http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/aca45ff2-2ea0-11e6-bf8d-26294ad519fc.html

Well there it is :/

What's more interesting is that it won't be at E3 (Eurogamer article link confirming no show at E3)

I'm saved I guess!? maybe I will still get some reasonable money for my old PS4 this weekend after all. (I've been meaning to offload the thing for 3 weeks but been bloody lazy!) :(

Despite a resurgence in PC gaming and the popularity of smartphone games such as Angry Birds and Candy Crush Saga, PlayStation 4 become Sony’s fastest-selling console yet, reaching cumulative sales of 40m last month — far ahead of its rivals. Analysts at IHS, a consultancy, estimate that Microsoft’s Xbox One had sold 21m units at the end of March, while sales of Nintendo’s Wii U have struggled.

Wow, is that accurate? I knew Sony was doing better than Microsoft right now, but that's crazy. Why do I feel that every one of the people responsible for the always online / DRM / forced Kinect plans of the original Xbox One still probably has their job right now, when they really shouldn't?

I feel astoundingly frustrated for the staff at Xbox within Microsoft, those guys busted their asses on the Xbox 1, took a huge loss, fought again even harder on the Xbox 360, - finally gained some ground. They really were totally poised to strike this round too, they just had to stay on target and not fuck it up, but nope, along comes the Xbox One and holy crap the initial launch mess with that.... Jeff has spoken of it many times. So has Dan, Brad and maybe Patrick - all anecdotal stories of normal consumers *still* thinking you can't buy used games etc.

That whole launch was an ultra-combo-deal-xxl-weapons-grade fuckup, seriously. They had so much goodwill and pissed it away. Poor bastards.

@ohagan said:

Interesting. The door is open for Microsoft to win this E3.

@abrasion: @spaceinsomniac: The PS4 consistently outsold the Xbox One for many months after both launched and usually continues to do so. There was a black friday one year where the Xbox had a great deal and stopped a near year long streak of the PS4 outselling it. MS have tried to hide how many units they've sold, but places like EA and Gamestop have let it slip if you look at the numbers they're talking about in earnings calls. Back in January EA had a call which mentioned "55 million next gen consoles". Sony are all too happy to tell you at the time they had 36 million PS4 owners, so it doesn't take much math to figure out that leaves about 19 million Xbox One owners.

As for why, it's not just that Joe Average thinks you can't buy used games, in fact I doubt most Joe Averages even remember or would've heard that you couldn't. At the start that was a problem, but also at the start it was more expensive, assumed less powerful, required a kinect and so on. It just snowballed out of control for them.

I don't have the exact figures, but from what I understand, the Xbox One is still outselling the Xbox 360 at this point in its lifecycle. It's doing well. It's just that the PS4 is doing ridiculously well, far better than anyone could have expected.

While I can appreciate their philosophy of both consoles being treated as equal but different, not talking about it at E3 when everyone is already buzzing with speculation and instead doing it down the line seems like a strange move that might move the story away from them (especially if Microsoft does something crazy). Unless they're trying really hard to make the console come off as no big deal and superficial choice at best to try and stave off any potential ill will.

I don't envy Xbox though, even as someone that consider himself rational I still have a weird hangup about Xbox One since it's launch. I can best describe it as being invited to a party at the grocery store when you know everyone else got their invitation in the mail, I just don't feel like going anymore because I don't feel like it's an honest invitation.

@jesus_phish: @abrasion:

I just have to blame groupthink for something like this. Everyone says "that's a great idea," and everyone with sensible doubt keeps their mouths shut because they don't want to be seen as "negative" or "not being able to see the big picture."

I was so invested in Microsoft, with a nearly 50,000 gamer score, and after that console reveal I just went running back to Sony for the first time since the PS2. So stupid.

Totally yeah, it's more than just used games, it's the always online, the lower power - so many different variables in the Xbox One were poor vs the PS4. It still takes like 12434512541415415 years to install / patch damn games on the Xbox One. It's like the PS3 and 360 reversed roles! Xbox 360 used to patch fast, PS3 slow, now it's changed. Just made the Xbox One feel so rushed.

Regardless it's got a sour name and it's stayed sour and I think that's a shame, because competition is good and Nintendo has nothing to offer anymore.

I do hope MS stick in the race long term.

(Proportionally) those sales figures aren't far off the reverse of how the last generation was going 2.5 years in, and I don't think anyone now thinks of the PS3 as being a disaster - in fact by the end they were pretty much neck-and-neck... though I'm a long way from convinced that'll happen again this time ...

PS3 was a tortoise and the hare situation. I loved the heck out of mine, simply because I felt like the X360 was the online gamers console of choice (Gears, COD, Halo, etc) and the PS3 was the single player gamers console of choice, right up my alley.

It was my interpretation, of course the 360 had SP games but I liked my PS3 (I also liked not hearing a hair dryer)

I don't think the Xbox One would ever catch the PS4 at this rate :( not good. Competition is good.

As someone who has posted on this site in recent weeks about wanting to get into Playstation, I'm a little more than disappointed that Sony won't even discuss the high end console. What it will do is put a mire on everything they show at the press conference. They could show some incredible stuff but all anyone wants to know is what the PS4K can do and how Sony will handle it. I'm already one foot in the door for Sony but I would've really liked to have gotten more information before I make a buying decision. But if the price is really that much more significant than a base PS4 than I may just buy a base PS4 and be content with how that until a later date. The base PS4 isn't a slouch by any stretch, but it isn't a PC. I bet Microsoft is wringing their fingers and looking for a way to capitalize on the no show for PS4K. But at the same time, if Sony couldn't justify showing off a more powerful console at this years press conference than we may be in for some shit at the press conference that will blow our minds.

I really wanted to know more about this damn thing at e3. This is annoying.

Yeah, I'm kind of pissed about this as well. It feels like a really dumb move, but perhaps it's just too early. It would be really bad to show games on unfinished hardware, and then for them not to hit the targets with the actual release. Imagine the Watch Dogs downgrade controversy, only with an entire console. That would not be good.

The problem isn't so much consumers still being misinformed about the XBox One. I'm sure there are still people out there who have incorrect information about it, but that is not one of the likely big reasons the XBox One trailers the PS4 in sales. It's a combination of the XBox One being seen as the "less powerful system" as Playstation 4 having the larger initial install base, thus consumers who have friends with one console are going to likely buy that console to play games with them.

On top of that, XBox has always been a predominantly North American platform. The PS3 actually caught the XBox 360 in sales by the end of the generation just because they made up sales in other markets they had lost in North America. Microsoft doesn't have that luxury as they've never had any real penetration in Asian markets.

I wouldn't be overly concerned about the XBox One catching the PS4 though. It'd only be a concern if Nintendo had a resurgence and starts eating into the market share of both platforms.

My thoughts exactly.

This is a disaster for Sony, who will realistically buy a PS4 now? When they know this thing is coming?

@spaceinsomniac: Actually those people are all gone. The shift in design and focus on the Xbox One has been because Phil Spencer took over Don Mattrick's role

Do day one buyers of the PS4 get a trade in discount or something? If not my loyalty to Sony might take a hit.

@cav829: This is very subjective but to me it also seems like Playstation has the games. I see the games that come out, from big studios and indie teams, and really does seem like Sony is just knocking out of the park compared to microsoft when it comes to getting games on the platform. I'll see a game come up on the site that is really cool looking and about 8 times out of 10 it's only out on PC and PS4. As an Xbox One owner and someone who likes games in general, not just xbox games, I'm starting to feel left out of the conversation. That isn't to say that xbox doesn't have cool games coming, Below and Cuphead look cool, but Sony is just getting so many games so fast that it just seems like I have very limited options right now on my xbox in comparison. No Man's Sky might be the game that convinces me to get a PS4, because right now that game won't be coming my way for quite a while, if ever.

I really want to see the "acceptable" performance on baseline PS4 games (which is not great to begin with) will become once the Neo hits the market.

This is a terrible practice.

@laxbro19: For sure. Microsoft's early restrictive philosophy toward indie gaming sure did come back to haunt them. They couldn't have misread the direction of the market much harder. They've since walked back their day one launch parity mandate, but it of course takes time for developers to adjust back to that. And meanwhile, the larger install base of the PS4 means indie developers will prioritize development there. Mind you, I do think up until this year that the XBox One had a far stronger lineup of AAA exclusives (though Bloodborne was better than anything they put out).

Are they? Whatever gave you that impression?

I don't want to come off too dickish but are we totally forgetting about the great strides MS has made just in the last year? They've turned around the messaging and platform pretty well, and have shown that they're listening to owners as well as potential buyers. They're down in the numbers for sure, but usually it's just us on sites like this and analysts that really dive into that. As was said earlier, when friends ask me "what's better" it boils down to one word answers with caveats - the PS4 is currently more powerful - but do we see seriously noticeable differences? And are those differences noticeable to the masses that only buy the one console so they only know that one experience?

Sony is definitely up, MS has room to improve, but they're also not in any danger of dying out or exiting the console space - They're talking PC convergence, and more importantly doing something about it. If the rumors of Scorpio's performance are true, it'll change the conversation as well to Xbox when asking "which is better?" because the raw power of Scorpio Vs Neo seems tipped in Microsoft's favor.

MS made nothing but bad decisions from the gate with Xbox One, but I think Spencer is righting the ship and the course correction will continue. It'll be interesting to see if Sony becomes complacent or continues to innovate, even if this is going to be offered alongside the current PS4 it's just curious that they're not going to try to get out before potential Xbox One Slim / Scorpio press starts hitting.

I think a lot of us did. I'm bummed.

definitely, and the same for the NX

I won't even consider buying a PS4 or even more WiiU stuff until I hear what these new systems are going to be.

@spaceinsomniac: http://www.theverge.com/2014/3/31/5566768/microsoft-appoints-new-xbox-and-cloud-leaders

@nickhead: Yup, I guess I will have to continue to hold off on buying a PS4.

They'll just buy the higher-margin Neo later, then. Keep in mind MS is taking the exact same strategy, so it's not like anyone is going to jump ship (except to PC, which has been happening all along for years - many multiplats, the biggert ones, sell far better on PC now for good reason. Yes, I know there are exceptions especially when the port is terrible - but now the port-being-terrible is also happening more now on the consoles too with terrible performance on the consoles with Fallout 4, Just Cause 3, etc).

Guess I'm not playing Final Fantasy XV this year (Assuming no PC release) because I'm not buying a PS4 until I know what this Neo thing is all about. If they'd at least talked about it, what it's for and when they aim to bring it to market, I could have seen myself getting a normal PS4 instead of waiting (believing that I don't need it). While I simply don't know what the Neo is, I'm not going to purchase anything.

@joe_mccallister: I don't think anyone is saying MS is done. But right now the power of the console isn't the issue. There are more game related reasons to own a Playstation (base model or otherwise) than an xbox. A lot more developers this time around are targeting for a PS4 tather than an Xbox. Some developers don't even bother to port games from playstation to xbox, and if they do, not until a lot of time has passed. It's all well and good to have a 6 terraflop console, but what good is it if game makers don't put games out on the console? Now, let me be clear, MS is also doing alot to remedy this. Chris Charla is doing his best with the xbox indie division to add more, and exclusive, games. A console that soundly beats Sony's console could see a swing in neutrals who buy multi platform games ad just want the best performance for the dollar. That swing could really help MS court small and mid size game developers to consider coming out on Xbox and PS4 or even sign an exclusivity deal. I think that MS is playing a smart card by making there new console much more powerful than Sony's. But it's only a smart bet, it could still fail. there is also the aspect that alot of people may be too bought in to the Sony ecosystem to switch. All these things make this a really complicated time to play games and we might be thinking back to this time as an important period in the history video games and traditional business models.

Also Sony may be taking a calculated risk by not talking about the new console. If Microsoft's new console is really that much more powerful, than it would probably be wise to hold off and let a few weeks pass before a full reveal. As it was three years ago, Microsoft is going to be first up, and Sony's going to go much later in the day. This was important three years ago because Sony was able to react to the price announcement and take advantage of it accordingly. The same could be true this tie around but reversed, this time around Sony may have gotten information that says Microsoft is showing the new console and it really is that much more powerful than the PS4.5 and Sony may have decided to hold back and not get over shadowed immediately by Microsoft. Or the more obvious conclusion could be that the system isn't ready to go yet and they really have nothing they feel comfortable to show. I'm not of that mind. This is effectively a more powerful version of the thing that we have already. It should be in a state where we can at least get some target renders and gameplay if not a mock up unit on stage, if it's really coming out as soon as everyone says it is.

Well, confirmed not to show up this year. Very much confirmed that Sony doesn't think its needs to put it out this year. or even discuss it...so confirmed what? Confirmed Sony is unsure if it needed it...ever. I think this makes Neo less likely, and in turn I think this new makes Scorpio slightly less likely. If NX is not all it cracked up to be in processing power, if VR is taking off much slower, andif Sony is sticking with a PS4 it can sell at $199; then what is Microsoft really going to do in 2017?

Does Microsoft need Scorpio if it wil be the most expensive console out in 2017?

From my view this news seems to be saying, Neo and Scoprio are a lot LESS likely now than they have been in the past 12 months.

@laxbro19: I can agree with the fact that devs are targeting PS4 primarily but I think that's just smart business, right? If you've got one platform with 40+ mm units and the other has half that - you're going to play the numbers and not wait out the hopeful (if even plausible) Microsoft comeback. But you can't deny that if headlines start showing "60fps reliably on Xbox Scorpio, 35 on PS4" that drum will get beat to the point that eventually the mainstream consumer just says "well I heard it's better" which could be true and could not be. You're dead on though, most consumers aren't going to by a second console, and it's going to be a hard bargain to convince them to switch.

Both platforms have their problems - I think both are incomprehensible from a "I just want to find my god damned games" perspective, there are social kinks that need to be worked out, and overall they've got to figure out how to run more games better. I think the most interesting part of this whole Neo/Scorpio thing will be messaging and marketing. How is Sony going to come out and say "if you're in the market buy this, but don't wait for this, or I mean sure buy that too but..." it's an unenviable position to have 2 skus because even the base-model isn't considered "entry level" at $350 (common pricing for bundles I'm seeing).

@joe_mccallister: Considering the Scorpio is going to be a small subset of an even smaller subset, how much time/money will developers spend? If Neo can do 1080/60 reliably isn't the Scorpio's extra power overkill unless you own a 4K TV. I have a hard time seeing a games being 1080/30 on the standard PS4/XB1 and 1080/60 on the Neo/Scorpio much quicker/cheaper to just have slightly better IQ, games can be more or less identical across both platform so it doesn't look like your selling a gimped version for standard owners.

I am sure there will still be sales, but yes, this just has to impact some of the bottom dollar surely.

If it's not obvious from my op, I'm with you 10,000% on that stance. I didn't ditch PC gaming for no reason. I like the fixed platform and simplicity. I love the equal playing field. I'm not happy about this thing at all.

@thepanzini: Good point - I think it really depends on how that whole x86 and porting come into play right? If they're making PC the priority development platform, then port to Xbox and PS4 at the same time, I'd like to think it's as easy as High/Ultra settings for Scorpio and Neo, then low-med for the current skus. Of course I don't have the experience of know-how to back that up so it's total speculation, and I know there's no magic "export to PS4 button" but I'd like to thing we're reaching some sort of convergence in development to help those game makers get their experience in more hands quicker.