I hate this digital distribution crap

What's even worse is when you buy a boxed copy and it forces you to download as if it were digital anyway a la Battlefield and I think Diablo III was the most recent cases.

Digital Distribution is great for DRM. GoG doesn't have any. Steam strips out a lot of DRM that everyone whined about years ago -- if you buy X3 on disc, you get StarForce whereas if you buy it from Steam, you don't.

Digital Distribution also allows games to go on sale. You can't pick up AAA games for $5 from the big box stores. It could also be a pain in the ass when retailers do have some sort of sale because if it is for a single day, you have to know about it and drive out there and if you are lucky there are no prior engagements that would hinder that ability. With Steam, you just add to cart, click Purchase For Myself, and you are done.

@Riboflavin said:

Digital download only releases allow companies that don't have the resources to produce disks to make games, and also to make games that traditionally woudn't belong on a disk or are target at a smaller audience.

Other than HDDs and the like, I am pretty sure they stopped making disks a few years ago ;)

@Oldirtybearon: I live in Canada and had no problems with the internet, you just gotta stay away from bell and rogers, go for smaller companies like teksavvy that don't place data caps and have 20mb/s connections. Unless you live in a rural area then you're just screwed. But that's not Steam's fault.

Also the other advantages stand, I don't have room for 400 PC games. Console games already take up all the space and make my room look ugly.

I'm still rocking back catalog PS1, PS2, dreamcast, saturn, etc. The physical medium is a satisfying security blanket of self expression.

I've really enjoyed DD for Braid, SMB, Bastion, Castle Crashers, etc, but I just like owning stuff. I own a lot of rare collectables and could liquidate my stash for a couple thousand dollars easy. I can't sell my copy of Braid to anyone. If my friend wants to play it, he has to buy his own copy. It's just not as cool. I own assets, not a list of stuff I can download to my specific machine.

DD is easier, more convenient, more environmentally friendly, and is the way of the future. I've used it and will use it more in the future, but it will make a lot more sense to my baby who won't know any better than it ever will to me,

All right. Let's break this one down, shall we?

@BigChickenDinner said:

I really like having the game on disc because you can always install the game faster, and your not dependent on an internet connection to install (fuck DRM >_>).

I've been downloading games on 1.5 Mbps. That's barely high speed and yet it only takes me about a day, and for the price that digital games often go on sale that's a fine price to pay. Installs on downloaded games are usually much faster than from a disc, and discs almost always have the same DRM as the downloaded copy- which is opposed to GOG.com, which has no DRM whatsoever.

You don't get a manual.

Except for Skyrim, I didn't buy a new game last year on the Xbox that had a manual and I haven't in a long time.

Oh, and it still costs you full price unless you sit around waiting for the game you want to go on sale.

Steam often knocks a small percentage off of pre-ordered games. I know they did it for Sleeping Dogs before it came out, and they've done it on several other games before. In addition to that, if you want to wait a month and save twenty bucks you've probably got other things to play and do from a Christmas sale two years ago.

So, you're wrong on several counts and the only two actual knocks you've made against digital downloads are internet speed and manuals. The former isn't that bad and is a good compromise for the price drop that digital often goes for, and manuals are often either digital or completely unnecessary these days.

I think it's great, they usually cost a bit less with some exceptions (EA and Activision have games on PSN for £20 more than they do at retail, what the fuck?) and they don't take any physical space.

You must have very slow internet. My games install much faster than a DVD due to read-access times of DVDs. There's also the issue that most PC games would be 3-4 DVDs, which would take forever to install. Also, once you have it downloaded, it's easy to an archive of the install to a backup drive, thus negating the issue to require you to completely download the game again.

There's also the issue of not needing to drive to a store/wait for UPS to deliver the boxed game. I can think of very few advantages to boxed games. As soon as you install a game, you will be required to download patches from the internet. Patches that would have been combined into that first download from Steam/Origin.

You seriously care about manuals? This only mattered before the internet. There's guides online, message boards, YouTube videos, wikis, etc. It's not needed anymore. Also, did you seriously read manuals when you were a kid? I just figured it out normally.

@MikkaQ: I do live in a rural area. That's my point. Bell is my only choice when it comes to an ISP. I've checked with TekSavvy, they can't offer anything where I live.

Digital Distribution isn't bad, and I not once said my personal issues with it were Steam's fault, but you can't ignore that there is a massive infrastructure problem that needs to be addressed before it's a viable option for everybody.

Now that I own my own house, I want less stuff. I don't want clutter.

I agree that it sucks that publishers will charge you the same amount for a boxed AAA PC product with physical media and the digital equivalent.

However, I'd accept DRM if I get a lower price and convenience in return. With Steam, I do. With XBLA, I do. In fact, I get so much of a better deal with digital that I generally don't even buy AAA boxed console games anymore.

I prefer going to the store and buying physical copies of games. Call me old fashioned but that's the way it is.

I don't mind digital distribution anymore, as it made me realize my terrible addiction to collecting every box to games I ever owned (threw out everything except for Diablo II, which has a sweet cover). But when a unique game comes out with cool collector items, yeah I'll dump $60 or $150 for it. Skyrim and Witcher 2 have been great examples of reasons to get physical copies.

I could be wrong here, but it seems like I can download and install a game over my 75Mbps connection faster than with a 24x DVD drive. And even if it's not actually faster to install, it's certainly faster to get to playing the damn game--no waiting for snail mail to deliver a physical disc and all that.

@Kidavenger said:

I like chocolate milk

The only problem I have with it is the fact that I have nothing to say if the servers shut down. Buying a game through digital distribution is in fact rental.

@HellBrendy said:

The only problem I have with it is the fact that I have nothing to say if the servers shut down. Buying a game through digital distribution is in fact rental.

You can always make a backup with Steam, though. The only difference between a backup and a retail copy (apart from the nice DVD and case) is that you still need Steam to play those backups. That also happens with Steamworks, uPlay or GFWL games, though. If Steam (or any other online DRM) ever goes off, I think "pirating" the game or using a no-DVD crack is justifiable. You've already paid, the money has already gone to the developer. No harm done.

What is the deal with all this thread Resurrection lately? Maybe I've just never paid too much attention to the forums.

Until my ISP stops charging me for data transfers by the GB, I will buy a physical copy over a digital version. (Unless it's a Valve game, like Portal 2, which made me download an entire 1.2 GB patch before playing, and disabling the option to install the game offline. )

Also for DRM, Penny Arcade has you covered.

@Oldirtybearon said:

@MikkaQ: I do live in a rural area. That's my point. Bell is my only choice when it comes to an ISP. I've checked with TekSavvy, they can't offer anything where I live.

Digital Distribution isn't bad, and I not once said my personal issues with it were Steam's fault, but you can't ignore that there is a massive infrastructure problem that needs to be addressed before it's a viable option for everybody.

Oh sure of course I agree. I'm all for increased internet infrastructure, especially in Canada. I'm just saying that bashing it like the OP did is kinda strange since it's based mostly on issues dependent on your location and in some cases how much money you have. I'm not like one of those people saying that physical copies should be done and over with I'm just saying that the DD option should always be there day and date with retail games, consoles and PCs. Because if you can get to to work well for you, and you don't have scruples about owning and collecting boxes, it's a fantastic way to get and play games.

Digital distribution is fantastic provided the price is suitable.

Steam is very competitive in their service with games constantly on sale makes the service feel very active and extremely competitive. But because retail is still so big for the consoles, PSN and XBLA have this thing where retail being cheaper than digital distribution is the rule and not the exception. For DD to thrive on the consoles, the network holders are going to need to be more active and competitive with retail but that's not going to happen anytime soon which is disappointing.

@BigChickenDinner said:

Sure I guess it has its ups, but its downs are so down its not worth it to me. I really like having the game on disc because you can always install the game faster, and your not dependent on an internet connection to install (fuck DRM >_>). You don't get a manual. You have nothing physical to show for it. Oh, and it still costs you full price unless you sit around waiting for the game you want to go on sale.

It really seems like no one noticed the fact that you can either pay $60 for a manual (they used to be worth it back in the day, they weren't always 3 pages long) a DVD/CD(s) so you can install it where ever when ever and usually a map or poster or some other goodies, or flip side $60 for the ability to install it........

I agree somewhat.

The price of most games are too expensive.

I don't really have an issue with digital distribution as I find it to be very convenient for my tastes. It's easier to shop around for deals and I can go through the entire purchase process from home. As someone to plays older titles as well, digital distribution has been my hookup for finding/purchasing rare titles. I still do buy physical, but over the past couple of years I've definitely converted more over towards digital purchase behavior.

Actually I download faster than my DVD drive could read from discs.

i hate DD because you have nothing to show for it and you cant sell or trade or even lend games. Publishers love this and will use DD to get more controll over you.

I like having the space. I don't have a huge house to just store a ton of DVD cases/Cartridges (Like all the GB guys seem to have, entire rooms of games...jesus) and such and I would rather that space go towards my books, collectibles and work areas(drafting table, etc). Having a closet full of DVD cases would make me insane. I buy a collectors edition when I feel its worth it (Helloooo Borderlands 2 loot chest) but if I just want the game, digital is my way to go.

Its what I hated about my Xbox 360 when I had it. All these games just stood in a stack. I have a friend who literally has about 3-5 stacks of PS3/Xbox cases about 100 tall each. Its insane. You could fit a big screen TV or something in the space that takes up.

Then again I'm an OCD Maniac with a Tetris fetish, so I'm a sucker for maximum use of space.

@GunslingerPanda said:

Let go of your materialistic shackles, friend.

Some of us prefer to own the physical product.

Digital is never forever, Servers will never last forever. Being materialistic has nothing to do with preferring to own your product over "renting" it.

@BigSocrates said:

A physical disc can be lost/broken/stolen, while a digital distribution account will always be there for you (assuming there aren't problems with the major services, which there have not been so far.) Updates will always be available. If you buy a game on disc and it gets patched and you want to reinstall it in a few years, those patches can be hard to find. With a digital distribution company you get the latest patched version.

Plus you can buy games at 3 am when you're sick and just want something to play, and you can get great sales without leaving the house. My steam list has like 73 games in it and I have paid full price for 0, getting most for at least 75% off. Meanwhile on the console side the discounts aren't that great, but if not for digital distribution we wouldn't have Braid or Super Meat Boy or Bastion or any other number of truly great games that are too niche for a full retail release.

You also can't resell those digital items for any kind of money, they never gain value. Services can and do go down. Physical media can be stolen/broken/lost? So can your PS3/360/PC. Yeah you can get access to that stuff again if you have internet service which is another huge complaint. What about people who don't have broadband in their area? This is why Digital media won't be taking over any time soon is because of broadband and capped bandwidth. There is a reason the average consumer prefers to own physical media and there is a reason i don't buy digital unless it's the only option or it's so cheap it would equal out to a "rental" Because you are never 110% guaranteed to own this stuff forever and i am 110% guaranteed to own my physical products until they are stolen (which i am insured for, so no loss) broken (which is impossible unless a bull runs through my house) or lost (which is also impossible unless it climbs off my shelves and runs away)

I just prefer physical. The guarantee of me owning it puts a calm over me and it's totally fine if you don't like physical or if you don't like digital. It's all personal preference but this notion of digital taking over is a pipe dream until blazing fiber is installed everywhere with unlimited data. There is a reason CDs still sell like crazy, why DVD and Blu-Rays still sell like hotcakes and why rental places like Redbox make ungodly amounts of money. Physical is easier to deal with.

i like digital. but it should not fucking cost $60 still!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! if thats what it costs for all the physical stuff, the disc, the case, the book, shipping it, then why should it still cost that when they are not having to make anything.

this is funny, you funny

Why would they lower the price just because you get a manual and a disc? the manual probably is barely worth a dollar nowadays and having the game connected to your online account so you always have it and can download it anywhere at anytime is much better than having a physical disc you can lose or break. Don't forget they are providing you with the service to store and download the game files.

I moved recently and having to pack the cases and the disc in boxes was really a pain. Early in the year, I had to buy a new PS3 after my old one stop working. I was able to re-download the digital games I purchased on PSN. Times have changed but I still buy physical media once in a while.

I love digital distribution because i dont have to patch a game myself every damn time i reinstall it...

WoW took longer to install from a disc than from a download. Seriously.

Also, Discs get lost. Accounts are a lot easier to keep track of. And when ya lose an account, it takes about 5 minutes to find it because its always in the same place. To lose your Steam account, you pretty much have to lose your identity. You have to lose ANOTHER account, and if you ever buy anything ever, your credit card. If I had to lose my house to lose my CDs, maybe I'd be ok with that, but when my Hard Drive poops out some magnets, I can just download a new installation once I get my PC back up and running. If you snap that disc in half, it is gone. They won't replace it. If you're a lucky bastard, it's a Blizzard game, and they have you covered, assuming you have ANY idea where that CD Key got off to.

I don't really give a fuck about lending, selling, or any of that shit, because if someone wants to play it, they can get their own damn shit. I have more control over a Steam game than I have of the Diablo 2 discs I've gone through because I kept losing the fuckers in moves.

No. Play the game.

I just wish I could buy games on my Xbox for 10 dollars cheaper on midnight release day;

@Bourbon_Warrior said:

I just wish I could buy games on my Xbox for 10 dollars cheaper on midnight release day;

I would love that.

I love it.

Maps/posters don't come with every game and most of the other crap I don't care about. I have no need for discs in my life and preloading means that waiting for downloads isn't terrible, and if you have any sense you're not going to buy most games day 1 anyway.

@MB said:

I never understood why people get so up in arms about DRM. My PC is always connected to the internet anyway, so if the game wants to connect to a licensing server to check out my copy, what do I care? It's fast and convenient, discs are a thing of the past.

I agree with this except for when it's shitty DRM and they fuck up and don't let me play my legit, unpirated, unhacked copy of the game. But unobnoxtious DRM is totally fine with me.

@MordeaniisChaos said:

Also, Discs get lost.

Games go from the case, to my console/device, then back to the case and on the shelf. What are you doing that you lose so discs?

Digital Distribution is great, I don't have to interact with scumbags in Game stores.

Steam is great.

There will always be physical releases though. They'll eventually become nothing but high price Collector's Editions for those willing to be fleeced, but they will always exist to some degree because companies will want to pad their profit margins via fleecing $40 of goods in a box sold for like $200.

@BigChickenDinner said:

Sure I guess it has its ups, but its downs are so down its not worth it to me. I really like having the game on disc because you can always install the game faster, and your not dependent on an internet connection to install (fuck DRM >_>). You don't get a manual. You have nothing physical to show for it. Oh, and it still costs you full price unless you sit around waiting for the game you want to go on sale.

It really seems like no one noticed the fact that you can either pay $60 for a manual (they used to be worth it back in the day, they weren't always 3 pages long) a DVD/CD(s) so you can install it where ever when ever and usually a map or poster or some other goodies, or flip side $60 for the ability to install it........

GOG.com (DRM-free)

It's kind of rare for a PC disc version of a game to be $60 (except it's from a shitty over-gouging publisher), though.

Most times, you can install any game from any computer if you're a user on the DD service.

I'm totally ready to embrace a 100% digital download future, and I hope that the next generation of consoles will see Sony and MS bring their digital download services into line with what Steam is offering on PC.

A lot of people that are for digital services aren't thinking very long term. You're not buying an actual product, you're buying the right to access that product for as long as the servers decide to have it up. So what'll happen when the servers shut down? All that money you spent, and you'll have not a dang thing to show for it.

As for me, I'll have my discs, my cases, my instruction manuals, my artbooks, statues, soundtrack CDs, I could go on and on. Most importantly, I'll have shelves stocked with video games. You can't really appreciate an online library as much as you can with a physical one, right?

Who doesn't want to download games and play them while they're in their home? I love downloading games. Fuck driving to gamestop!

Steam has taught me to love digital distribution, but my fear is that more publishers will take the EA route and keep their titles exclusive to their own store, I would hate to see anyone have a monopoly on the distribution method for any game.

I can always find a game even on release day for 10-30 euro cheaper on other sites that give you a code to punch into steam or whatever online store. You guys probably talked about that already but I didn't read the whole thread.

edit: I don't like always online DRM, I have diablo 3 and a couple of times I just couldn't play cause my character would freak the fuck out and die.

edit2: I like physical copies too but recently I haven't found anything cool in them, only if you buy the really expensive package that give you some cool stuff like a model or a cool art book, I wish I could buy those separately.

edit3: Funny story when I bought GTA IV on steam and started downloading it, it was really slow, so I found a torrent of it and started downloading that and installed it and started playing it while the steam version was still downloading and the I copied my saves over to steam.

@LikeaSsur said:

A lot of people that are for digital services aren't thinking very long term. You're not buying an actual product, you're buying the right to access that product for as long as the servers decide to have it up.

If you read the EULA for some of those new physical games you own, you'll see that you're sort of in the same boat. The publisher/developer still owns the software on the disc and reserves the right to take it back whenever they want (hard to say how enforceable that is in court though). Also, with online features and DRM becoming more prominent, owning a physical copy is increasingly not a guarantee that you'll be able to play a game forever. In addition, there's a pretty good chance that companies like Microsoft, Sony, Valve, and Apple will be around long after we're dead, so I'm not sure there's all that much to justify your fear.

As for me, I'll have my discs, my cases, my instruction manuals, my artbooks, statues, soundtrack CDs, I could go on and on. Most importantly, I'll have shelves stocked with video games. You can't really appreciate an online library as much as you can with a physical one, right?

I don't put much value in a physical collection any more. Aside from stuff I'm actively playing, I've got all of my games stacked in boxes in my closet.

I never looked at a game manual anyway. And I value my shelf-space a lot more now, so I'd have rather have something downloaded to a hard drive.