Report: ‘Homesick’ dev commits suicide on Twitch.tv

I can't feel sympathy for a liar and a fraud.

Also, the vitriol and bile being directed Allistair is disgusting.

All he did was tell the truth.

chloe is quite obviously a she? Like, SRS for FtM dudes costs way more than she was raising for the first part (and for the most part is unsubstantial), she'd quite obviously look the part and be more masculine if she was (easier for girls to tomboy it up then the other way around), considering you need to have been on hormones for at least a year to attempt it.

and you know what? SRS is not cosmetic surgery to a lot of people. I live with it, but lots of us don't (transpeople have the highest rate of suicide amongst young people last time I checked). You saying it's cosmetic surgery can very well be true, but to her it wasn't and that's the point.

and it sounds like this was her last chance to try something before killing herself, so it still would've been attempting to save her life (even if it was scammy of her); and again, I really doubt she'd have been able to find some hospital to help her save her life if that was actually her issue.

I really don't know what you're trying to argue though. Do I agree that it was a scam? yes. I don't feel bad about it though and there are no amount of words you could say that would make me feel bad about it.

edit: also she didn't commit suicide (just attempted) the OP should probably fix the title

"Chloe Sagal, a valued member of our community and fellow indie developer, needs life saving surgery to remove a piece of shrapnel after a car accident, and if she doesn’t have it removed it will be fatal."

Vaguely calling the surgery "life saving" would have been better, and arguably quite true. Telling the full truth would have been ideal. Claiming that you have shrapnel lodged in your body and if not removed you will die is not an okay thing to do, if it's not true. There is no justification for this behavior.

I hate to hear about anyone attempting to take their own life, and I absolutely hope that this person gets the help that they need, but fraud is fraud. If that's really the situation here, then that's all there is to it.

someone please be a gentleman and summarize this whole shindig to me in few words

I feel sympathy for her whether she is a liar, scammer, or anything else.

People of all kinds and character are pushed toward suicide, and it is never the answer. It is tragic, and regardless of any details surrounding it, this is a disturbing and sad story. I hope that she truly is alright and can turn her life around through the help of those whom care for her.

Transsexual boy has huge problems and tries to scam people for a final operation which changes him to a woman by saying that he/she will die of metal posioning if the does not get the money for the OP. Indiego closed this scam attempt but boy tries to pressure them with suicide. Shortly after she announced that he/she will kill herself on twitch. People who watched thought she was joking but after realizing it was real they called the cops. After that people were blaming twitch and Indiego for these results but now people try to speak up and try to tell the whole truth.

Now all the stuff he/she tried to get her operation money comes to light. This person does not need sympathy but professional help and now it seems he/she gets it. But at what costs.

An individual developer raises money for alleged surgery. Turns out it may have been meant for different surgery. Allegations fly. Loses funding. Some of Internet goes overboard in their response. Individual then attempts suicide live on an Internet stream. It appears that they are now alright in a hospital. Hopefully they will receive professional help.

@darji: Granted you're comparing one human life against the credibility of the numerous people she fucked over. The human life still weighs heavier and the cost is probably greater for her. It's hard to sympathize when she seems to have almost gone out of her way to fuck as many people as possible in this whole process, but like you said, maybe now she can finally get some help. And with the story out, I guess all the other affected parties are exonerated now. So that's something. I guess.

@darji: @truthtellah: Thank you gentlemen, you are most gentlemanly.

This sounds so interesting that I've lost interest though. Crazy stuff.

I do not really can feel for people who try this kind of stuff. I do not really care for people who try to victimize themselves even they are the criminal or offender. It is like a person who killed someone and then blames it on his bad childhood. A lot of people have the same problems but they do not react like that. It is good that he/she now can get help but I do not feel for him/her at all.

hey if you read my post it is quite clear you should refer to her as a her and not a he or a boy or anything like that!

don't be a jerk is a rule on this forum if I am not mistaken

edit; oh wait you are just a jerk never mind correcting you is pointless

Okay? You can feel however you like. For me, though, I find it tragic that anyone would seek suicide, and I hope she will get the help she needs.

Yep. Regardless of her crimes she doesn't deserve the things being said about her. People saying "Meh. She's a scammer. Whatevz lol" seem to be devoid of any empathy.

Also as @animasta has pointed out, can people in this thread please, for gods sake, have some tact and stop with the "he/she" and "it" stuff? It's pretty insensitive and disrespectful to trans people in general. And since we have trans people in our own community, it will also cut down on the off-topic arguments on the matter.

I am sorry that it offends people but I really do not know how to address people like her. But know that I know I will write her all the time. So sorry for that.

As for the rest. So if someone scams your mother or family or yourself because of these reasons and people really fell for this stuff you still feel sympathy? If so you are a much better human being than I am.

Yes. Absolutely. I've been affected by suicide. It's nothing short of horrific. And I also donated an okay sum of money to her IGG fund and even knowing it was for SRS (Sexual Reassignment Surgery) as I do now, I'd still probably end up donating. Again, Animasta has mentioned many times in these forums that Trans people have a massive suicide rate and have a really tough time in life. And if I can help someone whose game I really enjoyed (Homesick is dope, yo) get through that process, I'm happy to. I wish she was honest with donaters, but I'd still donate now. And I think she may have had an easier time getting donations if she were honest. The LGBT and their straight supporters (like myself) are generally pretty awesome about that sort of thing. I could see her getting that money from LGBT supporters easily if word spread.

@darji: money is replaceable, human lives are not.

it's not that hard. is what she did a scam, yes. is she a scam artist? no, that moniker assumes she's doing multiple scams and that's how she makes her income. did she need help? yes.

@mariachimacabre what is homesick? it's funny I've read plenty of things about this but haven't heard about her game yet

Oh I would not doubt that these issues are really hard to deal with as I said. And I would have certainly felt sympathy with her if she just told the truth. But reading all the stuff she did makes me thing otherwise. Like treating people with suicide and so on especially when people who have it as hard as her or even worse do not try this kind of stuff. Well at least she will get professional help now.

Also I think people who try to blame indiego are totally wrong. These should not the people you should blame at all. They did the absolute right thing.

I can't say that I don't sympathize. You can only see so many options when you feel completely hopeless and trapped, especially inside your own body.

Raising money for that sort of thing is already very difficult without having to worry about how the world at large is going to judge you for what you want. It isn't easy to ask for help with something that is still socially "unacceptable" so I understand the reasoning behind the "deceit", if you want to use a harsh word for it. When it all comes crashing down and you perceive your life crumbling around you because you see your final option has only turned into you being called a liar and a cheat, you decide to make another, more final option.

It's a side-scroller horror game. It's free. A flashlight is involved. It's kind of rough but I liked what I played and I hope, once she recovers, she can build on it more.

@darji: I have it just as bad as her and I have nothing but sympathy for her, so try a different tactic.

and you just have to look at the terrible shit this has kicked off to realize why she did this, because people are so ignorant about this stuff that they don't believe her with her not having this surgery would be considered life or death... for example:

http://nnlm.gov/bhic/2011/02/08/transgender-suicide-rates/

Also being depressed fucking sucks enough without literally hating everything about you because it isn't "correct." I am glad she isn't dead, but I can't say that I don't understand why should would try it, and I can't say that I think it's over for her.

I can second the notion that Depression sucks enough already. I can't imagine having Depression in addition to going through what she and the majority of trans people go through.

See that I can believe. Psychological problems are the worst ones. Especially in these kind of situations and even more if her family does not support her but she lied about the whole story about metal poisoning because of a car accident. And then if we can trust the stuff Allistar wrote about even try to "blackmail" (sorry i can not think of the right English word) with killing herself is way too much in my opinion.

But I guess I am pretty radical in such things I also would never sympathize with a person who kills someone and then blames this on psychological problems or a bad childhood. Or people steal rob money because they saw no other solution anymore. I really can not tolerate his kind of stuff when there are tons of people who have even worse problems and do not act like this.

comparing her IGG thing to murder is duuuumb. Come on.

It was an example. Maybe a stupid one but in general it is the same. Just because you have severe problems does not mean you can do such things. That is at least my believe.

And something for the whole he/she debatte:

That is why I am not sure what to write. Again sorry If i offended people...

@darji: yeah other people haven't done what she's done but lots of those other people are dead or successfully transitioned.

again, I am, like, not even close to where she was in this whole process and I feel for her so this "other person" understands. Then again I do not have clinical depression (and thank god for that because I would've killed myself a year ago to be quite frank)

You also know something? everyone got their money back. it's, in essence, a victimless crime. railing against her is pointless at this point, she'll get the help she needs (hopefully), and everyone will be happy. Except her because I doubt just getting SRS will fix her depression, unfortunately. so blame her all you want, but attacking her, like many people are still doing, is just inspiring her to get even worse.

and again, the blackmailing thing was because she was in a terrible place mentally. I literally cannot comprehend being trans and clinically depressed, and I am one of those things.

Also Allistair is a fucking idiot. Lots of trans people (myself included) go by male in real life, and going by female terms on the internet is one way I cope

Good to know the internet still doesn't know when to shut the fuck up about things, even if they get incredibly dire or dangerous! Real swell guys.

Seriously, I'm reading through all this shit now, and every fucking time I see somebody saying "Well she promised a suicide and I didn't see it," I want to reach through my computer and beat the living shit out of them for being retarded.

I have never heard of this person or their game so I'm not going to pretend like I care, but suicide is most definitely not the answer for this.

This may not even be her decision, she may feel forced to go by male because she doesn't have a proper support network. All of my friends still refer to me as a he and call me Snake, and when I ask them to try and check their pronouns because being referred to as a he makes me think that they just don't want to accept me, I get told to "check my privilege." On days when I am more depressed than others, I refer to myself as an "it" or a "thing" because I don't know what the fuck I am.

Your friends do that? What? That's seriously fucked.

oh my god that sounds terrible :( sorry to say but it sounds like you have terrible friends

@darji said:

@mariachimacabre said:

@darji said:

@animasta said:

@darji: I have it just as bad as her and I have nothing but sympathy for her, so try a different tactic.

and you just have to look at the terrible shit this has kicked off to realize why she did this, because people are so ignorant about this stuff that they don't believe her with her not having this surgery would be considered life or death... for example:

http://nnlm.gov/bhic/2011/02/08/transgender-suicide-rates/

See that I can believe. Psychological problems are the worst ones. Especially in these kind of situations and even more if her family does not support her but she lied about the whole story about metal poisoning because of a car accident. And then if we can trust the stuff Allistar wrote about even try to "blackmail" (sorry i can not think of the right English word) with killing herself is way too much in my opinion.

But I guess I am pretty radical in such things I also would never sympathize with a person who kills someone and then blames this on psychological problems or a bad childhood. Or people steal rob money because they saw no other solution anymore. I really can not tolerate his kind of stuff when there are tons of people who have even worse problems and do not act like this.

comparing her IGG thing to murder is duuuumb. Come on.

It was an example. Maybe a stupid one but in general it is the same. Just because you have severe problems does not mean you can do such things. That is at least my believe.

And something for the whole he/she debatte:

That is why I am not sure what to write. Again sorry If i offended people...

Mental illness is tricky thing. It's pretty easy to stand on the outside and say that they shouldn't do that, or feel that way, but in their own minds, they do not see the same things the same way. She most likely truly believed in what she was trying to accomplish. It takes the love, and help of those around her to help her through these things, since it can't be changed by the flip of the switch.

@animasta: Do not sit here and play the victim.

Chloe is a liar, a cheat, and a would-be criminal. Her "condition" is no excuse to prey upon people's good will.

And quite frankly, I'm sure she would have gotten much more support if she were honest in her intentions.

I do not blame her.Personally I just can not feel sympathy r feel sorry for her. And people got the money back because Indiego closed the project and not because she has said so.

As for the he/she thing Allistair if he is telling the truth talked to her a lot in the past months she even thought of him as a friend so if she called herself as him in their conversations should normally mean she is ok with that or that she maybe did not feel like using the she until she fully transforms into a woman. Who knows. That is why this stuff is so difficult. While you rather prefer the to be addressed as a woman , she maybe did not think like that.

@morbid_coffee

These are idiots or rather trolls since this stream was posted on 4chan as well.

I watched some of the video from her Twitch stream. Definitely looks like someone suicidal or severely depressed. Pretty disturbing that she'd have a live feed of it and people would watch. But then, people were apparently more curious than concerned.

A weird situation all around. Emblematic of our time. Regardless of what she has done or what the truth is, this is a sad and twisted turn of events.

Hey, you're not in another person's mind, so what gives you the right to judge them. I agree that she should have been more upfront with her reasoning, but it's knee-jerk judgements like that that force people into being all cloak and dagger about this. This has got to stop.

@darji: dude, she's clearly looking like a woman. I mean sometimes it can be hard to tell but she would hardly refer to herself as him in a conversation as that would be really fucking strange to refer to yourself like that.

my time on the internet has not, in fact, proven your "sureness" accurate. We are treated worse than gay people, in fact (sometimes gay people get some respect). So yes, I have sympathy. I have never ever suggested she was completely in the right for doing so, however! She is (clinically, from the sounds of it) depressed and trans which is a terrible terrible condition.

Yeah but maybe she does not feel like saying that until she fully transforms. You never know about this until you know her. As for the friend example which was posted just now. I would never call him he because I know how she feels because I know her and the situation would be totally clear for me.

With people I do not know I don't know how to adress them...

@darji: I get that but the easiest explanation is that Chloe told Allistair that she's not officially out yet and she is called him outside her house, and he assumed that to mean that sometimes she refers to herself as a he. or he's just super ignorant.

You are making this much more complicated than it actually is.

So how is any of this reason for somebody to kill themselves?

Seriously, internet. Cut the fucking shit. What happened in the past doesn't really matter when somebody whose clearly suffering from severe depression tried to fucking kill themselves live in front of hundreds of viewers.

I didn't care about the indiegogo controversy before. I still don't. I went on not giving a flying fuck about it. But people are being dicks to somebody who clearly isn't in a mental state to deal with it and all of them need to fuck right off.

I think this state is kind of complicated but yeah ok lets say that he is ignorant and she wants to be addressed as she.

@animasta said:

Even if he is wrong, which is totally arguable, how could you think he's a "fucking idiot" for being confused about something that roughly 100% of everybody ever has been confused about before? You ought to cut people some slack for not always knowing the exactly correct way to refer to them, because odds are they don't even know a trans person. They only account for like 1:500 people, according to my research, and I certainly don't know 500 people, how about you?

Not that I wanted to turn this into a pity party, it wasn't my intent. I am just trying to give my perspective on these things.

Oh man is it only me or are your names way to similar that it is getting confusing XD

@artemesia: if you want we could get into the pity olympics later

(but it was still totally worth it because people often times don't know how hard even some of the smaller problems are)

I called him ignorant later is that good enough? I mean considering she ran the IGG as a woman, and talked to him and told him she was transgender, it's not that hard to figure out?

Also he literally did a story earlier about her when he refered to Chloe as her all throughout

I agree; I don't think any of us has right to judge. No matter where anyone stands on the moral compass, I think it compromises values to force a judgment upon others without fully understanding the perspective of the people involved. How are we going to bring up that they might've cost other people money in the past when they're attempting to throw their life away in the present?

I've known someone in particular who has made some terrible life decisions and in spite of finally having the desire to come clean, he ended up committing suicide anyway and left behind a family that was supposed to rely on him. People would never stop judging him for his past mistakes in spite of his desire to clean up his life. No one looked out for him. In spite of how passionately he sounded like he wanted to clean up his life, I guess the pain was too much for him; there were so much more people judging him than actively helping him.

I can't accept the assumption that "she would have gotten much more support if she were honest" because my personal experience above exemplifies the case of someone who was seeking help and by not getting it ultimately committed suicide; it's the most crushing thing in the world to find out something like that when the last time I saw him he seemed so optimistic about cleaning up.

All I'm trying to say is that instead of judging others, people really need to look out for each other more. A lot of the discussion in this thread really shouldn't be happening at all.

The problem here is also that she did not hurt herself with these lies but mostly also people who actually have true intentions for such a campaign maybe not get funded or it will taken down because of this. Just to think about the person instead of the consequences other may experience because of this is not really the right think to do in my opinion.