Honestly the most exciting thing I'm hearing here is that the dialogue sequences are less fucked up because that is the thing that consistently yeeted me out of any moment in the first game.

Especially replaying it on PS5 where it looks and runs beautifully and then you talk to anyone and instantly it's Yo What The Fuck?

@efesell: One of the most interesting things about the voice acting and facial animations is that they've clearly used a lot of character actors from film as inspirations for various characters to the point you spend almost as much time trying to place why you think you recognize this character that's super well animated and looks 80% and sounds 50% like someone you just can't quite put your finger on.

I'm talking to this dude right now that may as well be Harry Lennix (he played Captain Locke in the Matrix films and the general in the Superman/Batman movies) and the only reason I can't name more examples is I didn't get all the way there with the others.

A lot of the changes in this game are either minor and kind of confusing why they were even made in the first place, minor and very much appreciated, major but still connected to the same root systems as before. These conversations are legitimately interesting to watch. Probably the biggest strides in convo-tech since The Witcher 3; it's not quite the level of engagement as a lot of the minor conversations in Red Dead II were, but you'll just be talking to a merchant about a new weapon they can make for you and there'll be a whole scene playing out in the background, or characters uninvolved in the conversation or even the story at all that just happen to be in the room will butt in with a comment or exclamation.

It's a huge, huge difference.

Edit: I'd also wager that outside of the NBA 2K series this is by far the best rendering of minority skin tones and facial expressions I've ever seen.

Too much repetitive handholding in this game. Guerilla really needs to tone it down or add some toggle to turn it off.

I just started it and I think this will finally be the game where I sacrifice 60fps to get the full visuals.

alright! i just made through The Daunt and on the other side of the gate (into the 'proper' open world).

while there are aspects that are loosey-goosier than i remember (the climbing and related mobility puzzles can look and feel a bit rough around the edges), and some perplexing default settings (with the amount of items to pick up, did they really think people wanted to pulse on R3 constantly?)- this game (thus far) is basically exactly what i wanted! and it looks fucking great- landscapes pop with color, and the character facial animators really nailed it (Erend first game spoliers: when he recounts mourning his sister- he stares into the middle distance such that the facial expression feels utterly authentic).

if you weren't over the moon for HZD, this ain't it. but if you wanted more Horizon- they made some pretty rad changes. and holy shit, having a stash and some more inventory organization- GAME CHANGER.

will play some more and collect some thoughts, but tl;dr- game big! systems deep! aloy sassy! story movin-n-groovin!

There is an option to invert the new Focus controls, in case needing to hold R3 for full scan drives you crazy like it does me.

@efesell: ha, that's the very first thing i did (toggle was how it was in the first game anyway). focus pulse would have been fine if the icons didn't fade so damn fast!

speaking of which- i just set the UI to display all the item icons all the time. my head canon says that's how aloy would see the world through her focus, so eff it heh.

also- shout out to the devs for making the HUD so customizable again. the 'touch to display' thing (and the option to turn it off if you hate it) is so rad, i wish more games did it natively.

I thiiiiink I just hit the first big twist of the game like 6-7 hours in, and now I don't know how I'm gonna spend the next 20+ hours caring about the primitive tribal stuff....

Speaking of settings… there’s an option to just make the game load faster. By default it delays until you have the chance to read loading tips. You can turn this off to load as soon as it’s ready.

It’s an interesting approach to this “problem” with SSDs.

I think they've found an...interesting approach to the tribal politics and those (including me) who would be worried about being less interested. Mainly that Aloy doesn't have much patience for any of it either.

It doesn't hurt that, again, I just can't gush enough over how alive the NPCs feel in this game compared to the first. All of these characters benefit from being interesting to look at and talk to beyond just being vessels for information.

Somewhat surprisingly, it's the stuff I'd have thought I'd be interested in that I'm feeling a little ambivalent about. It's a lot harder to follow the logic of some of what this game is doing compared to the last game, and certain aspects worry me that the storytelling might rely on a lot of tiny conveniences and video gamey hand waving when it suits whatever epic set piece or plot point that needs to occur.

Plus, without saying much, one of my least favorite aspects of Zero Dawn was the random bits of tech magic. Think Hades flying through the sky and being trapped in Sylens' lantern. You could excuse it as a visual tool to show the player what's happening whenever Aloy sticks her spear in things, but there is a lot of tech magic in this game. There might be wizards?

But about 15 hours in I'd wager I'm at best 10% of the way through the story given the pace of information rolling out so far and implications of meeting the Far Zenith crew, your clone, and GAIA's exposition dump. Plus the amount of side activities and whatnot, which I will absolutely do because that's the sort of dude I am.

Yeah the way these dialogue scenes are structured is actually very impressive. I think it actually works as something of a new bar for games of this type to need to hit, it's time to stop starting side quests with two guys just standing near one another and B tier animating.

Also Aloy has some immensely powerful body language in this game as she meets wave after wave of people she wants to get away from Instantly.

@chaosnovaxz: Keep with it for sure, I'm a fair bit further than that and this thing took a HARD right turn(in a good way imo).

People thought the first game became more than what it seemed from e3 trailers....lemme tell ya.

I will say.... the climbing feels super janky now. It's more magnetized than ever before and has led to a couple of instances of me wondering why a jump didn't work when it looked like it should.

It's not going to really get in the way of enjoying the game or anything but with everything else being much crisper and better animated a lot of these jumps really stand out.

As the enemies and weapons have become considerably more complex (sidebar: it's not The Daunt that's way too long, it's that I'm 20-ish hours into the game and the weapons are just starting to get rare/blue, aka interesting and strong) another change they've made that I find pretty clever is tying certain parts to whether they're detached or remain intact when a machine dies.

In most cases, the most valuable loot in the game for upgrading and resale value will fall apart along with the machine if still attached, while many of the components that fuel their most vicious attacks contain tons of resources that are valuable for ammo and tool crafting.

Edit: I forgot to add why I thought of making this comment on Giant Bomb in the first place - Jeff and others' opinion that if the stealth combat makes the game too easy, but is a mechanic in the game, then it should be exploited at all times. By designing the structure of combat in this way, you're always guaranteed to get a good amount of basic and rare resources from the enemies, but you'll only get the best stuff you engage with the combat. I think it's a pretty cool risk/reward system.

It's one of those things that looks more than a little janky and I found pretty jarring early on when it was mostly just resource packs on Burrowers' backs, but now that I'm really having to consider what I need vs. what I'm desperate to crack off these beasts I'm having a really good time enjoying that extra layer to the combat - plus, it avoids the problem of having to constantly fight the same machines hoping for a good roll in their best loot at the end.

Oh, and while we're talking combat - digging the new beats. It's obvious they prioritized "really cool sounds" while they were composing the fight tracks. And outside of combat I'm enjoying the more orchestral additions to the usual skittering synthesizers of the first soundtrack. The whole experience in Plainsong was just...pleasant.

18 hours in and having a great time! Exploring the world feels a lot more satisfying now, thanks to it being way more lush and varied in comparison to HZD. Interacting with people also feels better because of the significantly improved animations, like many have already mentioned.

Janky climbing is my biggest complaint so far as well, but that feels like a very small problem, when compared to how much I’m enjoying it otherwise. I *almost* want to say Machine Strike too, but it’s not that it’s a bad ”mini-game”. I’m just way more interested in fighting cool machines and exploring a very cool world than I am sitting down to play a board game.

Tech-wise, I ended up favoring Performance. I can see the obvious fidelity increase in 4K, but when it still looks terrific with 60FPS, I just don’t feel like making the sacrifice.

Unless it scales up a lot more in this game stealth being overpowered to the point of making things too easy feels like an early game strategy. Once the machines stop dying to a single Silent Strike then it's kind of a waste of time compared to just loading up a good bow with enough mods to rip off components instantly.

I find myself reevaluating the climbing and actually it is bad enough to be a distraction. Specifically the Grapple Points.

These things look terrible and are incredibly finicky when you have to combine them with any actual platforming. It's another instance where you can change a setting to help a little bit. You can change to be Tap instead of Hold to initiate the grapple which is a little less akward to use but.. blegh.

Well, a cold front hit the Midwest hard and made the past two days negative 10-20 degrees with wind chill, so I spent way too much time sitting in front of a TV plowing through this game. I'm at just over 35% by the game's tally with nearly equal distribution of content (12 main quests, 12 side quests, 8 errands) ... and I've still got about 50% of the map shrouded in fog. The trophies say I'm in a pretty spoiler-laden portion of the game for most as I'm on pace with around 6% of PS5 players so I'll speak pretty non-specifically.

I think they've done a really great job of making all this stuff I was worried wouldn't be the most interesting stuff in the world quite interesting if ultimately hard to keep track of. There are so many characters, all with abstract/"tribal" names that can make them hard to remember whether I'd heard other characters mention them before. So while it has ultimately all turned into mush in my brain, I can't say that I've been disinterested by anything in the moment. And the main story is, to this point, quite interesting. Can't say I saw any of it coming.

The combat is at a point where it's spiraling in its breadth of builds and options at this point. Trouble is, because it's neither the best versions of the armor or weaponry I could possibly have, and I think I know what the game wants me to do to get it...I'm struggling to decide if I want that stuff badly enough to completely sideline the main story until I have it, or just accept something else I'm starting to ponder...that this game is more conspicuously designed to be play forever than the first was, and I should just get along with the main quest before using all this side content as an excuse to keep fooling around with the myriad weapons, gadgets, new enemy types and challenging side content, as most of the side quests and even some errands have stood out mostly for being far more dangerous than their similar-level main quests. Not really sure where the next 10-20 hours will take me in that regard, either.

All told, for me, Zero Dawn was essentially a perfectly paced campaign with just the right amount of combat complexity and puzzle solving. Forbidden West, as I said in the "positive things" thread, is giving me some kinship with big fans of DOOM Eternal I couldn't muster before. For one example, the shift from a limited but easily expandable inventory to an essentially unlimited inventory that is nonetheless artificially limited by expandable (through very hard to find materials) pouches, a seemingly static amount of items you can keep in your "inventory" on a given journey, and a completely unexplained "stash" that Aloy can't stop talking about you need to visit to re-up those static "inventory" stocks. It's...almost pointless, other than clearly trying to drive players towards more diverse playstyles and considering a given play session as more of an expedition than you ever would in the first game.

This is everything I loved about the first game - plus some Mario Kart, weirdly enough - dialed up to 15 in a way that makes it not feel so bizarre that I feel something like 2/3 of the way through the story and yet I've still barely scratched the surface of what's in this thing. I can completely understand why that would be off putting for a lot of people who put their hands on this game and I'm not surprised the subreddit has had a more mixed reaction to this game than one might've expected from a sub that's been about as active and passionate as Bloodborne's the past few years.

Unless I see something I wanna respond to this is probably the last big update summary I'll post in here, at least until the endgame or more people start getting into the thick of it and posting their thoughts here. I'll leave you with this: Spike Throwers might be the new meta. Seek the rare ones.

yeah, game very big. it'll probably be a few weeks before i'm prepared to have coherent thoughts beyond first impressions.

however one aspect i find fascinating is how many public figures in the games sphere have mentioned the so-called abrasive characterization of aloy. granted i'm not anywhere close to done (just saw the first big reveal/twist), so i don't really have a sense of her arc through the entirety of HFW- but even in the character moments from the start, through The Daunt and now in these first few quests in the 'main' world; aloy remains an overwhelmingly empathetic character to me. sure, she really doesn't have time for anyone's shit (HZD through HFW The Daunt spoilers:) (including her friends most of the time) but that seems pretty consistent with someone who's has no family, an identity predicated on someone else's enormously daunting identity, is 19/20, has a bunch of older dudes making (even if well-intended) advances and really isn't interested in adhering to social norms that personally embittered her. i've heard some comment the game is a rumination on loneliness- and for a headstrong young adult with trauma and a savior/imposter complex- everything seems pretty spot-on. despite all this- i still find she expresses moments of concern for others (though to be fair i think this more often happens in the side missions than the main line).

tl;dr- i dunno, she seems pretty understandable to me. but i suppose if the story isn't actively grabbing you- on a superficial level she can seem overbearing.

Aloy is a much better realized character in this game. I feel like if you go on about her being "abrasive" then it's just all you remember from ZD is her being sassy and irreverent. Which was always the weakest part of ZD to me because those moments made her feel like she was written for a different setting.

She is very focused in FW and I think the game does a decent job of examining what's good and also very bad about that mindset.

I'm having an absolute blast with this game and am thankful for its timing because SoulsBornes aren't for me and never will be. The thing that's really helped me, especially this week, is just looking at the IGN guide before I start a story mission not to read it or find out anything about the mission, but to just scroll the page mostly blindly to try to get an idea for "how long is this commitment?"

It's been great - I played up to a point on Monday night and saw the next story mission seemed pretty long, so I put it down and though "I'll focus on this tomorrow and it will be THE thing I do." I ended up being busy and by the time I was able to sit down and play, I knew I didn't want to invest that much into the game, so I did a couple side quests, checked out a couple question marks on the map. The rest of the week kinda played out like that for me with various other things coming up and I was grateful I didn't feel "locked in" to getting through a mission that would start feeling like a slog. With the weekend here, I still feel like I've made progress and am really ready to sit down with some uninterrupted time to tackle the next bug mission or 3 or 4.

@asmo917: I know the crew said they didn't find any of the side stories particularly interesting.

But I'm really enjoying them, for exactly the reason you mentioned. I love how easy it is to sit down and do random side stuff when you don't have time to invest in the big story beats.

Even in those, you still get a nice little self contained narrative.

@reap3r160: Exactly! Last night I was super burned out on life but did one side thing that took maybe 20 minutes that went: combat, storytelling, platforming, combat, stealth, combat, and a nice narrative bow* on the story. Perfect for what I wanted/needed.

*just a nice wrap up. As I was typing I remembered this was a game with a shitload of actual bows and I did not get one from this quest!

That's a good thread so far but I haven't played this so I can't judge.

If you wanted [spoilers], this game'll give you [spoilers].

Finished the story a few days ago with little over 50 hours played (though the email that I got from Sony said 66). It would probably be closer to 70-80 if I had done all the side stuff, but I stopped focusing on anything else besides the story and major side missions around 35 hours, because there’s just SO much of it. Even when I don’t have a compulsive need to clean the map of all the icons, it felt kinda exhausting to either hear Aloy or some of her npc buddies bringing up stuff that I should go check out.

In relation to Aloy speaking, there definitely was a noticeable contrast to see (hear?) between this and Elden Ring, which I was playing at the same time. I like Aloy and Ashly Burch, but this game really could’ve used some kind of dialog slider. Commenting on some stuff in the world’s fine, but it was pretty jarring how quickly she (or some npc with her) would tell me what to do in most situations that required a bit of thinking. Meanwhile I’m basically told nothing in ER after it’s first set of tutorials.

That said, I still enjoyed my time with FW. The story was neat (even if it stumbled towards the end), the combat still felt great (though you could remove like 4-5 of the weapons and I wouldn’t notice) and the very gorgeous world was cool to explore, even when it doesn’t have the surprise factor of something like Elden Ring. I do feel like they gotta shake things up more for a possible Horizon 3 cause this kinda did feel like Horizon 1.5. In the end.

I'm around 15-20ish hours in and I'm having a real blast with it. I can forgive pretty much all of the gripes I've heard about it as I just love being in that world and doing what you do. And even on performance mode its still one of the prettiest games I've ever seen.

I'm taking my sweet time with it as well. I'll play a few hours and drop it for a day or two or three. I think that's the best way for me to play it without getting burnt out as I'm doing most of the side stuff. I'm also playing Ghost of Tsushima right now at an even slower pace because I am in Act 3 and already kinda burnt out after clearing the whole map on my way there. I'm already weary about the DLC and not sure I want a sequel. Meanwhile, I know I'll be excited to play HFW Burning Shores in a few months because I'm more invested in the whole experience. I'm honestly curious to see how I'll feel though when I'm 50 hours into HFW which is why I'm writing this today.

I already feel like there are more weapons that I won't ever use, and maybe more choices than I need, but I also know there are plenty of 'build-centric' folks out there who love messing with that stuff and creating a playstyle they prefer. Maybe it feels a little out of place in a narrative driven game. I wanna like Nioh more than I do but one of the reasons is how menu heavy it is. So I'll chalk it all up to personal preference. I suppose choice isn't worse and I can avoid it most of the time.

Aloy sure doesn't shut up does she. And ya know what? I'm fine with it. I'm invested in her character enough that its like were in this together and I don't mind the internalizing out loud. Although she could zip it a lot more in the puzzle sections. That said, I think the mocap is incredible and I'm actually delving into all the dialogue as I go along, while enjoying the story and most of the characters so far.

Traversing is kind of ugly sometimes because its often hard to see what's climbable and using the focus and seeing all the yellow lines isn't all that pleasant against the beautiful world. I kinda let it slide more with the context of the focus having the ability to find optimal/possible climbing routes, which makes sense to me.

Anyhoo, I think that's about all I want to say about it for now since I've got quite a bit left to go in this journey. So far, I'm all in.

I've also got Ragnarok on deck still since I got it with my PS5. Between that, and everything on Game Pass and PS Extra I'm playing, I feel filthy fucking spoiled right now :P.

I definitely think that maybe they overthought the amount of weapons in the game. You only really ever seem to need two or three variants?

@rorie: I find myself just using bows and switching out damage types accordingly. And I just picked up a longer range bow that I started using. I've barely used anything else so far when it comes to the traps and whatnot. Some of the weapons also seem to have ammo that is more frustrating to acquire as well. I feel like I have too much for how early on I am. I have a frost bow and nothing really to use it on, for example, even though I'm wandering all over and doing side stuff.

@spacemanspiff00: Oh no, get on the spear/spike thing train my man! Specifically the one that drills into enemies, you can absolutely load them up and pop bunches of armoring off while stunning or nailing them to the ground for valuable time to focus on others. Was by far my favorite strategy, not only is it super useful but it looks and sounds brutal.