Does anyone here actually enjoy the PVP/Dark Zone content? I thought it was an interesting idea during the betas and the game's initial launch but quickly I realized how unactualized every piece of the Dark Zone is, even now. Part of it, I am sure, is it being another symptom of a game whose development went way over and that had to launch as an incomplete product.

That being said, the Dark Zone is incredibly frustrating. Some of it boils down to the fact that the combat just isn't good for pvp. When 3 people with level 204+ equipment from Underground can't kill one guy out in the open there is a problem (and its not lag or being unable to hit the target). From what I can tell the game also doesn't group you into an instance with similarly ranked players. Once you hit level 30, that's it in terms of matchamaking (other than things like people on your friends list, etc). I haven't had issues with trollish groups of players as much as instances of one single guy killing an entire group made of 2 to 3 players which is insane. However, it becomes a game of "what gear do you have" opposed to actually hitting the target accurately.

With only 2 trophies left until we hit platinum (both being Dark Zone related) it frustrates me even more, but maybe I'm just whining... Anyone else having/had similar experiences in the Dark Zone? With the issues I am having with other players its even worse as they've ramped up the amount of NPCs in the Dark Zone that are just hanging around so its pretty easy to for other players to bait NPCs into your group which is also frustrating.

Apparently so. I'm not into it, but I've got a friend who got the game day one and hasn't even hit level 30, but is like Dark Zone level 90.

It used to be great before the newer update, to be honest. Once they let you cut down the rope, that was it for the game. Not blaming it ON the rope mechanic, just when everything shitty happened. Tougher NPC's etc,

@alkusanagi I don't think that's possible? Don't you have to be level 30 to start leveling in the Dark Zone? Edit: I'm pretty sure you're right and I'm wrong.

It was pretty cool until people started exploiting it like crazy. Also, with everyone min/maxing armor and weapon sets, anyone who isn't lvl 99 is just getting crushed to the point where it just isn't fun anymore. Up until recently the loot in the DZ sucked too, so it was just a bunch of people griefing others.

Honestly, everything was fine until they introduced gear sets, which made everyone play the same pretty much. Unfortunately, before gear sets, people didn't have a chance to enjoy it with all the hackers so they stayed away until it was too late. Ask anyone who played the open beta DZ compared to now and how much fun it was back then.

It's a very good design and concept but the sort of thing that a modern gaming community would never be able to keep interesting for longer than a week or so, due to the proliferation of information and the over reliance on it by the general consumer. If there were no groups it's possible it would work at max level, but it's very hard to balance that sort of thing. Ubisoft did make the best multiplayer games last generation with AC/apparently the Blacklist and this has similar concepts involved but making a game with super interesting multiplayer that doesn't get dumbed down and made into the most boring thing by the community is nearly impossible, as evidenced by Hearthstone and various other games.

Day one of the closed beta was super fun and engaging, by day two it was already becoming the cesspool.

The Dark Zone isn't PVP and was always going to run into a dead end after all the early players got all the best loot the ones who stick around do so just to gank noobs which in turn causes them to quit, its a vicious cycle that Massive can't solve. What the Division needs is some multiplayer modes King of the Hill would work really well from H1Z1.

I like Dark Zone stuff, but I find I have to really have to put myself out there and ask "randos" to joining the group. If you are going solo in the DZ you will eventually get ganked, so even just two other people who are "okay" at watching you back can help.

One of the funnier episodes I had was rolling with a crew that just started picking off solo players. I was really conflicted about them doing it, but in the end (like after 3 second of thought) I figured, "Well, that's the game...I guess. Better them than me!"

I like the Dark Zone, but it's definitely not for the PvP aspect though. While there are some good moments that involve other players, in my experience, they get overshadowed by all the groups of assholes you shoot you down and steal your shit. It's all part of the game, but it doesn't make it any more pleasant. It's a better experience with other friends or teammates.

I also still have some fundamental issues with how the rogue system works. I love the concept, but people in a group shouldn't be able to have different rogue levels, because it leads to situations where you can't shoot one of them, who isn't rogue because *you'll* turn rogue, so he can just get your back while his buddies, who are rogue, keep you occupied. Some stuff is just tough because of how video games work. Some dude walking in front of my line of fire shouldn't turn me rogue, but that would be almost impossible for the game to know the difference between that and me actively shooting someone.

The Dark Zone is a great idea with flawed execution.

I kind of feel like you can say that for the entire game in general. Like I've said in other threads, The Division has an awesome setting and the core gameplay loop is solid, but Ubi Massive totally dropped the ball on the development side. I feel like if the game were made by a more competent developer with more MMO experience, all of these problems either would have been fixed early on or would have been avoided completely. It seems like Massive is just struggling to keep up, let alone actually fixing problrms with the game. I just don't think they have the chops to handle a game of this size and scope. It's sad really because there is so much potential for this game that is just wasted. Bugs, exploits, poor design decisions, slow response to fixing said bugs and exploits... It's like the game is on fire at any given moment and Massive is trying to put it out with a garden hose.

@stonyman65: I agree, though the PVE stuff is way better than the PVP/DZ. I am really hoping that none of this game makes its way into Ghost Recon next year.

Yeah, I'd agree with that for sure. But, I also don't think there is a totally fair way to play an unfair sistuation.

One thing I would add would be "the option" to booby trap equipment with a dye pack. in exchanges for 2/3 of the 'highest level' equipment in your haul, you can set a dye-bomb that takes 15 seconds of standing still to set. If you die in combat that dye pack arms and anyone who picks up that loot will get sprayed with a dye that gives them 'Rogue' stasis that lasts 3x as long. If you extract that equipment you get only the worst 1/3 of the haul. So, you give some stuff up in exchange for making any Rouges who mess with you give pause. If that perosn takes that loot and last 3x as long as a Rouge then get the haul clean....and ist probably pretty good stuff. Its a bet: you bet they are screwed and they bet they can still get away with it. Also, the Rouge status follows them, they can't leave the DZ on foot or otherwise to remove the status.

@monkeyking1969: Adding more mechanics or tweaking the Rogue status will not prevent the Dark Zone being a finite experience. When you get the best loot in The Division, what is there to do? Other than either stop playing or gank other players in the Dark Zone. Destiny has PVP players can keep playing without new content and you can still make some progress by ranking up different factions, the Dark Zone will never keep people playing without new content.

The Dark Zone execution isn't flawed it's the concept.

It was a cool experiment. I thought the early days were cool, when you’d forge alliances and sometime PvP, never knowing if the next guy was cool or was someone who would kill you and jack your stuff.

At some point not long in, it got where it was always going to go and people just hung out there ganging up on people. It got a lot less interesting at that point...