Why the internet should probably relax about Ground Zeroes

Metal Gear Solid V: Ground Zeroes is short, if you haven't heard yet. But you probably have heard about it because the internet basically exploded when news of it's length got out. Since then Kojima has commented on the length and Game Informer have released more details about the game.After reading about the game I've decided that the internet needs to calm down.

Was anyone REALLY surprised at Ground Zeroes length? I mean, if you buy the game digitally on Xbox 360/PS3 it's $20. Did anyone really expect a $20 game to be the same length or size as say, MGS4? Back when that price point was revealed I noticed some people on twitter who pointed this out. The smaller price point and the fact that every time that game was shown it was the same area/mission I began to realize that Ground Zeroes wasn't going to be that big.

Now to be fair, Kojima and Konami could have been upfront with the length of the game when they first revealed it was the "Prologue" to MGSV Phantom Pain. In fact, I wonder how much of the internet freak out would have happened if they had just told people right away that the game was only 2 hours or so. Waiting this long to reveal the actual length of the game and letting a magazine be the ones who break the bad news was a bit of shitty move on Konami/Kojima's part.

But, ignoring how Konami and Kojima handled revealing information about Ground Zeroes, I still feel the internet is going a bit crazy. Granted, asking people to pay $40 for a game that can be completed in less then 2 hours might seem crazy. But then again people have beat Dark Souls in less then a hour. Hell tons of people have beat Skyrim in well under 2 hours. Or even the original Metal Gear Solid has been beaten in less then 2 hours on extreme difficulty. Sure, these people are speed runners but I think it shows that the length of a game is not a good way to judge quality. More importantly it shows that a game's length is relative to the person playing it. I still haven't beaten Dark Souls, and took months to finish Skyrim's main quest. I was too busy exploring Skyrim to actually care about the lackluster main quest, and Dark Souls kicks my ass. So what took some 2 hours or less took me weeks or months. Now I don't expect it will take months for someone to finish Ground Zeroes, but I bet for some this game will take more then 2 hours to complete. I know my first run will be a super slow and stealth run that might take longer.

Then there's the open world and sandbox approach to stealth and combat that Ground Zeroes has. More so then any other Metal Gear Solid game, Ground Zeroes gives you the freedom to play how you want. Game Informer's Tim Turi talked about entering a jeep then realizing that the headlights would give him away. So he had the idea of shooting out the headlights. That wasn't something the game told him to do, or some much touted feature. No, he just naturally figured it out and did it. And honestly its these little things, all these systems coming together, that has me super excited to mess around with Ground Zeroes. To explore every nook and cranny, to discover the stealthiest way to finish the mission, or the fastest. Plus some of the bonus missions look cool.

That feeling of doing something just to see what happens. Its why I love the Grand Theft Auto series. Shooting a passing car's tire or pushing a dumpster into the ocean, just to see how the game reacts. And Ground Zeroes seems to be filled with this type of gameplay. So why I am excited to learn more about the crazy Metal Gear Solid story, I'm even more excited to see Metal Gear Solid evolve and to mess around in that world and see what is possible. To me that's worth the $30 I'll be paying for the PS4 digital version of the game.

And for me, when it comes down to it I will ALWAYS take a good game over a long game. I'm here to have fun and play something cool, not spend 60 hours or more of my life playing something that is sort of ok. But I understand that for others they can't stand spending $20 or more on something that can be beaten shortly, especially if that game has no multiplayer. Which is fine, everyone has different tastes. But that doesn't excuse people acting like 4 year olds who got their toys taken away from them. Attacking Hideo Kojima, or people attacking Game Informer for lying or not playing it the right way.

And if you don't feel like Ground Zeroes is worth $20-$40 don't worry, you don't have to buy it. Also I wouldn't be surprised if it comes packaged in with Phantom Pain. But either way, calm down internet. Seriously, go read a book or something.

I'm probably going to buy it because I am a filthy whore for Metal Gear Solid, but man, the sheer attitude of entitlement that some gamerdudes display. You'd think they were charging a monthly fee for this shit.

We'll survive, guys.

I'm glad it's cheaper than $60, I wish it was longer. But if it's anything like the Tanker mission it'll be a jam-packed two hours.

@dochaus: Man, I love me some Metal Gear.. right there with you. But luckily pretty much every game has been worth playing. I think this wont be any different.

@bigjeffrey: Im getting it on PS4 so I'll get the old school Deja Vu mission, which looks pretty cool to. I really think 30$ is more then enough for this game. Plus they said it will tie into Phantom Pain, which sounds like a sure fire way to make me buy this.

You can say "Why the internet should probably relax about X" with X equaling about 99% of things and you will be right.

@ilikepopcans: Hey, dont point out how lazy my title is...lol

Yeah, I'm fine with it. for what's in there, I think it (most likely) is more than $20 worth of content. And, to me, the upgrade to the PS4 version is worth the extra $10, because that game looks GREAT. Is having a box worth another $10 on top of that? To me, yeah, probably.

I was a little upset at first, but I'm fine with it now. Besides, even if it can be beat in two hours, I can guarantee than I'll beat it more than once, because that's what I do with all the MGS games. Sure, my Metal Gear Addiction is known to those who know me, but I'm fine with this. I hope $40 for the first two hours of longer games doesn't become a trend, but for this one case, I'm fine with this.

half of it is trolls who are never going to buy the game, and the other half is a consumer report style culture where you have to get the most bang for your buck. This is the next big hot button topic since 1080p vs 720p, a debate that still isn't very well though out. It's no different then media headlines "OBAMACARE IS BLAH BLAH BLAH!!"

i honestly don't mind it, because I'm a horrible MGS Fanboy and believe Kojima is a golden god who can do no wrong. Oh dear god..... I am the problem. Why did I pre order the 100 buck action figure?

I never was going to get the game, I don't really have any fandom tied in Metal Gear, but seems like this will all balance out. May catch the casual gamer off guard on game length but the educated gamer has everything they need to decide if the 30/40$ for this one is worth it to them for the length of gameplay provided.

@wolfgame: Yeah, that is the worry I have is people who don't live and eat gaming all the time might buy it, and become upset with what they get.and I highly doubt Konami will put anywhere on the box "Estimated completion time 2 hours" or something to that effect.

The real annoying thing is that they are selling it separately to begin with. Kinda weird. 30-40 dollar demo. No likey.

Like always, people over hype and over expect out of something and then are horribly disappointed by it. Nothing new. Dumb people will continue to be dumb.

Yeah people going bananas because of dollar / hour ratio is dumb.

Said so, I have never understand why this Kojima guy is a thing in the industry, MGS games are juvenile dramas with nonsensical plots, a convoluted mess with boring gameplay trow in. And pretty much everything Kojima has said makes me think he is a pretentious twat.

There, got that out of my system.

I'd be really happy if the internet just calmed down about /everything/

Then it wouldn't be the internet

It's more than I'm willing to spend, but thankfully there's this whole "sale" concept that's been floating around lately. It'll be dirt cheap in no time.

sum up the internet is "over inflated sense of entitlement."

if only the internet was just puppy and cat photos.

I am going to pass at first and pick it up for $10 before Phamtom Pain comes out. I honestly don't care what console I play it on. So, whether it is 360, ps3, ps4, or Xbox One, I will be able to shop around.

Actually it should since you get various bonuses for Phantom Pain if you played Ground Zeroes. And I doubt that it does not matter on what console you played Ground Zeroes and the play Phantom Pain. So I would go for a next gen console if you have one at that time.

As for the rest. I payed full price for the Tanker Demo that came with a game and I was glad I did that without touching much of Zone of the Enders. What is important to me is the Quality of the piece I pay for. I pay like 15 Euro for a Cinema ticket with a drink and I will happily play something like Ground Zeroes for 20 or 30€ if the quality is there. Game informer did a video for Grand Zeroes and I think people should watch it to understand what they will get for the price and that the price is not the important thing here.

ITT: internet dwellers complaining about their dwelling.

The disappointment I've heard is just that; disappointment. People aren't saying they shouldn't make a two-to-five hour game, people are saying they shouldn't charge $40 for it. I'm sure there's also disappointment over the fact that it is a two-to-five hour game, but that has more to do with people wanting a new MGS as opposed to what is essentially the Tanker/Virtuous Mission from previous MGS titles sold separately. We still don't know when The Phantom Pain is coming out (I've heard 2015 specifically, but that was awhile ago), and Ground Zeroes was supposed to tide people over until then. Turns out instead of a nice juicy steak we're just getting the tip.

I haven't seen anyone be an asshole over this news; just express their disappointment. If people are seriously resenting other players for being disappointed in the game's length then they should probably follow Jeff's advice in that Tumblr post.

Some of the developers supporting the pricing/game(wish I could find the link now) tried to use Journey as an example of a short game that wasn't ultra cheap. Except Journey takes on average 2-3 hours to complete the main story, and costs $15. That's nearly double the game length for half(or nearly half, depending on whether you're going retail or next gen) the price.

That being said, I do think the pricing is kind of terrible. I am interested in Ground Zeroes, but will probably just wait until it is $10 or less.

There's a difference between a game taking two hours for a player who knows how to play the game to "complete" while ignoring most if not all optional content and a game that takes someone two hours to finish for the very first time. Justifying Ground Zeroes's length by comparing a standard playthrough to speedrun times is really disingenuous.

$40 for a two-hour game is expensive for such a short experience. Even $20 for a two-hour game is asking too much in many people's minds (it was a common criticism of Gone Home), especially when some people are unable to get the digital version. It's definitely a valid criticism of the game. It's not something worth raging over and screaming at the developers for, but at the same time these sorts of justifications for the short length for a $40 game are also silly.

@lilywhite: I was trying to show that length is relative to the player.Also, disingenuous is a pretty strong word for a blog post. I'm not trying to trick people/being paid off.

I'm not justifying the price, I'm explaining why I dont think people should freak out over it.In fact as I said above, if you don't like this don't buy it. Vote. With your wallet.personally I could care less about length, I've played games twice the price that are horrible and way to long. I'm here for a good game. But I totally understand some want more bang for their buck

@oldirtybearon: I don't mind if people think the game is too short or priced too high, its the way some on twitter and comments on some sites have made it seem like this is the most evil thing ever. Its not, and if you don't like it don't buy it. I explained why Im going to buy it, but I totally get those who don't like this idea.

I obviously can't speak for the entirety of the internet, but the discussion I've seen on here and on Twitter regarding Ground Zeroes has been plenty reasonable considering the topic of discussion. And they shouldn't stop; charging between $20-40 to play the "prologue" of a game when complete, lengthier games can be had for less is a new concept that is worthy of prolonged discussion and, in my opinion, heavy criticism.

One thing to keep in mind is that if this strategy succeeds for Konami then every other developer will be looking to do the same thing. So even if we deem Ground Zeroes worthy of the price it is asking, are we ready to drop $20-40 on prologues for every new game in each franchise we follow?

The fact that people are even receptive to the idea is a huge credit to the $10-20 indie games which have made healthy arguments for considering quality over quantity as the primary metric for the value of games.

I wouldn't even pay more than $10 for a 2 hour game. Sorry, but the ratio at which you value price to length to experience or whatever doesn't match mine or anyone else's, so you are in no position to judge whether or not the price is "okay."

Also, comparing the hour count to speedrun records for games is fucking laughable, considering the people who speedrun those games have played them dozens of times just to map out routes alone.

It should be $5 like Dead Rising 2: Case Zero

I guess I'll just buy it when the full game comes out, or whatever.

Well again I think this is an odd thing to really complain about, because we are complaining about the internet complaining. And also a sense of entitlement and indulgence.

Personally for me, I have been saying that this could be short, and you can find it on these forums. So I managed to deal with the news better then anyone else has, and I think the internet will deal with that too.

But again on indulgence, we live in a culture where people do things and they may pay extra just because they want better shirts, eat better meals or just drive better cars. And maybe they have crap shirts, crap foods and shitty gas guzzling cars but it's their right to pay for it if it's got a cute pattern on it. But it's right to buy the stuff they want, it makes them happy so what. I can think of a lot of dumb things I did for star wars, like pay to see Meet Joe Black in theaters just to see the Episode 1 trailer when it already came out on the internet. I don't know why I stayed to watch the weird sleep walking acting of 90s pretentious films?

@ajamafalous: I point speenruns out as a way to show that game length is relative. Depends on the person, so the game could be shorter or much longer, depending on who plays it.

As for price versus length, for me a game like Journey or Gone Home or Jazzpunk show that quality is not directly tied to length.

@cmblasko: I'm fine with the discussion, is totally fair to say " Hey that game is not long enough to be worth x dollars" But when you act like this an terrible evil thing or attack game informer or others over it...it just seems like overkill.Personally I feel if it's half as good as the tanker level, with more options, I'll gladly pay 30$. Others don't agree, that's fine.

Do you really though? That'd be like going to the zoo and watching a cage full of monkeys play chess or talk world politics. No, we want them to fling poo at each other then mock their silliness.

Actually, bad analogy on my part. Monkeys playing chess would be kinda awesome.

People keep referring to the "tanker level". Is that the $50 MGS2 demo that came with a free copy of Zone of the Enders? Is that your touchstone for a great condensed Metal Gear experience?

@darji: I am quite certain that the Phantom Pain will be entirely playable without bonuses earned in Ground Zeroes.

I think the internet should probably relax full stop.

I wouldn't have paid 30 dollars for the Tanker Mission in MGS2. It would have been too little time and content, and I would have been annoyed to have to wait six months to a year for the continuation. Also, I wouldn't want to have two packages and discs for the same game. Changing discs and transporting packages safely is a pain. The extra missions aren't going to influence whether I buy the game when it's complete. That will depend on the main campaign and maybe MGO.

Amazingly enough, this is the first I heard about this. I think it's a bad move, but what do I know. They probably justify it by how much they spent on cutscenes. I just know that I'm not gonna bite for that price.

Agreed.

Of course it will but you will get special benefits from playing Ground Zeroes.

@darji said:

That is fine and good. But, for me personally, I would rather save money on the deal that have extra character skins or weapons. I will play both. I just don't really mind where I do it.

Did you just use speedruns of Dark Souls and Skyrim to justify you post?

Fuck that there is no way I'm reading the rest of this shit.

@halomaste19: Comparing people speedrunning games to what members of the press said it took for them to get through the main story the first time they played the game is laughable (the Skyrim run is glitched as fuck too). Come on. If we're going down that rabbit hole, "speedrunners" at Konami can finish the story in 5 minutes.

Anyways, my problem isn't really with the lenght of the game in itself, but that I don't want this to turn into a trend. We all know that AAA devs are complaining about not getting enough money from sales, so selling a demo for $30 digitally on current gen platforms seems like a great way to fleece their most loyal fanbase. If this catches on, I see devs like Capcom (with the new RE game, maybe, if people are still loyal to that brand after the trainwreck that was RE 6) being more than willing to divide up their own games like this.

And when is it too much by the way? What about $40 for 2 hours and some open world stuff? $50? $60?

And no, I'm not one of those assholes yelling on the internet about this. But people need to be able to say that they think this might be the start of a bad trend without others dismissing it with "OH LOL I WISH THE INTERNET WOULD CALM DOWN!" (that's not directed at you, by the way). That's almost as bad as people blowing this way out of proportion.

People with no intentions of playing Zone of the Enders GLADLY dropped $50/$60 on that game for an hour of MGS2, and promptly played that demo for 9 or 10 hours just because it was so damn fun and revolutionary. I'm willing to bet there will be a ton of MGS fans who do the same with this game, as long as the open world premise delivers on the fundamental change to gameplay Konami is promising.

If you don't like it, then don't get angry about it, just don't buy it. Personally, I'm ok with it.

@amatureidiot: What about not buying it AND criticising it in a civil manner. Is that allowed?

@amyggen: Yeah, sure criticise it. I'm mostly talking to the people who will buy it anyway, thus undermining their argument, and the sort of people who send messages like that to Jeff.

@amatureidiot: The people who send those kinds of messages to Jeff are assholes who shouldn't be made to represent the people who oppose this. This isn't just a case of the internet having to "calm down", like some in this thread seem to think. Anyways, yeah, people who complain about stuff like this and still buys the game are just dumb, and will forever remind me of that COD Steam screengrab.

That is a pretty big price tag for a prologue. Maybe there's a big enough fan base to make that sort of pricing make sense for them, but I'm not in it.

How expensive is Phantom Pain going to be? If it's $60, is it going to be a 3 hour game? It just seems like they are squeezing the die hard fans just because they can. Maybe they're trying to subsidize the cost of Phantom Pain so they don't have to jack up the price there? I dunno. I can see why some people would be upset. Money is tight for a lot of people, and buying a new game at $60 is hard enough as it is.

Then again, I could arguably be described as a yuppie, so what do I know about value propositions?

I have no idea why anyone gets worked up over Metal Gear. It's kind of pathetic how emotionally invested people get over the stupidest game in the universe. If Konami is taking advantage of Metal Gear fans, it's the fans' fault for always showing up for the next bullshit game in this series and loving it.

I actually held off from playing Metal Gear Solid: Peace Walker, because I had a sneaking feeling that Ground Zeroes might be short and/or lacking. (though I didn't anticipate it'd be this short)

So I'm just going to treat it as a shiny-looking bridge between my time with Peace Walker and Phantom Pain.