I'm hanging it up. After 40 hours, the progress is too damn slow (even with the membership) and the items are too damn expensive. Perfect storm of bad/dumb business model.

Why the hell don't they just have a package or membership that makes you feel like your buying something. A progressive membership where you have to wait 6 months to get up to the max benefit of 50% faster cert rate is just sleazy. By the way, this games progression is so damn slow, 50% increase in certs still makes it a deathly crawl of progression. The only thing I can think of is prices and progression model are the brain child of a Japanese business/market team. Because these prices seem to be made for the way people spend MMO money in Japanland.

It's crazy slow. I get that they want to make you buy things, but like you it just makes me want to give up. League of Legends pretty much figured this free to play shit out. Why not just copy them?

Why. is. there. a. period. after. every. word. in. the. topic. title. ?.

While I understand the frustration, if progression is the only thing you are getting from a shooter... that's a bad sign.

Haven't played myself yet (waiting for a new PC this X-Mas) so I can't say. I remember when progression wasn't a thing and I sure played a lot anyways.

The thing I certainly agree about is that F2P games need to acknowledge the traditional game model in that someone, if they want, should be able to pay a retail-esque price and get EVERYTHING.

I stopped at about 25 hours into the game. I was saving up to get rocket pods for fighters and saw that I wasn't even half way to unlocking them, and even if I did unlock them it would bring me right back down to zero certs. And then I'd have to start all over again to unlock one other decent upgrade. Having to play 40+ hours to unlock something fucking sucks. At the rate I was earning certs it meant that I would have to put in 350 hours just to finally have the load-outs I wanted. The game's fun but it's not that damned fun.

I like the game, honestly it's something I have a lot of fun with, but I agree.

Costs need to be reduced, or (ideally) the rate of cert gain needs to be increased. 1000 certs to just even out a MAX build with another anti-infantry, -tank, or -air weapon is crazy to me. I'm a paying member with a sub, and it still seems nuts. Do I need to invest in a boost, too? Even though I'm already a paying member? I can get around 100 certs an hour, on average; that's still 10 hours for another gun. With nothing else in between.

I enjoy the way PS2 plays, I like the weapons, vehicles, and factions, I like everything about this game except for the slow progression and map control feels kinda meaningless. I wouldn't be BR31 if I wasn't having fun, but still...

I hope the developers realize this before it's too late.

Same reason I quit. The unlocks just take entirely too damn long. I'm fine with dropping $5-20 on a F2P game if I'm having fun with it, but their costs are so ridiculous that it just made me want to stop playing. F2P games seem to make this mistake all the damn time. It's saddening.

What's wrong with supporting their work?

Also pretty surprised nobody's set up a GB outfit yet!

@devilzrule27 said:

Why. is. there. a. period. after. every. word. in. the. topic. title. ?.

Say it out loud, it's not hard to grasp.

I think this is what you're looking for.

Edit: @seannao:

I think this is what you're looking for.

@Xeirus: That doesn't answer my question.

I agree that progression is godawful, but the game itself is fun and I like playing it even with the base gear. Haven't come across anyone that was miles ahead of me in terms of stuff and made the game not-fun, but I could see that happening in a few months' time.

@ArtisanBreads said:

While I understand the frustration, if progression is the only thing you are getting from a shooter... that's a bad sign.

This is essentially how I feel. The progression systems in modern shooters aren't exactly "fun" to me, so I don't really see the problem.

@SirOptimusPrime: The vanilla vehicles base gear sucks compared to the stuff you can buy for it.

Yeah, they copied the Tribes: Ascend F2P model, which is one of the worst F2P models out there and I stopped playing that game because of it. In this case it is also Pay2Win in specific cases. Ex: In one on one airfights, the person you are battling could have spent a bunch of money and have a much better vehicle with more varied weapons. For the sake of argument lets say you guys are on the exact same skill level. If you're someone who hasn't spent any money and the other guy has, your vehicle will be inferior. You could even have spent the few certs you have to unlock the same upgrades as the guy, but his might be of a higher level since he spent a bunch of money. So pay money and you have an objectively better vehicle than someone who did not. If that ain't Pay2Win... You can make the argument that you could just spend the time to unlock that stuff, but in saying that you have obviously not played PS2 and seen how long that would take.

I think everyone can agree on the weapons being way too fucking expensive. It is absolute bullshit that I need 1000 certs (that is a shit ton of time for those of you that don't know) to get a lock-on rocket launcher. My only option for AA as infantry is to grab a burster MAX, but I don't wanna do that when there are only 1 or 2 light aircraft harassing our sunderer, especially when Heavy Assault is my primary class. Or what if I want a different anti-infantry weapon for my MAX? That especially goes for the different types of weapons/upgrades for vehicles, too. I have no problem driving people in a Sunderer, but I'd never pull one because mines has jack shit on it and I'd rather not waste the few certs I have on it to actually have that thing be useful compared to others.

I absolutely love the gameplay in PS2, but I do wonder when I'll start to tire of the model. Having to play a ridiculous amount of hours or way too much money just to unlock one weapon is stupid. In numerous situations my character is objectively inferior to someone who has paid money. And I say this as a player who bought the damn XP boosts, so I can't imagine how a totally free player feels. Tribes: Ascend lost the majority of its players because of its model. I don't think that will happen to PS2 because it has a much larger and loyal fanbase, but I do believe many will tire of the model. Truly breaks my heart to say that as I love the game and am still having some fun with it.

Valve has kinda perfected the F2P model with TF2 and Dota 2 (never played Dota 2 TBH, but I know that all the characters are free). With TF2, you will never feel inferior in a situation with the default weapons and the cosmetic stuff ain't hurting the free players.

@seannao said:

What's wrong with supporting their work?

Also pretty surprised nobody's set up a GB outfit yet!

There is a GB outfit and its a bunch of fun when there are enough people are online. And I have no problem supporting the game (I've bought a bunch of boosts), but their current model is stupid in so many ways. I honestly would take the subscription model over this if it meant that everybody was on equal footing and had access to everything in the game.

@devilzrule27 said:

@Xeirus: That doesn't answer my question.

Then you're not very bright and I cannot help you.

@Jrinswand: Tribes is so good!

@SirOptimusPrime said:

I agree that progression is godawful, but the game itself is fun and I like playing it even with the base gear. Haven't come across anyone that was miles ahead of me in terms of stuff and made the game not-fun, but I could see that happening in a few months' time.

@ArtisanBreads said:

While I understand the frustration, if progression is the only thing you are getting from a shooter... that's a bad sign.

This is essentially how I feel. The progression systems in modern shooters aren't exactly "fun" to me, so I don't really see the problem.

The problem comes not from the existence of progression per se, but from the locking away of what makes a shooter enjoyable (guns, power ups, vehicles, what have you). If everything was available to him from the get-go, I'm sure he'd have no such problems with the game. Progression is the only thing most people get from shooters anymore because it's what most developers build their entire game around. And unfortunately in the case of Planetside 2, that progression is required for the F2P model to work.

Do you earn credits slower in this than in Hawken? Because Hawken without spending any real life money is.. lemme count. New mech 6450, average earnings per round if you're good and go 50/50 wins losses 150, 43 rounds of average 15 minute combat, eight and a half hours of constant actual play. Then you want the addons and upgrades for the mech, 2600-3800 more points to earn.
 
The difference is that there's f'all to spend freely earnable credits on in Hawken besides mechs and their individual upgrades. Tribes Ascend is marvellous in comparison with a truly great F2P RMT model. (Hawken is of course still in beta)

@SomeJerk said:

Do you earn credits slower in this than in Hawken? Because Hawken without spending any real life money is.. lemme count. New mech 6450, average earnings per round if you're good and go 50/50 wins losses 150, 43 rounds of average 15 minute combat, eight and a half hours of constant actual play. Then you want the addons and upgrades for the mech, 2600-3800 more points to earn.

Yes. A lot slower.

I haven't found the certification return rate to be that slow. It's slow, but that's what you get from a Free-to-play shooter, regardless of a subscription option. If it wasn't that way, Planetside 2 would be buried underneath the masses of outcries over the pay-to-win bull-shit people seem to jump on constantly. I would honestly prefer the same system the first game used, but this is 2012 and I'm not going to bitch about change. I love the game, and after about 30 hours I'm BR19 and that feels right.

It's okay to not like the game in and of itself, but if you're just playing to unlock stuff and playing alone, you're doing it wrong. It's free to play, so whatever, but it's probably one of the best F2P games on the market right now. The main thing impacting your game experience is usually "do I have this vehicle weapon or not" You have to keep in mind that they're being pressured by their investors and producers to make a game that makes money at the same time and that subscription fees are kind of a thing of the past.

I would recommend waiting for multiplyer sales on SC-Creds and buying some of the vehicle weapons and saving boosters for EXP events (they stack).

They've got their development track lined up and there's already some teaser art dropping out of their NDA barrier http://fc07.deviantart.net/fs70/f/2012/334/2/d/2d73db6452121bb8e793ea3cf8e3623f-d5mojvr.jpg

Carriers. Eventually. Imagine 3 of these converging on the same point.

Anyway, I hope you stick with the game and thanks for the outfit links!!

@Xeirus: I'm not bright because you failed to answer my question? Yeah, lets think about that. I never mentioned anything about comprehending the title, simply I asked about the excessive punctuation.

Its slow, but if you are trying to unlock everything you are doing it wrong. You shouldnt be saving up for the most expencive thing first. You should be saving up for things with the best price to benifit ratio. Focuasing on one class. With out paying for anything I already have 6% of the heavy assualt unlocked.

I've already posted multiple times that I think their model for cert acquisition as well as their Station Cash prices are completely screwed. It is counterproductive to make the progression that people end up leaving the game and giving up. Normally people that don't have time just plop down cash, but their prices are (in my opinion) too high. $7 per weapon? Do you know how many weapons are in this game? $5 for a permanent camo? Having to pay money to unlock a HORN for your vehicle? I'm afraid these guys are going to do significant damage to themselves if they don't figure this out soon, which is a shame because the game is legitimately fun.

@devilzrule27 said:

@Xeirus: I'm not bright because you failed to answer my question? Yeah, lets think about that. I never mentioned anything about comprehending the title, simply I asked about the excessive punctuation.

No, when I said read it out-loud I meant the whole thing, with the periods, know how to do that?

Cool, we're done then.

@seannao said:

What's wrong with supporting their work?

Also pretty surprised nobody's set up a GB outfit yet!

Someone has it's a NC outfit on Waterson, but I don't remember what it is called. There is a thread about it somewhere here, check the Planetside 2 page.

@devilzrule27 said:

Why. is. there. a. period. after. every. word. in. the. topic. title. ?.

Emphasis, duh.

Is progression rate really everything these days? I love me some leveling up but the core game mechanics should be the main reason to play the game, right? I like Planetside 2 and don't care about slow progression (tough I struggle to find real objectives when I play it).

I dropped $100 on triple Station Cash day. Granted I really love Planetside.

Some of the things behind the pay wall are lame, but if you stick with the basic weapons and cert them up you can have a pretty awesome time.

I know this because all my SC is for one TR character, but I do play others and refuse to spend money on them.

@jabbertrack said:

I dropped $100 on triple Station Cash day. Granted I really love Planetside.

Some of the things behind the pay wall are lame, but if you stick with the basic weapons and cert them up you can have a pretty awesome time.

I know this because all my SC is for one TR character, but I do play others and refuse to spend money on them.

I can vouch for this. I did the same thing and sunk a ton into an NC character. I really don't notice a difference except for some of the vehicle weapons. Other than that just use certs to improve the stock weapons.

i quit when i was killed by a guy with 'wicked badass' armor and dual pistols who shot me 3 times after i blasted him with a heavy machinegun for a good 8 seconds before he even turned around . . ..

@devilzrule27 said:

@Xeirus: I'm not bright because you failed to answer my question? Yeah, lets think about that. I never mentioned anything about comprehending the title, simply I asked about the excessive punctuation.

Is this a ruse, or do you really not understand that it's a form of emphasis?

@Tarsier said:

i quit when i was killed by a guy with 'wicked badass' armor and dual pistols who shot me 3 times after i blasted him with a heavy machinegun for a good 8 seconds before he even turned around . . ..

Was this some other game? I don't think there are dual pistols.

@ArtisanBreads said:

While I understand the frustration, if progression is the only thing you are getting from a shooter... that's a bad sign.

Haven't played myself yet (waiting for a new PC this X-Mas) so I can't say. I remember when progression wasn't a thing and I sure played a lot anyways.

The thing I certainly agree about is that F2P games need to acknowledge the traditional game model in that someone, if they want, should be able to pay a retail-esque price and get EVERYTHING.

It still relies a lot on your progression and it's really slow and the prices are high. It's a bad F2P model as it makes you spend money not because you want to have extra benefits but because you must have them.

I remember checking how much it would be to have basic lock-on for my rocket launcher and got dismayed. The gameplay is fun enough but the interface can be abysmal and after a while the tug-o-war just felt pointless. How many times can you retake the same outpost day after day because the moment you go to sleep the night shift recaptures it.

Yeah, seems the free-to-play model is getting more and more stretched out with every release. I have no issue with the free-to-play, pay-to-excellerate concept but they're getting drug out to the point that the free option is practically a stand-still.

Seems every time the video game industry has a good or clever idea they almost instantly destroy it by going overboard. Free-to-play models are becoming more like demos every day, DLC is being used for integral pieces of narrative, season passes, online passes, pre-order bonuses.... ugh, I hope this industry implodes soon because I'm ready for a crumble and re-build.

Sorry about the tangent, it's just all getting so frustrating. :P

@mordukai said:

@ArtisanBreads said:

While I understand the frustration, if progression is the only thing you are getting from a shooter... that's a bad sign.

Haven't played myself yet (waiting for a new PC this X-Mas) so I can't say. I remember when progression wasn't a thing and I sure played a lot anyways.

The thing I certainly agree about is that F2P games need to acknowledge the traditional game model in that someone, if they want, should be able to pay a retail-esque price and get EVERYTHING.

It still relies a lot on your progression and it's really slow and the prices are high. It's a bad F2P model as it makes you spend money not because you want to have extra benefits but because you must have them.

Yeah I could see how that's an issue. My PC is finally built as we speak. Going to check this out and I hope the gameplay is good enough to make a slow progression not a problem.

This is why I stopped. Basic stuff like red dot sights should not take hours to unlock. It's crazy

@Jackel2072 said:

This is why I stopped. Basic stuff like red dot sights should not take hours to unlock. It's crazy

It really doesn't take much to rack up some certs in the game. you get 1 for every 250xp you get which can be from killing enemies, capping points, healing/repairing etc. You also get 12 per day just for logging in. I agree that 1,000 for some of the unlocks is a bit steep but then again they're incentivising (sp?) you to spend money. Do you NEED red dot sights on all your weapons? The stock loadouts work just fine.

I also agree that the new user experience could be improved. It's tough for someone never who has never played the game before, to just jump right into the middle of a huge battle without even remapping the keys yet. I say give the game a chance and definitely find an outfit to join or tag along with. It's a completely different (better) game with other people.

Planetside is one of those games that just makes me sad it's F2P.

Its just like, such a cool fucking game, and I just wish I could plop $60 down and play it like any normal shooter instead of having to think about the fucking economy all the time.

@FoolishChaos said:

Planetside is one of those games that just makes me sad it's F2P.

Its just like, such a cool fucking game, and I just wish I could plop $60 down and play it like any normal shooter instead of having to think about the fucking economy all the time.

For $60 you can buy pretty much every alternative gun you would really want. TBO nothing in the store is 100% needed to do well. The whole cert earning process just takes actually playing the game to progress. Players can hold their own with stock guns that are certed properly over a gun that is purchased with no attachments.

PS2 is an FPS first and an MMO second. Last I checked whether it was COD or WoW, you have to pur some hours in to unlock items and progress.