DoA will not be brought to the west, according to Tecmo.

“Do you know many issues happening in video game industry with regard to how to treat female in video game industry? We do not want to talk those things here. But certainly we have gone through in last year or two to come to our decision. Thank you.”

I would love another Dead or Alive straight up fighting game sometime

Yeah. Good call. It's been 12 years since I was 13. Video game boobs don't really do it for me anymore.

@billmcneal: one came out this year....

I would love a Dead or Alive 6. Dead or Alive 5 first came out in 2012

Word of any pervy stuff in the game will get out anyway via Kotaku and YouTube, seems like they're merely delaying the inevitable to me.

This is pretty crappy IMO. I have no interest in the game, but people should be able to buy what they want without other people (who aren't even going to buy it anyway) telling them they shouldn't be able to.

http://www.vgchartz.com/game/481/dead-or-alive-xtreme-2/

The previous one sold the most copies in the US.

What's the source of this quote? It sounds like poorly translated gibberish. Also, I do think that the market for these kind of games is shrinking in the US.

Team Ninja hasn't made a great game in about a decade, so I don't think we'll be missing much. Also, I'm sure it will be easy to import if you really want to play it.

Can't wait for the inevitable Kickstarter to bring this out worldwide. Part of their campaign includes getting people who are defenders of free speech to invest in their game.

Oh God, am I that cynical?

@octaslash: Its from their community manager on the Facebook page. He's Japanese so I assume that's why it seems like gibberish.

http://nichegamer.com/2015/11/no-plans-to-bring-dead-or-alive-xtreme-3-west-developer-koei-tecmo-fears-backlash/

Also the previous entry sold the most copies in the US and the company has stated that it is not releasing it because of "issues happening in video game industry with regard to how to treat female in video game"

Hold your horses, cowboy. Who exactly is saying you shouldn't be able to purchase these games? There have certainly been criticisms of DoA's bizarre treatment of their female characters, but I don't think anyone wants to ban them.

It's not really a critics job to worry about the "stink" they raise when they voice their opinion on something. If Tecmo had any confidence in their product to sell, they would most certainly release it. They're not afraid of getting their feelings hurt by someone criticizing their game.

Except the first one sold over twice as many copies (590k versus 250k - and I checked using the same site as you: clicky). The second game was also critically panned (59 on Metacritic).

I'm pretty confident this isn't so much as a "criticism" issue as people are being led to believe. Plus, they aren't cancelling the game. They're just not releasing it in the US. If you're that hellbent on playing it, you've probably already preordered an import copy anywho.

@n1nj4d00m: Most people call "self censorship" editing and game companies have been deciding about whether to bring games out in foreign countries for as long as there have been games. I would have loved to read about how Square Soft "self censored" FFV when they decided not to release it in the US originally. Or how Japanese designers "self censored" their US releases to make them easier because they didn't think Western game players could hang with the original difficulty.

Also I haven't actually read anyone clamoring for DOAX to be banned, but I have read a decade or so of reviews calling those games out for being skeevy and bad. Which is kind of what reviews and cultural criticism are for: providing criticism so that readers can know what they're buying and so that authors can get feedback on what was wrong with their product.

Of course the PR from Tecmo said that. It's just another way of saying that they're worried it won't profit and also misdirecting their fans' anger in the same statement.

Sucks for whoever wants to play this, but I imagine if they really wanted to they'd just import it.

This isn't really some big win or some big loss. Does sorta seem like a PR spin though.

I'm more inclined to believe that this is a very easy excuse to use for the game not coming out here, when there may be other factors at play. It would probably take quite a lot of money to localize and prepare this game for the Western market, and it might not be worth the time, money and effort to do so. Sales are not guaranteed, even if the prior installment did well. That was almost a decade ago and times have changed. I remember the other games having a kind of mystique around them, and DOA was actually a pretty popular fighting game. Now this stuff is kind of boring, all things considered, and DOA doesn't have the cache that it once had as a franchise, fighting or volleyball-wise.

Plus, looking at the numbers provided for the prior installment, would it really be worth their time and money to bring it to the United States and to Europe and sell maybe 170,000 units combined? Really? The only reason it didn't do well in Japan, most likely, was because it came out on the XBox 360. So assuming that it did well in the US because we want this stuff more is just presumptuous. It's more likely because it came out on an very unpopular system there versus a very popular system in the west,

I'm sorry, but I think it's probably a lot more simple and based on actual money and business sense than it is based on the fear of some critics or customers complaining about boob physics and skimpy bathing suits. It certainly didn't prevent them from making boatloads of sexy DLC for DOA 5, so why is it suddenly the main reason that this game isn't coming to the US? I'm suspicious.

Actually, the main DOA series games are dubbed in the US.

@n1nj4d00m: Harsh criticism is not the same thing as a call for a banning. I also don't see what is intellectually dishonest about saying that a series that features a voyeuristic camera mode and lets its players play dress-up with an exclusively female cast is objectifying women. The product is literally female character models with impossible breast physics playing barely functional minigames. If Koei Techmo is actually listening to the people who say that product is off-putting (it seems like that statement is PR spin, but whatever), then that is their prerogative as a company. The people who want it will probably still import the game just fine.

@jadegl: I'm with you in that this is hardly the only reason they wouldn't bring it to the west. It's not like people weren't calling out those DOA Volleyball games as being sleazy and embarrassing a decade ago, and it's not like weird creepy Japanese games aren't coming out here anymore; just look at the Vita. There's probably some boring business reason this game isn't coming to the west as well.

@n1nj4d00m: Having a problem with objectification is not the same thing as having a problem with sexualization. And again, if they care what people who are not their audience thinks, that's their prerogative. They can totally choose to ignore that group of critics if they want, just like the whole industry has ignored the people criticizing exploitative DLC or free to play games.

Well that seems like a somewhat irresponsible statement to make. Though I guess the intended audience for the statement itself isn't really the English-speaking crowd. I'm not fully familiar with the implications of Koei Tecmo being a publicly traded company but I have a feeling it's related. I mean, they could have just never announce it and nobody would probably notice.

Meh. I don't give a shit. My interest in the title pretty much died the moment they dropped like 1/3 of the roster because people can't get enough fucking lolita vampires and big-tittied, airheaded, schoolgirl pop idols. besides, if I was going to buy it, I'd just import it anyway.

But seriously, fuck Marie Rose and fuck Honoka. I pray the next DOA fighting game doesn't keep going down that road or I'm done.

Can someone point to where the 'Developer Koei Tecmo Fears Backlash' part comes from?

I would be interested to see how a publisher talks about these things.

sure, it starts with this game. It's only a matter of time before this type of logic impacts a game you care about. If the gaming market in the west isn't opposed to this title being released I say all gaming outlets should sign on a pledge to tecmo koei that they welcome the title in this market in the face of any and all criticism. Advocates for the industry shouldn't sit by quietly in what could become a very disturbing practice.

If that is your "main problem" with this situation then I would say to just relax. Your worries are essentially founded on the slippery slope fallacy. Tecmo Koei is not indicative of the entire video game industry, and the idea that this ONE specific case, even if it were a case of censorship (which I feel has not been proven), will automatically lead to the new industry standard is presumptuous.

My reaction is that if this was a real world, and legitimate, concern that faces game development then we would have heard it from other developers when they created their sexually exploitative or provocative video games or character designs. So far...there is no evidence to suggest that that is stopping or has stopped.

@n1nj4d00m: @wolfgame: If you think that a company choosing to not release a poorly selling, culturally anachronistic game in a foreign territory is the canary in the coal mine for the dangers of criticism changing the industry, then I guess that's your prerogative. I personally doubt that this is actually the start of a slippery slope that sends this industry into ruin. I extra don't think that a bunch of gaming outlets should feel compelled to form a coalition to show solidarity with a multi-million dollar international corporation because they chose not to release a game in a territory. Especially not based on the explanation provided by two PR facebook posts.

Honestly, I don't buy this "fear of backlash" as the actual reason they aren't releasing it. It may have played into some of their thinking, but if they felt there was enough money to be made to justify a western release, I feel pretty confident in saying that they would do it.

Just speculating here, but I think the quotes that kicked off this discussion are likely just the result of community manager(s) over-reaching in looking for a way to respond to people asking why there wasn't going to be a western release.

I'm sure translation and development costs never came to mind during this decision.

No, we all know businesses worry insistently over perception and response and rarely worry about cost and making money.

Also the statement on their Facebook doesn't mention any backlash, it mentions that they don't want to have the conversation about how women are viewed in games:

"Do you know many issues happening in video game industry with regard to how to treat female in video game industry? We do not want to talk those things here. But certainly we have gone through in last year or two to come to our decision. Thank you.”

And finally, you can still import this game. Nothing is stopping you from purchasing this game. If you believe in something vote with your dollars not with your forum outrage.

They are putting out a version with English in asia that anyone could import.

Games already translated, the asian version of doax3 is region free as well. All these reasons about translation costs seem inaccurate to me since game is already translated into english.

@thatpinguino

Can a video game character really objectify women? I mean, they aren't real. Everybody who is playing them knows they aren't real. They're just pixels on a screen. Should I be mad because my glutes don't look like Snake's?

@n1nj4d00m said:

Sorry for being dense, I'm still not seeing the part where they talk about fearing a backlash? Is it hidden further down the comments page or something?

Are they fearing a backlash if they do release it or are they fearing a backlash because they are not releasing it?

@duhvinci: I'm really not going to go about explaining all of feminist film criticism 101 here. I would say that a game who's central gameplay loop is winning the favor of women on a magical dream island so that they'll go on sexy photo shoots in bikinis probably qualifies as being objectifying. If you want to read any of the studies that look into whether objectifying portrayals of women in media effects people's perceptions of women, google is one tab away.

@thatpinguino: well the topic is here to have a discussion, you don't have to participate, that would probably be preferable over telling community members to just go hit up google if you aren't interested in engaging. You want to say the game is objectifying while telling @duhvinci to find evidence for you in google, seems lazy to me.

Keep in mind translation isn't the only cost to releasing a game in other countries. Sure they've got the infrastructure to do it, but it's definitely not free to get the contracts signed, press the discs, market the game, contact the press, distribute the game, etc. Somehow I doubt that a multinational publicly traded corporation consisting of hundreds of people just decide not to release a finished game only because of they're afraid of the danged PC SJW's. My guess is they mean something like estimating sales to be lower due to changes in societal norms and deeming it not worth the resources, but maybe the message is lost along the way to the community managers.

Edit: and huh, looking closer to the words they use in their statements, they don't really say that they're fearing backlash or anything. Just that they don't plan to talk about those issues in public, even though they've talked about it internally and that informed the decision.

Ban this sick filth.

@thatpinguino

Okay, so I spent about 10 minutes googling, and I only found one peer-reviewed study:

"Controlling for age and education, it was found that sexist attitudes--measured with a brief scale assessing beliefs about gender roles in society--were not related to the amount of daily video game use or preference for specific genres for both female and male players." http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/25844719

Everything else I found talked about films and television, which I don't think count because they're real people.

I thought of one more question: If it was decided (and proven) years ago that video games don't cause violent tendencies, then how could they possibly cause sexist/objectifying ones?