I just listened to what Jeff had to say about the closed beta weekend that just happened, and man, he really bummed me out. To reiterate, he played a human thief and turned it off after the first hour, saying it didn't grab him the same way the first Guild Wars did it. They compared it to Warhammer's public quest system and how the "no subscription" philosophy is not as prevalent today with all of the recent free-to-play MMO's going around, and that's about it.

What do you guys think? I'm aware how Jeff is with first impressions of games, but damn I wished he stuck around longer for more detailed thoughts. I also think playing as a thief and dealing with the initiative mechanic isn't wholly representative of Guild Wars 2, but I don't know if that's an issue for Jeff specifically or an issue of the game itself. Maybe his disgust of Operation Raccoon City bled over into Guild Wars 2, but now I'm just being biased and grabbing at anything I can.

All I know is that I'm bummed.

do you think he's not going to play more? He'll give it more time I'm sure, even if it's just to see how it is on release.

I don't know dude, I didn't listen to the podcast yet, but everything I've seen of this game just looks like a step above all other MMOs and everyone making videos of it on Youtube seems to really like it. Looks so fun to me. This comes from a man who was VERY skeptical of this game as I hated GW 1.

I think it has more to do with him not liking MMOs in general, but he played TOR for a while so I'm sure he'll give this another go. 
 
Sounds fantastic from what I've heard, most people are loving it.

I've never known Jeff to be a huge MMO guy. In recently memory I think The Old Republic is the only game he seemed to enjoy and that seemed more just because some parts of the story was cool and not because he found the game fun. I dunno, I do hope he gives the game another chance either in another beta or when the game comes out and tries sitting down with a bit more but either way. I think Guild Wars 2 looks fantastic, but I wouldn't expect anyone on GiantBomb to really get into it.

Haven't listened to it yet but I definitely thought Jeff would like it. I've followed the game for awhile now and all the youtube guys (TB, Yogscast, etc.) love it and it looks like the first MMO I'm going to buy since WOW. The RPS article got me really excited too. It seems strange that he would not even give the Guild Wars 2 beta a chance, but would play Old Republic to almost max level. I tried SWTOR during the free weekend and I found it really awful. Alot of things ripped straight from wow and I thought the UI was really ugly. It just seemed like a free to play game or something.

Jeff also didn't like Red Dead Redemption because the horse riding controls confused him.

This thread took longer to make than expected...

As for what i think? it doesn't bother me. He played an hour, stated his early impressions aren't that great, and that was that. If he said he never wanted to play it again because it was the worst thing ever then I could think there might be some discussion to be had, but he just seemed indifferent about it. Yes I know he only played an hour and yes I know it's an mmo so it probably deserves more time, but I think that Jeff's opinion is totally valid.

Haven't listened yet, but I'm not all that surprised that he wasn't that fond of it. It would be nice if he thought it was amazing, but like some people have said, he's just not into MMOs that much.

It's been weird to me that Jeff showed so much early excitement for GW2, yet never actually bothered to find out more about the mechanics of it. So much so that during the SW: Galaxies stream when they were discussing various MMOs, he mentioned confidently that it was instanced like the first game. Super confusing.
 
EDIT: Also, to be fair, ArenaNet should really do a better job of explaining their systems and the interactions between them. After getting impressions from several dozen different outlets, I can recall two of them that have noticed the difference between dynamic events and renown hearts. Jeff seems to be having a similar problem.

I would love to hear Matt Rorie's opinion :(

@SeriouslyNow said:

@WindFall259: Bummed? Who cares what Jeff says compared to the actual gameplay footage from Totalbiscuit? I certainly don't. Jeff clearly doesn't understand MMOs at all if he can't see the obvious differences between GW2 and every other MMO so far. GW2 is a much more comprehensive game overall.

It's kind of like complaining if someone can't see the difference between Warsow and Quake, or even CPMA and Quake. To someone not invested in the genre they're not really going to notice the differences.

I'm more interested in seeing how MMO players feel about TERA vs GW2. I've been playing TERA a bit in the last 2 betas they've done and it's pretty fun. One thing I noticed when watching TB's GW2 beta footage is that he was getting hit a lot. I don't know if it's possible to avoid that or not, but TERA has the same type of action-focused combat and you can completely avoid all damage from an enemy if you do well in that game (it's actually pretty easy to do in what I've played so far). TB's videos made the GW2 combat seem like you just run up and hack away at each other until someone dies. I mean, I like the way the skills change based on your weapon loadout, but if I have to take most of the hits an enemy throws at me, it doesn't seem effectively much different from standard MMO combat.

Jeff also didn't like Red Dead Redemption because the horse riding controls confused him.

@Boboblaw said:

@McGhee said:

Jeff also didn't like Red Dead Redemption because the horse riding controls confused him.

Wait... really?

Nah, Jeff simply didn't like the game. I'm not sure that he ever managed to clearly articulate why. The horse controls were just an example of one specific thing that Jeff didn't like.

Every once in a while a game will come along that you just can't get into even though its genre or other ostensible qualities should put it squarely in line with other games you've liked. It can be hard (and frustrating) to pinpoint just why this is when it happens, and your first instinct is usually to identify the little obvious things that you didn't like, which are nit-picky things like controls being different from games you're used to.

jeff has been sounding like ME3 is one of the worst games ever made. but im fucking loving it. so im just going to see him as 'just another opinion'

It's not a FPS or rap based TPS so Jeff simply cannot like it.

GW2 will be great, don't worry. Jeff doesn't know shit about MMO's frankly.

What I found weird was that he didn't like the look of GW2. I absolutely love the artstyle and the way they present the "cutscenes" - gives the game a very unique look.

@Bell_End said:

jeff has been sounding like ME3 is one of the worst games ever made. but im fucking loving it. so im just going to see him as 'just another opinion'

Yes, that's why he's clearly stated again and again that it's a good game and gave it a four star review.

Not that concerned about Jeff's take on GW2, really. He admittedly didn't play it for long, and he's never been a fan of MMOs. Every other site out there that's spent more time with the game has had a glowing review. I have friends who have gotten in the beta, and they've told me all about it. I trust their opinions more than I trust a MMO curmudgeon like Jeff. I think the biggest factor, besides limited hands-on time with it, is the fact that Jeff's not as burned out of the "kill quest/drop quest/travel quest" theme that MMOs have repeated over and over since EQ. GW2 is going to be a game for those who want a different formula, and I think that's where they'll succeed.

I agree that he should spend more time with it, and he likely will. I don't think he'll like it much more either way however. Everyone else is praising it though, so it's not something to be worried about.

From what I've seen, it takes a bit for the dynamic events to really get interesting. Most of the early ones seem to be along the lines of "help this farm" by feeding cows and watering plants, etc. So it's a shame if he didn't wait it out long enough to get into the big group play ones. I'm sure he'll give the game more of a chance, but yeah, he's never really liked an MMO, and while GW2 is doing a lot of things different, this is hardly surprising.

I know not everyone around these parts cares for TotalBiscuit, but he has a video up with his thoughts on Guild Wars 2 that I found to be fairly informative. He goes quite a bit more in depth than Jeff did, for sure, so if you're curious, it is probably worth giving a listen to.

Jeff says few positive things about any MMO so I wouldn't take his opinion in this matter too seriously. Still believe GW2 will be a great game.

All MMOs have been very similar for a long time, this doesn't seem any different...

GW2 is still an MMO, despite what the fanbase is trying to tell you. If you don't like MMOs, this won't change your mind.

Since when GW2 has been marketed as something else than a MMO?

It doesn't matter to me if Jeff doesn't like it, that's fair enough. I know I'll be playing the hell out of this game for years.

I find it amusing people think Jeff was positive on SWTOR.

The main reason Jeff is probably not going to put much time if any into a beta is the inevitable character wipe. He likes the persistence of his guy. That don't mean shit in a beta.

I'm actually a little more excited for GW2 now that I've heard some descriptions of it that aren't complete drooling. People have been proselytizing this game for years now, and that always makes me nervous. Hearing that it's actually a video game with strengths and weaknesses is actually more interesting than a lot of "IT'S GONNA CHANGE THE WORLD, BROTHER!" creepy prophetic talk.

Jeff is also a skill clicker. I love the Duder, but he can't even hotkey. Jeff isn't an MMO player. I don't listen to his opinions about them at all.

@WilltheMagicAsian said:

@Bell_End said:

jeff has been sounding like ME3 is one of the worst games ever made. but im fucking loving it. so im just going to see him as 'just another opinion'

Yes, that's why he's clearly stated again and again that it's a good game and gave it a four star review.

Personally, I haven't heard Jeff say anything good about ME3. It's constant, this is disappointing, that is disappointing, blah, blah, blah. GB review scores are hilarious. 5/5 on Uncharted 3 but still they kept moaning how this and that was disappointing in the game. 4/5 for Saint's Row 3 and they it sound like the best game ever made. Jeff says that metacritic is garbage but he won't tell metacritic to remove them from their site. Also 4/5 on GB means a game that is 8-9/10 good which doesn't translate on metacritic. Still he doesn't allow the addition of "half stars" that would fix that problem.

GB is not a great site for game reviews. It's for crazy videos.

@phrosnite: it's a great site for game reviews actually

@phrosnite said:

@WilltheMagicAsian said:

@Bell_End said:

jeff has been sounding like ME3 is one of the worst games ever made. but im fucking loving it. so im just going to see him as 'just another opinion'

Yes, that's why he's clearly stated again and again that it's a good game and gave it a four star review.

Personally, I haven't heard Jeff say anything good about ME3. It's constant, this is disappointing, that is disappointing, blah, blah, blah. GB review scores are hilarious. 5/5 on Uncharted 3 but still they kept moaning how this and that was disappointing in the game. 4/5 for Saint's Row 3 and they it sound like the best game ever made. Jeff says that metacritic is garbage but he won't tell metacritic to remove them from their site. Also 4/5 on GB means a game that is 8-9/10 good which doesn't translate on metacritic. Still he doesn't allow the addition of "half stars" that would fix that problem.

GB is not a great site for game reviews. It's for crazy videos.

The part where you're talking about half stars and translations says more about you than GB's review system. Mainly that you don't get it.

@Animasta: @Brendan: Yeah, dream on.

Anyways noone should take seriously Jeff's opinion about Guild Wars 2. After Syndicate Jeff's opinion is useless to me.

jeez he played it for an hour and didn't like what he played it's like he killed your dog or something

I really like Giantbomb but I don't get why they get the guy who actively hates MMO's to play all the MMO's.

@mazik765 said:

I really like Giantbomb but I don't get why they get the guy who actively hates MMO's to play all the MMO's.

A-fucking-greed. Giantbomb is also missing a proper RPG guy.

@phrosnite: You mad bro ?

@SlashDance: You Siri, bro?

Jeff doesn't like MMOs. Neither do I, to be honest.

GW2 looks like its going to be one of the pinnacles of the genre, but I still won't give a shit. It wouldn't be a particularly healthy podcast enviroment for either the personality / listener, if they gushed over every single game you liked.

@Jayzilla said:

Jeff is also a skill clicker. I love the Duder, but he can't even hotkey. Jeff isn't an MMO player. I don't listen to his opinions about them at all.

...I've met plenty of people who skill-click when playing MMOs. Just because you don't hotkey doesn't mean you 'arent an mmo player' lol wow

@Animasta said:

jeez he played it for an hour and didn't like what he played it's like he killed your dog or something

lol I know right?

Also, I haven't seen anyone mention what he clearly said right before he gave his opinion. He went into expecting to play all weekend so it's not like he was expecting to be let down.

This is reminding me of the whole Destructoid thing where Jim Sterling only played a few hours of BF3 mp (and he said the mp was fantastic btw) and gave the game a 7.5. People went nuts demanding he play more and blahblahblah. The funny part is people were trying to convince themselves they weren't mad because of the score, but if that didn't bother them, what was the point of demanding he play more mp? Oooooh this also reminds me of the whole SWTOR Gamepro thing too. A few of the editors in their preview said they only played a few hours and people lost their shit.

Now, I find the same general sentiment present here in the thing with Senior Gertsman. People don't seem truly mad about how long he played. They seem mad about what he had to say. Go look at any preview for GW2 (or SWTOR or whatever) when the person in question only gets to play an hour or 2 at an event, says they love it, and notice how no one seems to bring up how long they played for. If you play for an hour and say you love it then good. If you play for an hour and say you're indifferent, you're a bad man.

I love video games.

people STILL give a fuck about what Jeff says about MMOs? really?

I mean... REALLY?

Jeff never struck me as an MMO type of guy.

He's also a hardass. He sounds disappointed with most games these days.

The game has a lot of hype, and I am sure it will have some very interesting systems. It's just that all the footage I have seen so far (also the totalbiscuit stuff) seemed totally standard mmo fare to me. Totalbiscuit talking excitedly about that public quest where you can click on some guys at a mill to motivate them, or blow up tree stumps, it's nothing new. The public questing was introduced in Warhammer and wasn't such a big deal there either, it's a minor variation on questing.

If someone can point me to a video where they show something truelly innovative or awesome I'd be very thankful.

@RobbieMac said:

@WinterSnowblind: Yeah I find all MMOs always start off a bit slow. The starting quests/areas are always a bit boring but it always picks up in the later content. So maybe if Jeff gives it a bit more time in the future it will draw him in a bit more. Who knows.

Pre-searing Ascalon was such a chore in GW1.

@Vorbis said:

GW2 is still an MMO, despite what the fanbase is trying to tell you. If you don't like MMOs, this won't change your mind.

I'd say that depends on what you dislike about MMO's. GW2 puts skill ahead of the amount of time you spend playing, it does away with grinding and e-peen waving ego maniacs who think they're gods because of their gear and level.

Of course, there's going to be people turned off by the lack of those things, but I think there's a really good focus on the actual gameplay being fun and co-operative elements here that sets it apart from a typical MMO, and it's something you can enjoy occasionally without having to devote thousands of hours to.

Most people seem to think it's good, many people whose opinions I respect and generally am in line with, like TB and the RPS guys are pretty enthusiastic towards it.