it clean by disassembling redundant implants tho.

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Ares42

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@tennmuerti: ye, I couldn't quite find the right words.. I was mostly talking about the visual design, like the icons. They all just mesh together and the prominent part is the rarity, not the actual iconography that sets them apart. And you can't sort them in any way that makes it easy to find the functionality you want, you just have to scroll through each and every one reading the text to see if it's the one you're looking for.

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Tennmuerti

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#14  Edited By Tennmuerti

@ares42: Fair enough.

Which reminds me, I wish there was a proper sort option for armor and weapons, there are all sort of useless sort options but none by type for weapons or sets for armor. Weird.

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GaspoweR

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Bought it for $38 on Greenmangaming on PC if anyone's interested.

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nickhead

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I went into this game with super low expectations and I've found some enjoyment in it. The body part targeting and risk/reward of it is a nice concept that is mostly working for me even if, most of the time, I'm not gaining much from it. I was afraid of the minimal enemy/level variety and that appears to be the case.

I also don't love the boss fights (only beat the 2nd this morning) - instead of it being based on my current skill they're just tedious. I've still had to learn them and died plenty of times trying but I never felt tense. I'd consider myself a Souls veteran and all the way up through DS3 some bosses still got my blood pumping.

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Syndrom

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i'm in the security dudes zone atm, really enjoying my time with this. I always dabbled in souls games but always just stopped for some reason. So this game is doing something i actually enjoy. I really like the feel of the combat in this game and the limb severing thing is pretty cool imo and fun to do, it adds variety to the grind imo.

I like the progression with the implants, but i really don't like the proficiency though. I'm still rolling with the chainsaw sword that dropped in the first zone, and i really want something else, just to even look at lol but i can't really switch weapon type because my profiency is so damn low. So i'm stuck with this sword and i'm not finding anything else. (i found an 1hander axe, but that thing is worse statwise)

The bossfights are kind of lame, but i don't mind as much, the boss fights in souls games are always memorable but most of the time not in a fun way. They're not as much of a stupid roadblock here, wich i can appreciate.

Overall i really like the game and having a fun time with it. It has some flaws but not as gamebreaking or funstoppers for me.

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mems1224

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As someone who used to be staunchly opposed to Dark Souls games I'm interested in it. I'll probably wait for a second because right now I got Prey, Persona 5, Injustice 2, Bloodborne and Bayonetta on my plate

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geirr

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I might've gotten into this but Shortbrownhair McWhiteDude is the most boring main character of any game ever. If you make games heavily inspired by Dark Souls, why ignore the character creation? I need it. ; 3;

Also the workshop/medbay music is terrible and repetitive.

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Humanity

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#20  Edited By Humanity

@tennmuerti: Thanks for the in-depth reply! Like some people I'm simply starting to feel a little fatigue from seeing things compared to Souls games as souls-like, whereas the Souls games are usually presented as an ideal to strive towards. This mostly irks me because all of the Dark Souls entries had plenty of problems with them and were far from perfect games, they were simply the only games of that ilk so in a way they got a pass. That "pass" ended for me at some point when the camera was still wonky in Dark Souls 3, and the targetting was still weird and a number of other small details and quirks from the past 3-4 entries were still present and From Software was apparently in no hurry to fix them. For instance what you loved about Dark Souls 1, the lack of fast travel for the first half of the game, I found pretty bad (I also think the level layout is also pretty bad and apart from the Undead Burg a lot of those areas are just not very well designed), so we already have a difference of opinion on what makes a good Souls game of sorts. After watching Vinny stream the Surge last night I did see a lot of the level design complaints come to life in real time as I was unnervingly getting just as lost and turned around in the very similar looking corridors as the Bomb crew. That said my main take away from this without getting into a long rant of what I personally like and dislike versus what others like and dislike (which is usually a dead end conversation anyway because your enjoyment is yours alone) I'm curious when we will start judging these games as action RPG's instead of Souls-likes. I suppose when a lot more of them start getting released? It's not like people to this day say that a cover shooter is on par with a Gears of War, or that an FPS is on par with a Call of Duty. People usually say that it's either a good cover shooter or a bad one. The Souls shorthand seems to have gotten somewhat out of control to the point where any game slightly more challenging than the norm is suddenly inspired by Souls design. Although to cap this off, I ironically defended the Souls-like branding in the past when discussing Hyper Light Drifter, when others were saying it is more Zelda and not like a Souls game at all, so I'm probably just as guilty of propagating the trend myself.

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Tennmuerti

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@humanity:I don't know about Hyperlightdrifter haven't played it, but this game is a very specific case because it really is like a Souls game, it is very directly trying to ape 95% of it's systems and design mentalities. Unlike when people try to start applying the "soulslike" label to everything difficult under the sun, in this case it is the most appropriate thing ever. They literally made one of those games with only slight tweaks to the formula god or bad. So I feel like this type of though and conversation would be more appropriate in a game that indeed has much less in common with the Souls franchise. This doesn't feel like a time and a place for that label to be called into question when the developers very deliberately sought it out.

Btw I totally don't give Souls games a pass for their problems, god knows they have plenty (but mine might not be the same as yours). But yes you can only compare things to a genre as a whole when it actually grows beyond the shadow of what spawned it. Right now what do we have as proper definitive Soulslike games? Bloodborne - same studio. Lords of the Fallen - a totally mediocre game by this very studio. Nioh - the one other good game by Team Ninja. (And then a whole plethora of games "inspired" by them or derived from them where there is that grey water that you dislike of people debating what is or isn't a souls like starts.) Compared to 4 Souls games with their various DLC's and Bloodborne, they by default are the measuring stick atm, because aside from say Nioh nothing has yet stepped up. Like you said we really do need to see more of them start getting released for that to stop being the case, and not just more but of a better quality. We started talking of FPS as a genre proper when we got beyond just a few mediocre Doom clones and into games that went beyond, improved the space on their own and set their own bars of quality and fun too. Nioh so far is like the one step in that direction I feel like, but it's not without it's own issues either and isn't quite the powerhouse. This game is sort of another little half step. But the souls games have so far run a marathon and they're still kind of the best we have in this niche space like it or not. We need a CoD and a Battlefield franchise. A Legue of Legends and Dota2 and HoN and HotS to a lesser degree. A Doom and Quake and Unreal. A Siera and a Lucas arts. A C&C, a Warcraft and Starcraft and Supreme Commander. A Baldur's Gade, a Fallout and a Planescape: Torment. But also a not just them, we also need some not so successful stuff around them to create a proper mass, if this is to get out of a niche (not that that is necessarily a good thing, getting out of a niche, it might be perfectly fine as one). Heck there were Diablo clones for a long time rather then arpgs and that genre still has a label problem, now even more so, are they the arpgs or are these games now the arpgs even when they are so different in structure.

Who can say if Deck 13 improves as much as they did from LotF to the Surge with their next game, they could be that other measuring stick to start moving away from the souls shadow proper.

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handlas

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#22  Edited By handlas

I feel like i have the same issue with it that I had with Lords of the Fallen.

I can't put my finger on it exactly. Just something feels off about the combat when you compare it to Dark Souls. It always feels like it's my fault when I die in Dark Souls. In this game it just seems like there isn't enough feedback when hitting enemies. Every time I die I feel like I've been hit unexpectedly. Like the enemy looks staggered but they are not and, out of nowhere, they quickly hit me and I'm dead. Really puts me off when I'm dying on the basic enemies because of that... I like everything else about the game; but that's a major thing to get past.

edit: I've played a bit more and notice one thing that is causing an issue. Sometimes I'll hit the attack button once and my guy will swing his weapon twice. I'll hit it twice and randomly he will swing three times. Bizarre. Maybe it's the weapon... I dunno. But it's annoying when I swing twice and plan to dodge but then I get stuck in a third swing which causes me to get hit. Humm now that I've noticed this it I'm realizing how often it is happening.

edit again: Okay it is the weapon. The rhino weapon and the first boss's weapon. Sometimes when you attack he will do a shoulder attack and then follow it up with a swing. Basically ur one attack turns into two and a looong animation that you can't cancel out of causing me to die multiple times. Well I won't use that weapon anymore though seems like terrible design.

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Ares42

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#23  Edited By Ares42

@handlas: I'm 100% with you. I dunno how many times I've died because the enemy just punches through my 4 attack combo, or because they quickly do some poorly telegraphed attack. I've found myself playing the game more and more by rhythm rather than reacting, as in I know can do X amount of attacks before I have to dodge whatever attack is about to happen and just rinse, repeat. The dark areas in the game also doesn't help, since you often can't really see what the enemy is doing even with the flashlight on.

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handlas

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@ares42 said:

@handlas: I'm 100% with you. I dunno how many times I've died because the enemy just punches through my 4 attack combo, or because they quickly do some poorly telegraphed attack. I've found myself playing the game more and more by rhythm rather than reacting, as in I know can do X amount of attacks before I have to dodge whatever attack is about to happen and just rinse, repeat. The dark areas in the game also doesn't help, since you often can't really see what the enemy is doing even with the flashlight on.

I tried the big hammer weapon. Again, if you swing like 3 times he will go into this long spin animation that you can't get out of. It's like I'm fighting the game to play it. Seems like you have to play like...swing once... dodge... swing once... dodge. I think I'm done with the game. I would probably request a refund but I'm 3 hours in so I'm past the time limit. Oh well. My fault, I should of not bought it since I thought Lords of the Fallen felt bad as well.

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Shindig

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So ... you don't explicitly level up in this, do you? I've only made it to the first shortcut so maybe something opens up. Is it all gear based?

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Ares42

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#26  Edited By Ares42

@shindig: Using your tech scrap to upgrade your rig gives you more core power, which allows you to equip more and stronger implants, which can give you bonuses like more hp, damage, healing etc etc. You also unlock more implant slots at specific core power levels. You can think of it like the Souls system, except you're not commiting your stats (as you can switch up implants at any point) and they have an even wider range of possible effects. But ye, you do have to find the implants (like items), so in some regard it is gear based.

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Shindig

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Cool stuff. I figured something was up. I also loved the reveal of the protagonist. As soon as the game asked you to move I was taken aback. Nicely done.

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doctordonkey

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This game is fuckin' rad, but it does a piss poor job at explaining the systems. There are a lot of mechanics that just get either glossed over way too quickly, on a wall you might just run right past in the tutorial, or just straight up not explained at all. For example, I don't ever remember the game mentioning countering. If you block an attack and hit R1 right after, you deal a high damage counter attack. Same with ducking and leaping, you can counter after a successful duck or leap. Before I knew about this, I thought blocking was just worthless. There is also a very quick, very useful attack that covers a lot of ground that you can execute by dodging towards an enemy and hitting R1.

There are so many little things not explained at all, I would recommend sifting through this reddit post and its comments, and learn all the little nuances that the game never touches upon.

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Syndrom

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finished the game yesterday, the last boss was a real bitch until i switched implants and had 12 medpacks and powered through it. That ending is real depressing haha. Overall the story doesn't quite do it but i liked it way more than the souls story cause it wasn't so obtuse.

don't know how i feel about new game plus though. The profiency system kind of kills that for me, i'd rather just start a new game where i can experiment with new weapons much more easily

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Syndrom

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#30  Edited By Syndrom

edit: @doctordonkey beat me to it with the reddit thread.

I started messing around in NG+ today with some different weapons and felt like i didn't do really less dmg than my onehander. Allready in the second zone after some farming and beating the boss from zone one very easily. Also cleared the bit where Brad got creamed in the QL very easily, once you figure out the pattern on those scorpion dog things they are actually very easy.

Very weird, this continues to be the very first souls game where i'm having fun and it not feeling like a big chore to get through.

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Shindig

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I'm cooling off on this. Lock on when you've got two enemies after you is kinda borked and I definitely grow tired of enemies that will get an attack off during one of your combos.

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Was surprised it was only five gig when I bought it, haha.

As a Dark Souls fan, I enjoy it. There are enough similarities to grab my attention, and enough fresh content to keep me interested. I've only played about two hours so far and I'm really enjoying how smooth it runs and how precise the combat is. Looks incredible, too.

The game starts strong with one of my favourite, simplistic intros to a game in a long time.

Curious to see how the bosses go.

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UpperDecker

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I think it's fair that I thought this post was about that movie where at night, you can kill anyone you want and get away with it........I think it's called something else.

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Derpderpa

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I think it's fair that I thought this post was about that movie where at night, you can kill anyone you want and get away with it........I think it's called something else.

is it GTA?

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UpperDecker

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@derpderpa: I looked it up. it's called the Purge.

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Derpderpa

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#36  Edited By Derpderpa

@derpderpa: I looked it up. it's called the Purge.

everynight? I thought its like yearly. :/

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Shindig

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#37  Edited By Shindig

Yeah, it's yearly. The even had an election-themed sequel. Alright, my restart's gone better. Seems like crafting the new stuff in each area is the way to go and now I'm using the first boss weapon. I'm a little slow but that's nothing a few core levels can't fix. Now that the gear is sorted, I'm back to focusing on weak spots. This run's also the first time I spotted the optional enemy in the first zone.

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