All Systems Goku 21

Been waiting for this!

I'm ready!

We're back!

The grand return!

Very excited for them to cover this saga (and to rewatch along with them).

I'm so HUNGRY

Good to see this back, but I will sadly not be following along because the blu-rays for this season are just too darn expensive right now.

Here we go again.

Y'all forgot the whole week where Goku was just fishing and relaxing with Super Saiyan hair. Plenty of time to entertain Chichi.

Guys, guys, Goku hung out at home while Super Saiyan before Cell for like over a week, plenty of time to conceive Goten.

GIVE IT TO ME, ASG STRAIGHT INTO MY VEINS

Saiyaman time!

10 mins in, “did Chi Chi do the business with goku while he’s sleeping”

I missed this podcast so much no exaggeration

The original Kai run up to the Cell saga was handled by a separate production company. The FC were done in-house, which is why the remastering is so poorly done.

Funny Dan should compare Mr Satan to Heihachi since they share(d) the same voice actor in Japanese.

Dan was right. This is great! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MROK1yM2RDY

Man, this Saiyaman horseshit is going to be a slog but at least there's Satan City!

Anime Wint in the middle of that pod-image.

I can't believe anime is BACK!

Great Saiyaman rules and I'll hear no disagreements.

I love this part of DBZ, highly underrated. ALSO ASG IS BACK MY MONDAYS ARE GOOD AGAIN.

jump in the satan mobile boys, its time for all systems goku

Leave it to Dan to within 10 minutes mention a Cats in the Cradle Goku/Gohan tribute video and finding it. I NEVER thought of that and I grew go on those shitty things like Goku is such a cunty father I should’ve known that would exist and Dan got it immediately

Also W2G guys taking months off and not missing a beat with the organic wrestling analogies

Wait. What exactly are they watching? In the Kai release I'm watching a bunch of the stuff that they talk about doesn't happen. Like the part where the mayor is in danger and Gohan causes a tiny earthquake with his feet.

What's going on here?

@cheesus: You might be watching the Japanese broadcast which cut a lot of stuff out of the Saiyaman arc. It was added back to the NA Blu Ray release.

@cheesus: They're watching episodes 99-103 of Dragon Ball Kai. What are YOU watching?!

It's back!

Really glad to have more DBZ/Metal Gear/wrestling discussion to listen to over lunchtime again.

Glad to hear they are liking this saga so far, I think they're gonna have a blast with the tournament and what follows.

I was worried, not about their enjoyment because the final chapters is awesome, but about all the people who said that it should've ended at Cell or whatever, possibly leading them to think they shouldn't continue.

Surprised they didn't comment on the great intro song beyond the kind of teaser-y stuff they show in it. (considering Jeff at least said he didn't like the previous song)

@tanookisuit: "Is Goku a Bad Father" - the greatest thread in the history of forums, locked by a moderator after 12,239 pages of heated debate,

oh god damnit now I have to buy some blurays

fuck

@dstopia: Dang. That's really dumb. Oh well, synching up with them is gonna be a bit of a pain then. Thanks for letting me know!

The weird planet Goku and King Kai are on is part of a filler arc from the orignal run. It’s just Goku participanting in an afterlife martial arts tournament.

Great Saiyaman haters vacate

@cheesus: I was wondering the same thing. A lot of stuff they mentioned happened all in one episode for me and the business with the mayor was also news to me.

I'm also watching the japanese version.

@crylion@cheesus: 8 episodes from these Final Chapters did not air in Japan, including episodes 101, 102, and 103.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Dragon_Ball_Z_Kai_episodes#Season_5:_World_Tournament_Saga_(2014)

I don't know if this is an established part of the fiction or if it's just a fan theory, but I like the idea that Gohan based his Great Saiyaman alter ego on the Ginyu Force, who he encountered at such a young and impressionable age. Like, that each of his goofy poses lines up with one of the GF member poses or something.

It was established earlier that 17 and 18 are cyborgs meaning they were once humans but got turned into "androids" by Dr. Gero (who became Android 20 by doing the same thing to himself) so it's pretty easily implied that 18 can still conceive and have babies. I don't think turning a person into a superpowerful robotic supersoldier necessarily requires removing reproductive organs. Though I could have sworn that Krillin uses the Dragon Balls at some point to wish 18 back to being purely human, but I can no longer keep things straight.

Anyway this is why in Japanese all of the Androids plus Cell are collectively referred to as "Artificial Humans" rather than using the word "android" or "robot" since some of them technically aren't those.

I'm so glad we're back to business!

I'm so happy they're back and into the Great Saiyaman Saga, it's one of my favorite sagas in DBZ.

So, @Jeff and @danryckert didn't mentioned it, but the American version of Kai has some extra episodes that weren't part of the Japanese version. I was following along with the Japanese version until now and switched to the American version to keep following the podcast.

Now, regarding some of their questions:

- The Flying Nimbus comes from og Dragon Ball and they always talked to it back then. Master Roshi gave it to Goku as a thank you for saving Turtle. Everyone can use it and not just Saiyans, however, to ride the Flying Nimbus you have to be pure of heart otherwise you will fall.

- Goku had some time at home before the Cell games (when he was always Super Saiyan and wore that cool jacket), that's when Goten was conceived.

- That new planet Goku and Kai were on was part of filler they removed for Kai. It was briefly shown on the end of the Cell Saga in Kai. It's basically Goku and Kai traveling in the Other World, meeting more Kais, and Goku participating in an afterlife fighting tournament.

- The original run of DBZ didn't cut directly from Gohan beating Cell to Gohan being in high school. The filler arc with Goku in the Other World made it more gradual.

- Fortuneteller Baba is also from og Dragon Ball. She can make connections between the living world and the Other World. And she's Master Roshi's older sister.

Also, I can't believe I've been following Dragon Ball since I was a kid and never realized how Videl's name is an anagram for devil until Jeff pointed it out.

Fwiw, Videl was listed in that second leak for FighterZ characters, and seeing as the first one was 100% correct, she probably WILL end up in the game!

@crylion: @cheesus: This was news to me so I did a bit of research and the Final Chapters portion of Kai was originally planned to have 69 episodes but for whatever reason was cut down to 61. Weirdly enough you can watch all 69 episodes in Japanese on the international blu-rays but only the cut down 61 episodes were ever released in Japan. What a mess.

Discussed here: http://www.kanzenshuu.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=36648

Hell yeah, the full return of the best podcast around! Another great episode, thanks guys! Also as I'm sure others have pointed out Androids 17 & 18 were originally humans that were augmented with that perpetual energy engine thing so they can age, have children and what not. We Gotta Power may be my favorite Dragon Ball song but Fight It Out is pretty good too

Wow this whole time I never knew Videl was an angagram for Devil. Thanks Jeff!

The Buu Saga has some of the best music of the series. The intro song 'We Are Angels' is my 2nd favorite after "Chala Head Chala". Also the original Japanese BGM episode ending music right before the next episode preview is one of my all time favorites.

If Dan likes the goofiness of the Buu Saga, he will probably like Dragon Ball Super as it dials it up even further.

Opening credits showing a bunch of characters you haven't seen yet and spoiling upcoming plot points is pretty much par for the course for anime.

After Jeff and Dan mentioned the kind of bad performances during History of Trunks it made me think about the old dubs. But having watched this Buu saga through with the original Funimation dub recently and now watching it on Kai in both these first 5 episodes and in the next 5 which I'm currently watching, I have to say the acting and script is unquestionably worse in Kai: The Final Chapters. On top of that, despite more filler making it in, it feels like the cuts are too jarring and the pacing has been destroyed, whereas the pacing remained pretty excellent in all of the previous Kai stuff.

With acting/the script, a lot of iconic lines have been changed, and it feels like all the actors are speeding through their lines. Vegeta doesnt sound as battle-hardened, Goten and Trunks are not as spunky, 18's strong tone is replaced with an almost giddy girly voice. Also, I get the sense that because the actors know DBZ like they know their mother in Kai, they're trying to hard to match up with whats expected of that character and as a result comes across as less natural. No doubt about it, History of Trunks was pretty bad as Jeff and Dan pointed out, but the original dub of this and even normal Kai was much better than what I'm hearing in Final Chapters.

The music choices also dont work as well I think. There's a scene in the next batch of episodes, where Goku zaps in and greets everyone and particularly meets Goten for the first time, that's very moving in the original, but the cuts, pace-change, music choice, line rewrites, and new delivery really suck out the emotional impact thats supposed to be there. Watched back to back there is a clear difference.

Finally, the best podcast returns! Hearing them talk about Mr. Satan for so long, I'm convinced they'd love at least a certain batch of episodes in Super where he shows up doing exactly what they describe here. Great stuff, keep em coming! I'm still enjoying rewatching these along with the show.

IT'S HAPPENING!!!!!

Gohan absolutely learned his posing from the Ginyu force. There's a joke about it in Fighterz. I'm also very glad they both like the Great Saiyaman.