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Hailinel

I wrote this little thing (it's not actually a little thing): http://www.giantbomb.com/profile/hailinel/blog/lightning-returns-wha...

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Why Asura > Kratos

I'm sure that, given their obvious similarities, comparisons have already been drawn between Asura, the rage-fueled protagonist of Asura's Wrath, and Kratos, the rage-fueled protagonist of the God of War series. But even with that being the case, I felt the urge to add my own views to the argument. Namely, that in terms of their characterizations and despite their similarities, Asura is the better, more realized of the two, even taking into account that Kratos has had more games in which to develop.

Warning! The rest of this article is scattered with spoilery references to things that happen in Asura's Wrath. If you care at all to experience the game for yourself, don't read any further!

Despite that advantage, Kratos's characterization exists more or less on a downward slope. The first God of War is a tale of revenge and redemption as Kratos makes up for being tricked into murdering his own wife and child. But then the sequels only serve to regress him. He becomes less a tragic hero or antihero, and more just straight-up petulant, like an angry teenager. He goes about murdering everything in his path with very few exceptions, and falls into the trap of being more or less defined by his thirst for slaughter above all else, with a side of sex minigames.

You know, because he's supposed to be a badass.

Asura, on the other hand, is a more sympathetic figure. Whereas Kratos's thirst for revenge came from, in general, being a violent fool that pleaded to Ares for power and became a zealot, leading to his family's deaths, Asura is never under any such delusions. From the outset, he's a pawn in a coup enacted by his comrades, framed for the murder of the emperor, and branded a traitor. Further, his wife is killed and his daughter is kidnapped not because of anything he does, but because of the villain's overarching scheme.

As for the nature of their ever-present rage, I've noted before that Kratos's anger, which is at first justifiable toward Ares, grows petulant over time. There's little about it that serves him, other than being his one definable emotional trait. On the other hand, Asura's rage is innate because of his demigod powers. His Mantra is empowered by his fury, but even when he's at his most volatile, he doesn't just lash out at anyone and everyone. Asura saves his wrath only for those that are his enemies, while Kratos would likely stab an innocent to death, and then rip the poor soul's head off, for merely standing between him and Zeus's throne room.

And as for their sexuality, there comes a point in Asura's Wrath that almost seems like it's there to make fun of Kratos's conquesting libido. One of the game's chapters is spent relaxing in a hot spring at the behest of Asura's mentor, Augus. While in the spring, Asura is waited on by a scantily clad, busty beauty. There are even several humorous trophies/achievements linked to this portion of the game, such as one for ogling the attendant's assets. But if the player decides to allow Asura to indulge in too much booze, he can enter Burst mode, at which point he'll get frisky with the lady.

Then he gets shot down in hilarious fashion. No boobies or ridiculous sex minigames for you, buddy. I'd actually prefer it if God of War had this sense of humor; the sort that's willing to put the protagonist in a depreciating scenario of humiliation.

But to get back on track, over all, Asura, despite his anger and his furious ability to do battle with a giant space Buddha, is a man of compassion. Against forces that have absolutely no qualm in killing countless humans, he's the only demigod that comes to understand how idiotic and cruel their scheme is, despite his former allies' belief that they're working toward a greater good. During the entire course of the game, the one thing that sets him off the most isn't some perceived slight against him, it's witnessing the death of a human girl that looks like his daughter; the only human in the game that refuses to accept these mass slaughters as some sort of gift from the gods, and who sympathizes with Asura's desire for revenge. He learns how to channel his rage so that it doesn't consume him; so that he can still look his daughter in the eyes when all is said and done. That's not something that I think Kratos would ever be capable of. Not when his last act of God of War III is to (supposedly) kill himself just to spite the one remaining goddess of Olympus that was in any way his ally.

Asura may be a very melodramatic character (a natural tendency, given the styles of anime that Asura's Wrath is meant to evoke), but in the end, his journey is a far more satisfying one than Kratos's. Where Kratos embarks on what becomes little more than a juvenile power fantasy, Asura's tale is one that features more emotional weight that feels heartfelt. And for that reason, I would much prefer to see an Asura's Wrath II, complete with its crazy mix of cinematics, quick-time events and action, than another romp with Kratos.

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Hailinel

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@President_Barackbar said:

@Hailinel said:

@President_Barackbar: It's true that I tend to like Japanese games more, but I'm not exclusively partial to games from there. At the same time, arguing about hypothetical scenarios such as "If Kratos were a Japanese character, you'd like him more," is an empty argument because there's nothing in it that can satisfactorily answer that question one way or the other. It's a fantasy scenario with no resolution.

I'm not saying it was a GOOD argument, but you said "I'm not sure what would make you think otherwise". What I said is what would make people think otherwise.

Fair enough.

@Vinny_Says said:

Oh....another Japan is better than the west thread..awesome. Both of these characters are garbage btw.

Not fair enough.

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Praxis

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Edited By Praxis

While I can't really speak to the quality of Asura's Wrath or its protagonist, I've always seen Kratos' increasingly vile behavior over the course of the series as an intentional arc; he is, as I surmise, meant to be a man traumatized by a legitimately tragic event, who then uses it as fuel for ever-increasing levels of violence and depravity. The irony is of course that he was responsible for the tragic event in question, and the longer that Kratos holds onto his anger, and the more wanton and indiscriminate his killing becomes, the less pathos the audience ultimately feels for him. By the third game, I think you're meant to feel that he is just as despicable, if not more so, than the very people he seeks to depose, and that his methods are no longer justifiable to anyone but himself. It's true that the plot of God of War ceased to be noteworthy after the first game, but I still find Kratos himself to be an interesting character, and a lot more compelling than the vast majority of cookie-cutter leading men I have played in various action games over the years.

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Catolf

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I can agree with this 100% not because of what this duder said:
 
@Vinny_Says said:

Oh....another Japan is better than the west thread..awesome. Both of these characters are garbage btw.
Thats stupid, cause it isn't what this is about.
 
I LOVED god of war.. LOVED IT. Love me a revenge and redemption story and you know what, the first round was great. I wanted Kratos to get back at Ares, and he did, and that was great.. but then they made  God of war 2.. and 3. I stopped caring. It because about him wanting to just kill with no remorse, innocent or enemy it didn't matter. Thats when I stopped caring and that's when I stopped buying. I finished the first GOW... I only got partway through of GOW2.. and I won't be touching three.
 
Now I was no planning to pick up Asura's Wrath, I heard it before and was unsure about getting it. But with a little pressure and a bit of cash (btw I got it for 44$) I picked this up and beat it in 7 hours, and Asura is the superior character. His rage has a reason, and he dosen't attack innocents, he has a line and he's drawn it in the sand that he does not cross.. thats what makes him a better character. Asura actually has a god damn soul.. and a good one.
 
There is a point in the game where the golden spider is speaking to him after Asura looses himself when the little girl dies. It tries to convince him to continue, to fuel that rage and pretty much destroy all his enemies. Asura proclaims that this rage, this power (which is completely out of control) cannot save anything, not even a little girl that needed his help. Loosing himself won't help him, it would hinder him. That he needed to keep his head.
 
Asura is Superior..
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Hailinel

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@dudeglove said:

You like Japanese games; we get it.

That's not what this blog is about.

@Catolf said:

I can agree with this 100% not because of what this duder said:

@Vinny_Says said:
Oh....another Japan is better than the west thread..awesome. Both of these characters are garbage btw.
Thats stupid, cause it isn't what this is about. I LOVED god of war.. LOVED IT. Love me a revenge and redemption story and you know what, the first round was great. I wanted Kratos to get back at Ares, and he did, and that was great.. but then they made God of war 2.. and 3. I stopped caring. It because about him wanting to just kill with no remorse, innocent or enemy it didn't matter. Thats when I stopped caring and that's when I stopped buying. I finished the first GOW... I only got partway through of GOW2.. and I won't be touching three. Now I was no planning to pick up Asura's Wrath, I heard it before and was unsure about getting it. But with a little pressure and a bit of cash (btw I got it for 44$) I picked this up and beat it in 7 hours, and Asura is the superior character. His rage has a reason, and he dosen't attack innocents, he has a line and he's drawn it in the sand that he does not cross.. thats what makes him a better character. Asura actually has a god damn soul.. and a good one. There is a point in the game where the golden spider is speaking to him after Asura looses himself when the little girl dies. It tries to convince him to continue, to fuel that rage and pretty much destroy all his enemies. Asura proclaims that this rage, this power (which is completely out of control) cannot save anything, not even a little girl that needed his help. Loosing himself won't help him, it would hinder him. That he needed to keep his head. Asura is Superior..

This is what this blog is about.

@Praxis said:

While I can't really speak to the quality of Asura's Wrath or its protagonist, I've always seen Kratos' increasingly vile behavior over the course of the series as an intentional arc; he is, as I surmise, meant to be a man traumatized by a legitimately tragic event, who then uses it as fuel for ever-increasing levels of violence and depravity. The irony is of course that he was responsible for the tragic event in question, and the longer that Kratos holds onto his anger, and the more wanton and indiscriminate his killing becomes, the less pathos the audience ultimately feels for him. By the third game, I think you're meant to feel that he is just as despicable, if not more so, than the very people he seeks to depose, and that his methods are no longer justifiable to anyone but himself. It's true that the plot of God of War ceased to be noteworthy after the first game, but I still find Kratos himself to be an interesting character, and a lot more compelling than the vast majority of cookie-cutter leading men I have played in various action games over the years.

I can't say that I agree that you're meant to feel that way about Kratos in the third game. While it's certainly possible that the developers intended for him to be as despicable as he becomes, I wonder how much of it was intent versus being lax in giving him any reason for sympathy.

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Praxis

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@Hailinel: While there are certainly elements of God of War's storytelling that could be called lazy (the "vessel of hope" explanation at the end of God of War III comes to mind), I think they've been pretty consistent in communicating that Kratos is not a good guy. In God of War I, even his wife questions whether his conquests are for Sparta or for himself. God of War II basically begins with Kratos refusing to heed warnings that his endless campaign of conquest (which led directly to the deaths of his wife and daughter in the first game) could not continue much longer without consequences, and it ends with him killing his only advocate and the very person who tried to caution him against his impending comeuppance. By the third game, any notion that Kratos is fighting the good fight is more or less quashed, since his personal vendetta against the Gods unleashes flood, famine, and turmoil across the globe, the effects of which he is completely callous to. Apart from some late game sequel setup, I think God of War III does a pretty good job of not shying away from just how ugly Kratos really is. To put it another way, I don't disagree that Asura is probably the more likable of the two and a better person to boot, but I also don't feel like that's saying much given how consistently hateful and repugnant Kratos is. It seems like an apples to oranges comparison.

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Shun_Akiyama

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you could have just said, he's got 6 arms. 6 arms beats 2 arms any day.

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RE_Player1

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Goku > Asura

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Hailinel

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@Praxis said:

@Hailinel: While there are certainly elements of God of War's storytelling that could be called lazy (the "vessel of hope" explanation at the end of God of War III comes to mind), I think they've been pretty consistent in communicating that Kratos is not a good guy. In God of War I, even his wife questions whether his conquests are for Sparta or for himself. God of War II basically begins with Kratos refusing to heed warnings that his endless campaign of conquest (which led directly to the deaths of his wife and daughter in the first game) could not continue much longer without consequences, and it ends with him killing his only advocate and the very person who tried to caution him against his impending comeuppance. By the third game, any notion that Kratos is fighting the good fight is more or less quashed, since his personal vendetta against the Gods unleashes flood, famine, and turmoil across the globe, the effects of which he is completely callous to. Apart from some late game sequel setup, I think God of War III does a pretty good job of not shying away from just how ugly Kratos really is. To put it another way, I don't disagree that Asura is probably the more likable of the two and a better person to boot, but I also don't feel like that's saying much given how consistently hateful and repugnant Kratos is. It seems like an apples to oranges comparison.

I can agree with that. I began this blog post with the notion of comparing two protagonists that are primarily characterized by their rage within (relatively) similar genres. And it is something of an unfair comparison, seeing as how Kratos seemingly doesn't have a redeemable bone in his body, nor does he appear to care. Part of me is curious to know how far the developer can take Kratos down this rabbit hole, but the other part doesn't really care for him and could live without knowing the answer to that question.

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tim_the_corsair

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I...really don't want to see Kratos burst

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@Hailinel: If he's got a redeemable bone in his body, he's probably used it to beat a kitten to death at some point :P As far as his future is concerned, It'd be nice if he was actually dead, as I don't really know what contrivance you use to keep him going after killing a pantheon and nearly destroying the world with his own anger. He's already killed everyone he could possibly blame for his own mistakes, and the post-credits cliff jump is about as fitting an end for that character as could be hoped for.

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Hailinel

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@Praxis said:

@Hailinel: If he's got a redeemable bone in his body, he's probably used it to beat a kitten to death at some point :P As far as his future is concerned, It'd be nice if he was actually dead, as I don't really know what contrivance you use to keep him going after killing a pantheon and nearly destroying the world with his own anger. He's already killed everyone he could possibly blame for his own mistakes, and the post-credits cliff jump is about as fitting an end for that character as could be hoped for.

All very true. I know that Jaffe had his own idea for Kratos post-GOW1, but it supposedly would have just involved him slaughtering the Norse pantheon for some reason. Without more detail, I can't honestly say whether his concept would have been better or worse.

But in all honesty, I'd just rather he stay dead at this point.

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"HERP DERP! I HAVEN'T PLAYED ASURA'S WRATH AND DON'T UNDERSTAND THAT THE STORY UNFOLDS AND MUCH LIKE AN ONION SHOWS OFF LAYERS OF MOST CHARACTERS IN IT THE MORE YOU PEEL!"

Nice to be able to differentiate the simpletons who are still stuck in the 13 year old "I'M MAD AT MY DAD! BLOOD AND TITS ARE AWESOME" mindsets that Kratos espews the further down the rabbit hole the GoW franchise went.

It's a damn shame to see so many people willfully want to ignore how much more pathos a character like Asura has unlike Kratos over the course of the game. Which was much to my surprise as I expected Asura to just yell alot and punch stuff with his many arms.

Even as mired in Japanese melodrama as Asura's Wrath was, I was pleasently surprised at how well it was told and presented while managing to stay away from the worst of pitfalls inherent to the genre. The closemindedness of so many towards this utter gem of an experience saddens me when we're usually forced formulaic Japanese angsty drama or standard jarhead tough guy shooter as narratives from these big companies.

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I haven't played Asura's Wrath, so I won't read this, but I will say that Kratos is extremently one-dimensional and that's kinda of the point. I find it hard to believe there's anyone out there that thinks he's such a deep character. He's just rage-incarnate. Kill everything, kill everyone. Granted he does seem to take the time to channel that rage into boning, he's still a simple dude.

Whether that results in a better experience or not is up the player I suppose. The games seem to be handled differently enough that comparing the two sounds silly (and yes, I'm aware you're just throwing your two-cents into an already started debate; this response isn't a slight against you).