Why Mass Effect 2 was a disappointment

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FrostedDolphin

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Edited By FrostedDolphin

   Mass Effect 2 wasn't a bad game at all ,It was fun and exciting game . But it was good for the wrong reasons, the first mass effect was a true RPG with a expansive ability chart and assortment of different weapons and loot .However Mass Effect  did have below average shooting mechanics  and  item management was frustrating .You would think the second would be amazing  because all they had to do was tweak a  few flawed  parts of the game.Which they did in mass effect 2, the shooting mechanics are phenomenal. So why is the first one better than? they stripped that game into a another third person shooter, they solved item management by removing items all together so theres no longer a loot system. Bioware also  decide to dumb down the ability tree  so theres almost  no in depth character customization          

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FrostedDolphin

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#1  Edited By FrostedDolphin

   Mass Effect 2 wasn't a bad game at all ,It was fun and exciting game . But it was good for the wrong reasons, the first mass effect was a true RPG with a expansive ability chart and assortment of different weapons and loot .However Mass Effect  did have below average shooting mechanics  and  item management was frustrating .You would think the second would be amazing  because all they had to do was tweak a  few flawed  parts of the game.Which they did in mass effect 2, the shooting mechanics are phenomenal. So why is the first one better than? they stripped that game into a another third person shooter, they solved item management by removing items all together so theres no longer a loot system. Bioware also  decide to dumb down the ability tree  so theres almost  no in depth character customization          

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Sambambo

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#2  Edited By Sambambo

Why it wasnt: I enjoyed it.

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emkeighcameron

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#3  Edited By emkeighcameron

This is a new and novel topic and I am excited to discuss it.

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FrostedDolphin

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#4  Edited By FrostedDolphin
@SuperSambo:  i loved the game but they ddidnt have to remove so many thing from the game
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MystDragon3k

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#5  Edited By MystDragon3k
Welcome to the club
 
You don't give it enough credit though, just because they took out the dull item management and made the level up system more responsive, its the same game with better shooting mechanics. 
 
Now that's not to say I don't want them to bring back some item management and customization...but I think they wanted to focus on the shooting and gameplay and story and character parts of the game for ME2, so they can rely on those for ME3
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BeachThunder

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#6  Edited By BeachThunder
@emkeighcameron said:
" This is a new and novel topic and I am excited to discuss it. "
Oooh, sarcasm.
 
But anyway, I agree, I liked the first one better. Also, the story in ME2 was a bit light.
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TaliciaDragonsong

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#7  Edited By TaliciaDragonsong

Excuse me, but your topic title needs to read: "Why Mass Effect 2 was a dissapointment in my opinion".
 
As I said before, how about we bloody stop giving Bioware flak for this?
They make some of the best games around, have personally never failed me with expectations and so far don't seem like stopping soon.
Go complain about other games that are worth complaining about, the Mass Effects are a bloody work of art.

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FrostedDolphin

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#8  Edited By FrostedDolphin
@MystDragon3k:  I see what your say but  i liked having the option of witch gun i wanted to use  i dont think that the item management was so bad that they had to strip it complety from the game . You didn't find the different upgrades for the guns entertaining 
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pweidman

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#9  Edited By pweidman

I disagree.  They streamlined the game a little admittedly, but I just thought all the changes made the game more interesting, less tedious, and an overall more dynamic experience.  The character focused missions that told backstories more than made up for the more expansive gear and weapon choices from the first game.  And hell, how much was really cut out besides the cumbersome inventory interface problems?  Not really that much.   ME2 had a lot of weapons and ship upgrades, as well as plenty of tech upgrades to find.  I did enjoy the main story from ME1 more though, and I hope ME3's story is more classic sci-fi like the first game.
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FrostedDolphin

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#10  Edited By FrostedDolphin
@TaliciaDragonsong:  It was a great game and i loved it for the story and the dialouge  but it wasent a rpg it was a shooter .Bioware is trying to make mass effect more mainstream as there doing with dragon age 2 which undrestanable from a money view point
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Damien

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#11  Edited By Damien

I too preferred ME1 to ME2.  Just something about it.  It felt right.  That excused the less than perfect gunplay, even though I had no real problems with it, but I can see how others did.  ME2 seemed to lose a lot of the amazing atmosphere from the first.

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FrostedDolphin

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#12  Edited By FrostedDolphin
@pweidman: I agree with that a 100%  but all im saying is i would have perfered a bigger ability tree and items and upgrades more like the first they could have fixed those  much better tjhan they did
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BeachThunder

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#13  Edited By BeachThunder
@TaliciaDragonsong said:
"Excuse me, but your topic title needs to read: "Why Mass Effect 2 was a dissapointment in my opinion".  As I said before, how about we bloody stop giving Bioware flak for this? They make some of the best games around, have personally never failed me with expectations and so far don't seem like stopping soon. Go complain about other games that are worth complaining about, the Mass Effects are a bloody work of art. "
o_o Of course it's his opinion...also, it's not like he's exactly trash talking Bioware or just complaining about Mass Effect. I don't think there's anything wrong with reasonable critique on a game (especially on a website about games), admittedly some parts are worded pejoratively, but overall, I think he does raise valid points. Anyway, it's not like he said it was a bad game - in fact, that's exactly what he said in the first seven words of this thread.
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SpiralStairs

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#14  Edited By SpiralStairs

Mass Effect was boring, and the story was shit. Mass Effect 2 was worse.

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TaliciaDragonsong

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@FrostedDolphin: 
 
No, no, no, no and no.
 
Show me one SHOOTER where they talk this much, have major story decisions, characters to talk with and build up relations with and a bloody mining minigame!
 
Yes it became more streamlined but no that does not make it a shooter. 
They could have done a lot more to make it better, but heck, just go figure what they could do to all those lackluster games out there?
I'm not saying to worship them as gods (well...) but a little respect and faith is in order!
They made some truly great games in terms of gameplay, story and music, not many games can come even close to them.
 
Edit: I don't mean to sound mad, sorry if I do =p
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riffingt0n

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#16  Edited By riffingt0n

It felt like I spent half of my final ME1 playthrough (level 60 + insanity) throwing trash out of my inventory.  I don't begrudge them simplifying this game one bit.  It still felt very tactical in the right ways in terms of character building.
 
My only issue with ME2 given the weight of each 'talent point' was no ability to respec your crew.  Less a problem in ME1 because you had so many points.  Also ME2 encouraged you to vary your crew mission by mission (vs. building a dream team based on combat/tech/biotics ratings) and made the story more interesting.

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NTM

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#17  Edited By NTM

The second was better, but there was still problems with it, whether it be opinion or fact. I still don't think the shooting mechanics were up to snuff even if it were better than the original. But, once you near the end of the game there's something there that made me like the game a lot. It was epic, and I'm not just saying that because that's the only word I can find. It literally was. Yeah though, it was a shooter more so than a RPG if you look at it in that way. But.... so?
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FrostedDolphin

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#18  Edited By FrostedDolphin
@TaliciaDragonsong: Yes I agree with you,But the fact is that they shouldn't have dumb down the ability tree and removed loot and different manufacture of guns ans upgrade s completely 
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CL60

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#19  Edited By CL60
@SpiralStairs said:
" Mass Effect was boring, and the story was shit. Mass Effect 2 was worse. "
Nope.
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TaliciaDragonsong

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@FrostedDolphin: 
 
Yeah I missed the modding of the gun, gave it a little more rpg feel indeed, also not enough weapons and Machine Pistol's were piss.
Besides that I think they delivered a great game, smoother in many ways and the game felt like a whole package to me, everything seemed to fit.
I guess it's not a real rpg if you can't decide what to keep or what to sell =p
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FrostedDolphin

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#21  Edited By FrostedDolphin
@NTM: lmao   I got same feeling at end 
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Bennyishere

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#22  Edited By Bennyishere

I think Mass Effect 1 was better simply because Saren and Sovereign made for far better antagonists than the stupid Collectors. Mass Effect 2 was still great and I don't find any of your points to be significant.

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gamer_152

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#23  Edited By gamer_152  Moderator

I thought Mass Effect was a great game and loved Mass Effect 2. As I posted in another thread I feel like the changes made to the gameplay mechanics between the two games had more to do with streamlining than dumbing down.

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FrostedDolphin

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#24  Edited By FrostedDolphin
@Bennyishere: I meant in more rpg sense
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pweidman

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#25  Edited By pweidman
@SpiralStairs said:
"Mass Effect was boring, and the story was shit. Mass Effect 2 was worse. "

Not.
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lawlerballer

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#26  Edited By lawlerballer
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FrostedDolphin

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#27  Edited By FrostedDolphin
@lawlerballer: lol thanks
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FreakAche

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#28  Edited By FreakAche

 @FrostedDolphin:  
All of the things you're complaining about are still in Mass Effect 2. Also, if your complaints are about lack of a loot system (I don't understand this point because there is still loot in this game) and a slightly dumbed down ability tree, it seems that you're misunderstanding the definition of an RPG.

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FrostedDolphin

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#29  Edited By FrostedDolphin

play mass effect 1  

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gike987

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#30  Edited By gike987
@FreakAche said:

"  @FrostedDolphin:  
All of the things you're complaining about are still in Mass Effect 2. Also, if your complaints are about lack of a loot system (I don't understand this point because there is still loot in this game) and a slightly dumbed down ability tree, it seems that you're misunderstanding the definition of an RPG. "

No it's not. You get new weapons at predefined locations just like in most shooters.  And you get three (four if you play on Hardcore or Insane)  assault rifles over the course of the game, there are pure shooters with more weapons than ME2. 
Unlocking new weapons is not the same thing as loot.
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SpiralStairs

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#31  Edited By SpiralStairs
@CL60 said:
" @SpiralStairs said:
" Mass Effect was boring, and the story was shit. Mass Effect 2 was worse. "
Nope. "
ok
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Aounslaught

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#32  Edited By Aounslaught

I agree with you, but not really because of the game mechanics. The removal of the inventory and the simplifying of the stats tree weren't actually welcome additions for me, but it was whatever. From a pure gameplay perspective, I believe that Mass Effect 2 was a billion times better than Mass Effect 1. 
 
But what Mass Effect 2 lacked was the overall feeling of awe that the first Mass Effect captured so beautifully. The reason why I loved the first Mass Effect was because to me, it was how the '70's thought the future would be like, if that makes any sense to anyone but myself. And I loved that fact. The lens flare, combined with the film grain, with the amazing background score overall, was what MADE Mass Effect great. Everything that Mass Effect did made me believe that, "Yep. We're in the future, alright." Literally, I would just leave the game paused to I could endlessly hear this - 
 
    

  I've never done that with a video game before. Ever. Usually, I just play games with my TV almost on mute. But Mass Effect's music was absolutely brilliant. That's the biggest thing that I felt was missing from Mass Effect 2. While the music was relatively similar, it just didn't bring up the same sorts of feelings that the Mass Effect 1 soundtrack gave me. To me, it just didn't feel "futuristic" enough. 
 
The second thing that hurt the sequel was the removal of film grain. Like I said earlier, I perceived Mass Effect 1 as how the 70's thought that the future was like, and the film grain effect was why I perceived it that way. 
  
Also, they ruined the Citadel. The first time I walked into the Citadel, I was completely awestruck and utterly intimidated at the size of the thing. I really believe it to be one of the very few truly great video game locations, right among Rapture and Pandora's Temple from the first God of War. I get that the Citadel was sort of destroyed at the end of the first one, but come on BioWare. I know for a fact that you can do better than portraying like 3 floors and calling it the Citadel. Hell, the Citadel DESERVES more than that. 
 
Next, the Mako and the whole going down to the planets and exploring them. Now, I know people hate the Mako, but I became really fond of it after I realized what it could and couldn't do. Also, while it was true that there wasn't much to do on most of the planets that you landed on, the simple fact that you could land on that amount of planets gave the first ME a sense of scale that I don't think any other game has captured. The world felt incredibly huge. Most people hated the Mako, but I think I'm not out of line in assuming that just about everyone hated the planet scanning... 
   
Someone also mentioned that Saren and Sovereign were better antagonists than the Collectors. I believe that to be a fairly personal choice, but I do agree Saren and the geth were way cooler enemies than some oversized beetles. Way more interesting too, if you ask me. 
 
~~~ 
 
At the end of the day, these both are video games, and as a video game, I think the mechanics of Mass Effect 2 were more sound and it was just built way better than Mass Effect 1. Better graphics, no frame rate dips, no screen tearing, it was all brilliant. But as an experience from beginning till end, I feel that Mass Effect 1 has the sequel beat. Me personally, the second one just failed to capture the awe and amazement that surrounded the original.  
In the words of Top Gear, I really believe that Mass Effect 1 was the Alfa Romeo of video games. Those who know Top Gear should instantly understand how I feel about Mass Effect 1. Those who don't know Top Gear, I sincerely suggest you go and look up some Top Gear, because it's amazing.
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ArbitraryWater

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#33  Edited By ArbitraryWater

You know, making Mass Effect 2 more of a shooter and less of an RPG was the greatest thing to happen to it. Who gives a damn if the mechanics aren't determined by dice rolls and percentages anymore? It is a significantly better playing game, and if that is at the expense of the first game's attempt at being a hybrid then so be it. If I wanted to play a Bioware RPG with good RPG mechanics, I would play Dragon Age or Baldur's Gate 2.

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Milkman

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#34  Edited By Milkman

Another person complaining about BioWare making Mass Effect 2 more accessible.
 
Move along, move along.

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mazik765

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#35  Edited By mazik765
@FrostedDolphin:  I've played through many other third person shooters and most of them don't involve dialogue trees, an expansive world of lore and customizable characters and party members. I'm pretty certain it's not just another third person shooter.
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Red

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#36  Edited By Red

Mass Effect 2 did give you less customization choices than the first game, yes. But the choices it gave you were a billion times more meaningful. Choosing whether an assault rifle is burst or fully automatic is a much better option than having to waste a lot of time managing loot and equipment to get a weapon with better stats that have unintelligible effects. 
 
 
 
 
I would also like to remind everybody that your opinions aren't fact, and making general statements like "MASS EFFECT 2 SUCKS AND DOESN'T HAVE ANY CUSTOMIZATION" just makes people want to strangle you for being such a freaking moron.

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Pinworm45

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#37  Edited By Pinworm45
@SpiralStairs said:
" Mass Effect was boring, and the story was shit. Mass Effect 2 was worse. "
Would you mind giving an example of a game that had a better story and/or storytelling? I mean, I disagree with your opinion on Mass Effect, but i'm not asking in a doucheymanner, if there's a game that does it better than Mass Effect I'd love to get my hands on it
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Yummylee

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#38  Edited By Yummylee

I wouldn't say it was disappointing for me, just didn't match my initial reaction the original Mass Effect gave me. There is ''alot'' I miss from the original aswell, but ME2 is still a top quality game for me.

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Clinkz

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#39  Edited By Clinkz
@SpiralStairs said:
" Mass Effect was boring, and the story was shit. Mass Effect 2 was worse. "
ME2 was overrated but not worse. ME1 was shit.
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SpiralStairs

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#40  Edited By SpiralStairs
@Clinkz said:
" @SpiralStairs said:
" Mass Effect was boring, and the story was shit. Mass Effect 2 was worse. "
ME2 was overrated but not worse. ME1 was shit. "
It felt like too much of the same thing to me. I think Mass Effect was just way cooler when it came out because it was so new and shiny.
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BraveToaster

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#41  Edited By BraveToaster

Shit hit the fan and there was no time for Shepard to go loot hunting. He only had enough time to assemble his team. He doesn't need a metric fuck ton skill tree because he was already a bad ass.

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FrostedDolphin

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#42  Edited By FrostedDolphin
@Axxol: lmao
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nail1080

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#43  Edited By nail1080

i agree ME2 was a dull shooter, I only cleared it once and am not going to do so again.
 
On the other hand, I cleared ME1 4 times :)

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BraveToaster

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#44  Edited By BraveToaster

For me, if a game has too much loot I waste too much time searching for items that suit my play style. If I spend too much time loot hunting I lose interest and move on to another game. I love me some RPG's, but sometimes the equipment grinding is lengthy and tedious. When I player ME1 I grew impatient and only played through mandatory missions. ME2 was has more of a movie or episodic feel to it, which was pretty cool. I understand why you were disappointed. You expected an rpg with a in-depth equipment system, and a vast amount of weapons to choose from. You're not saying that the game is shit; you're stating that ME2 did not meet your expectations.

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jasta

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#45  Edited By jasta

Even if the shooting was shite (which it wasint) the Story,Setting and Characters was more than enough to keep me playing through the first and the second game. Some folk dig it and some dont. No such thing as a universal opinion.

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schizogony

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#46  Edited By schizogony

Yeah, man, I hope they make it more of an RPG for the third installment.

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dunderri

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#47  Edited By dunderri

Personally, ME2 was far better than the original. I wouldn't call it disappointing since I felt more connected with the universe than I did in ME1. I get the whole dumbed down weapons, upgrades, etc. I like it much more like this though. To me, ME1 had too many customizable options for me. Too many weapons, ammo, etc. to choose from. I didn't know where to start, or even what to invest in. With ME2, it was gone which made my advancement in the game much more easier.
 
Plus, Afterlife was the shit.
 
Edit: the only thing I didn't like with ME2 was all the scanning. Too much scanning and holding down the left trigger. MY INDEX FINGER IS PERMANENTLY BRUISED.

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jasta

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#48  Edited By jasta
@dunderri said:

" Tthe only thing I didn't like with ME2 was all the scanning. Too much scanning and holding down the left trigger. MY INDEX FINGER IS PERMANENTLY BRUISED. "


As tedious as it was I thought it was a really good idea, it seemed relevant to the experience.

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Ashtwin

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#49  Edited By Ashtwin
@dunderri said:
" Personally, ME2 was far better than the original. I wouldn't call it disappointing since I felt more connected with the universe than I did in ME1. I get the whole dumbed down weapons, upgrades, etc. I like it much more like this though. To me, ME1 had too many customizable options for me. Too many weapons, ammo, etc. to choose from. I didn't know where to start, or even what to invest in. With ME2, it was gone which made my advancement in the game much more easier. "
I mean no disrespect to the person I quoted here, but unfortunately its the most recent example for me to use.  Its people like this that caused ME2 to play so radically different from the first game.  Alot of people came into ME1 expecting a shooter and instead got a RPG.  So they all said the shooting mechanics "sucked" and the leveling up was over complicated.  
 
Unfortunately for those of us that knew what ME1 was before we bought it something major happened.  EA bought Bioware after ME1 came out.  EA doesnt care that Bioware has a reputation with RPG's.  You cant deny that they put pressure on Bioware to make ME2 a dumbed down RPG......oh sorry I mean more "accessable" and  "streamlined".
 
I can understand removing of the loot from the first game.  It didnt REALLY add anything and 3/4 of the way through your first playthrough you were either selling everything you picked up or turning it into omni-gel.  I can understand reducing the number of weapons because lets face it, we all went straight for the Spectre weapons in the first game.   The early weapons were place holders until we got the Spectre weapons.  Once we got those, nothing else was worth using.
 
What I cant understand or forgive is what they did to the skill system.  In the first game it was a bit overwhelming at first, especially if youve never played a RPG before.  But what was so hard about picking a weapon to focus on just like in ME2?  You had to actually read what you skills did and how best to use them.  Thats part of the RPG experience.  I can understand improving the shooting, because thats the combat.  But dumbing down the RPG mechanics because the pure shooter groupies can figure out how RPGs work?  C'mon.  In ME1, every skill point had value, it did SOMETHING.  If it wasnt improving a skill flatout, it was giving passive bonuses to make your other skills or your character outright stronger.  In ME2, if you dont spend your points the right way, youre stuck with left over points that just sit there because they cant be spent.  For a company that built their reputation on RPG's, thats unforgivable, its almost amatuerish.
 
You spend the entire game collecting squadmates while being give the illusion of non-linearity.  After every couple characters you pick up, you get shoehorned into a mission you cant put off or postpone to do some sidequests.  There is one exception to this, and the game punishes you for going on sidequests and trying to get your team prepared for the final stretch of the game.
 
If I didnt know any better, I wouldve sworn that Bioware did not make this game.  As far as their line up goes, this title is the most disappointing.  Those that have been playing Bioware games since the days they were working with Black Isle know this.  The ones that dont see this are the ones that came in with ME1 expecting a TPS and got what they were wanting in ME2.
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Atlas

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#50  Edited By Atlas

Mass Effect 2 was a game I liked much less after I was finished. At the time it was amazing, but because it's not a proper RPG it doesn't have the replayability you expect from the genre. Once you've seen the story once, you're pretty much good. To put that into perspective, a few months ago I was undecided on what game to play and decided to do a third Dragon Age playthrough instead of a second ME2 playthrough. Which surely means Dragon Age is 50% better than Mass Effect 2. MATH.
 
That said, ME2 is objectively amazing. It's just not what I wanted from a Mass Effect sequel, in hindsight, and Dragon Age is still the winner in my heart.