The uphill struggle (aka business on the internet)

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Suicrat

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#1  Edited By Suicrat

It's been 53 weeks since this website became a website, and it is really remarkable seeing the transformation of this idea from a Skype-based podcast of two dudes trying to motivate eachother out of unemployment to what looks set to become a viable advertising model in the not-too-distant future.

Giantbomb has close to 47 000 registered users, and draws in a daily average of close to 25 000 people. But that is a candle in the sun compared to the bigger video game websites out there.

No Caption Provided
In fairness to Giantbomb, they've only had a year, and they've grown almost entirely on the back of word-of-mouth buzz. Whereas Kotaku has been around longer, IGN has Fox and NewsCorp to help promote it, Gamespot has CBS backing up its play (which might indicate a conflict of interest when it comes to coverage of Sony, but I wouldn't go so far).

What do you think Giantbomb can do to make a dent in these numbers? How many people have checked out (or even signed up to) the site because of what you've showed them?
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keyhunter

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#2  Edited By keyhunter

Giant bomb might be a little too personal for most people.
Generally a person just wants to go on a videogame website, and see a number between 1 and 10, and call it a day. Giantbomb obviously doesn't have the staff to review every last game the day it comes out and give it that number between one and ten people care about.

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Suicrat

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#3  Edited By Suicrat
@keyhunter: Okay, so it's not set to take on IGN or Gamespot any time soon, but do you think they can catch the likes of Kotaku?

Also, I was looking at it, and Penny-Arcade draws a daily average of close to 800k. I guess that's in line with the quick hit in the daily routine, but still. Don't you think the people who like PA would also like the sort of coverage provided by Jeff, Vinny, Ryan, Brad, et. al?
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phlegms

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#4  Edited By phlegms

I say we make the GB crew wear skimpier, more evocative clothing.
Hot Pants and Glitter will most definitely help.

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#5  Edited By jkz

GB is MUCH more community oriented than others, and I think that's key. With IGN and Gamespot's positions as purely news orginizations, and Kotaku somewhere between them and GB, I'd say that they have the advantage in sheer information available. I still go to kotaku/joystiq for my news, but I always end up back at GB because of the community. In all honesty, I think that the community aspect is a blessing, and while it may keep the site smaller than the likes of Gamespot and IGN, it ensures a more personal and, in my opinion, enjoyable experience than is available on other sites.

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Suicrat

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#6  Edited By Suicrat
@phlegms: You've got a taco avatar and your screen name is phlegms. More people need to listen to your business advice! :p

I kid. I kid because I love.



Or some shit.
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keyhunter

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#7  Edited By keyhunter

I imagine putting the Giantbomb app commercial on TV would do the trick.

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#8  Edited By jkz
@keyhunter said:
" I imagine putting the Giantbomb app commercial on TV would do the trick. "
Oh god, think of the possibilities...
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Benjaminvdv

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#9  Edited By Benjaminvdv

Yes Giantbomb simply can't offer you everything you need, still that's not a issue, whether a site is big or small, advertisers will still pay depending on the amount of traffic etc, ofcourse certain aspects could cause advertisers to go away (like discussing or offering illegal content), on the other side advertisers will value page visits more on sites like this where people will spend 10 minutes watching a report or review.

All in all this site should do fine with the proper advertising, ofcourse I have no idea how well they are doing it right now, the site looks really clean like this, I just hope they are atleast breaking even on it.

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Suicrat

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#10  Edited By Suicrat
@jukezypoo: Well, since it's a community-focused site, do you think the guys should do more to cultivate business opportunities from within the community? The t-shirt contest and question of the week are good starting points. But are there other things they could pursue?
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Suicrat

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#11  Edited By Suicrat
@Benjaminvdv: I think they're mostly in the market-test phase, so Whiskey's probably giving them the chance to grow their site before pulling the plug. The banners for the Giant Bomb app were probably testing users' propensity to click cheesy ads.
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jkz

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#12  Edited By jkz
@Suicrat: I would respond, but any attempts to stimulate my brain are met with cold disdain....it was a long day at the office

But yes, I do believe that doing more meet-ups and doing more selling of merchandise would be a good step.
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#13  Edited By phlegms
@Suicrat: My business advice is gospel!
I'm like the internet business advice version of Dr. Phil. Except I don't go home after every show and furiously masturbate over photos of young Vietnamese boys.......

Wait what was I saying?

Oh yeah, my 5 step business plan is as follows;

1. Glitter
2. Hot Pants
3. ????
4. Profit
5. A range of shark or panda based energy drinks.
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Suicrat

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#14  Edited By Suicrat
@phlegms: You need to rid your research firm of underpants gnomes. They'll start finishing their 5-step proposals.
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StarFoxA

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#15  Edited By StarFoxA

Giant Bomb is doing a lot better than their sister sites Comic Vine and Anime Vice, though.

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Suicrat

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#16  Edited By Suicrat
@StarFoxA: That's true. I was just about to post the following graph actually.

No Caption Provided


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StarFoxA

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#17  Edited By StarFoxA
@Suicrat: Comic Vine had a spike earlier. That must have been Comic Con.
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Suicrat

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#18  Edited By Suicrat
@StarFoxA: Don't think so, I think the last vertical divider represents the beginning of July, meaning that spike happened in June.
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Stang

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#19  Edited By Stang

Giant Bomb has more personality then all those other sites combined. I have no doubt that in due time Giant Bomb will rule the world.

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deactivated-5c5cdba6e0b96

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Giantbomb kicks all other asses and will soon follow along as more and more people find out about the site, I kind of like us being a little underground, gives us a little bit more of a close knit community, and even if it stays that way I would be perfectly fine.

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#21  Edited By Scooper

I don't think they're aiming for those other guys. They have alot of views which means more advertising $ but at the same time they've got many more people to give pay checks. The great things about a site like GiantBomb is because they're not 40 people in a huge office, they have much lower overhead, that means they need less $ to pay the bills. I'm sure they wouldn't mind it though because I doubt they're even making enough money to cover their backs at the moment. But hey, it won't stop them. I'm sure of that.

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ieatlions

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#22  Edited By ieatlions
@Scooper said:
" I don't think they're aiming for those other guys. They have alot of views which means more advertising $ but at the same time they've got many more people to give pay checks. The great things about a site like GiantBomb is because they're not 40 people in a huge office, they have much lower overhead, that means they need less $ to pay the bills. I'm sure they wouldn't mind it though because I doubt they're even making enough money to cover their backs at the moment. But hey, it won't stop them. I'm sure of that. "

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#23  Edited By natetodamax

If Giant Bomb ever reached a million users, I would probably leave. I love how community driven the site is, it's all personal, and the people that use the site are wonderful. I would hate it if it got too crowded.

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#24  Edited By Agnogenic_delete
@natetodamax: I don't know if I would leave but I would probably take a step back from the forums. I love all the main users here on GB.
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#25  Edited By Video_Game_King

I haven't really told anybody about the site, so that may be part of the problem. The other part may be that it's young, by which I mean "give it time."

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#26  Edited By Brendan
@natetodamax:
Growth is capitalism.  You sir, are a communist. ;P jk

In all seriouseness though, does anyone remember Gamespot in the late 90's?  It was tiny.  Growth takes a few years (or a buyout of course) for most companies.
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Suicrat

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#27  Edited By Suicrat

First of all, I don't think they can catch up to Gamespot and IGN. As I said, those sites are backed by huge media companies and thus have far more cross-promotion opportunities. That doesn't mean the producers (and the backers) of this site don't want to grow.

Second of all, they don't have to replicate the bigger sites in order to grow. As jukez pointed out earlier, they can find community-focused ways of making money, as well as adhering to their unique style (which I love and would never want to change ever, by the way) while still reaching new people. I'm sure we all know several people who might potentially dig Giant Bomb's craziness, but have we all exposed these people to said craziness?

You don't necessarily have to 'sell out' (godlessness I hate that phrase) in order to make money, you know.

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Hamst3r

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#28  Edited By Hamst3r

Giantbomb is about even with Destructoid on the Quantcast charts. :D
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#30  Edited By Absurd
@Hamst3r said:
" Giantbomb is about even with Destructoid on the Quantcast charts. :D "
Hey,  I was right about to go check that out.
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#31  Edited By DanielJW

Well I know I like coming to the forums because I see familiar names all the time, so getting crowded would be a downside for me, but as previously stated I'd just step back from the forums a bit. 


I don't mind if the site gets bigger, as long as the content doesn't change. I think we're all here because of how personal and sporadic the site's content is, and that really adds to the experience. The community really adds to it, at least for me, but if growth is needed to keep the site alive, I'd be willing to stick out the trolls and the jerks to enjoy the content and have some conversation with the regulars. 

Again I love the site the way it is, but as long as the content remains as is and doesn't change to try and appeal to a mass audience, than I will continue to love this site.
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Suicrat

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#32  Edited By Suicrat
@DanielJW: I think that Jeff and friends realize that changing their style would alienate their current fans, but not win them any new ones. After all, the market's pretty flooded with generic video game coverage.
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#33  Edited By DanielJW
@Suicrat: Well your right, which is why I think I'm gonna be here for a long time. I think I'd rather see the site go down than have it become a one of those generic sites that are cluttered up messes of ads and quick, impersonal content.
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#34  Edited By Wolverine

Giant Bomb needs to review more of a variety of games. Maybe they should hire more editors to be able to handle to work load.

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#35  Edited By Suicrat
@DanielJW: Ads are inevitible, but hopefully Whiskey and their advertisers will take steps to understand their audience. The fact that their "Quantified" is a hopeful sign in that regard in my opinion.
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#36  Edited By DanielJW
@Suicrat: What they've had on here is fine with me, they fits in to the site, and they arent' in intrusive places. Once ads start popping up and making me close them, or when they grow 10 times in size when my mouse is close by, then I get annoyed. Anything thats going to significantly distract me when I open a web page isn't too nice. I mean I know ads are meant to draw eyes, but it gets ridiculous when I click a link to an article and I get a new window with an ad in it.



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Suicrat

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#37  Edited By Suicrat
@DanielJW: I think they'll go for more subtlety than that. While their ad site has prices for a skinning of their site, I doubt they'll make that sale too often. I think you'll see more stuff like the World at War downloadable content segment of the Bombcast and less "YOU WON A MILLION DOLLARS! CLICK TO CLAIM YOUR PRI$E!"
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#38  Edited By DanielJW
@Suicrat: Mhm, and I'm ok with that. As long as I'm not winning any Spanish National Lotteries by visiting GB, than I'm cool.
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#39  Edited By Cassita

Noob question: How does Giant Bomb make money? I've never seen any ads or anything of the sort, and I know they said they will never do a paid user service.

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#40  Edited By Benjaminvdv
@Suicrat said:
" @DanielJW: I think they'll go for more subtlety than that. While their ad site has prices for a skinning of their site, I doubt they'll make that sale too often. I think you'll see more stuff like the World at War downloadable content segment of the Bombcast and less "YOU WON A MILLION DOLLARS! CLICK TO CLAIM YOUR PRI$E!" "
I heard they made an exclusive deal for skinning the site after the next Kane and Lynch, ofcourse the game will get 5 stars with circles around it. ;)

Anyway, yeah the bigger a site gets, the worse it gets in the sense that it's hard to keep a real community feeling to it, then again when you speak about your annoyance about a game that is less popular, people will still respond to it. ;)

Personally I've left more messages on this site in the past week or so, then I have in the last couple of years on GameSpot, I only posted there when I wanted to know something, answered some questions while looking for my own answers to my questions, besides that I simply could not be bothered, you leave a message on a article that is flooded with ignorant fanboys and it's on the 10th page the next day.

It's not all bad ofcourse, the amount info you can find on big sites is incredible, but if you want to talk games, then it's completely useless. Right now I simply check the games here, if I don't find enough info then I'll just check GameSpot.
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Suicrat

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#41  Edited By Suicrat
@Benjaminvdv: I don't understand why people think that if they get more people to visit the site then Giant Bomb will cease to be what it is. It's a total logical fallacy. Secondly, like I said, they actually do have prices for skinning the entire site, skinning the video page, appearances/mentions on the Bombcast, et cetera. They want to make money, but they're not going to switch strategies to go about doing it. They've made a bet (and Whiskey Media has backed them up) that there's enough people on the internet who like video games, and who like crazy shit to build an advertising medium out of their website. I don't know why everyone has to launch these doomsday scenarios whenever it comes to discussing the commercial prospects of this site. "OMG It'llbe like youtube comments except with a black background". It doesn't necessarily have to be like that, and it probably won't.

After all, close to 25 000 people visit this site every day, yet somehow it still feels "intimate" to you, doesn't it? That's already a shitload of people, but no loss of "community"? Is there?
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Suicrat

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#42  Edited By Suicrat
@Cassita: They're more in the generating buzz, and building the user-base phase. They put the producer of the WaW DLC on the first part of a Bombcast a few weeks back, they've got the iPhone App, and every now and then you'll see a banner. I saw one for the Watchmen Interactive Graphic Novel last year, and some sort of Tekken6 preorder bonus a few months ago.

But like I said, at the moment, it's more about generating users and pageviews.
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#43  Edited By Benjaminvdv
@Suicrat: The skinning of the site was a joke, as indicated by the Kane and Lynch story. ;)


Still like I said, the bigger a site gets, the worst the community gets, I'm not saying it will be crap, but it's simple logic, the bigger it gets, the less personal it gets, I'm sure the site has a high ratio of active forum members considering the amount of people registered, but if this site was 10 times as big then you can't tell me that there would be atleast 4 times as many members, probably even more, so it wouldn't be as personal at all.

It's simply how it works, I've been a longtime member on a site which has over 1 million members, quite a lot that are active, and things are different compared to the early days, that's fine, but it doesn't change the reality.
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Suicrat

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#44  Edited By Suicrat
@Benjaminvdv: But like I said, it's not a joke. They actually will do it if someone pays them to, they'll probably try to determine beforehand if it's the kind of thing that will actually get a positive reception with the userbase.

And okay, so you think that having 100 000 daily visitors will somehow make this site less intimate? I mean, come on. 25 000 PEOPLE VISIT THIS SITE EVERY DAY! DO YOU TALK TO ALL OF THEM? NO! So how will a larger number affect that? The mods will continue to lock spam posts, and the users will continue to call people out on their shit when they make questionable forum posts, none of this has to change if Giant Bomb can find a way to make some money, if they keep the strategy they have now.
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hockeymask27

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#45  Edited By hockeymask27

its not about the number of visitors its about the awesomeness of the site.

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Suicrat

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#46  Edited By Suicrat
@Hockeymask27: Awesomeness can't be monetized unless the users are willing to pay for it. Which, we're not. So they have to figure out other ways of making money. They can still be awesome and grow their userbase. Why do these two things have to be mutually exclusive? I don't fucking get it.
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hockeymask27

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#47  Edited By hockeymask27

no doubt I'm just saying that a little bit of ads never killed anyone so when that days comes i will understand. but for now i tip my hat at this virtually ad free kick ass site.

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#48  Edited By Benjaminvdv
@Suicrat said:
" @Benjaminvdv: But like I said, it's not a joke. They actually will do it if someone pays them to, they'll probably try to determine beforehand if it's the kind of thing that will actually get a positive reception with the userbase.And okay, so you think that having 100 000 daily visitors will somehow make this site less intimate? I mean, come on. 25 000 PEOPLE VISIT THIS SITE EVERY DAY! DO YOU TALK TO ALL OF THEM? NO! So how will a larger number affect that? The mods will continue to lock spam posts, and the users will continue to call people out on their shit when they make questionable forum posts, none of this has to change if Giant Bomb can find a way to make some money, if they keep the strategy they have now. "
A joke as in that I know they offer it, but my comment was meant as a joke that the site will be skinned in Kane and Lynch... you do know that the rumor is that Jeff got fired for giving it a bad review after GameSpot got paid shitloads for their whole site being skinned for that game...

100.000 daily visitors is not 250.000.
No I don't talk to any of them, but you do understand that if right now 5% is active (I doubt it's that high, but still), that would mean there are 1250 people active on the boards, if we had 250k visitors and 5% was active that there would be 12.500 people active on these boards...

It's not the thousands of people who just read and view the site, but it's about the people who post on them and when the size of the site increases, so will the amount of people who post here...
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tekmojo

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#49  Edited By tekmojo

When they are ready to expand they will, seems like the crew are really ramping up their contacts and associates throughout the past year.

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Suicrat

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#50  Edited By Suicrat
@Benjaminvdv: Yes I'm aware of the K&L situation. I was a long-time listener to the Hotspot when it happened. Anyways, think about a site like Penny Arcade. They get 2 million daily visitors worldwide, and people who hang out in those forums tell me the community is close-knit, and it hasn't diminished with the increase in popularity.