Amazon Says Mass Effect 3 Refunds Aren’t Unique

It would be unfortunate for these people if they released awesome DLC which puts all this bitching to rest.

@EDfromRED said:

Best summation I've seen yet of why Mass Effect 3's ending sucked, and how horribly Bioware lied: http://angryjoeshow.com/2012/03/top-10-reasons-we-hate-mass-effect-3s-ending/

Wait, this is from the guy who went on a complete bitchfest because Geoff Keighley wouldn't stop doing his job of running the VGAs (as it was going on, mind you) just to give him an interview and answer why FFXIV wasn't nominated for "Best MMO." I don't trust him.

Wait, what? Damn, and I thought my local electronics store with 30 days return policy no questions asked was considered good customer service.
That one doesn't apply to pc games. And most likely not console games either, why would amazon have such a service, I bet it's going hamstring them in the long run tbh.

It isn't that strange, over here in Australia, retailers like EBgames and GAME offer a 7 day return policy, generally for store credit, but still, you can bring back an opened game after finishing it (even with that as a reason for returning) and they will exchange it for you. They do then go ahead and return it to stock as a new product though.

Edit: Applies to all but PC games.

@Gunzilla: no ones upset that its not a happy ending, its that the last 10 minutes has more plotholes than the rest of the series combined. pretty much NOTHING in the ending makes sense. how you dont have issues with it is beyond me, i dont mean to insult your intelligence, but uh, how can you not see the utterly flawed logic and plotholes? did you fall asleep before the ending and wake up during the credits or something?

I finished mass effect 3 I had no issue with the ending I could not believe people are crying like babies about the ending people need to grow up red dead redemption did not have a happy ending and it was a great game m.e. 3 ending was not worth all this backlash it's still a great game I enjoyed it

@Crono:

I believe the refund is less shipping...and you have to ship it back on your own.

anyone saying it'll become a trend are complete morons. if you do it a bunch of times they will call bullshit on you. obviously they keep records so you won't be able to "buy games, then just claim they were bad and return them after you beat them" seriously, how naive and stupid are you people? lol

@StoicForce said:

So the ending was that bad?

yup, will probably end up refunding 40 percent of what they sold. Doesn't matter lead creators are rich doctors anyway, whats two flops in a row.

@Wrighteous86 said:

Yeah, if you complain that a movie sucked you get your money back. If you complain that your food sucked (even if it was prepared properly) you get your money back. If you complain anywhere, in the right way, you can get your money back. Because it's easier to pay you off than deal with your bitching and creating a scene.

That doesn't mean you deserve it. If you bought Mass Effect 3 and didn't like the ending, you don't deserve your money back. You're not paying to be satisfied, you HOPE to be satisfied. You're paying to experience the game. And you did.

If I bought some lotto tickets, I couldn't return them afterwards and say, "I didn't win. I want my money back."

Art is a gamble. There is no guarantee that anything will satisfy everyone. That's just how it is.

You are a gentleman and a scholar, no wonder your girlfriend whose name escapes me finds you totally awesome.

Unfortunately, I'm becoming very conflicted with this issue. I find the game great, and also find people abusing the refund policy to be the scum of the earth, BUT, the ending to a game series that people have invested physically, spiritually, and emotionally in, deserve better than the piece of shit we got, and for it to be included in DLC seems atrocious. Art may be subjective, but empirical evidence of the majority that hates it with a passion, is definitely winning out.

Sadly, I'm not sure how people should be getting Bioware to listen properly. Asking for a refund from Amazon so they can sell it later as a used game does absolutely no damage to anyone, especially Bioware. But if their solution does turn out to be a $10 "real" ending to the game, is justice done?

I usually find the best answer to be the one that does things in moderation, no extremes. But I honestly can't figure out what the fuck that is for this particular situation, and it's bothering me.

I think even Burger King has a deal where "If you are not 100% satisfied with our whopper, you get a new one".

That actually sounds more like a threat if you didn't like the Whopper because it was a Whopper D:

Wow how do they continue to exist with that policy? Amazon is truly the greatest thing run by the greatest people.

Now that's what I call a happy ending. LOOOOOOOOL

Who needs gamefly when a subscription to Amazon's Games is $0

@Brodehouse said:

@Pinworm45 said:

@Scotto: They weren't satisfied, and Amazons policy is to refund you if you aren't satisfied.

the vast, vast majority of products and even services offer refunds if you aren't satisfied. Buy a hammer and its broken? refund. Watch a terrible movie at the theatre? ask for a refund, and you'll get it. Was a food product terrible? Complain, and you'll get a refund and usually coupons.

That's just how it works.

You can get refunds because you didn't like a movie? Never heard of such a thing.

For most theaters I've been to they will give you a certificate/gift card to see a different movie if you walk out within the first 30 minutes.

@CommissarDuke: That's just not true at all. If you killed a certain character in ME1, his world on ME3 is very different, and makes it much easier for you to make a decision that is "renegade" otherwise. And there were a lot of characters I helped/hurt in 1 and 2 who came back in interesting ways in part 3. I will agree that some major decisions end up having minor consequences, but as a whole I think your decisions do paint the world in some rather interesting ways.

Are some people going to actually justify their dislike for Mass Effect 3 because "the ending invalidated all of my choices"? Sure, the Mass Effect series does let the player choose what to say during dialogue, but the problem is that the results of those dialogue choices don't really steer the story in a radical direction, other than who and what appears and who and what doesn't. The flow of the Mass Effect games are like this up until the end of the game when this happens on a larger scale:

The choices Shepard gets to make in all of the games carry no significant impact in the game world. At best, all that happens is basically "x NPC from previous game shows up/doesn't show up/shows up in place of an alternative", but the baseline story still ends up being the same and every player shares roughly the same experience. When all of the choices Shepard makes fails to carry an impact that radically changes the game and gameplay experience throughout the series, why get mad at Bioware because of the game's ending following suit?

The complaints about the plotholes in the ending are valid complaints though, but just because the ending was terrible for that reason doesn't mean that a person should be entitled to a refund on the entire game. If I thought the ending to a movie was terrible, or that the last two tracks of a music album were god awful, should I have the option to return the whole thing for my money back? No, not at all. The rest of the movie was great, and every track in the album was pretty good then I still got what I paid for and shouldn't dismiss either the movie or the album as a whole because a small segment is terrible. The gameplay in Mass Effect 3 is pretty solid, and is an enjoyable experience. I did think the end is a little lackluster but returning the entire game for a refund simply because the last ten percent of the game is terrible is irrational. If anything, those who hated the ending should get a voucher for $5.99 USD or equivalent in proportion to the part of the game they disliked.

@Pinworm45 said:

@Scotto: They weren't satisfied, and Amazons policy is to refund you if you aren't satisfied.

the vast, vast majority of products and even services offer refunds if you aren't satisfied. Buy a hammer and its broken? refund. Watch a terrible movie at the theatre? ask for a refund, and you'll get it. Was a food product terrible? Complain, and you'll get a refund and usually coupons.

That's just how it works.

You can get refunds because you didn't like a movie? Never heard of such a thing.

Mass Effect 3 isn't broken, people just don't like it. The hammer analogy is more if you bought a hammer and you don't like that it's blue.

The food product would be apt if you were complaining to the people who actually made the food, and not the intermediary delivery service.

@Pinworm45 said:

@Scotto: They weren't satisfied, and Amazons policy is to refund you if you aren't satisfied.

the vast, vast majority of products and even services offer refunds if you aren't satisfied. Buy a hammer and its broken? refund. Watch a terrible movie at the theatre? ask for a refund, and you'll get it. Was a food product terrible? Complain, and you'll get a refund and usually coupons.

That's just how it works.

Yeah, if you complain that a movie sucked you get your money back. If you complain that your food sucked (even if it was prepared properly) you get your money back. If you complain anywhere, in the right way, you can get your money back. Because it's easier to pay you off than deal with your bitching and creating a scene.

That doesn't mean you deserve it. If you bought Mass Effect 3 and didn't like the ending, you don't deserve your money back. You're not paying to be satisfied, you HOPE to be satisfied. You're paying to experience the game. And you did.

If I bought some lotto tickets, I couldn't return them afterwards and say, "I didn't win. I want my money back."

Art is a gamble. There is no guarantee that anything will satisfy everyone. That's just how it is.

@Scotto said:

It's their story. You chose to partake in it. Not only is "art" a valid excuse, it's the beginning and end of the conversation as far as I'm concerned.

It's been noted on many occasions that the endings we got isn't what BioWare wanted or intended. So, you'll have to excuse us for being able to see the incredibly fallible, ham-fisted, half-assed endings as a disappointing way to close out a trilogy.

So, you're wrong.

@Pinworm45 said:

@Scotto: They weren't satisfied, and Amazons policy is to refund you if you aren't satisfied.

the vast, vast majority of products and even services offer refunds if you aren't satisfied. Buy a hammer and its broken? refund. Watch a terrible movie at the theatre? ask for a refund, and you'll get it. Was a food product terrible? Complain, and you'll get a refund and usually coupons.

That's just how it works.

If I worked in a movie theater and someone watched the movie up until the credits and tried to ask for a refund I would laugh in their damn face. I would probably do the same thing with the meal to if they finished off the whole plate.

Amazon. Still one of the best places to buy stuff.

I kind of have to agree with some others.... why is this an article? Newsflash, amazon accepts returns. What is the point other than trying to stir up more stupidity about the ME3 ending?

So... Free games forever amirite?

@Scotto: They weren't satisfied, and Amazons policy is to refund you if you aren't satisfied.

the vast, vast majority of products and even services offer refunds if you aren't satisfied. Buy a hammer and its broken? refund. Watch a terrible movie at the theatre? ask for a refund, and you'll get it. Was a food product terrible? Complain, and you'll get a refund and usually coupons.

That's just how it works.

@RVonE said:

I think it's interesting that when consumers complain they are advised on forums such as these to "vote with their dollar or shut up" but when they actually, you know, "vote with their dollar" they are portrayed as whiney, childish, or entitled. Stay classy, I guess.

Pretty much. And then if you say 'boycott' you're immediately insulted by the entire internet, from the same people who said vote with your wallet. It's pretty stupid.

@jorojoserojas said:

I...I was pretty okay about the ending. And I had over 55 hours of playtime. Went through the whole series. What was so terrible that I missed?

People were ready to hate ME3, short of it being flawless. It's the culmination of all the internet shitting on Bioware that has been going on since Dragon Age 2 launched.

I also finished ME3. I thought it was fine. The ending wasn't exactly what I wanted, but it was good enough, and I think that final conversation you had was really interesting.

In some ways, I actually think it's the best game of the series - not the overall story (I still think ME1 takes that honour) - but I loved the more dynamic and numerous cutscenes, the further improved action mechanics, some of the beats of the main story (the Geth stuff is fantastic), and the attempt to reintroduce some of the inventory/mod stuff that was absent from ME2. Probably the weakest story of the three overall (though still pretty good by videogame standards ), just because of the amount of fan service they crammed into this game (as Jeff said on the podcast - to the point of it being kind of silly). But still a solid Mass Effect game.

And all of this is coming from someone who was extremely disappointed by Dragon Age 2, to the point I was petrified that this game was going to be garbage - so I'm by no means a blind homer.

heres something if anyone is curious to why we're all pissed and doing this

for the record that little piece in the youtube video your seeing here before you click, was in the launch trailer

@BluPotato said:

This is exactly the type of bullshit people hear about gamers that makes me embarrassed to associate myself with them in any way. Seriously, it seems like gamers are the most entitled and childish among any consumer group. If something doesn't end up the way they want, well, might as well throw a tantrum about it. Move on and get over it.

Have you ever hung out with serious movie buffs or people that go to midnight releases for books that they have been waiting for? When people are invested in a story and told to expect something (in this case: choices mattering) and get something beneath the level of quality they were expecting they tend to get a little bent out of shape. Gamers just so happen to all be connected to the internet and lots of us use this method to communicate.

If you think gamers are bad about this kind of thing find somebody in film school and talk to them about Godfather part 3. That is 2 hours of my life that I will never get back.

Also, I don't get how this effects you or any of the other people coming into these threads and bashing people who don't like the endings. It stinks of hipster contrarianism.

@kater said:

@Wrighteous86 said:

@AlphaDormante: An artist can essentially end their work however the fuck they want. It's up to you to decide if it's worth it or not. You decided that ME3 wasn't. You don't deserve your money back. You'll get it back because whiny bitch customers get what they want. But you paid for that company's ending to that story, and you got it. Art is open to interpretation, stories are open to interpretation, basically any media is open to interpretation. The game was playable, and finishable. Therefore, it did all it had to do in order for you to get what you paid for. Sorry boutcha.

Just quoting you because there are too many posts like this.

People, "art" is not an excuse. It is not something to hide behind. It is an achievement of human development. Something we all should take pride in. To call something "art" and use that as a way to shield it from complaints is incredibly dismissive. It's not fair to the audience, and especially not fair to the work. Art can be criticized. It can be deemed to hold value. People are right to judge. Right to criticize.

When a story betrays itself as much as Mass Effect 3's ending did, it is faulty. It's broken in the plainest way a story can be. People are right to ask for refunds, because they received a product that does not function as advertised. It is literally at odds with everything people could have expected, from both experience playing the games and awareness of what this product should be. There are dozens of interviews with Bioware swearing up and down that the game plays out in the complete opposite way that it does. Thus the thing that consumers obtained cannot be functioning correctly. People are right to ask for a refund.

In what parallel universe is "the game's story didn't end in a way I consider satisfactory" the same as "the game isn't functioning properly"?

It's their story. You chose to partake in it. Not only is "art" a valid excuse, it's the beginning and end of the conversation as far as I'm concerned. If you didn't like the story, that's another matter, but entitling you to a refund? That's insane.

It's like paying to go to an art exhibition, and then asking for your admission fee back because you didn't like any of the paintings. You're paying to be there - not to specifically see something you like.

The Mass Effect 3 hate gets crazier and crazier.

@StoicForce said:

So the ending was that bad?

Yes, thankfully I didn't purchase it. Nor do I intend to ever purchase a EA or Bioware game. Not after DA2 and this ME3 ending crapfest.

I'll continue to let the ME fanatics get it out of their system and chuckle at the side-lines. But, c'mon, standard Amazon customer service (for years I might add) doesn't require a pseudo-"investigative" chat or a "news"-stroy. You can find that shit in Amazon's terms you probably should've taken a look at when you decided to buy from them in the first place. Unless this really is some weird case of American customer service being significantly toned down compared to the European versions of the same damn website. Which it doesn't sound like.

If you ask me this type of story is uncalled for and a waste of time. I read shit like this and I don't want to even click on stories here anymore. Stop giving the ME-hysteria more attention. There are many other interesting games. A lot of them.

Edit: Skimming through some more of the comments it appears many people are literally amazed by this? This "story" is all part of some genius level Amazon viral marketing plan, isn't it?!? Anyways, I see people want to continue to freak out about ME and also consider this news-worthy. So it's merely not content I personally care for at all. At least I can easily ignore shitty articles. But god help me when all that inevitable DLC nonsense starts...

I think it's interesting that when consumers complain they are advised on forums such as these to "vote with their dollar or shut up" but when they actually, you know, "vote with their dollar" they are portrayed as whiney, childish, or entitled. Stay classy, I guess.

@depecheload said:

I think some of the things fans are doing regarding ME3 are going overboard, but I'm still happy about it.

Think about it, EA/BioWare decided that the THIRD game in a TRILOGY would be a great game to try to mainstream and simplify for a mainstream audience. They crammed in a mulitplayer mode no fans were really clamoring for, and they stripped out elements from the original main story and then shoveled them onto overpriced day one DLC.

So I'm sorry, my sympathy for EA/BioWare is zero. Everything they've done with ME3 has been for them and their profits, nothing to benefit the consumer. When you do that, it always comes back to get you. They're getting what they deserve.

good points, I agree.

It also opened REALLY weird. If you hadn't played "The Arrival" the opening made no sense. Real hamfisted writing and plot design.

So maybe we don't get a real ending until the DLC? That would be in line with how EA has treated the series so far.

And to all the people who say the ending is fine. BUUUUUULLSHIT. you don't get to end a series that has highlighted decision making and dealing with consequences with "BECAUSE SPACE MAHGICS!". No. Everything from the white platform onward should have never made it into the game. The fact that someone at bioware wrote that and had it signed off is not a good sign for the future health of that company.

I'm sure if you send back too many games they might get pissy, but good to know I can basically rent games from them lol.

the game is not too bad...i guess...

Just beat Mass Effect 3 like 20 minutes ago...... as for the ending.... without giving too much away about it; I chose the middle one...... and well... It makes me wanna play Mass Effect 2. Which I am currently doing. Take that how you will.

@KaneRobot said:

modern gamers are such whiny and entitled pissants. ugh.

Sometimes gamers have to be vocal and whinny to get publishers and developers to pay attention.

@Mode7: well exactly. what really baffles me is how reviews didn't say anything about this. i beat ME3 and how terrible the endings are is mind boggling. like i find it amazing jeff hasn't said how terrible and nonsensical the endings are, so i guess we cant even trust reviews anymore either. hopefully this causes problems for their DLC sales, i certainly won't be buying any ME3 DLC.

is "mass effects ending is bad" a meme now or are people that crazy? i got a job before i could finish it

I'm not a Mass Effect guy, but the amount of outcry about this game is insane. I've never seen a fanbase be so vocal about their franchise. I guess it speaks to how good the first two were.

Shhh, Patrick, shhh! Too much reporting on this and Amazon will change their policy.

Doest the PAL version of this game for PS3 have game-breaking frame rate problems?? Shouldnt that be the controversial aspect of this game

so wait, are you saying that you can buy 10 games, beat them, claim to be unsatisfied with them and get a refund? this is dumb

modern gamers are such whiny and entitled pissants. ugh.

This is exactly the type of bullshit people hear about gamers that makes me embarrassed to associate myself with them in any way. Seriously, it seems like gamers are the most entitled and childish among any consumer group. If something doesn't end up the way they want, well, might as well throw a tantrum about it. Move on and get over it.

I returned mine because it's been two weeks and I still can't import my face. I waited, I had most of the important stuff already spoiled for me thanks to the internet and coworkers, and at this point I'm so disgusted with everything surrounding this game that I just don't want to play it anymore. I'll probably borrow it from somebody like I did with Mass Effect 2. At least this time I'll have access to the full game.

Don't worry, they'll still get some money from me when I buy the story DLC.

how can the ending be that bad? at least it ends!!!

So you ran with a story by quoting Random Amazon CS Rep #7371 instead of, you know, their PR? Doesn't that seem a little..iffy?

It's more fun to pretend that the CEO of Amazon is so angry at the ending to Mass Effect 3 that he's allowing everyone to get their money back if they share in his rage.