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#51 Posted by pbhawks45 (738 posts) -
#52 Posted by alternate (2719 posts) -

@Scrawnto said:

Are embargoes enforced by contracts that are signed to get pre-release copies? Is it a EULA sort of thing, where they say "If you play this copy we sent you, you implicitly agree to these terms:"? Or is it purely a matter of playing nice with the publishers?

I think in most cases you sign a legally binding contract and fax/email it to them before you get review code.

Of course the threat is not that they will sue you - they never would, not worth the effort and bad PR - it is that next time the publisher is going to snub you and maybe your whole site.

That is why very early reviews are often euro press. They get treated like second class citizens by PR anyway so nothing to lose by breaking embargo.

#53 Posted by HatKing (6108 posts) -

@mosdl said:

@HatKing said:

Out of curiosity - and this probably isn't the place for it, but whatever - do you have an idea of why publishers embargo reviews until the release day? I mean, I get it if they know the game was disappointing, but this hardly seems like a bad game. I mean, THQ isn't doing great financially, and I think a few positive reviews right before launch might help push some of those on the fence. Feel free to educate this fool.

If you break their rules I am sure they won't be sending you any more review copies.

Oh, yeah, I get that. I was just wondering what the publisher's thought process is. I mean, maybe I'm naive, but I'd hope that a publisher would be confident about what they're putting out. In reality, do day one sales really mean that much? It's the shelf life. Really by embargoing the review until the day of release they're only hurting their biggest fans who want to know if the game keeps up. But, maybe I just don't get it.

#54 Posted by alternate (2719 posts) -

@Grissefar said:

@Jackhole said:

Edit: IGN gave it a 7.5 http://www.ign.com/articles/2012/08/14/darksiders-ii-review

Gamespot 8.5 http://www.gamespot.com/darksiders-ii/reviews/darksiders-ii-review-6391200/

Ouch, that has to suck a giant dick. I think THQ had bigger expectations than that.

It is the new "scale" gamespot and IGN seem to be applying. GS are especially rating on a stricter curve than they used to. IGN rate games with a complex formula where the score is directly proportional to the money hat they got :D

Bare in mind it is likely to get 4 stars on GB and as far as metacritic viewers are concerned that will be an 8.0.

#55 Posted by phrosnite (3518 posts) -

@pbhawks45 said:

@Klei said:

@phrosnite said:

IGN's review was hilarious. I don't know who that skirt was but she doesn't know shit.

This. I don't know who Audrey Drake is, but whenever she gives her opinion about something, I always wonder why she's tasked to represent IGN's views with her reviews.

Hey, let's lay off the misogyny, okay? Who gives a shit if it was a female reviewer? Jesus.

Because most woman are bad at video games? Her complaints made me laugh throughout the video(none technical/performance ones).

#56 Posted by c0l0nelp0c0rn1 (1811 posts) -

@phrosnite said:

@pbhawks45 said:

@Klei said:

@phrosnite said:

IGN's review was hilarious. I don't know who that skirt was but she doesn't know shit.

This. I don't know who Audrey Drake is, but whenever she gives her opinion about something, I always wonder why she's tasked to represent IGN's views with her reviews.

Hey, let's lay off the misogyny, okay? Who gives a shit if it was a female reviewer? Jesus.

Because most woman are bad at video games? Her complaints made me laugh throughout the video(none technical/performance ones).

She said she liked the game. Did you actually read her full written review? There's a reason they point you to it at the end of the video.

#57 Posted by phrosnite (3518 posts) -

@c0l0nelp0c0rn1: You kidding me? Reading a review? Especially when the video review was hilariously stupid. I have better things to do... like picking my nose.

#58 Posted by Twinsun (493 posts) -

@phrosnite said:

@pbhawks45 said:

@Klei said:

@phrosnite said:

IGN's review was hilarious. I don't know who that skirt was but she doesn't know shit.

This. I don't know who Audrey Drake is, but whenever she gives her opinion about something, I always wonder why she's tasked to represent IGN's views with her reviews.

Hey, let's lay off the misogyny, okay? Who gives a shit if it was a female reviewer? Jesus.

Because most woman are bad at video games? Her complaints made me laugh throughout the video(none technical/performance ones).

Are you for real?

#59 Posted by Klei (1768 posts) -

@pbhawks45 said:

@Klei said:

@phrosnite said:

IGN's review was hilarious. I don't know who that skirt was but she doesn't know shit.

This. I don't know who Audrey Drake is, but whenever she gives her opinion about something, I always wonder why she's tasked to represent IGN's views with her reviews.

Hey, let's lay off the misogyny, okay? Who gives a shit if it was a female reviewer? Jesus.

I don't care that she's a woman. I don't get why she's tasked with the reviews of important games, that's all. Especially when I see this :

Reminder: 7.5 = "Good." Also, it's ok if we disagree. Maybe wait to play the game first, though? Kthnxbye. <3 ;P :D <3http://www.ign.com/articles/2012/08/14/darksiders-ii-review …

Aminka GameOnAminka

FroJack90 Maybe, but as a journalist it's my duty to rate games based on our review scale. It's "good," I enjoyed it. Thus the score. ^_^

She wrote this like a 14 years old girl would have done. It's not very professional, to me, at least. People like her should stick to reviewing games such as Kingdom Hearts and stuff like that. No, i'm not being sexist, but I think Darksiders 2 isn't aimed at her at all.

#60 Edited by phrosnite (3518 posts) -

@Klei said:

@pbhawks45 said:

@Klei said:

@phrosnite said:

IGN's review was hilarious. I don't know who that skirt was but she doesn't know shit.

This. I don't know who Audrey Drake is, but whenever she gives her opinion about something, I always wonder why she's tasked to represent IGN's views with her reviews.

Hey, let's lay off the misogyny, okay? Who gives a shit if it was a female reviewer? Jesus.

I don't care that she's a woman. I don't get why she's tasked with the reviews of important games, that's all. Especially when I see this :

Reminder: 7.5 = "Good." Also, it's ok if we disagree. Maybe wait to play the game first, though? Kthnxbye. <3 ;P :D <3http://www.ign.com/articles/2012/08/14/darksiders-ii-review …

Aminka GameOnAminka

FroJack90 Maybe, but as a journalist it's my duty to rate games based on our review scale. It's "good," I enjoyed it. Thus the score. ^_^

She wrote this like a 14 years old girl would have done. It's not very professional, to me, at least. People like her should stick to reviewing games such as Kingdom Hearts and stuff like that. No, i'm not being sexist, but I think Darksiders 2 isn't aimed at her at all.

Agreed. Important games should be reviewed by known people("veterans"). She said she loved the boss battles and that the dungeons are repetitive and arguably boring whereas Kevin from GS said that the bosses were disappoiting(especially the last one) and the dungeons are varied and different enough from one another. WTF? Who to believe? Kevin who has reviewed one some of my favourite games of all time and with whom I agree most of the time or this newly hatched woman?

P.S. - The last boss in D1 was also disappoiting and a push-over despite looking epic(dragon part) though :D

#61 Edited by stryker1121 (1580 posts) -

@Vashyron said:

@phrosnite: Not to say anything bad about her, but she was very quick to point out every single flaw with the game in the video review. It sort of felt like she was nitpicking, but I think overall, it just wasn't a game she liked to begin with.

I thought her text review was fair and pretty thorough. Kind of summed up my worries about the game coming off the first, which I liked but didn't love for many of the reasons she points out. She's not the only dissenter among reviewers, either. XBox Mag gave DS2 a 7/10 and pointed out a number of the same flaws Drake did.

#62 Posted by TheDudeOfGaming (6078 posts) -

Hint: The game will suck.

#63 Edited by JoeyRavn (4983 posts) -

@phrosnite said:

@pbhawks45 said:

@Klei said:

@phrosnite said:

IGN's review was hilarious. I don't know who that skirt was but she doesn't know shit.

This. I don't know who Audrey Drake is, but whenever she gives her opinion about something, I always wonder why she's tasked to represent IGN's views with her reviews.

Hey, let's lay off the misogyny, okay? Who gives a shit if it was a female reviewer? Jesus.

Because most woman are bad at video games? Her complaints made me laugh throughout the video(none technical/performance ones).

I'll side with here. I read the review without paying attention to whom the reviewer was and thought it was incredibly obnoxious. I found out later that she was a woman but, seriously, it doesn't matter. Man or woman, the review was bad. How the fuck is comparing the game's graphics to God of War 3 of any relevance? Not only that, but calling them "subpar" because they are not like God of War 3's...

Edit: Holy shit, this thread moves quickly.

Also, how did she wanted Vigil to "populate the world" if, you know, humanity has been wiped out from the face of the Earth?

#64 Posted by Drakoji (230 posts) -

@TheDudeOfGaming: Protips, I played midnight to 2 am, the game is good.

How does it feel?

#65 Posted by JeanLuc (3608 posts) -

@Klei said:

She wrote this like a 14 years old girl would have done. It's not very professional, to me, at least. People like her should stick to reviewing games such as Kingdom Hearts and stuff like that. No, i'm not being sexist, but I think Darksiders 2 isn't aimed at her at all.

Not going to lie, that sounds sexist.

#66 Posted by phrosnite (3518 posts) -

@stryker1121 said:

@Vashyron said:

@phrosnite: Not to say anything bad about her, but she was very quick to point out every single flaw with the game in the video review. It sort of felt like she was nitpicking, but I think overall, it just wasn't a game she liked to begin with.

I thought her text review was fair and pretty thorough. Kind of summed up my worries about the game coming off the first, which I liked but didn't love for many of the reasons she points out. She's not the only dissenter among reviewers, either. XBox Mag gave DS2 a 7/10 and pointed out a number of similar flaws as Drake did.

You note a magazine? You kidding me?

Anyways let's be civil here. D1 got worse reviews overall and I loved the game to bits. Most people say D2 is better so I'm a happy camper. 24th can't come soon enough.

#67 Posted by mosdl (3258 posts) -

@HatKing said:

@mosdl said:

@HatKing said:

Out of curiosity - and this probably isn't the place for it, but whatever - do you have an idea of why publishers embargo reviews until the release day? I mean, I get it if they know the game was disappointing, but this hardly seems like a bad game. I mean, THQ isn't doing great financially, and I think a few positive reviews right before launch might help push some of those on the fence. Feel free to educate this fool.

If you break their rules I am sure they won't be sending you any more review copies.

Oh, yeah, I get that. I was just wondering what the publisher's thought process is. I mean, maybe I'm naive, but I'd hope that a publisher would be confident about what they're putting out. In reality, do day one sales really mean that much? It's the shelf life. Really by embargoing the review until the day of release they're only hurting their biggest fans who want to know if the game keeps up. But, maybe I just don't get it.

You are thinking like a gamer. Since pre-orders and the first batch of sales numbers are important for business reasons (stock price, etc), they want to delay any potential negative information as much as possible. Those rules probably help sales of bad games, but you could argue that it mgiht hurt good games.

#68 Posted by kerse (2118 posts) -

I'm not sure what world you guys live in but 7/10 is not bad, calm down if you liked the first game you'll love this one.

#69 Edited by JoeyRavn (4983 posts) -

@kerse said:

I'm not sure what world you guys live in but 7/10 is not bad, calm down if you liked the first game you'll love this one.

I don't think the 7 itself is what bothers most of us, but the reasons she had to lower the score. For example:

There’s rarely enough happening onscreen to justify these MMO-like graphics. It looks good enough that it usually won’t distract from the adventure, but compared to similar games like God of War 3, the graphical presentation of Darksiders II is subpar.

Subpar because it made the conscious decision to chose this art style (consistent with the first game) instead of aiming for God of War 3's, while not being an MMO? OK. I can understand that the game may be repetitive or devolve into button mashing or whatever. But comparing it to God of War 3 and saying the graphics are subpar is total bullshit and has not place in any review.

Edit: Or this one:

Some of the textures are so pixilated they look like they belong on a Wii, such as the oft-used skull and bones pattern (which is alarmingly flat, and thereby entirely unconvincing).

Wii bashing? Welcome to 2008.

#70 Posted by Dixavd (1369 posts) -

I always found embargoes funny as they can only work for the first country that releases it meaning places like Euope get to read reviews before the games release anyway (which makes it look even sillier to those that have the game released first and don't get to see it until the day of release). I don't really understand why a company would force embargoes like these and not release a game simultaneously worldwide - I see the need for embargoes on one side (the most convincing argument being that you don't want a company to release a review immediately as they get a review copy to get all the traffic of people looking for reviews without actually playing/finishing the game so you put an embargo on it in the hopes that the reviewers would rather spend their time playing it to give it a propper assessment than simply waiting until they can release a review and making up a review) but I can never really take them seriously when they don't also release a game everywhere at the same time since not doing that always made it seem like a joke to me.

Also, I am talking solely about that since I don't have much interest in Darksiders II anyway. While I played and finished the first one, I didn't find it to be special in anyway (simply a good game that I enjoyed, but nothing enthralling - although I can see the parts which people would find exciting, it just seemed like one of those games where the difference between a good and a great scoring review for it was purely on subjective opinion) which I would class as a 7/10 so if the second is continuing to get those sort of reviews then I think that must be great since those that really liked the previous one will enjoy the second. I only really see any of the frustation people are having with reviews like that if the content is completely false; otherwise it just seems like a continuation of the quality of the previous one.

#71 Posted by phrosnite (3518 posts) -

@JoeyRavn said:

@kerse said:

I'm not sure what world you guys live in but 7/10 is not bad, calm down if you liked the first game you'll love this one.

I don't think the 7 itself is what bothers most of us, but the reasons she had to lower the score. For example:

There’s rarely enough happening onscreen to justify these MMO-like graphics. It looks good enough that it usually won’t distract from the adventure, but compared to similar games like God of War 3, the graphical presentation of Darksiders II is subpar.

Subpar because it made the conscious decision to chose this art style (consistent with the first game) instead of aiming for God of War 3's, while not being an MMO? OK. I can understand that the game may be repetitive or devolve into button mashing or whatever. But comparing it to God of War 3 and saying the graphics are subpar is total bullshit and has not place in any review.

Edit: Or this one:

Some of the textures are so pixilated they look like they belong on a Wii, such as the oft-used skull and bones pattern (which is alarmingly flat, and thereby entirely unconvincing).

Wii bashing? Welcome to 2008.

Yeah, it's not necessarily the score but the things she said. She contradicts things that other reviewers have said.

#72 Posted by Vashyron (221 posts) -

@pbhawks45: Okay, so she did like it. Just wasn't the best game ever for her. Thanks for correcting me. (shrug)

@stryker1121: Sure, I'm not saying she is wrong. It's her opinion and it would seem, as Van Ord points out in his review of DS2, that the 360 has a really bad issue of occasionally crashing. I would say that would merit it a few points down, at least on the 360 side of things.

#73 Posted by Marz (5671 posts) -

yeah I don't understand the IGN review of DS2 much when they score Kingdoms of Amalur higher on their scale.

#74 Posted by Hunter5024 (5961 posts) -

@Marz said:

yeah I don't understand the IGN review of DS2 much when they score Kingdoms of Amalur higher on their scale.

Save yourself some grief and don't compare 2 games' scores. That's not what reviewers think about when they're giving their scores out.

#75 Posted by Marz (5671 posts) -

@Hunter5024 said:

@Marz said:

yeah I don't understand the IGN review of DS2 much when they score Kingdoms of Amalur higher on their scale.

Save yourself some grief and don't compare 2 games' scores. That's not what reviewers think about when they're giving their scores out.

i will compare them, they are conceptually similar games and the complaints about Darksiders 2 art style, uninspired mechanics borrowed from other games can be applied to Reckoning as well.

#76 Posted by Heltom92 (714 posts) -

@Marz said:

@Hunter5024 said:

@Marz said:

yeah I don't understand the IGN review of DS2 much when they score Kingdoms of Amalur higher on their scale.

Save yourself some grief and don't compare 2 games' scores. That's not what reviewers think about when they're giving their scores out.

i will compare them, they are conceptually similar games and the complaints about Darksiders 2 art style, uninspired mechanics borrowed from other games can be applied to Reckoning as well.

Remember that they were reviewed by different people. Not everyone at IGN will have the same opinions.

#77 Posted by c0l0nelp0c0rn1 (1811 posts) -

@Vashyron said:

@pbhawks45: Okay, so she did like it. Just wasn't the best game ever for her. Thanks for correcting me. (shrug)

@stryker1121: Sure, I'm not saying she is wrong. It's her opinion and it would seem, as Van Ord points out in his review of DS2, that the 360 has a really bad issue of occasionally crashing. I would say that would merit it a few points down, at least on the 360 side of things.

Kind of like the screen tearing problem with the first game.

#78 Posted by Hunter5024 (5961 posts) -

@Marz said:

@Hunter5024 said:

@Marz said:

yeah I don't understand the IGN review of DS2 much when they score Kingdoms of Amalur higher on their scale.

Save yourself some grief and don't compare 2 games' scores. That's not what reviewers think about when they're giving their scores out.

i will compare them, they are conceptually similar games and the complaints about Darksiders 2 art style, uninspired mechanics borrowed from other games can be applied to Reckoning as well.

That may be true, but review scores are not determined by where a game falls in comparison to another game, they are determined by a gut feeling (and sometimes a stupid math problem) about how each reviewer felt about their own experiences with the product. And as Heltom pointed out this wasn't even the same reviewer so comparing the numbers doesn't make much sense.

#79 Posted by mikey87144 (1806 posts) -

@LikeaSsur said:

It's a good thing I've never relied on reviews. I know if I want a game or not, and I'm not waiting for a bunch of reviews telling me how good a game is before I go and get it.

I disagree. When Batman AA was being released I thought the game was going to suck until the reviews started rolling out saying it was great. Saints Row the Third is another example of me buying a game because the reviews swayed my initial belief of it's lack of quality.

#80 Posted by mikey87144 (1806 posts) -

@Marz said:

yeah I don't understand the IGN review of DS2 much when they score Kingdoms of Amalur higher on their scale.

Most sites now are trying to push that the reviewer gave game x a score and the publication stands behind it.

#81 Posted by amir90 (2178 posts) -

Well, it hasn't been released in Norway yet, so maybe they want to wait till everyone in the world can access it?

#82 Posted by Vashyron (221 posts) -

@c0l0nelp0c0rn1: Yeah. That shit happens, a lot of games suffer from it. It would seem that the developer has an issue with that that they haven't quite ironed out.

#83 Posted by Thumbrunner (133 posts) -

2 points/problems with this thread here from me. 3 if you count the fact that this thread has strayed so far away from the original posters question...

1.) If you want to play a game, play a game, forego reviews, be excited about it and make your own decisions. If you rely on reviews to make your mind up for you your doing it wrong. I understand people don't want to spend money on shitty games but if your worried about a poor review for a said game then you shouldn't even care about or want to play that game. Getting someones impressions on a game is not a bad thing that is not what I am saying, but don't try to justify your purchase by shitting on anyone for a review of a game they didn't like. Game journalism just like movie criticism is opinion based on that specific persons experience with a game not the end all be all definitive answer to the question should I buy any game.

2.) The fact that Ms. Drakes gender even came up in this debate is why I believe that most male game players believe that gaming is "theirs" and are completely terrified that this will "change games forever!" guess what Forty-seven percent of all game players are women, and adult women represent a greater portion of the game-playing population (30 percent) than boys age 17 or younger (18 percent) based on ESA stats. Games have not changed over the course of my 34 year adult male life and probably never will, women are 50% of our world learn to understand and deal with them and not be a sexist asshole or be forever alone. "Men" are not the greatest thing on this planet PEOPLE as a whole are...

/rant off

#84 Posted by Ravenlight (8011 posts) -

@Thumbrunner:

Not to belittle your (admittedly fine) rant, but can you cite your sources for those statistics?

#petpeeves

#85 Posted by Thumbrunner (133 posts) -
#86 Posted by Ravenlight (8011 posts) -

@Thumbrunner said:

they are already sited in my rant as "based on ESA stats" but if you want the page link here you go: http://www.theesa.com/facts/gameplayer.asp

GDI, that's what I get for failing to google properly.

The info you cited is hella interesting to me, thanks for posting a link so even I couldn't fuck it up :P

#87 Edited by HatKing (6108 posts) -

@mosdl said:

@HatKing said:

@mosdl said:

@HatKing said:

Out of curiosity - and this probably isn't the place for it, but whatever - do you have an idea of why publishers embargo reviews until the release day? I mean, I get it if they know the game was disappointing, but this hardly seems like a bad game. I mean, THQ isn't doing great financially, and I think a few positive reviews right before launch might help push some of those on the fence. Feel free to educate this fool.

If you break their rules I am sure they won't be sending you any more review copies.

Oh, yeah, I get that. I was just wondering what the publisher's thought process is. I mean, maybe I'm naive, but I'd hope that a publisher would be confident about what they're putting out. In reality, do day one sales really mean that much? It's the shelf life. Really by embargoing the review until the day of release they're only hurting their biggest fans who want to know if the game keeps up. But, maybe I just don't get it.

You are thinking like a gamer. Since pre-orders and the first batch of sales numbers are important for business reasons (stock price, etc), they want to delay any potential negative information as much as possible. Those rules probably help sales of bad games, but you could argue that it mgiht hurt good games.

I guess that's kind of my point. Are they really not confident this is a good game? It's certainly no Call of Duty, so it can use all the good press it can get. I mean, I've only played a few hours, but even still, I have no doubt in my mind that this game would get generally positive reviews. The way I look at it, THQ is in trouble. They need help. This game is one of their biggest of the year (their only?), and not that many people are aware of what it is. I mean, if they marketed this as the loot based game that it is, that'd help a lot, but they didn't, and nobody really knows (general public) what Darksiders is. So, that all in mind, why didn't they just allow the reviews to go up, like, a week ago to start generating some hype? I mean, it's either corporate bullshit (seems likely) or a lack of confidence (which seems rather absurd considering). I mean, I'm not mad about the situation, just - concerned. THQ is a good company, generally, and I'd hate to see them go because they're making silly marketing mistakes.

#88 Posted by Thumbrunner (133 posts) -

No problemo. I appreciate you for caring enough to see said article, more often then not people just except others words as gospel. I on the other hand love to do a lot of research to form a complete opinion based on real facts. Believe it or not folks google isn't to big to fail.

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