aromaticflower

That's a fair point of view, but one I disagree with. Its a good example of what I was saying: just because we have a different idea of what being politically moderate or having common decency means doesn't mean we can't respect each other and share a forum :)

I think one good thing that could come from this is moderate people caught on either side of a damaging, politicised divide getting to mix together and share in their mutual appreciation of video games

100% this! I have a bias check I like:

1) does your narrative boil down to good guys vs bad guys (us vs them)?

2) are you one of the good guys in this story?

If you answered yes to both questions, there is a good chance you're biased and haven't thought hard enough about it :P

He chose to write it because he believes its a complex issue that demands more critical thinking and discussion. It seems like your stance is devaluing his point, but if this was your intention I apologise.

Haha, I live about ten minutes from Salford, so I might have to take you up on that :D

It sounds like you agree with nearly everything I said! Most importantly the bit about race being a big deal here. I think it will only get more so as well. I suppose part of my point is that it takes a LONG time to supercede literally hundreds of years of political culture. It may well happen eventually though, especially if those who stand to gain from it (tories, UKIP, Sun etc) get their way

Heh, we took a long, long road to get there but we got there in the end :P

Do I think racism is an important issue in the UK? Yes. Did I say it wasn't? No. Do I think racism is much more culturally relevant in the US (because of their history)? Yes. Do I think economic class is much more culturally relevant in the UK (because of our history)? Yes. Do I think economic inequality is an important political issue in the US? Yes. Is it treated as seriously as I think it should be? No. - just to clear up my stance so you don't have to read between the lines :P

Btw, have you ever been to the US? Even having been immersed in US culture pretty much my whole life, I was shocked at how pervasive and obvious the divides appeared. And I'm from Liverpool, if you can find a black man and a white man there who would rather dispute who has it easier in English society than to talk about fucking up the Tories, I would be amazed :)

I was replying to Austin's assertion that, because critics aren't lobbying for legislation, they are not exerting significant force on the creative landscape. I tried to give an example of how people can, intentionally or otherwise, influence creativity in the service of their own moral agendas. I think maybe you've taken my comment as more aggressive than it was intended to be and this is causing you to focus on what you perceive to be my own negative feelings about the gaming press.

Because you brought it up, I do believe there are people in many walks of life who are lying liars, bullies and tricksters who do things for personal gain and it would be naive, in my opinion, to think gaming is immune to that. And as I also said earlier, the negative impact of people promoting their own moral agenda can be extreme whether they mean well or otherwise.

Also, I stand by my earlier comment that social influence and persuasion are extremely powerful and no amount of agency or intelligence guards against it entirely. I was being tongue in cheek about the nazis, but they remain perhaps the best example of this we have in our culture.

We were talking specifically about the discussions about morality and computer games, which are focused nearly entirely on race and sexuality. God knows inequality is a huge issue in the US, but I definitely don't think it gets a platform befitting of its importance in US politics (but again, that is a slightly different question and I am not really qualified to talk about US politics). As I implied above, I think there are good historical/philosophical reasons why different social justice issues have a different emotional weight in different places, which is the point yothatlimp made, which I was agreeing with.