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Avatar image for tabitha07
#51 Edited by tabitha07 (1 posts) -

i am really disturbed that this conversation is even being had in the first place. The reasons why the empire is evil include 1. zero accountability to the people because even when the imperial senate existed it had zero actual power 2. the suppression of free trade and free speech for example in inferno squad we learn even saying something bad about the empire can earn you lifetime imprisonment also the holonet is heavily censured 3. genocide on races like the geonosians 4. slavery on races like the wookies and the bodachi which we learned about in lost stars 5. subjegation on worlds with no regard for the citizens or environment for example on lothal, jelucan, and wobani 6. most of all the destruction of alderan and jedha city killing billions of innocent men women and children that did nothing to deserve death. to address the point that ''the republic wasnt much better'' no the republic was not perfect especially shortly before and during the clone wars corruption and bureaucracy were like a cancer eating away at the heart of the republic and yes slavery on planets like tattoine was allowed to continue but the republic was nowhere near as evil as the empire. The republic didnt build a planet destroying super weapon then use it to blow up a planet and a city killing billions of innocent men women and children and the republic didn't subjugate entire worlds like the empire. to address the idea that luke should not have blown up the death star 1. the death star was a legitimate military target 2. the death star was seconds away from destroying yavin 4 and the rebels opposing a fascist tyrannical regime does not mean they deserved to die on yavin 4 and if the rebellion had allowed the death star to remain the empire could have used it to blow up more planets killing millions more innocent civilians

Avatar image for whitestripes09
#52 Posted by Whitestripes09 (910 posts) -

I always assumed a regime controlled by a power hungry dictator that called for the death of an entire opposing religious group of people were considered bad, but I guess everyone has a different moral compass.

Avatar image for darkeyehails
#53 Posted by DarkeyeHails (538 posts) -

Better question: Given that the films have established how obviously incompetent The Rebellion is, why should we care about their plight?

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#54 Posted by burncoat (478 posts) -

@darkeyehails: "Why should we care about the people fighting against a military force that has committed genocide on a galactic scale when they're outmatched most of the time?"

Should they just go home and reserve themselves to their fate? This is in contention for the worst point in this topic.

Avatar image for relenus
#55 Posted by Relenus (220 posts) -

If you wanna take SWTOR as still-established-canon, the Sith Empire (which was pretty much the exact 1:1 template Palpatine used to reorganize the Republic into) straight up collapsed under its own weight because when you have a society built all around self-success at the expense of others and isolating any potential external allies, turns out it's only a matter of time before your empire rips itself apart.

Also genocide is bad, kids.

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#56 Edited by Blackout62 (2169 posts) -
@soulcake said:

The 501 was littarly a Division in the third reich (the nazi's ) if i remember corretly.

Other way around. The 501st was a US paratrooper regiment that the founder of the 501st's father served in. Yeah I don't get how naming your group of people cosplaying as the bad guys is honoring your father's service either.

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#57 Posted by bybeach (6236 posts) -

Except for an obvious reason (it's the villain in a movie) I am surprised the empire is so overtly evil. You have an Emperor with white mascara rubbed all over his face, and his right hand man wearing an oversized Nazi Helmut. In reality, it would be as other posters have mentioned, most likely a ruling faction representing the rich and powerful, who's value is recognizable to the Empire. And combined with the efficient control over vast light years of planet systems, populations, and trade/manufacture. Except for slavery, say the Wookies and other 10th grade citizens terrorized and conditioned by brutality into how the Empire perceived them and thus justified their slavery, the average citizen instead would have 'rights of citizenship', and most likely an okay economic existence. Even with some ability to climb the economic ladder. The Empire would not be interested in abject misery, only abject compliance. The watch phrase , Rule of Law, would be the term all would understand. This would to great deal suppress the need for insurrection and deviant thinking. The irony might be that their immediate rivals, the other party presently on the outs, might only be different from them by degree, rather than an absolute force for justice and true liberty. Not sure I trust a group with royalty included.

I know I should leave it there.

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#58 Edited by Bill_McNeal (779 posts) -

The jedi order was asking to be killed. From the movies I gather they were a group of idiots.

The Jedi were a bunch of proactive self-appointed Space Cops that doled out justice as they saw fit using Space Magic. They were not held accountable for their actions and there was no jurisdiction. They could come and go as freely as they wanted and would interject themselves into a conflict without being asked. They abducted children. They were manipulative. Blind to the goings on around them.

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#59 Edited by Jaalmo (1723 posts) -

A lot of it was probably explained in the now non-canon expanded universe. Just assume whatever has been said about them before is true today because Disney has no plans to explain anything that happens in their movies.

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#60 Posted by Rahf (443 posts) -

@blackout62: Perhaps because not all people choose to plummet into the meaning of things, instead enjoying fandom and the connection people make through shared experiences. While I understand the desire for discourse, not every act has to stand up under a college-level analysis.

Avatar image for opusofthemagnum
#61 Posted by OpusOfTheMagnum (647 posts) -

I think most people are missing the actual question here but let me provide you a little context: when we were trying to get guys like Saddam and Bin Laden, why did we fight their forces? Two reasons: they carried out the crimes they were ordered to commit and they stood between us and our targets. Bin Laden especially was a tiny, incredibly difficult target to even find much less engage. His forces however were plentiful and relatively easy to find and engage. And you're talking about a coalition of some of the most powerful military forces in the world. Now imagine you didn't even have the ability to go where your target is.

Also, a lot of the fighting is defensive or in reaction to aggression. The stormtroopers are also either cloned or brainwashed for the express purpose of carrying out the regime's orders. There's not much room for good guys as a result. Compared to german forces in WW2 for example who had more free will in some cases and exercised it to not be evil.

Amd the jedi aren't all that great either, IMO there are troubling aspects to their order, even if you buy into the idea that they are altruistic.

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#62 Posted by soulcake (2217 posts) -

@blackout62: Maybe the biggest link of them all was when The German Reich introduced "SturmTruppe" aka. Stromtroopers in WWI.