Basically my Gold account expired.   I've found PSN is adequate for online gaming although of course not on par with Live so far.  However, now that I am one of the filthy unpaying horde it means I now have to wait a week for demo downloads.

I must have missunderstood something.

I have to wait a week to be advertised to?  I actually am expected to pay, to download adverts?  This seems wrong at best.
A demo for a game has one purpous in life, to help you decide you like the game and that you want to pay money for the retail product.  It takes a developer a fair bit of effort to even make a demo.  And they do it for that reason alone.

Microsoft have every reason to want you to buy games on their platform, they get a slice of money for every copy sold.  Yet I am finding that games like the upcoming Force Unleashed will have a demo on PSN and XBL within a day or so of eachother, and since I can get the Playstation demo immediatley that pretty much solidifies where I will decide to buy the game, shoud I like it.

Now thats one thing, but I have found it does something else more destructive to Xbox.  Since I have all current consoles and enjoy each my money is not so capable of covering every game I want on every system, so when platform exlusives like Ninja Gaiden 2 and Too Human are on the way, I rush on over to the Marketplace and see that big red logo that tells me "We do not need you to buy this game" and that is exactly the message I take away, because quite often by the time that week is over the demo news and chat has died down, and I forget about it or just stop caring.

I would have no problem paying for Live again some time, it is a superb service.  But Microsoft fucked up on scale elephantine when they first tried to differentiate Gold and Silver accounts, and now years into the console they still are trying to make it feel like you get something worth paying money for over the free account.  There are a few reason I know, but video chat on my camera on my bandwidth and week late demo downloads is certainly not one.

I just felt like letting that out.  It seems unusually stupid for Microsoft.

so...you came to tell us the dream that is psn and the scum that is xbox live then? sorry but its a week a freaking week, if you cannot wait that long then i hardly believe you in your honesty of not wanting just ending up the unpaying horde.

its a week thats it, nothing but a week. and let alone the fact that xbox live still gets more demos then psn most of the time. i dont really see the problem, and really a demo doesn't cost much to make in terms of time or money for a company, its a week to a months time of work to get a demo up and going.

I agree with delaying demos being unfair. I don't think punishing Silver members is the best way to get new Gold members...

and most demos are inaccurate and show wrong pictures within games.

Shocking how close the PSN is coming to Xbox Live Gold, especially seeing as you don't even have to pay for that... I wonder if microsoft will have to do something about that

"Shocking how close the PSN is coming to Xbox Live Gold, especially seeing as you don't even have to pay for that... I wonder if microsoft will have to do something about that"

"so...you came to tell us the dream that is psn and the scum that is xbox live then? sorry but its a week a freaking week, if you cannot wait that long then i hardly believe you in your honesty of not wanting just ending up the unpaying horde.

its a week thats it, nothing but a week. and let alone the fact that xbox live still gets more demos then psn most of the time. i dont really see the problem, and really a demo doesn't cost much to make in terms of time or money for a company, its a week to a months time of work to get a demo up and going.
"

"Shocking how close the PSN is coming to Xbox Live Gold, especially seeing as you don't even have to pay for that... I wonder if microsoft will have to do something about that
"

Yeah, you'd really think being able to actually play online with friends would be enough to differentiate from Gold accounts and Silver accounts. I also hate the fact that my account is stuck a child account forever, and therefore cannot download M rated content at all, it's sad, I hope the new Dashboard gives me the option of changing that.

"Yeah, you'd really think being able to actually play online with friends would be enough to differentiate from Gold accounts and Silver accounts. I also hate the fact that my account is stuck a child account forever, and therefore cannot download M rated content at all, it's sad, I hope the new Dashboard gives me the option of changing that.
"

Funny how people will attack this guy for stating his opinions. It's not like he is being a fanboy at all. Do we all have to sugar coat the Xbox experience and not talk about its flaws? Come on...

I agree to an extent, PSN is better IMO, and is really really close to XBL when keeping in mind its free. PSN will be getting revamped later this year as well as in 09. The in-game XMB, trophies, movi store, etc, was just the first step according to them. So just like they revamped the PS Store (which now looks and functions better then the XBLM IMO), they will be doing the same with PSN, adding more features and whatnot. Like they did with the max 100 friends recently and so on.

But MS really needs to do something, not only are you paying 50 bucks but you even get ads in your face after giving them money? Most places tell you to register for an account (money) to remove the  ads, but MS does the opposite. Shows how much money they are trying to make.

So by this time next year PSN will be really close, and MS will HAVE to react. Either by lowering the price of XBL or removing it compeltely... like thats going to happen.

Do we really need to turn this thread into a system wars debate?  The fact is that those that pay, have access to content first and in my eyes that is how it should be.  Now regarding the statement by Sentry, that PSN is "better" than XBL, my response to that is...are you serious?  Seriously that is just laughable....

I sorta have to agree with your point about demos. Demos help let people make a decision whether they want to purchase a game or not, so why make Silver accounts wait? Seems like they could lose potential sales of the game in question.

They make silver account members wait a week for demos so that they download faster for the gold members.

"Do we really need to turn this thread into a system wars debate?  The fact is that those that pay, have access to content first and in my eyes that is how it should be.  Now regarding the statement by Sentry, that PSN is "better" than XBL, my response to that is...are you serious?  Seriously that is just laughable....
"

Where in the hell did I say that PSN is better then XBL?
"

I agree to an extent, PSN is better IMO,
"

"Sentry said:

Where in the hell did I say that PSN is better then XBL?
"

In your statement here:
Sentry said:

I agree to an extent, PSN is better IMO,
"

When you get into the whole, system A is better than system B than that my friend is something better to be debated in a console war type forum.  Geez....didn't mean to ruffle your proverbial feathers....it's just my opinion as is your opinion yours.  No need for all the hostility....it's just a forum. :P
"

"Do we really need to turn this thread into a system wars debate?  The fact is that those that pay, have access to content first and in my eyes that is how it should be.  Now regarding the statement by Sentry, that PSN is "better" than XBL, my response to that is...are you serious?  Seriously that is just laughable....
"

I'm just saying that im tired of everyone being so defensive about a system, like they can't talk about its flaws whatsoever without being called a fanboy.
"

Lol, true.

I don't mind paying for gold....I think it's worth it...

They used to sell demo disk, and it takes up Microsoft's bandwidth for you to download it, so I guess I understand their thinking in making people pay for early access. But still like you said demos are more advertisements then anything.

"so...you came to tell us the dream that is psn and the scum that is xbox live then? sorry but its a week a freaking week, if you cannot wait that long then i hardly believe you in your honesty of not wanting just ending up the unpaying horde.

its a week thats it, nothing but a week. and let alone the fact that xbox live still gets more demos then psn most of the time. i dont really see the problem, and really a demo doesn't cost much to make in terms of time or money for a company, its a week to a months time of work to get a demo up and going.
"

Anyone who thinks a comparison of what is readily available in the same market space is flame bait is looking too hard.

The plain point is that I am unhappy with Xbox Live's current model, and I have every right to be because I have been there since the start.  Paying.  When there is a case for case example of a service working differently, what is wrong with making it an example?  Some of us do not feel a need to fight over the validity of consumer electronics.  We just like them.

I'd prefer it if people came to argue with me that the fee is valid and tell me why they think so, not kick off on some bender because they can not accept I have no fucking scret agenda.  I really hoped we might avoid that given it being a new forum.

Examples are sometimes useful.  So I'll just thank those who understood that, and replied in kind.

$50, complain more.

"

The plain point is that I am unhappy with Xbox Live's current model, and I have every right to be because I have been there since the start.  Paying.  

"MsCortana said:

"Do we really need to turn this thread into a system wars debate?  The fact is that those that pay, have access to content first and in my eyes that is how it should be.  Now regarding the statement by Sentry, that PSN is "better" than XBL, my response to that is...are you serious?  Seriously that is just laughable....
"

Hulk agree.
"

Vinchenzo said:

"$50, complain more.
"

"

nailerr said:

"

The plain point is that I am unhappy with Xbox Live's current model, and I have every right to be because I have been there since the start.  Paying.  

Yeah, but you're no longer paying.....

It's like saying, I have used my phone service for years and been a loyal paying customer.  Then one day you stop paying, your service is disconnected and you start complaining that a specific service from the phone company isn't readily available to non-paying customers.  Just because you used their service for years, doesn't mean they owe you anything.  It's not a logical nor valid argument.  If you want the content then pay the fee, if not, then quit complaining and wait the extra week.  It's as simple as that. 

"

Ew @ people who say PSN is close to matching Live. It's nowhere near it, you must either be a fanboy or all you want is the basic online play. The only other option is that you are out of your mind.

I love how PSN supporters are always quick to point out how it has a web browser yet they disregard everything Xbox Live does. Apparently, Xbox Live only has cross game invites, custom soundtracks, in game private chat/messaging..

The few things PSN does, Xbox Live does better with more features. Just because PSN is free does not mean it's better.

By that logic, living in a shack is better than living in a mansion.

Clearly I should have used PC demo's as an example.  Can we now drop the console arguments?

Any old PC gamers have an opinion on Live?  Feel you get what you pay for compared to the familiar old days of Gamespy and publisher hosted servers?

"Basically my Gold account expired.   I've found PSN is adequate for online gaming although of course not on par with Live so far.  However, now that I am one of the filthy unpaying horde it means I now have to wait a week for demo downloads.

I must have missunderstood something.

I have to wait a week to be advertised to?  I actually am expected to pay, to download adverts?  This seems wrong at best.
A demo for a game has one purpous in life, to help you decide you like the game and that you want to pay money for the retail product.  It takes a developer a fair bit of effort to even make a demo.  And they do it for that reason alone.

Microsoft have every reason to want you to buy games on their platform, they get a slice of money for every copy sold.  Yet I am finding that games like the upcoming Force Unleashed will have a demo on PSN and XBL within a day or so of eachother, and since I can get the Playstation demo immediatley that pretty much solidifies where I will decide to buy the game, shoud I like it.

Now thats one thing, but I have found it does something else more destructive to Xbox.  Since I have all current consoles and enjoy each my money is not so capable of covering every game I want on every system, so when platform exlusives like Ninja Gaiden 2 and Too Human are on the way, I rush on over to the Marketplace and see that big red logo that tells me "We do not need you to buy this game" and that is exactly the message I take away, because quite often by the time that week is over the demo news and chat has died down, and I forget about it or just stop caring.

I would have no problem paying for Live again some time, it is a superb service.  But Microsoft fucked up on scale elephantine when they first tried to differentiate Gold and Silver accounts, and now years into the console they still are trying to make it feel like you get something worth paying money for over the free account.  There are a few reason I know, but video chat on my camera on my bandwidth and week late demo downloads is certainly not one.

I just felt like letting that out.  It seems unusually stupid for Microsoft.
"

If you cant pay 4 bucks a month, you better learn to wait your extra one week.

......and if you cant, heres an advice, ONE DAY a month, for ONE day, dont GO TO McDONALDS and supersize your fries, and youll be able to afford xboxlive and not bitch about it anymore.

"Shocking how close the PSN is coming to Xbox Live Gold, especially seeing as you don't even have to pay for that... I wonder if microsoft will have to do something about that
"

You don't have $8.00?

>__>

No.  I do not.  I am not using that currency.  (just being sarcastic for the sake of it)

None the less, it is not about the money so much as the value for it.  I think Live can justify payment, but not how it is currently done.  The users host the games, not Microsoft.  they are the joining factor that link players together.  And as good as that is, the current "what you get" for the money does not come across as proportionate.

What actually is your money going towards?  It's not servers for lag free games with more players and it is not for bandwidth of voice chat or video, because that also is peer to peer networking.  The advertising alone has to go  a fair way to covering the costs of running Live.

I've no problem with people paying for something, weather they know or care what it actually provides is of no concern to me.  But I want to know.

If it makes you feel any better, Sony users are going to have to start paying for some demos only available through their "qore" gaming service.  So yea, everybody sucks, and we're all paying to be advertised to. : (

"No.  I do not.  I am not using that currency.  (just being sarcastic for the sake of it)

None the less, it is not about the money so much as the value for it.  I think Live can justify payment, but not how it is currently done.  The users host the games, not Microsoft.  they are the joining factor that link players together.  And as good as that is, the current "what you get" for the money does not come across as proportionate.

What actually is your money going towards?  It's not servers for lag free games with more players and it is not for bandwidth of voice chat or video, because that also is peer to peer networking.  The advertising alone has to go  a fair way to covering the costs of running Live.

I've no problem with people paying for something, weather they know or care what it actually provides is of no concern to me.  But I want to know.
"

When 360 makes up over half the current gen gaming market, you'd have to be out of your mind as a 3rd party developer to not develop your game for PS3 and 360.  I really doubt MS is having to pay billions to secure exclusives.  The exceptions to this are actual 3rd party exclusives--such as Rockstar's forthcoming GTA downloadable content--and likely Final Fantasy XIII.  I'm guessing Square told MS they would port the game after finishing the US PS3 version, and MS paid them to hold the US PS3 version back for a day and date simultaneous release with the 360 version.

Either way, Sony did the exact same thing--spent billions securing exclusivity--only with Blu Ray movies instead of games.  Nothing to blame either company for, as both were smart moves for Sony and MS to make.

@OP

You have a problem waiting 7 days for something you call ADVERTISEMENT. I call it a demo, I've already decided if I'm going to buy Too Human (I'm not), or another retail product. Live membership costs me... I forget, because it's so damn cheap I don't care. I enjoy my PSN but right now I'm having huge difficulties getting it to download 2.42 and I want to buy PixelJunk Eden tomorrow and I doubt I'll be able to because of these issues, yet X360's Live and even my Wii's Internet capability is still working but am having serious issues getting 2.42 that I am enjoy Geometry Wars 2 much more than awaiting my next shitty PSN patch. Pay the Gold service, enjoy everyone having a freaking mic in multiplayer and keep the lips zipped.

"When 360 makes up over half the current gen gaming market, you'd have to be out of your mind as a 3rd party developer to not develop your game for PS3 and 360.  I really doubt MS is having to pay billions to secure exclusives.  The exceptions to this are actual 3rd party exclusives--such as Rockstar's forthcoming GTA downloadable content--and likely Final Fantasy XIII.  I'm guessing Square told MS they would port the game after finishing the US PS3 version, and MS paid them to hold the US PS3 version back for a day and date simultaneous release with the 360 version.

Either way, Sony did the exact same thing--spent billions securing exclusivity--only with Blu Ray movies instead of games.  Nothing to blame either company for, as both were smart moves for Sony and MS to make.
"

"Soap said:

"Shocking how close the PSN is coming to Xbox Live Gold, especially seeing as you don't even have to pay for that... I wonder if microsoft will have to do something about that"

do you own any of these service, it doesn't look like it. XBL is far better, in less lag, and more content.
"

"Anyone who thinks a comparison of what is readily available in the same market space is flame bait is looking too hard.

The plain point is that I am unhappy with Xbox Live's current model, and I have every right to be because I have been there since the start.  Paying.  When there is a case for case example of a service working differently, what is wrong with making it an example?  Some of us do not feel a need to fight over the validity of consumer electronics.  We just like them.

I'd prefer it if people came to argue with me that the fee is valid and tell me why they think so, not kick off on some bender because they can not accept I have no fucking scret agenda.  I really hoped we might avoid that given it being a new forum.

Examples are sometimes useful.  So I'll just thank those who understood that, and replied in kind.
"

I am confused as to why Xbox Live see it fit to not only sling adverts at you as a paying customer but also limit the access to the demo's that encourage people to throw money their way for the non paying members.  Surely if you have customers who are not paying monthly/yearly for a service the thing you want most at that point is for them to at least be spending their gaming budget on your platform?

"nailerr said:

"Anyone who thinks a comparison of what is readily available in the same market space is flame bait is looking too hard.

The plain point is that I am unhappy with Xbox Live's current model, and I have every right to be because I have been there since the start.  Paying.  When there is a case for case example of a service working differently, what is wrong with making it an example?  Some of us do not feel a need to fight over the validity of consumer electronics.  We just like them.

I'd prefer it if people came to argue with me that the fee is valid and tell me why they think so, not kick off on some bender because they can not accept I have no fucking scret agenda.  I really hoped we might avoid that given it being a new forum.

Examples are sometimes useful.  So I'll just thank those who understood that, and replied in kind.
"

I see what you meant now. My mistake. I thought you were just saying that it's not good and saying that others should get a PS3 to use PSN.
"

I would assume their rebuttal to that would be  trial codes, and plenty of them.  I remember when GTA IV came out, every copy had a free trial code.  Honestly, as a paying customer, I believe I should have content and/or service that a non-paying customer doesn't.  It's not like you don't have access to demos, you just have to wait longer.  So if we look at this as the glass is half full, then at least as a silver account holder you have access to almost everything a paying customer does, minus live and a few other minute things.  So really who's getting jipped here?  The paying customer or the non-paying customer?

I definitely understand your point and your disdain for not having demos available, in what you believe, is a timely manner.  Even if you are silver customer, you are a paying consumer otherwise..i.e..games, accessories..I just do not understand, why a silver account holder should have access to content that a gold account holder does, logically, it doesn't make sense.  Not to sound arrogant, but as a paying customer, I want my content first, I want to be first in line, after all, as a loyal live user, I am the one paying my way and utilizing the service to it's fullest extent.
"

so its definitely not this service that is MILES ahead of the competiton.,its a few,very few features left. (not including the ton of "bigger" library of arcade games and movies/tv shows where quantity to say"we have more" is better than quality.)

"Basically my Gold account expired.   I've found PSN is adequate for online gaming although of course not on par with Live so far.  However, now that I am one of the filthy unpaying horde it means I now have to wait a week for demo downloads.

I must have missunderstood something.

I have to wait a week to be advertised to?  I actually am expected to pay, to download adverts?  This seems wrong at best.
A demo for a game has one purpous in life, to help you decide you like the game and that you want to pay money for the retail product.  It takes a developer a fair bit of effort to even make a demo.  And they do it for that reason alone.

Microsoft have every reason to want you to buy games on their platform, they get a slice of money for every copy sold.  Yet I am finding that games like the upcoming Force Unleashed will have a demo on PSN and XBL within a day or so of eachother, and since I can get the Playstation demo immediatley that pretty much solidifies where I will decide to buy the game, shoud I like it.

Now thats one thing, but I have found it does something else more destructive to Xbox.  Since I have all current consoles and enjoy each my money is not so capable of covering every game I want on every system, so when platform exlusives like Ninja Gaiden 2 and Too Human are on the way, I rush on over to the Marketplace and see that big red logo that tells me "We do not need you to buy this game" and that is exactly the message I take away, because quite often by the time that week is over the demo news and chat has died down, and I forget about it or just stop caring.

I would have no problem paying for Live again some time, it is a superb service.  But Microsoft fucked up on scale elephantine when they first tried to differentiate Gold and Silver accounts, and now years into the console they still are trying to make it feel like you get something worth paying money for over the free account.  There are a few reason I know, but video chat on my camera on my bandwidth and week late demo downloads is certainly not one.

I just felt like letting that out.  It seems unusually stupid for Microsoft.
"

Oh, I forgot to mention my Xbox RROD'd ten hours after the account expired.  Don't read too much into that now, people ;)

XBL pwns PSN