Can I run windows with an external gpu on the 2017 iMac's?

Hi, Duders

I'm getting back into PC gaming after being away since middle school, so about 2008. I've been working a pretty sweet job since graduating in May and I've been saving up to get a proper desktop machine. Right now, I think the best value to start is getting the base model of the 2017 iMac in the 27inch 5k display. I think this model gives me an incredible display (it's also a good all around machine) but also gives me less hassle when I want to make memory upgrades compared to the cheaper priced models. I've also read that external gpu's are becoming a popular option and I think this would be a great upgrade I can make later after the ram. I realize that gpu's are in short supply due to the Bitcoin bubble right now, but I'm pretty confident that there will be a lot of cards available in the future when that bubble full on bursts. I'm probably looking for something in the 1060 or 1070 range (again, I know they are harder to get than usual). Furthermore, I fully intend to dual boot this machine to also run Windows.

With the combination in the display, ease of upgrades and the ability to add-on graphics, is it a sound idea to get the 2017 iMac and make these upgrades later? Are there any technical barriers that I'll have to be aware of? If anyone out there has done anything similar please let me know. Have a good one.

Depends on what else you want to do with it, I guess.

I love Macs and OSX, but in my experience they're a hassle to get working with Windows sometimes. There will be some edge cases you'll run into where shit's broke, even if Boot Camp / Parallels works flawlessly the other 99% of the time. Add the X factor of an external GPU in (I didn't realize those were that popular?), and there's a recipe for a headache or two in there.

If most of what you want to do is to just play games, I'd recommend buying a regular PC and spending the Apple tax you'll save on a sweet monitor. If you're interested in getting a Mac for other reasons, then they're really nice.

Honestly that sounds like a terrible idea. What do you even want a PC for?

According to specifications this Mac has a rather good build in GPU. What's the point of using external one? Seems like a pointless hassle. Just remember that you won't play games in native resolution.

This seems like a bad idea. You might just go with an actual gaming PC and then pick up a cheap Macbook Air or something if you still really want a Mac. Unless you specifically need a Mac for some other reason that isn't stated here.

@alexw00d: I want to dual boot because while Mac OSX High Sierra is much better now at recognizing and handling external gpu's, all of the tests that enthusiasts on youtube and in blogs say that running the windows partition for PC versions of games always run far better than the Mac version. Essentially the PC partition would be just for optimizing game performance, as well as access to more games than if I was just running OSX.

Gonna echo what @mike said and go with a gaming PC paired with a MacBook. The iMac is $5k, plus another $6-700 for an external GPU.

I've never had an issue with Bootcamp, but another thing to note is that the Magic Mouse / Magic Trackpad are nowhere near as nice in Windows, and the Apple keyboard layout can get a little awkward when in Windows.

@kiwikuku: I would prefer to have an external card because when the new line of nvidia cards come down in price and become more available after this bit coin thing dies down, I can more or less future proof my machine. I'm also very entrenched in the apple ecosystem. I use iTunes, Apple Music, and have a good movie library built up over quite a few years. I also just prefer the build quality of the hardware. I do also have a professional use for it as well. My job requires a mac running osx and it would be nice to have a good machine at home so I can do development and testing on the side on something with more screen real estate.

I'm sure if the market for gpu's were different and I could actually get the card I wanted, I would just build a pc. But I want this machine to be usable for more than games out of the box and have room to grow, given those wants and needs, I think the 2017 iMac's work well.

@mike: I've thought about going the full on gaming PC route, but I have some professional reasons for wanting an iMac. Out of the box, assuming it's the baseline 27 inch model, I get a decent machine that can be expanded on with more ram and much more powerful external card. My work place uses Mac hardware and software for development and testing, so I would actually like/need a mac in this case. Also going strictly PC right now, is a actually more expensive than a speced out iMac, due to the intense shortage of gpu's and other components.

Under normal circumstances, you would be absolutely right that PC is the only and best way to go for gaming.

@laxbro19: Are you talking about iMac with Radeon 570-580? Because those are really close to 1060 and you really don't need external GPU.

@mikewhy: I absolutely agree that the magic mice and track pad are bad gaming peripherals, I actually have a decent mouse I use for work that I would plug into the back of the machine. However, I'm not talking about the Mac Pro in this scenario ($5K for that machine is the height of hubris). I'm considering the base model of the 27 inch iMac which starts at $1.7K with a 1TB fusion drive and a Radeon 570 Pro, it only has 8 gb internal though, so I would swap that as soon as I could (It's verified to handle 64 gb which is where I want the machine to be at some point). I also like that model because it's the cheapest one you can upgrade yourself without a special kit or technical know how.

I watched a video motherboard did where the Editor in Chief got the $1200 21.7 inch version htat only has 4 gb of ram and it took him 4 hours of complicated and delicate work with a specialized kit to add the ram. I'm just getting back into desktop games so that's way more hassle than I want right now. If cost weren't such an issue with specific parts right now, I'd go full PC for just gaming. But I also have professional reasons for using a Mac OSX machine as well just preffering the fit and finish of hardware itself and the overall balance of what I get out of the box. I also get a pretty chill discount because of who I work for.

Why not just regular PC? You get way better performance for the price (for example you could get better CPU, 2xRAM and same level GPU with half the price (tax included) of the imac you are describing).

Don't forget to include the 27" 5K screen, thunderbolt 3, keyboard and wireless mouse in any comparisons...

If it's for work, and OP works on Mac, I get it. I used to play on an entry level 27" iMac years ago. It's doable, much better than any of their laptops. But yeah, what you gain in usability you're losing in game performance, which is tough.

I ended up going the MacBook Pro + buying a gaming PC piecemeal.

Yes.

I'm just confused why you won't buy something that suits your needs, and are instead opting to buy something that doesn't suit your needs and are willing to spend upwards of a grand adding not particularly well regarded extras to it.

This seams like a really fun experiment that involves Boot Camp.

Wait, so can an external GPU feed back the image into the internal monitor?

I've never used an external GPU, but aren't they meant to connect to an external monitor, which would render a fancy internal 27" 4k monitor kinda useless?

@fisk0: Not sure if it's a Mac / Metal / OpenCL / hardware hack, but yes eGPUs can drive the internal display.

@laxbro19: I have that machine and it runs games excellently, but on the computer I am mostly playing RTS's and MOBA's.

@flagranterror: thanks for the feedback. I wasn't sure if anyone on here had gone that route or not. Do you mind if I ask how you play games on your machine? do you dual boot, upgraded the ram, run an external gpu? Just play it with the stock parts on OSX?

@laxbro19: I'm just playing with the stock parts on OSX. I also do some occasional Twtich streaming (via my PS4) and that gets pumped through a capture card connected to my Mac. Good performance there.

I used to have a gaming PC and be a little more enthusiastic about it but I'm a network engineer by trade and get enough of a computer fill during my workday, so I've dialed back. Everything that I run on my Mac works fine.

You're not going to really need an external GPU if you keep your gaming expectations in check. Keep things at 1080p medium/high and you'll be fine. Otherwise, you're asking your iMac to be something it isn't, while throwing a bunch of money at it to try to make it happen.

Even if you got an external GPU, that overhead is going to eat a lot of performance. If you're feeding that eGPU to a separate display which makes your iMac moot, you'll lose 20% performance. Feeding it back to your imac, you'll take an additional hit. Looking at the Techspot review, it looks like the overhead is causing a 1080 powered egpu to fall under 1070 performance levels and that's feeding to an external display.

https://egpu.io/forums/mac-setup/pcie-slot-dgpu-vs-thunderbolt-3-egpu-internal-display-test/

https://www.techspot.com/review/1575-external-gpu-gtx-1080-8th-gen-ultraportables/

If your iMac currently has just under 1060 performance and you want more, you're looking at $400-$500 for just the eGPU enclosure. Another $700(Holy crap) for a 1070. Then another $100 for a windows license. For $100 more LESS, you can get an HP Omen hex core i7 tower with a 1070.

http://store.hp.com/us/en/pdp/omen-desktop-pc-880-160se-2tb61av-1?

Crypto has screwed over the DYI GPU market bad...

@flagranterror: Thanks for the perspective. I also looked up a bunch of videos on youtube of people doing benchmark tests in gta and seeing what kind of results they get with the basic specs and it's pretty good from what I see. Adding in a bunch of ram upfront will probably get me where I want to be. Appreciate it.

If I was in that market at those prices I'd just buy the baseline Mac and a gaming PC as well. It would get you some PC hardware to do some of the basics you'd need on your Mac - email, browsing, and documents. That would be important if your income depends upon it, and you could play the games as intended without 3rd party hardware and O/S booting hassle. Carrying around external devices becomes a pain in the ass (so it tends not to happen), and if the port used for the graphics adapter on the Mac starts playing up, you wouldn't have a fall back whilst it's being repaired. A mid range PC will play most games nowadays since the platform usually offers graphic options. (edit: PCs have iTunes as well).