Quick Look: EX: Shadowgate

I thought Dan and Brad had relevant questions about the making of this game, how it worked (especially for non-adventure fans thanks Dan) and the original (thanks Brad)

A great part of this Quick Look for me was learning about the history of a game and hearing from the creative. NES were not really a thing here in New Zealand so it is nice to learn.

I thought Dan and Brad had relevant questions about the making of this game, how it worked (especially for non-adventure fans thanks Dan) and the original (thanks Brad)

A great part of this Quick Look for me was learning about the history of a game and hearing from the creative. NES were not really a thing here in New Zealand so it is nice to learn.

Great game.

Although some of the comments on here starting to remind me of Youtube.... how disappointing.

I loved the original NES port and am so excited to play this (with retro sound turned on) around Halloween! I have severe arachnophobia, so the frozen ceiling spider set my nerves on edge... I don't think it was in the original, so I'm curious how it'll play into this version.

Fuck yeah. I played this when I was a kid on an old computer.

I don't think I can handle a new Uninvited... that game scared the shit out of me when I was young.

@raven10: I disagree. As I remember the game has a ton of objects and if I have to wait for a radial command system to pop up every time I might lose my mind. Having the commands available at all times is good and I think he mentioned key binds which makes the radial thing even less important. As far as commands, I don't want a limited subset for each object - cause that just gives everything away and limits what I might want to try to do. Also, there was no walk command, just an arrow for going backwards.

@babayaga: There is a move command on screen. Go to 40 minutes in where they play the original game. Even the developer said that the controls in the old version were awful. Now maybe some of the old versions had a different UI, but since, again, as stated by the developer in this video, the NES one is the one everyone remembers, I doubt that really matters to most people.

As for the radial menu, Daedalic uses one in many of their games. It doesn't take any more time than this interface. You just hold down the button for half a second, and a menu pops up where you choose what to do. It keeps the screen free of clutter and you don't have to click multiple buttons to interact with the object, making the entire process faster. They also have included a system where you can scroll through the interactions possible with the mouse wheel. That system would definitely be faster than clicking a button and then mousing over the object and then rinsing and repeating 8 times.

Finally, I'm not saying to limit things so much that you immediately know what to do. I am saying that you don't need both an open and a close button for example. If the thing is opened then hitting the button should close it. If it is closed then hitting the button should open it. That isn't limiting your options. Doors and boxes and such are either closed or opened. It's an either or situation. You can't open and opened door, nor can you close a closed one. Furthermore, you can't take a door. You can't use a door beyond opening it. You can't eat it. In fact the only three things you could do to a door are open/close it, hit it, or talk to it. The same basic principle holds true for almost every object in an adventure game. 95% of these objects can only be used in a single way. So a single use button should suffice. No need to choose open, close, or use. And virtually every modern adventure game lets you use the left mouse button to use and the right mouse button to look. If you want to add eat, talk, and hit to that then fine. But have those things be dedicated buttons. If I click on a lever I either want to pull it or look at it. The game can be intelligent enough to know that I don't want to eat or talk to a lever. In fact unless there is a situation where you need to eat something without opening the inventory screen then don't include that button on the main screen. Have it as part of my inventory screen. There are just tons of ways to design a UI that are both more functional and more visually appealing than this that don't in any way sacrifice depth.

If people really want all those boxes on screen for nostalgia purposes or whatever then they can include it as one of the retro options, but right now this game looks like it will solely appeal to fans of the original, which is a direct contradiction to what the developer was saying. Making the game stupid easy won't bring in new fans. Making a UI that at least takes into account some of the massive improvements made in UI design over the past 30 years will.

I didn't play much of the NES version or the Mac/ PC version back in the day, but i'm very excited to play this come August.

Very pumped about this game and glad to see these types of first-person games coming back! I am a fan of the original and love all the new stuff and some of the shortcuts they are adding - key binds and locking commands for fast use. I also like the idea of achievements as well. Can't wait!

Watching this reminded me why I enjoyed the NES version so much! Looks fantastic!

I checked out the dev's website to see if there were any pre-order bonuses. It turns out there are three tiers to purchase, so I signed up for the Hero package to get into the beta and receive wallpapers, an artbook, a soundtrack and more. Though the dev said the game would be $20 in the QL, you can pre-order it for $15.

@nero42: I'm excited to see Brad talk about something not related to DOTA2.

Now a DejaVu remake I WOULD PLAY!!!!!!

I read an interview that said they would re-make/re-imagine Deja Vu and Uninvited eventually if Shadowgate did well... (Fingers crossed!)

I have little love for the original Shadowgate, what with its arbitrary, no-warning, no-way-out deaths and puzzles which require you to be telepathic and/or buy a Strategey Guide to progress past the first couple of screens -- BUT it's great to see the original programmers go back and refine this game.

Also, the Gentleman Gamer had a Let's Play Shadowgate series a while back which was funny and informative.

Game Text: "Gritting your teeth, you swear by your God's name..."

TGG: "By, uh, Yahweh!"

Holy crap, did he just suggest that there is potential for more Deja Vu? Ace Harding returns!!

Brad's awesome for being a Shadowgate fanboy. Made this more enjoyable to watch. New game looks nice. Hopefully it has a decent chunk of content to it. I really want them to make that Beyond Shadowgate sequel.

Want!

I only remember wishing I was allowed to swear when I played the NES version all those years ago. Never before has a game made me feel so stupid. So, naturally, I'm going to get it again. If for nothing else then how death looks like a disapproving parent in those end game screens.

@razielcuts said:

I also get the sense he expects a steep learning curve for his audience. It's 2014 yo, and this is a game that still distinguishes the commands of Open, Close, and Use. As though there was more than one useful thing to do with any given state of a box or door. (Hint: there wasn't.) It is a crappy trope of design to obfuscate what you can do with an object, in order to feign complexity. "Stumpers" in text adventures were especially guilty of this; I can still remember some bad Infocom ones.

I seem to remember during the Monkey Island Remake commentary, Tim and Ron made a similar comment about how adventure games became more streamlined and intuitive as actions were reduced (I think the formal term is remediation). What else do you want to do with a closed door, forfucksakes? And yet they found funny ways to play into this, like the huge door with a hundred locks that has a smaller door you just step through.

I dunno man, there's a thin line between nostalgia and deliberately wasting the player's time. Please see King's Quest V and the first game's remake. for designers beginning to recognise this. (Here's an excellent article discussing UI remediation, see Figure 11.)