Quick Look: Dragon's Crown

Who are you to decide what is and isn't necessary? There's a specific reason for the way the characters are designed, which seems to have gone over y'alls heads: Let's Analyze The Art Behind The Newest Dragon's Crown Trailer.

@thecheese33 said:

@budwyzer said:

@thecheese33 said:

@duffyside said:

@frythefly said:

@atwa said:

@darkdragonmage99 said:

it's true no one really has the right to tell you what offends you but on the flip side no one has the right to not be offended everyone is offended by something and the world keeps turning.

Stephen Fry apologizes for being offensive and insensitive towards Poland and its people:

"Once the interview had been transmitted I started to receive the odd invitation to talk on Polish radio, explain myself to Polish journalists and make apologies to the Polish people in general. Perfect, you might think. An opportunity to make amends. But some mad pixie of pride in my head had got me rather riled by this time. It wasn’t helped by the fact that some of the letters I received were of such a bombastic and dictatorial nature that any spark of apology was extinguished before it was born. So I just ignored the whole incident and pretended to myself that I had been misunderstood, mischievously misunderstood, you might even say; that it was obvious to the meanest intelligence that I had never meant to suggest that Poland was complicit in the Holocaust and therefore it would make so sense for me to apologise — it would only perpetuate the culture of offence and apology that is so tedious a feature of our world. Or so I muttered. Really I was so guilty and angry with myself that I directed the anger outwards, as people will.

I offer no excuse. I seemed to imply that the Polish people had been responsible for the most infamous of all the death factories of the Third Reich. I didn't even really at the time notice the import of what I had said, so gave myself no opportunity instantly to retract the statement. It was a rubbishy, cheap and offensive remark that I have been regretting ever since. I take this opportunity to apologise now. I said a stupid, thoughtless and fatuous thing. It detracted from and devalued my argument, such as it was, and it outraged and offended a large group of people for no very good reason. I am sorry in all directions, and all the more sorry because it is no one's fault but my own, which always makes it so much worse."

Soure

You're even less aware of his point than the people who always post that picture. Stephen Fry didn't apologize simply because people said "I'm offended." He also didn't just say "I didn't mean to offend." He thought he implied something he didn't want to, that he detracted from his argument, that he said something he didn't believe in, and on and on I could go, therefore he apologized.

He didn't apologize simply because people said "I'm offended" and the alarms started ringing and he rushed to make amends. He did it because HE believed he had done something he regretted and didn't want to do.

The creators of Dragon's Crown wanted to make what they made. Now that people are offended, they shrug and say "so what." The same way Stephen Fry would if a huge group were to scream about how offended they were by his atheism, or his sexuality. They don't regret these things, and stand by them, and you or anyone else being "offended" is nothing but "a whine."

Obviously people can still be critical, but "I'm offended!" is not criticism. Moreover, Vanillaware (and plenty of consumers) can hear that criticism and shrug it off. Which I hope they continue to do.

Yeah, because childish, misogynistic artwork and sexuality/religious beliefs are totally on the same level.

Are they not? Explain. You can't? Because you're one of those people who screams "I'M OFFENDED!"? Yeah, thought so.

I don't know why I'm giving you the time of day because you've clearly plugged your ears and started screaming "LALALALA NOT LISTENING," but I'll bite.

People have died because of their religion and sexuality. Right now, in Russia, youth are getting tortured and killed because they were born with a specific orientation. As for the religion, you might want to read up on the Crusades. Your life will never be placed in danger because you like depictions of helpless, buxom women in distress, and to suggest otherwise is a colossally selfish, close-minded action.

But yes, keep defending Vanillaware, brave knight. As women fight for their right to get an equal salary, "minorities" face a corrupt NYPD that unfairly profiles them based on their religion and the color of their skin, and LGBT citizens fight for their right to live and love, you can rest easy in knowing that protecting Rob Liefeld's legacy is the TRUE cause worth fighting for.

"Your life will never be placed in danger because you like depictions of helpless, buxom women in distress, and to suggest otherwise is a colossally selfish, close-minded action."

Yep, my life will forever never be in danger because I like porn. Makes about as much sense as the rest of your post. LMAO

Sure, u can't decide what someone else does or does not feel offensive, but if big breasts offends you, then you must have an amazing life and shouldn't complain in the first place. I feel everyone who ever feels offended should take a look at steve hughes stand up routine about offending, u will either take offence to it, or u will feel silly for feeling offended about stupid stuff in the first place, and probably never feel offended ever again about stuff that doesn't directly effect you.

And those who've said it demeans women; really? I'm guessing you wouldn't say the same about nude paintings. And when it comes to video games, men should feel more insecure then women, cause when you think about it, I'm not the hunchback from notredame, but I sure as shit do not look like Kratos, Shepard, Batman or any other extremly fit, and often shirtless male avatars.

I feel like most of the attacks on the artstyle, has been select group of guys in the media trying to make a story out of nothing. Like they are almost trying to be "superior" because they feel that the boobs in the game is somehow childish or something. And that its "hurting" gaming as a culture. But these last couple of years has shown more then any other years that games media is starting to grow up, that doesn't mean we can't have some ridiculous fun with it once in a while.

But if it really does offend you that much then just don't play it,

I will be looking forward to seeing if the same group of guys are going to object to bayonetta 2.

Yes! She is unwittingly furthering the mysoginist patriarchal oligarchy by not typing thousands of words to prove how righteous she is on the internet so she can win the coveted "GIVES THE MOST SHITS" trophy.

I honestly think this game looks fantastic. This art style has been in every Vanillaware game, ever played Muramasa? Their just going for a "swords and sorcery" tone in a much more european way than before and so they seem to be kicking out the Heavy Metal influence. I think it's fucking cool looking and seems like a fun game.

Isn't that dysentery?

Well society is fucking dumb then

Man, there are a lot of angry dudes in these comments.

Does it effect the gameplay? Perhaps not, but a video game is more than just gameplay. A video game is a multimedia experience that generally includes visuals and sound. As someone who is capable of appreciating that, I'm happy with how the game is now. The art goes beyond 'thematic reference', are you sure you've played the game? I'd love to read your detailed analysis of it. Am I a bad person for enjoying a game in which one of the fictional characters has big bosoms?

@shovat said:

We all tend to forget that the definition of misogyny is an extreme dislike, contempt for, or ingrained prejudice against women. People that like overly-sexualized images from a contemporary standpoint are rarely the type that are described by this definition.

Then again, this is the Internet, where the arguments are fake and the points don't matter.

Source: http://oxforddictionaries.com/us/definition/american_english/misogyny

They really need to put Muramasa out on PS3 as well.

Well crap. For some reason is was under the impression this was a $15 PSN game...nope, $50 for a brawler is too much.

OH NOOOO! BIG BEWBS! >:O

*Looks at porn 10 minutes later*

As one of the 20 or so people who watched this quicklook to see if the game was good and not debate the art, I agree. The game type is not worth that price investment to me.

I think the mouse is more sexy than the women in this game...no really.

The women and men are creepy. the mouse is more my type.

Really disappointed with all the sexist comments here - expected better from the GB community. I suspect most of you would'nt dare to repeat your comments to your wives/ girlfriends or other significant females in your lives. The developers of this tripe need to take a good hard look at themselves.

If it doesn't bring anything to the game, why put it in there?

I think the game looks neat, but the art is really the thing that will make me never play this.

At first, I was just put off, but not offended. At this point, I totally find the art offensive. If that is what you think I want in a game, you are wrong and you are insulting me and the group of people I associate myself with. At some point, someone thought that having bigger breasts and more sexual poses for the females would help make sales. Otherwise why would they put that in there?

Whatever, what I'm saying isn't coherent or helpful. I'm annoyed and offended. I'll leave it there. Maybe if someone makes this game with the art more consistent, I would consider it. Give the females the same treatment you gave the male characters. The wizard and knight looked real cool, but the art basically makes me not want to see any female characters in it. Make this game with all guys in it. The art is good, just... ugh.

This game always looked cool (and somewhat outrageous) in stills, but I hate the 'tween' animation style. Also I haven't liked a brawler since Streets of Rage 2 got released so I dunno.

That fairy/pixie thing is cute though and is seemingly unscathed by the art director.

Loving the game so far, actually made an unboxing for the Limited Edition along with Dragon's Crown.

Well you're in luck -- there's two Giant Bomb guys in this video. Oh, you know that and you're still complaining? Oh.

Entitled Giant Bomb guys are the best. I love their salt whenever a Gamespot dude comes by.

@assinass: I don't mind the gamespot guys. I just would rather see the first hand impressions from the personalities that I know. Allows me to better judge a game. This felt more like a quicklook EX then a regular Quicklook. Call me entitled if you will, I was just looking forward to their fresh takes, instead of something served to them.

Boobs.

If that sorceress were between two buns, no one would even be talking about her.

ORDERED!! George Kamitani is a fucking hero!!!

Bahahaha, oh god that made me laugh pretty hard.

I still find it hilarious that people are actually embarrassed by this stuff? Good lord. Grow up.

Holy shit that guy sounds like Drew.

This whole debate is dysentery.

You know, it's only now that I'm an adult that it embarrasses me. I guess I need to grow up even more?

This comments section is depressing. Most of the time I have a lot of fun with the Giant Bomb community, but when it comes to the discussion of issues of sexism, homophobia, racism, etc. I often feel like the last thing I want to be is a member of the Giant Bomb community. These discussions of women in games frequently turn into huge walls of posts from people who don't understand the actual problem or choose to communicate their disagreements by throwing around hostile comments and insults. I'm really disappointed.

im just sad that its only coming to the weeoo

Looks like it could be fun.

The Giant Bomb Community is just a bunch of fans of videos based on video games on the internet. You shouldn't really have any higher expectations than any other content producer on YouTube or anywhere else.

Besides, this community has been a fucking mess almost from the very beginning. It shouldn't be surprising this late in the game, especially considering you're a mod.

So is it possible to actually play solo through the whole game on all difficulties (New Game+)? I am considering buying this, but being forced to play with AI controlled characters is a huge deterrent for me on a game like this. It's basically guaranteed that I won't buy it if I can't play it by myself. I'm just a not a fan of playing hack 'n slash sidescrollers like this with other player, human or otherwise.

You can play totally solo if you wish. In the tavern you can select if you want any NPCs to join you. You can also select which NPCs you want to join you(if you wish).

That's not really fair...

Among the gaming communities out there GB is without doubt among the more "serious" ones.

You can have some pretty interesting and in-depth discussions around here, discussions that in other places wouldn't even be possible.

If you think the comments here are bad you should check out what Kotaku did on Dragon's Crown:

http://kotaku.com/game-developers-really-need-to-stop-letting-teenage-boy-472724616

Ain't helping that Kotaku has been baiting with these kinds of topics for a while, for the sheer sake of creating controversy which in turn creates page hits..

And just to add my two cents to this topic: Why is it that only women are allowed to be offended by objectivation but never man? Are the usual "Fighter stereotypes" a realistic depiction of male physique?

Why does nobody ask me how i feel about that dwarfs over the top giant beard, that i will never be able to grow myself? And have any of these people complaining about objectiviation of women ever seen/read or heard about Twilight? What about cheap romantic dime novels that clearly objectify Men for the sole purpose of giving women something "nice to read" and have done so successfully for decades?

What i'm getting at here: Objectiviation happens to every sex, only difference being that we are more aware of one side of it then the other. And tbh it's hardly an issue in Dragon's Crown because they go over the top with every stereotype they have. I mean seriously, they got an Amazonian that looks more bulky then the Dwarf. All of the designs are way over the top, not just the female ones, focusing on the females ones (once again) just once again shows the double standards we are applying here.

You do realize that this applies to the majority of games? The games where the art-style has an major impact on gameplay are RARE.

In the majority of videogames it wouldn't make a difference what your enemies are. Replace Aliens with Nazis, with Zombies, with Monsters, with Robots, with Soldiers with whatever the fuck you want, it wouldn't make a difference for the majority of games in terms of gameplay (except for making the whole setting look odd when you got the wrong enemies in there).

So yes, it is in the end an artistic choice, do you know why it's called that? Because it's the artists CHOICE. The artist is trying to depict his imagination in such a way that he can share it with other people. How he does it is HIS choice after all it's HIS imagination.

Because people forget one thing: Videogames are entertainment, they are part of our culture and as such they can also be considered art.

And if there is one thing people should finally know/realize about art it's that you can't value/judge it. Once you start going down that route, you will be straight in Nazi-Germany "entartete Kunst" territory (look up degenerate art).

The main problem seems to be the fact that the developers, more or less, shot themselves in the foot by making some of the choices they did, namely the look of the female characters. It doesn't really bother me. It just doesn't do anything for the game. The nun laying down sprawled out on her back was just weird and seemed out of place, not to mention the gigantic breasts on the sorceress. I like me some giggly lady parts just as much as the next guy, but there more comically large than anything which just seems pointless other than to alienate people from buying the game. These changes, along with some others, would have made the game far less polarizing. It's unfortunate, but many of the choices made were to the detriment of the game and not to it's benefit, especially since it seems like a pretty good game. And the overall look of it is fantastic.

I don't like the art and don't like the gameplay. I'm glad the quicklook wasn't thirty minutes of the guys whining about the art work...unlike the comments sections....why do I even bother skimming through comments any more?

@porousshield: Why did you ever bother in the first place for that matter.

@porousshield: Why did you ever bother in the first place for that matter.

Oh. I just got this picture...

Arrrgh damnit, why did this never come to PC? I'm still bitter about it.

This is a good video game.