Why are people so down on this game now?

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supermonkey122

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In the first few weeks after this game came out, people were treating it like it was the second coming of Jesus, and now it seems like everyone (at least on this site) have turned on it. What happened? I for one still think it is one of the best games ever made.

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TravisRex

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Fun to play, relatively poor story, people really dislike the fob/resource patches that came out over time

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BoccKob

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I dunno, I've never had an experience like this with a game before. I'd say through the first 50 hours or so I was having a blast with the AI, game mechanics, and weapons. The soundtrack in particular is superb. Not the licensed songs, but the actual score they composed for the game is so perfectly 80's movie. But every so often I'd hit a snag that would dampen my excitement a little. Like every main mission seemed to have restrictions to cut down on player freedom when I was so used to just running around doing what I pleased how I pleased. Nearly all of them were resolved by attaching a balloon to something.

Weapons and equipment were starting to cost more and more resources and taking time to research. The few characters in the game were completely flat, had no growth, no characterization, no nothing. The plot was completely stupid. Even by Metal Gear standards, even by video game standards, it was complete garbage. All the conversation tapes were completely dry and belabored the same handful of stupid points over and over. Eventually it all became one huge slog.

Steam says I spent 84 hours playing the thing, but by the end I was completely sick of it and uninstalled before I finished the last couple of missions. I don't even know the full details of the "big twist" because I completely stopped caring and figured even knowing would probably annoy me further with how crappy all the explanations were. In terms of pure gameplay, it's maybe the most I've ever enjoyed a game, but because of how much I disliked just about everything else around it, I never want to play it again.

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Slag

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That's what kinda happens when a game or anything gets crazy popular. It invariably starts attracting backlash from people sick of the ubiquitous praise. Anything under an intense microscope is going to have flaws. And to be fair there are elements in the game (or not in the game) that very easily could potentially bother somebody, especially those who have a strong conception of what makes a Metal Gear game a Metal Gear game.

Konami hasn't helped things either with their Micro Transaction shenanigan patches.

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onarum

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Idk, for me the second half of the game is just so much worse.. like 80% of enemies wearing full riot suits, so they are pretty much impervious to anything but high explosives or CQC, development costs/ base expansions and such requirements become quite silly, everything just becomes such a chore...

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Fredchuckdave

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Really damn good game but it isn't the Witcher 3. The patches are kind of hilarious thus far; you can pretty much buy a mother base staff of all S+'s if you want now.

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AlexW00d

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They're not, they're just not being drowned out by everyone who is singing it's praises. Happens with pretty much all games.

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ShaggE

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#8  Edited By ShaggE

I still love it as much as ever, but I get where the negativity is coming from. As for the delayed reaction, remember that a lot of things have changed since release, plus this is a very long game that drops quite a few things on players near the end that are likely to cause some heated opinions.

And then of course there's the ever-present "Things aren't allowed to be good" folks, but that's a given for any game.

Edit: Aternate reply: Who knows? Not me. I never lost control (over my enjoyment of this game, that is! Waka waka!)

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ThatAintFalco

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#9  Edited By ThatAintFalco

The more you play of it, the less exciting it is. It's still a fun game that I love to play but like others said, the progression really slows down later on and everything feels repetetive.

I'm probably going to start using cheat engine because I'm just not having fun waiting nearly an hour for development. I really don't understand that design choice.

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spraynardtatum

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It's one of the best games I've ever played.

The microtransaction stuff is highly disappointing to me but it is without a doubt one of my favorite games ever.

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GERALTITUDE

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#11  Edited By GERALTITUDE
@spraynardtatum said:

It's one of the best games I've ever played.

The microtransaction stuff is highly disappointing to me but it is without a doubt one of my favorite games ever.

yeah boom shakalaka all over this comment.

er... that means I agree.

Game is amazing. I mean, mechanically, the gameplay is legendary. Such a good feel to movement, to everything core to the experience.

That said, Konami's business practices leave much to be desired.

Also, @slag's on the money in general. Whenever something starts off so popular (or unpopular, even) there is always the inevitable swing back around. Humans like to feel the opposite way of other humans I guess?

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nickhead

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I don't have much negative to say about it - I loved my time with it. Chapter 2 was...mediocre and the microtransactions are gross, but I still played the game for 60-70 hours and enjoyed every minute. I'm not down on it at all.

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SuperJoe

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Mainly because it's incomplete. My first week with the game was amazing, discovering new areas and abilities while controlling better than ever, really immersive as a mercenary simulator - the novelty of playing a different type of Metal Gear game. But around the latter half of Chapter 1 when you unlock Africa I'd seen all there is to see. Then the repetition kicked in hard from doing the same objectives/areas in filler missions. Pretty sure everyone here can draw the floor plans of the Airport and the Yakho Oboo Supply Outpost by memory. By Chapter 2 it became apparent the game was incomplete and padded out, forced to revisit the same old locations with the only new area being Mission 43. It feels like Ground Zeroes had more mission variety in its side missions but I might be mis-remembering. Plus I totally understand people's disappointment if they were expecting Kojima's trademark Metal Gear shenanigans which were the heart of the series but absent here.

I still kept playing the hell out of it while listening to podcasts or watching TV, completing all the side missions and developing all weapons because expanding Mother Base was addicting in a Farmville sense. I farmed the intro to Mission 12 Hellbound for quick fuel and even left the game running overnight or when I wasn't home to circumvent the F2P constraints. But when I finally developed a nuclear weapon I felt ashamed (of my deeds) instead of accomplishment and immediately uninstalled the game.

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OurSin_360

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I don't think that's true, i just think most of us are just done with the game already and not talking about it anymore. It's my GOTY by a long shot(granted i don't play THAT many games lol). However it does seem they have changed things since I played, and the negativity could be from players who got in late to the party and the people who didn't like it from the start while the rest of us who loved it have just kinda moved on for now.

I"m still hoping MGO comes to pc so i get a chance to jump back in, but since all the studios closed i highly doubt it. :-(

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Dixavd

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This seems to happen with everything. Whenever there is such a vocal opinion on initial release of something, those voices eventually lessen as people move on to new things. The overall tone of discourse then returns closer to neutral and can often be misinterpreted as a backlash to the initial opinion (when in fact those saying so were always there, they were just drowned out at the start).

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cmblasko

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#16  Edited By cmblasko

It simply end much weaker than it begins. The story starts promising but ends with a dumb twist. And the content in the game is stretched way beyond its limits; for the 60-80 hours it takes to fully complete the game there should have probably been 2 additional fully realized locations with the same scale as Afghanistan and Africa.

That's not to say it still isn't one of the best games ever.

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Musubi

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#17  Edited By Musubi

It happens. Same thing happened with Bioshock Infinite. If you follow the crowd and critical reception it was orgasmic and then a few weeks later everyone started just criticizing the hell out of it. As to MGS V I'm still extremely confident in placing it as my 2nd favorite game of the year bar none. I actually really enjoyed the story for what it was.

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Hunter5024

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I think a lot of it is because people believe this is probably the last true Metal Gear Solid game. There's a finality to it that makes the weaker aspects of the game feel even more apparent.

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ArtisanBreads

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I'm not at all. Still feel the same about it. Loved it and the 2nd best game of the year unless Fallout 4 beats it out for me.

It happens. Same thing happened with Bioshock Infinite. If you follow the crowd and critical reception it was orgasmic and then a few weeks later everyone started just criticizing the hell out of it. As to MGS V I'm still extremely confident in placing it as my 2nd favorite game of the year bar none. I actually really enjoyed the story for what it was.

Yeah I agree with this overall. We just consistently see this type of reaction with most big games these days.

I mean if you bring up 4 you will still get a lot of vocal haters. It's important to remember as well just because you see vocal critics on a message board doesn't mean they represent most people. There are often vocal groups and negativity definitely will cause people to voice their opinion more in a message board environment.

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ArbitraryWater

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It's the usual hype-backlash cycle that happens to most big releases and critical darlings. I think that people with reservations or negative opinions tend to get drowned out around release time for these sorts of games, and once things have died down a little bit they're more noticeable.

For my part, MGS V is the best stealth game I've played since Dishonored. It plays so well it almost excuses the repetitive mission design and underwhelming story. Almost. I'm not even going to talk about the nightmare of Konami messing around with the FOB/Mother Base stuff post-release.

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ThatAintFalco

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kasaioni

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Mutual hate is stronger and louder than mutual love.

Same thing is happening to Fallout 4, which I think is a great game. But it's flaws are what people want to talk about.

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overnow

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There's the normal hype/backlash thing, but they also did some damage with the FOB stuff and while I'm sure there are a lot of people who enjoy the multiplayer I doubt the multiplayer was necessary to sell any copies and I'm sure there are more people who would have preferred the effort/money that went into the multiplayer going into other things.

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flasaltine

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Same thoughts I have always had on the game. It plays pretty well I guess but there is not much else to it.

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petethepanda

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There's always a backlash to mega-popular games, but with this one in particular I think it's largely the fact that it might not have been what many people wanted from something with "Metal Gear" on the cover, even if they had a lot of fun with what it wound up being. Plus, the escalating Konami online/f2p bullshit post-release and the lingering disappointment of the story probably took any sour taste left in anyone's mouth and just intensified it.

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TobbRobb

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Does this thread happen every time a game has completely overblown hype? I mean, MGSV is pretty awesome, top 5 this year for me. But fuck if it doesn't have huge glaring issues. Issues that people have been complaining about all along, they just aren't drowned out by the noise anymore.

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SSully

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MGSV has, hands down, the best gameplay of any game that came out this year. The shooting and controls are amazing, the gameplay loop is unbelievably tight, and the freedom it gives the player is absolutely incredible.

With that said it completely shit the bed when it came to the story and the FOB stuff is complete bullshit. I actually really enjoyed the story in the first half. Then chapter two was a stitched together mess. The back half deliver some powerful moments, but it didn't really earn them all.

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Quantris

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@onarum said:

like 80% of enemies wearing full riot suits, so they are pretty much impervious to anything but high explosives or CQC

two words: Rocket Peace
So OP. It's kind of ridiculous that they let you upgrade it.

But yeah, the basic gameplay in this game is fun but it really does not evolve much at all, and all the stuff you research hardly has much of an effect on that outside of a few new types of weapon. Even though they force it to take hours (& limit how much you can research in parallel!). And the "true ending", while somewhat Metal Gear-y in it's weirdness, just sort of happens...there aren't really any story beats that lead up to it, and aside from some throwaway dialogue (and one new option for deployment) it didn't even seem to be reflected in the game after it happens.

Basically the game feels like half of what it wants to be.

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Shindig

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The lack of build to the ending does kind of suck but the content of it I'm sort of cool with. So people are miffed at an ending that comes out of nowhere and an optional FOB system which they don't have to engage with. It's still my game of the year. Bloodborne's going to miss out because co-op is completely knackered.

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triplestan

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#31  Edited By triplestan  Online

Here's the thing - I don't love playing MGSV, but I love playing MGSV. It plays like a dream, and the way it feels will be the bar I compare every other game to from now on. But My Lord did I burn out on the loop of "side-op, side-op, story mission, side-op". Why do I care about this mission? The shit I'm doing in this Very Important Mission is the exact same shit I've been doing a billion times over, except now you add a terrible escort section (which, for the record, I cleared my first time. It was still awful.)

It's a game that gets in the way of itself so much and it just completely frustrates me. From the FOB stuff to the resources to the research timers it felt like they were actively trying to prevent me from having fun, and while I can realize it's a fantastic game (the 40 hours I've played are definitely in my top 5 for this year), I'd rather spend my time playing a game that encourages instead of stifles me.

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Error52

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Some people think that because it's "not what they expected from a metal gear game" but that makes it the most metal gear game possible in a way.

Honestly, it's best to go into MGSV with the right mindset. It's a base infiltration game that's got fantastic gameplay and a lot of weirdness, and not really a game you aim to beat, so much as just play the missions you want.

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rethla

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#33  Edited By rethla

Its still a great game and the microtransactions are way overexaggerated. Just look at Drew sighing beyond belief when he has to do the fob tutorial mission. In reality he will not have to deal with any fob, invasion or insurencestuff and continue to play just as before. The internet rage around it had made him think it will turn into a comletly different game at that point.

@onarum they arent wearing riot suits if you do the deploymentmissions to sabotage the suits. Sure one or two guys in each base will still be wearing it but that aint to bad.

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RonGalaxy

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#34  Edited By RonGalaxy

This happens with, literally, every well recieved game. Game gets a shit ton of praise, people move on, people who didn't like it keep talking about not liking it on forums because they get enjoyment out of yelling into an uncaring void. I wouldn't read too much into other people's opinions, or even concern yourself with consensus.

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pompouspizza

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@supermonkey122: It's definitely one of, if not the best game I have ever played. I know a lot of people were disappointed by the lack of story but I actually really enjoyed what was there. It feels like Kojima has finally been able to made the Metal Gear Solid game he's always wanted to make. In this game it felt like you could do anything, you could do things that in previous games would have been a cutscene. I had unbelievably high hopes for this game and I never thought it would actually meet them but it surpassed them.

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MeierTheRed

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Thats normal, Fallout 4 will have some backlash soon too, if its not already happening. Hype and excitement wears off, and you start seeing the glaring flaws.

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rethla

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#38  Edited By rethla

@meierthered said:

Thats normal, Fallout 4 will have some backlash soon too, if its not already happening. Hype and excitement wears off, and you start seeing the glaring flaws.

The Fallout 4 backlash starts before its even shipped but its also the exact same game as the previous 5 Bethesda games so its kinda justified. MGSV was something new that suprised most people, theres a unhealthy mix of returning MGS fans, stealth fans, fps fans and just mainstream players that all have different oppinions on whats good and bad with MGSV.

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TechnoSyndrome

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I think it's a different set of people who complain about this game than the set that praised it so much at launch. People who come to Metal Gear for the story/"experience" seem really disappointed on all fronts. As someone who came to Metal Gear for gameplay first and story second I think Phantom Pain is fantastic, even if there's definitely disappointing elements to it.

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Rafaelfc

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Michael Transactions and Konami not giving a fuck.

I still love the game part of this game, but everything around it is FUBAR.

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superfriend

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The ending and the last few missions were kinda weak. It basically screamed 'unfinished game' for the whole second half.

But that doesn't make it a bad game or anything. It's still one of the best games of 2015.. it just could have been much better if those last few things had clicked better. Oh and that Quiet mission where you have to defeat a bunch of tanks and can't quit the mission.. that has to be one of the worst things ever in any game.

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BoOzak

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Because people who liked the game played it to death to the point where they're very critical of it and people who didnt wont shut up about it not being a metal gear game.

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tikimorpher

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Eh people are moody *******. And when the staff starts turning on a game so goes the forums.

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Dussck

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I don't know. I liked the old MGS games. I liked MGS5 even more, because it's not that story heavy (I was sometimes getting tired of the endless cutscenes and conversations) and the gameplay is actually awesome this time.

The rare times there was a cutscene made it even more exciting. Kiefer is a fucking cool Big Boss! The amount of story is probably even on par with the old games only spread over more gameplay hours.

Could it be better if it was different or if it was more story heavy? Maybe.
Still one of the best games I've ever played.

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donchipotle

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Because it's a bad MGS game, a boring open world game, and the single most disappointing game of the year.

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DefinitelySacha

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Gotta say, I agree so far with what the others are saying here. I haven't made it that far into Africa but I already feel like I'm getting priced out of trying new guns over updating the originals I started with. I haven't gotten yet to the FOB stuff but, from the chatter, I wanna wait to see if it turns around. Sounds like the FOB is a big barrel you climb into for others to shoot at.

Anyhoo, strong beginning, great game overall but it seems to scale poorly as you progress. Glad I didn't commit to playing it on my LP channel.

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SilverSaint

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#47  Edited By SilverSaint

I think there are a few reasons.

1) The GB West crew was all about this game hyping it to the extreme, thus hyping everyone else up on the game.

2) The gameplay if amazing. This is further exemplified by the beginning of the game IMO... as its the best part of the game story wise. So when you start playing the game the theres all this new stuff and a great intro followed by great gameplay. People play this and then combine it with the GB hype, thus tons of positive posts.

3) After playing through the first 30 missions it becomes pretty clear the story isn't as great as that initial intro impression left. This is further exemplified by the "post" 30 missions, namely the repeats and after all that the unfinished story and "cut" story is pretty disheartening when compared to the previous MGS stories.

4) Further playing for a while people realized Mother Base (namely FOB) is incredibly poorly designed and frustrating, incredibly so with the micro-transactions and "insurance".

5) Basically the game starts amazing and people commented a bunch. Now that people have completed the game, its clearly a good game, but I think people were expecting more from the game overall as its MGS V. It also doesn't help this is seemingly the last MGS game by Kojima.

6) I don't think Metal Gear Scanlon has done MGSV any favors from a community standpoint. Metal Gear Scanlon 1-4 were considered great to watch by the majority, but watching MGSV has made a lot of the games negatives more clear.

When you boil MGSV down, it has incredible gameplay, there is no denying. The story and general game pacing are poor though, not even considering the previous MGS games, and the post game does the game no favors. Overall the story feels like a new IP with a hastily thrown together ending, instead of the culmination of a massive series. The pacing also does not help the game, as cut scenes are few and far between and having to listen to idroid tapes just sucks. One of the big components, Motherbase, is also basically a pointless large, similar looking square asset oil rig, that serves almost no purpose other then a way to introduce the player to an online component designed to make the player want to spend money through micro-transactions. Imagine how much more streamlined your MGSV experience would be if all Motherbase components were purely handled on your idroid, you never went there, and the online component simply didn't exist. Also consider the "open" world. Overall the open world serves little purpose IMO except for occasionally removing some loading time when some missions are by each other, more often you have to call the chopper, get to a chopper point and get on it, basically the same as a loading screen. It seems neat that a lot of areas are connected and you can go "explore", but the world is just dead and full of tons of soldiers. A lot of the game is great and if you only play the game for 5-10 hours it seems like by far one of the best games ever made, unfortunately the game is 50-100 hours long and what I am doing at hour 3 is the same as hour 10, 20, 50, 70, 100, except the hook that reeled me in (the story) has degraded along with the multiplayer component degrading my singleplayer experience.

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deerokus

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The mission design falls apart at around mission 25.

I have never gone from loving a game to finding it aggravating as rapidly as I did with this.

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WalterCrunkFite

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#49  Edited By WalterCrunkFite

Like most MGS games, once the novelty/nostalgia wears off, they don't have much going for them. Everyone gets super-excited at first, but it never lasts.

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fram

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I'm in a weird position where I've really enjoyed my time with MGSV so far, but my work schedule plus my wanting to play other games means I've only made it up to mission 7. I play it very infrequently, and there's no way in hell I'm going to finish it before GB's GOTY deliberations. I want to listen to those as they happen. This along with the reports of a muddled/unfinished story is pushing me towards listening to the story spoilercast, then going back to the game next year after some time away to just enjoy the gameplay.

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