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    The Xbox 360 is the second game console produced by Microsoft Corporation and is the successor to the original Xbox.

    Question: Next generation Xbox - back compat. and DLC support?

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    lasborg

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    #1  Edited By lasborg

     I know it is just speculation for now, but how do you guys think the next gen xbox will be able to handle backwards compatibility.
    Do you think it will be 100% backwards compatible, e.g. playing all games and supporting all DLC/arcade games etc.
    I sure hope that i can use all my DLC for a next gen rock band game on the new system when it arrive.

     

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    meteora

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    #2  Edited By meteora

    They better. The 360 has a strong and large game library. And knowing how the 360 will probably not last very long to play 10 years later; they ought to have a new console to play the favourite games we used to play on our 360.
     
    I heard that they will be using something like ATI; someone here on GB told me that it should be easier to make the console have backwards compatibility with older console games because it uses a similar processor. Problem with the original Xbox was that it used Nvidia or something so the backwards compatibility was out of question for the 360. Seeing how both the new Xbox and 360 uses ATI then we might be in luck.
     
    Also gives Microsoft an excuse to drop all support for the 360 and the amount of warranties/repairs they had to cover.

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    lasborg

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    #3  Edited By lasborg

    Also with gamerscore and overall "gamer identity"  (avartars and so far). I recon they will continue that on the "xbox 720".

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    toowalrus

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    #4  Edited By toowalrus

    Absoutely, people are so invested in their gamerscore right now to the point where wiping the slate clean would be a huge mistake.

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    EpicSteve

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    #5  Edited By EpicSteve

    I'm more interested on what they do with gamerscore.  By the time a new system rolls around, I probably wont care about 360 games. Gotta stay current!

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    timay

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    #6  Edited By timay

    I think it will. The only reason the 360 backwords compatibility blows is because they didn't own the hardware from the original xbox.  This time around they do so will have no problem incorporating whatever needs to be done if they want to.

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    gamer_152

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    #7  Edited By gamer_152  Moderator

    It would suck if the future 360 didn't have full backwards compatibility and it's not out of the realms of possibility that it could happen but if what Meteora said is true then it looks like a fully-backwards compatible Xbox 360 successor may be very likely. Also I think that Microsoft know that there's gonna be some very major backlash from the community if they don't transfer all Xbox LIVE accounts to the new system with gamerscore intact so I'm sure that's something we'll see as well.

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    nick_verissimo

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    #8  Edited By nick_verissimo

    Wow, I hadn't even thought of that stuff.  This console generation seems like it could go on forever and I wonder if new consoles are even being planned at this point.

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    Malchom

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    #9  Edited By Malchom

    I think it is out of the question for any console maker to avoid any form of backwards compatibility anymore. There is no reason why Live accounts, Game store and DLC would not be backwards compatible at all. As for physical games, like Gamer_152 said they own the hardware now and have a lot of leeway for a future console, a lot more than with the original Xbox!
     
    Let's not forget the backlash Sony and M$ got when they announced partial **cough** crappy **cough** backwards compatibility on their current consoles. I doubt they'll try it again.

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    cspiffo

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    #10  Edited By cspiffo
    @Meteora said:
    " They better. The 360 has a strong and large game library. And knowing how the 360 will probably not last very long to play 10 years later; they ought to have a new console to play the favourite games we used to play on our 360. I heard that they will be using something like ATI; someone here on GB told me that it should be easier to make the console have backwards compatibility with older console games because it uses a similar processor. Problem with the original Xbox was that it used Nvidia or something so the backwards compatibility was out of question for the 360. Seeing how both the new Xbox and 360 uses ATI then we might be in luck.  Also gives Microsoft an excuse to drop all support for the 360 and the amount of warranties/repairs they had to cover. "
    The reason Microsoft couldn't do hardware BC was because they didn't own the rights to key aspects of the hardware design of the the first XBOX.  They were forced to use software BC or pay both intel and Nvidia royalties for the use of the hardware in the 360.  They didn't make that mistake this time so I'm hopeful that they will have full BC in their next console iteration.  Who knows what they will do though.
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    Loghorn

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    #11  Edited By Loghorn

    I also hope that MS will have BC on their next X-Box console (At least for 360 games, if not original X-Box games as well). And make it hardware emulated based, since it's way better than software emulation.

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    addictedtopinescent

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    Depends on the timing, but if it's realeased in the next 3 years, they fucking need 100% backwards compatibility and gamerscores that carry over

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    Origina1Penguin

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    #13  Edited By Origina1Penguin

    I think it would be suicide for Microsoft's reputation in the gaming market if they did not have some sort of computability with their current gen games and data. However, I'm not so certain carrying over gamerscore is the best idea. Starting a new slate for the next gen's products may actually attract more people than it turns away. Everyone is familiar with the concept now, so putting everyone on even grounds again could entice a fresh boost of competitiveness in the launch window. I'm sure getting a leg up on the competition launch-wise will be a major strategy for MS again.
     
    As far as games and DLC goes... I think MS will try to do as much BC as possible. The hardware differences complicated things for the Xbox 360 from Xbox. Given the apparent focus for more digital distribution, I think they will try to have every downloadable full game and arcade title to date (- indies) as available on their next console in a separate section of the marketplace. Any game supported as backwards compatible MUST have supported DLC. Something like Rock Band is a special case that would really come down to what the developers can do and are willing to do(hopefully with cooperation and assistance from MS). I'm pretty much just talking out of my ass with speculation here, but you asked what we think.

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    iam3green

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    #14  Edited By iam3green

    i hope they do back ward compaibitly as i would be mad. i just have a feeling that DLC won't be possible just because. it would be weird if they didn't though. 
     
    i hope that next generation all the companies do it. sony made the mistake of not doing that. the older ones could but not the newer ones. i have some ps2 games that i wish i could play but i have a broken ps2 and i don't feel like paying for a new one/ repair.

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    guiseppe

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    #15  Edited By guiseppe

    It better. It would be even better if it played Xbox games as well, even if that's very doubtful. But then again, we don't know anything about the next Xbox, so anything is possible I guess.

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    Loghorn

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    #16  Edited By Loghorn
    @Origina1Penguin said:
    " I think it would be suicide for Microsoft's reputation in the gaming market if they did not have some sort of computability with their current gen games and data. However, I'm not so certain carrying over gamerscore is the best idea. Starting a new slate for the next gen's products may actually attract more people than it turns away. Everyone is familiar with the concept now, so putting everyone on even grounds again could entice a fresh boost of competitiveness in the launch window. I'm sure getting a leg up on the competition launch-wise will be a major strategy for MS again. 
     
    As far as games and DLC goes... I think MS will try to do as much BC as possible. The hardware differences complicated things for the Xbox 360 from Xbox. Given the apparent focus for more digital distribution, I think they will try to have every downloadable full game and arcade title to date (- indies) as available on their next console in a separate section of the marketplace. Any game supported as backwards compatible MUST have supported DLC. Something like Rock Band is a special case that would really come down to what the developers can do and are willing to do (hopefully with cooperation and assistance from MS). I'm pretty much just talking out of my ass with speculation here, but you asked what we think. "
     
    I don't know about you, but going DD only at this time would be suicidal, especially when a lot of people don't have online as well as internet speeds not being up to snuff. If that happens, I'll be buying a PS4 instead.
     
    I just think that MS can go with Blu-Ray for their next gen console, as well as having a 4x Blu-Ray disc drive to help avoid mandatory installs within games the Blu-Ray disc drive inside the PS3 is like 2x). Plus they wouldn't have to worry about paying the BDA much money to have it supported on their next gen console, as the format's becoming more cheaper in the long run.
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    Daryl

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    #17  Edited By Daryl

    I reckon the Arcade will be able to work on the 360 and their next console on a multi platform kinda thing. 

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    President_Evil

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    #18  Edited By President_Evil

    Microsoft is always working to make the 360's chipset smaller.  By 2010, it's rumored that the 360's GPU and CPU will be combined into one super chip (dubed "Valhalla").  If Valhalla is realized, it makes sense that they can further shink the 360 internals for full-on hardware backwards compatibility in the next xbox. 
     
    Plus with the whole Gamerscore/Arcade dealie being a pretty big incentive to play games on Microsoft systems, they best betta have BC!
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    KingBroly

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    #19  Edited By KingBroly

    They already said gamerscore would carry over.  I want everything to carry over.  Games, DLC, XBLA games, etc.  

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    ryanwho

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    #20  Edited By ryanwho

    Its basically a PC so I don't see why it wouldn't be BC. Your PC still plays older games when you upgrade the RAM and CPU.

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    AndrewB

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    #21  Edited By AndrewB

    Live Arcade games, certainly. DLC and backwards compatibility, I'm guessing  "probably," since, as mentioned, the Xbox 360's hardware so closely resembles basic PC hardware compared to the other consoles. Porting things over, depending on how the next Xbox's hardware goes, would be more simply like running an old PC game on a new computer. Emphasis on "depending," however, as if they use any sort of proprietary architecture, which is a possibility, that will break the ease of porting things over, which may require actual 360 hardware in the new console, which would mean an increase in expense, which, as the PS3 illustrated, is ill afforded in the highly competitive world of Video Game consoles.
     
    I'm still guessing they'll make the effort, regardless. Maintaining backwards compatibility promotes the purchasing of newer hardware, and it would be in Microsoft's best interest to do so. Besides that, with the way they've been pushing full-game digital downloads, there's even more pressure on them to maintain working backwards compatibility, or else all of those downloadable games become obsolete in the fairly near future.

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    Diamond

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    #22  Edited By Diamond
    @ryanwho said:
    Its basically a PC so I don't see why it wouldn't be BC. Your PC still plays older games when you upgrade the RAM and CPU.
    Because it's not a PC.  Console games are developed at a more efficient, but less compatible layer.  There's not as many layers of abstraction in coding, there's not nearly as many layers of one piece of software telling another piece of software what to tell a driver that tells hardware what to do.
     
    Just for an example, something like Uncharted 2 is programmed quite a bit on the assembly (directly coded to the processor) level.  This is as efficient as coding can get, performance wise, and it generally never done on PCs for a long time now, except by virus makers, hackers, crackers, or demoscene people.  There's no way you could run that on another console unless either you have the exact same hardware, or you have lots of emulation code running.
     
    Playstation 2 had PS1 back compatibility because PS2 had PS1 physical components inside.  The first PS3s had both main PS2 chips inside, the later ones had one of the PS2 chips and modern PS3s have no PS2 chips (but they all have the same PS1 chips).
     
    Xbox 360 emulates Xbox 1 games at a high level (seemingly), but there's lots of games that were coded too close to the hardware, so weren't easily able to be emulated.
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    Origina1Penguin

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    #23  Edited By Origina1Penguin
    @Loghorn: I don't disagree. I was just saying that 360 games would be available through DD on the next console, like how Xbox Originals is currently being done as well as some 360 titles.
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    ravensword

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    #24  Edited By ravensword

    Theres no good reason why it cant be BC. Also, they have to use Bluray next gen because DD isnt going to fly next gen. They would kill themselves if they try to do it next gen. So since DVD is completely maxed out by now, you have to go to a larger format. I would like them to keep the same basic controller design.
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    m1k3

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    #25  Edited By m1k3

    Microsoft wants to make some big changes to Xbox Live right now, but there are a lot of people still playing Halo 2 on their 360's that they cant change anything to their online structure. Or so i have been told.

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    DJJoeJoe

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    #26  Edited By DJJoeJoe
    @m1k3 said:
    " Microsoft wants to make some big changes to Xbox Live right now, but there are a lot of people still playing Halo 2 on their 360's that they cant change anything to their online structure. Or so i have been told. "
    It's really nice that they don't shaft the game just for a larger friends list for everyone, as much as it would be interesting I don't think most people have to worry about hitting the 100 friends cap (who has 100 live friends they actually care about.. if you do kudos I guess). Eitherway it's nice, it's not like they wouldn't benifit from cutting off halo 2 since halo 3 and odst have been going for a long time now, not to mention halo 2 itself is, what, 6 years old now?
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    SeriouslyNow

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    #27  Edited By SeriouslyNow
    @timay said:

    " The only reason the 360 backwords compatibility blows is because they didn't own the hardware from the original xbox."

    ummm what? They certainly did own the original hardware.  Who do you think owned it?  The flying sky demon Thrall the Flatulent?
     
    nVidia made the GPU and motherboard FOR Microsoft, while Intel made the CPU FOR Microsoft.   MS still owns all the rights to the original XBOX hardware.
     
    The reason why backwArds compatibility is difficult is because the XBOX and XBOX 360 have wildly differing architectures

    XBOX - Intel PIII derivative x86 CPU / nVidia NV4 derivative GPU
     
    XBOX 360 - IBM PowerCore derivative CPU / ATI X1600 derivative GPU
     
     These two machines have very little in common, especially in the CPU department which means many original XBOX titles will never be made compatible because they were made for a completely different CPU machine code.  Frankly, I think it's impessive that MS had made so many XBOX games work at all on the 360.
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    giyanks22

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    #28  Edited By giyanks22
    @nick_verissimo said:
    " Wow, I hadn't even thought of that stuff.  This console generation seems like it could go on forever and I wonder if new consoles are even being planned at this point. "
    lol...of course they plan new consoles. They probably planned the "Xbox 720" before the 360 was even out. I mean they obviously  pushed it back with the Xbox Updates to change the dashboard and add the facebook thing, but they've planned on it for while. It's going to be one powerful system though.
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    SeriouslyNow

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    #29  Edited By SeriouslyNow
    @ryanwho said:
    " Its basically a PC so I don't see why it wouldn't be BC. Your PC still plays older games when you upgrade the RAM and CPU. "
    Can people PLEASE stop saying that.  It sorta made sense in terms of the original XBOX but it makes no sense in terms of the XBOX 360.  Almost every aspect of the 360 is custom built and bares no relation with what the market refers to as a "PC" the IBM compatible. The nearest personal computer the 360 is slightly related to would be something like a late generation Core5 Macintosh Pro before they went to Intel processors and even then only ever so slightly as the CPU is not a standard PowerPC processor and ATI Xenon is not a standard ATI x1600 GPU and that's leaving aside all of the specifically built custom chipset stuff and non-standard memory.  So please, I beg of you stop saying that.  There is no guarantee that BC will be simple and effective on the next generation hardware because the hardware might, once again, be completely different from the previous console's.

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