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Egge

Controversial opinion: I like save-scumming. Acquiring a lot of loot in Deathloop and dying just before I exit the map is not fun.

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Why Dark Souls on PC will very probably save the world

By now the unofficial confirmations regarding a possible upcoming PC port of From Software's unapologetically hardcore action RPG Dark Souls are numerous enough that it's no longer meaningful to file this in the "rumors and wishful thinking" category. With that in mind, here are the top three reasons why I personally think having this game on PC is such a great idea;

1) Ensuring the long-term preservation (as well as incremental enhancement) of a truly great game.

Being able to play old games can be a hassle regardless of platform but console hardware developers such as Microsoft and Sony aren't exactly helping by severely limiting or even going so far as to actively strip out backward compatibility from their dedicated gaming systems, and the infamously subpar quality of (some) so-called "HD" re-releases of late don't inspire much confidence in the motivation of publishers to keep their older console games fully and faithfully playable on future entertainment rigs. Now, the PC platform has its own share of problems - enough of them, in fact, that entire commercial services (such as The Artist Formerly Known as Good Old Games) have sprung up to deal specifically with an increasing demand for easily playable classics patched up to work well with modern computers and OS setups. But the operative term here is "patched", since the inherent flexibility of the PC platform obviously allows both commercial and non-commercial actors to tinker directly with the game files and develop workarounds which adapts or even tricks the product in question to function properly on current operative systems and hardware configurations. An added bonus in this respect is modability, but at least in the case of Dark Souls I have a feeling that the focused design of the game in question makes modding a comparatively superfluous activity. User-made high-res textures, custom shaders etc. make a certain amount of sense but I'd probably put such efforts in the "modern compatibility" column since they don't directly influence gameplay.

It goes without saying that none of this perhaps needlessly pedantic concern with preservation would mean much if the actual product we're concerned with here wasn't worth saving from the slings and arrows of outrageous backward incompatibility in the first place. But despite not actually having played much of Dark Souls myself (I own PS3 copies of both Demon's Souls and Dark Souls but have only played the former game extensively), judging from what has already been written about the grim brilliance of From Software's latest RPG I think it's already fair to say that it's one of the finest releases in its genre during the current hardware generation. Whether or not the cool but not altogether essential online functionality is switched off at some point - and here the PC as a platform could presumably make unofficial networking solutions a viable option - the mere thought of having this challenging, lengthy, multi-layered and extremely replayable RPG experience readily available on digital distribution networks such as Steam etc. for many years to come is enough to warm my old school heart.

2) Increasing the likelihood of more frequent console-to-PC ports of high-quality niche titles.

Provided that all those petition writers and forumites who have expressed their strong desire for a computer version of Dark Souls manage to put their money where their mouths are and actually support this PC release the game could do very well indeed; both immediately at launch and during a longer time frame which includes the inevitable price drops and Steam sales etc. In turn, that would make it somewhat more likely that the recent bout of more or less unexpected PC announcements (including Warren Spector's Epic Mickey 2 and Yakuza developer Toshihiro Nagoshi's Binary Domain) might become a real trend and carry over into the next console era, during which increased technological parity between consoles and PCs should at least in theory make the business of porting a less jarring "oh shit, this looks awful in 1080p"-kind experience.

More specifically, Dark Souls is probably the one big test case in terms of an almost universally acclaimed but still relatively niche title, which in all likelihood would never have been ported if there hadn't been a very vocal demand for it among both ordinary gamers and more professional journalists and media content producers alike. The broadly Westernized aesthetics might seem to make this is a somewhat special case, but I personally doubt that since one would have expected to see a lot more of, say, King's Field on PC if this line of reasoning was correct. Thus, a successful PC port of Dark Souls potentially could play a significant role for future PC releases of previously console-exclusive Japanese games.

3) Promoting a cease-fire in the unhelpful console/PC culture wars.

This third point is rather speculative, and there have admittedly been some not entirely unreasonable arguments made for why Dark Souls - with its' gamepad-oriented control scheme and resolute lack of quickload functions - could very well end up alienating at least those exceedingly dogmatic PC players who conflate platform standards with design imperatives (which even otherwise well-meaning enthusiasts sometimes do). If that indeed turns out to be the case, it's their loss.

However, I do believe that Dark Souls represents a golden opportunity for those often uninformed skeptics who mostly associate console gaming in general with, say, Gears of War and Final Fantasy to discover the rich Japanese subculture of challenging and often surprisingly Western- and/or PC-influenced console titles. Indeed, apart from their most recent titles Demon's Souls and Dark Souls, it's not hard to see why From Software's focused gameplay and understated art design have enabled them to make a breakthrough of sorts in the West at the exact same time that some of the Eastern heavyweights such as Square-Enix are disappearing further down the rabbit holeof tired JRPG conventions. Ideally, Dark Souls could serve as a rebuttal both to the notion that all Japanese games are messy, impenetrable and influenced by the least tasteful anime imaginable as well as the embarrassingly wide-spread idea that console games by definition are dumbed-down and shallow compared to PC games.

But, yeah, all I really wanted to say with this is that it sure is nice to know that there's going to be at least one version of this game without the much-discussed frame rate issues in Blight Town...

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MrBoBo

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@Humanity said:

@whyareyoucrouchingspock said:

@Kaiserreich said:

@whyareyoucrouchingspock:

Total war more polished than than Paradox? It's like you've never even played a Total War game at release, Medieval II and Empire were broken when they came out.

http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561197970701643/games?tab=all

When it comes to low quility pc games, Paradox are the worst offenders. I'm not saying all the games they put out are terrible. Some are very good and have that niche pc appeal.

However, saying they are as polished as Total War (or most games) is folly. With Total War I can take it from practically any angle to use that argument. Even something like Empire, part of the reason it had problems was due to the sheer scope of it practically 0 AAA games can touch to this day. With Paradox little or large, they tend to just get banged out the door. It's more quantity than quility.

Alot of the games sell good as well. Magicka sold something like, what was it? 1-2 million units and 4 million DLC sales? Thats more than Shogun 2. Yet the game has nowere near the polish or budget.

Imo it didn't deserve those sales at all given the state it was in.

When its a bad console port, pc gamers complain and throw hissy fits. When it's a low quility pc game in an even worse state, they totally ignore it because it's a pc game basically.

Bad mentality.

The problem is you probably shouldn't be playing high quality console titles on a pc. You should use your pc to write documents or play Bejewled but leave the gaming to real gaming machines. Listen I'm not saying you can't play games on a pc - I played Minesweeper when I was younger too. You should just leave great atmospheric games and stop ruining them by trying to recreate the magic on a pc. Total War is a great example, it is like an excell spreadsheat with animated moving tamagotchis on your screen.

Trolling needs work.

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whyareyoucrouchingspock

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@Humanity said:

@whyareyoucrouchingspock said:

@Kaiserreich said:

@whyareyoucrouchingspock:

Total war more polished than than Paradox? It's like you've never even played a Total War game at release, Medieval II and Empire were broken when they came out.

http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561197970701643/games?tab=all

When it comes to low quility pc games, Paradox are the worst offenders. I'm not saying all the games they put out are terrible. Some are very good and have that niche pc appeal.

However, saying they are as polished as Total War (or most games) is folly. With Total War I can take it from practically any angle to use that argument. Even something like Empire, part of the reason it had problems was due to the sheer scope of it practically 0 AAA games can touch to this day. With Paradox little or large, they tend to just get banged out the door. It's more quantity than quility.

Alot of the games sell good as well. Magicka sold something like, what was it? 1-2 million units and 4 million DLC sales? Thats more than Shogun 2. Yet the game has nowere near the polish or budget.

Imo it didn't deserve those sales at all given the state it was in.

When its a bad console port, pc gamers complain and throw hissy fits. When it's a low quility pc game in an even worse state, they totally ignore it because it's a pc game basically.

Bad mentality.

The problem is you probably shouldn't be playing high quality console titles on a pc. You should use your pc to write documents or play Bejewled but leave the gaming to real gaming machines. Listen I'm not saying you can't play games on a pc - I played Minesweeper when I was younger too. You should just leave great atmospheric games and stop ruining them by trying to recreate the magic on a pc. Total War is a great example, it is like an excell spreadsheat with animated moving tamagotchis on your screen.

As far as a "real gaming machine" goes the pc generally outclasses consoles in multiple regards in factually objective (not subjective) ways. I agree though these "spread-sheet" games (as in sophisticated games) are and generally always have been better on the pc thanks to the controls and the audience. Even if motion control allows consoles to start playing strategy games properly, they will be incredibly simplified. Console gaming imo is very much coke can production lines and the people putting the games out assume (them not me) that the console audience are stupid little kids or dude bros. If you read the kickstarter for "hardcore tactical shooter" thats exactly what the project lead discribed when he presented his game to publishers.

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Humanity

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@whyareyoucrouchingspock: I agree PCee's are great machines, I am using one right now. I'm just worried that the game market where cool bros can enjoy games and have fun will get tainted by the PCee users that want to bring their spreadsheets to my easy going home atmosphere where I want to leave worries behind me(my computer is behind my living room). Coke is a product enjoyed by millions of people and I am happy you used that analogy to show how much joy console gaming can bring to the world - while the brooding fine wine PCee crowd sit at home in the dark, getting drunk and beating their children, an objectively not happy image I think?? Glad that Takedown got funded in the end, just barely, I was scared that maybe there wouldn't be enough people that want to play the sort of "game" that developer is proposing. Back on topic though, Dark Souls is a wonderfully atmospheric game that a lot of cool doods can enjoy right now, I think people should really give it a shot if they have one of the main console platforms out on the market right now. When it comes out on the PCee it might still be fun but they might not be able to port it right because the intricate "fun code" (technical term, not my own) is hard to duplicate from the console original.

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spazmaster666

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Considering my main complaint with Dark Souls was the, at times, abysmal framerate, a PC version would definitely be very welcome. I just hope the game sells well enough on PC so that we'll see more JRPGs start to come to the PC.

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whyareyoucrouchingspock

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@Humanity said:

@whyareyoucrouchingspock: I agree PCee's are great machines, I am using one right now. I'm just worried that the game market where cool bros can enjoy games and have fun will get tainted by the PCee users that want to bring their spreadsheets to my easy going home atmosphere where I want to leave worries behind me(my computer is behind my living room). Coke is a product enjoyed by millions of people and I am happy you used that analogy to show how much joy console gaming can bring to the world - while the brooding fine wine PCee crowd sit at home in the dark, getting drunk and beating their children, an objectively not happy image I think?? Glad that Takedown got funded in the end, just barely, I was scared that maybe there wouldn't be enough people that want to play the sort of "game" that developer is proposing. Back on topic though, Dark Souls is a wonderfully atmospheric game that a lot of cool doods can enjoy right now, I think people should really give it a shot if they have one of the main console platforms out on the market right now. When it comes out on the PCee it might still be fun but they might not be able to port it right because the intricate "fun code" (technical term, not my own) is hard to duplicate from the console original.

@spazmaster666 said:

Considering my main complaint with Dark Souls was the, at times, abysmal framerate, a PC version would definitely be very welcome. I just hope the game sells well enough on PC so that we'll see more JRPGs start to come to the PC.

Unless pc gamers decide to pirate it in spades (they probably will) or it's a terrible port (it could well be) I think it should sell well on the pc.

When it comes to hardcore gaming, pc is generally the platform of choice. Dark Souls seems to be a very rare exception of modern console gaming.

I generally couldn't care less about JRPG's but I understand anime and what not is very popular with kids these days. At the moment the pc mostly has derivative MMO's when it comes to Asain games. A few interesting indie games popped up though.

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zeforgotten

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3) Promoting a cease-fire in the unhelpful console/PC culture wars. 
 
Hah.. hahaha.. HAhahahahahahahahah, oh god.  
I'm sorry but that's just not gonna happen, ever. Kids will act like kids and lesser lifeforms over 20 will also act like kids. 
 
Rest of the blog was a good read though
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The worst part is the already archaic UI the game uses might possibly feel even worse on a pc. The rigid Resident Evil-esque way of picking up an item and getting that big blocky box come up saying you picked up a sword, press SPACEBAR to continue. The framerate issues were strange because Demons Souls featured levels just as expansive as some areas in Dark Souls yet it suffered almost no slowdowns apart from fire-lag. The 4-1 area of Demons Souls is pretty expansive, with flying Manta Rays crowding the sky and huge vertical dropoffs - practically no performance issues. Also peculiar that for a game whose engine has so much trouble rendering fire without completely bogging down the fps they choose to make a whole narrative based on fire with enemies being prevalently weak to fire. There was also input lag which I'm not sure if they fixed on consoles (curious how they'll implement the kick, is it just going to be a seperate key press?) Controls overall are not very PC friendly. If they leave the clumsy lock-on system, that will feel quite awkward with a keyboard and mouse. At the same time if they abandon the lock-on in favor of having the player just aim his attacks with a reticle I can only imagine the already clumsy, tank-like movement of the player-character will make combat insufferable.