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    The Elder Scrolls V: Skyrim

    Game » consists of 30 releases. Released Nov 11, 2011

    The fifth installment in Bethesda's Elder Scrolls franchise is set in the eponymous province of Skyrim, where the ancient threat of dragons, led by the sinister Alduin, is rising again to threaten all mortal races. Only the player, as the prophesied hero the Dovahkiin, can save the world from destruction.

    In Defense of Oblivion

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    TheDudeOfGaming

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    #51  Edited By TheDudeOfGaming
    @Laketown said:

    you forgot the part where the main story was bad, there was like 6 voice actors + patrick stewart, and the terrible dialogue interface.

    And Sean Bean, i mean come on, the dude played Boromir...BOROMIR! 
    Anyway OP, you didn't actually make an argument for the level scaling, it's what destroyed Oblivion. 
     
    @Badhands
    Dude, level scaling...i understand you can like the game but level scaling dude. That's really the only argument i need.
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    lmenzol

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    #52  Edited By lmenzol
    @Storms: oblivion was the first 360 game i ever played it got me back into playing games in the first place. its still my favorite game in my collection
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    The_Nubster

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    #53  Edited By The_Nubster
    @President_Barackbar said:

    @The_Nubster said:

    3. The game is bland and lifeless. There werne't enough voice actors, the conversation were all the same, the daily routines were basically "walk here, talk about mudcrabs, walk here, talk about thieve's guild, go to bed".

    You are so right, I forgot about all the rich voice acting in Morrowind...oh wait

    So you're saying they didn't fix it? I can see why that would be a sore point. If something in your game is so noticeably bad, get around to making it better on the next try.
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    kashif1

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    #54  Edited By kashif1
    @TheDudeOfGaming said:
    @Laketown said:

    you forgot the part where the main story was bad, there was like 6 voice actors + patrick stewart, and the terrible dialogue interface.

    And Sean Bean, i mean come on, the dude played Boromir...BOROMIR! 
    Anyway OP, you didn't actually make an argument for the level scaling, it's what destroyed Oblivion. 
     
    @Badhands:  Dude, level scaling...i understand you can like the game but level scaling dude. That's really the only argument i need.
    whats with the level scaling complaints, I never ran into any problems with it, then again i never slept.
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    Bollard

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    #55  Edited By Bollard

    Oblivion was amazing and everyone who doesn't believe it is crazy. Morrowind was cool and all, but Oblivion captivated me way more. 
     
    @IamTerics said:

    Something about Oblivion always put me off. I never felt like I was doing any damage or playing it right. Morrowind I only remember was the first big open RPG I played.
    Epic DP bro.
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    Getz

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    #56  Edited By Getz

    Morrowind was deeper; more factions, more dialogue, more choices, more weapons, more story. Not saying it was all good, but the sheer magnitude of that game left me speechless through my 300-some hours. Oblivion sacrificed a lot of that breadth for a denser, more detailed and polished presentation. Some people resented that; who are you to say they're wrong?

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    DAFTPUNK

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    #57  Edited By DAFTPUNK

    Oblivion with mods is fucking awesome!

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    Storms

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    #58  Edited By Storms

     

    like it or not, it is more realistic to have more people you don't interact with at all, like the hundreds of people you pass on the freeway every goddamn day, and a few that you do interact with like coworkers, friends, family, etc, than it is to have a few people that will all STOP IN THE STREET ON THEIR WAY TO DO NO MATTER WHAT as soon as some random ass fucker says Hi, and then doesn't even have anything to say to you in the first place. Like it or not, the shit you are defending CAN be done MUCH better 

    Well, I don't like how it worked out. I'm just glad they gave it a try. It didn't work so well but it also wasn't that big of a deal. I can certainly understand the appeal of a game where if you so choose, you can talk to anyone, even if you cannot understand why choices are good in a game like this. And it probably would have worked better in the pre-VA era with a lot more dialogue writers.

    Are they awful? Maybe not. 


    Well, at least I got you to admit that not every little flaw or thing that didn't age superbly was "awful" like so many Oblivion-bashers say.  Now that we're past that drama...
     


    that AWFUL fog 


    awfully dull 


    looks fucking awful  


    Never mind.   
     

    it just looks like WoW, because it's the same lazy ass way of hiding LoD and the lack of rendered objects


    Except not. If that were the purpose of the fog, it would be there all or most of the time. Like Morrowind. 

     The big "thing" in the game, Oblivion gates, was just you fighting through a bunch of dudes, and getting a stone.

    How is that "the big thing"? I think you have a fundamental misunderstanding of the point of the series. The "big thing" is role-playing. Because you know what? Last game I played, my character was a fanatical devotee of the Nine Divines, and entered every Oblivion gate she found and closed it. My current playthrough? My archer/ranger/druid just sneaks up, snipes the baddies milling around outside the gate and continues on his way. How can something that's mostly avoidable (there's just the one in Kvatch, the one at Defense of Bruma and then the semi-necessary "Allies for Bruma" quest) even in the "main" quest the "big thing"? You might as well call Alchemy the main thing because you're going to drink a potion at some point. Everyone knows they only called it Oblivion because anyone that told people "I'm playing The Elder Scrolls IV: Cyrodiil" would be laughed at (and the main quest of stopping Mehrunes Dagon lent them a cooler-sounding name than the main setting did).  
     

    The water actually flows, and not just in the waterfalls, with EVERYTHING else being the exact same flat, ripply water., like in Oblivion. There are rocky areas, diverse vegetation, better textures and models, more density, and much better draw distances, and everything isn't ruined


    Yes, we are all aware that Skyrim is a newer game. Thanks for reminding us. And all that is very cool and will make the series even better, but I wouldn't tear Oblivion up over not having it any more than I'd trash Morrowind, Twilight Princess or Final Fantasy XII over lacking them.   
     

    But EVERY bit of forest looks IDENTICAL to every other bit


    Again, who do you think you're convincing by saying things that are demonstrably false to people who've played the game and seen it for themselves? The West Weald, although not as thick as I'd like it, was full of towering hardwood trees that filtered out the light. The Blackwood was filled with trees like mangroves, willows and ash. The forest area south of Bruma had trees like birches, maple and oaks, that were often displaying colorful autumn leaves -- and that's hardly the limit of the diversity. I'll give you the benefit of  the doubt here and say you're making  absurd exaggerations rather than trying to outright lie. 
     

    The 30 hits thing is totally true on harder difficulties. And 5 hits would be lower than normal, I still play Oblivion, and at the normal difficult, even the little skamps take more than 5 hits from a silver axe with a newer character


    wat.  
     
    Are you really defending this claim with qualifiers like "if you have the difficulty up" and "with a newer character"? Did you really just go there? You realise that opens me up to saying "turn the difficulty down", yes? I mean, if I wasn't being reasonable and speaking of the game only at normal difficulty. Sheesh.
     
    @TheDudeOfGaming: Level scaling was the biggest problem in the game, like I said. But there were 20 different work-arounds for it, not including balancing mods (and you can't completely dismiss mods when it comes to TES). For instance, choose which skills to make major skills wisely, and the leveling will go smooth.  Not that this means Bethesda made a great system for leveling but it hardly means they didn't earn yet another Game Of The Year. 
      
    @The_Nubster: Oh, please. There was no change in voice acting from Morrowind to Oblivion? All NPCs did in Morrowind was say some variant of "hi" as you walked past. It really did improve between III and IV, just not quite enough.
     
    @Getz: Nice rhetorical device.  Who are you to say they're right? People would have been way more pissed if Oblivion didn't change in technical capabilities from Morrowind just so we could keep spears. As far as the story, that's nostalgia-blinders again. The main quest of Morrowind where you join the main houses and kill Dagoth Ur wasn't that much better than the main quest of Oblivion where you stop Mehrunes Dagon. I may prefer the Morrowind MQ a bit more than the one in IV, but it's not a huge difference -- story isn't the strong point of a game where you can skip the main quest altogether 
     
    As far as having more stuff goes; yeah, that's always good in a game like this. But was it loot that made Morrowind a great game? No, it was just one of the things that Morrowind got right that Oblivion didn't. At least, in our preference. Who are we to say people who didn't want more stuff are wrong?
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    Sputty

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    #59  Edited By Sputty

    The level scaling in unmodded Oblivion was seriously flawed in a way that made leveling get in the way of playing the game. My first playthrough I was playing through normally and after a few hours I realized I had to go to Kvatch to 'retake the town' or whatever. Going there was completely broken because it was expecting you to be low level and have similarly leveled guards to help. The guards all got one shotted and then I had to kill 4 daedroths and a couple other higher level enemies at once and it wasn't possible. If you never leveled up then you could go through the game against level 1 enemies the entire time while gaining skills and making the game ridiculously easy. On top of the gameplay concerns it also made playing the game feel less compelling because you'd level up and be impressed by buying a bunch of new armor and then you'd go in and see a bunch of random bandits in the exact same high level armor. In addition to that, the scaling and automated feeling of dungeons made dungeon crawling for items pretty much worthless.

    On top of that specific flaw in the gameplay itself, the voice acting was pretty terrible and limited the amount of information NPCs could convey because of budget and disc space concerns. Morrowind lacked voice acting but it wasn't something that was done in games at the time. In place of voice acting, text existed and allowed a lot more depth and information to be placed in the game.

    Morrowind was a really interesting setting and managed to feel more alive despite its completely alien setting and lack of actual mechanics creating a "living world" like Radiant AI. Games don't really need mechanics to create this, you can effectively trick people into making it feel realer and it doesn't matter. The radiant AI trumped up an idea that was a total letdown and the disjointed conversations and clockwork NPC schedules made the gameyness even more apparent. The combat in both games is pretty similarly bad and isn't a huge issue, although Skyrim really needs to fix it after all this time.

    While there are gameplay issues in Oblivion there were some setting and story flaws that stood out as well. Earlier elder scrolls built up an idea of Cyrodiil that was later completely ignored, the idea of a lost society of wild elves that exist in Cyrodiil and the jungle climate that melded a Roman Empire with Mayan architecture turned into English countryside and similarly shaped elf ruins to give it larger appeal but was really bland. Also, exploring was less rewarding and the tons of Oblivion gates sort of ruined any sense of excitement from exploring. A bunch of similarly structured Oblivion worlds got boring after the second Oblivion gate.

    A lot of people's issues with Morrowind stem from the game being a bit older and that's a pretty ridiculous complaint. People's issues with Oblivion come from the game feeling less open and more restricting than past games, granted people made this complaint with Morrowind compared to Daggerfall but most people seemed fine with the results and more concise setting and story of limiting the game to Morrowind. Not only that but people felt the setting was significantly less interesting and the plot far duller. In the end people walked away remembering the Dark Brotherhood especially and the other guild quests fondly and the main quest as really boring.

    These are the issues people have with Oblivion, some people turn around and try to claim Morrowind is an especially ugly game or something and no one cares. Morrowind's an ugly game now, yes. So is Oblivion, they're both graphically dated and they both have similar flaws with combat. Morrowind has you swing and miss based on endurance and skill and Oblivion has you do so little damage it feels like you're tickling your enemies. These complaints are silly because Bethesda games have never been strong with combat or graphical evolution. The open world and setting is what people play Bethesda games for and in that Oblivion let down a lot of people.

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    lucianotassis

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    #60  Edited By lucianotassis

    To me, the main story in Oblivion was so boring that I don't even remember a lot of details of it. But the game was good and I had lots of fun with it. But, again, I wasn't so amazed and captivated as I was while playing Morrowind before.

    The gameplay in Oblivion was better than Morrowind, but the plot and the setting (dialogue, NPCs etc) were really worse (to me).

    Some people love gameplay, some people love plots (I'm a part of this group), and this is the real root of this discussion. There is no right or wrong opinion here, since it is just a matter of personality.

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    Getz

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    #61  Edited By Getz

    @Getz: Nice rhetorical device. Who are you to say they're right? People would have been way more pissed if Oblivion didn't change in technical capabilities from Morrowind just so we could keep spears. As far as the story, that's nostalgia-blinders again. The main quest of Morrowind where you join the main houses and kill Dagoth Ur wasn't that much better than the main quest of Oblivion where you stop Mehrunes Dagon. I may prefer the Morrowind MQ a bit more than the one in IV, but it's not a huge difference -- story isn't the strong point of a game where you can skip the main quest altogether As far as having more stuff goes; yeah, that's always good in a game like this. But was it loot that made Morrowind a great game? No, it was just one of the things that Morrowind got right that Oblivion didn't. At least, in our preference. Who are we to say people who didn't want more stuff are wrong?

    Man, you're on a fuckin' warpath aren't you? Ok, I'll play. First, I didn't say anyone was right, that's kind of the idea behind the rhetorical device "who are you to say..." It's meant to point out that no one can state matters of opinion as empirical fact; much like how you're going about things and the main reason why many people here are responding so strongly to you. Now, concerning your counterargument:

    Spears: a strawman argument. I didn't say anything about spears. I said "weapons" and there were a shit-ton more in Morrowind than in Oblivion. I wasn't saying one is better than the other; just the facts.

    Story: What you described is the plot not the story. Sure, when you look at it from the perspective of who the major players are and how the climax plays out it looks like standard genre fare. There's nothing new under the sun, etc. etc. However, slowly learning that I'm Jesus FUCKING Christ and that in a past life I was right in the middle of one of the most formative conflicts in the world was infinitely more entertaining to me than just being some pawn of Akatosh to be played in the never-ending chess-battle of the gods. It's the way a story is told that grabs us and sticks to our brains. To me, the MC in Oblivion is just a blank slate; the real hero is Martin. I want to play the hero, not run fetch quests for him goddamnit!

    More stuff/Less stuff: In the end, yeah it's kinda silly to say that Oblivion is inferior 'cause it streamlined things. It's not really about which is the better game though, is it? I mean, when you remember something fondly you don't want things to change. Most people are like this. You feel the need to get defensive about Oblivion, and at the same time indict people for clinging to Morrowind the way they do. You're telling me you don't see the hypocrisy in that? Oblivion doesn't need defending, man. It sold millions of copies and put Bethesda on the throne it's on today. Can't we just get along and jerk off to screenshots from Skyrim? Maybe a circle-jerk or something?

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    Tsoglani

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    #62  Edited By Tsoglani

    A circle-jerk sounds good.

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    Hailinel

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    #63  Edited By Hailinel

    @kashif1 said:

    @TheDudeOfGaming said:
    @Laketown said:

    you forgot the part where the main story was bad, there was like 6 voice actors + patrick stewart, and the terrible dialogue interface.

    And Sean Bean, i mean come on, the dude played Boromir...BOROMIR!
    Anyway OP, you didn't actually make an argument for the level scaling, it's what destroyed Oblivion.

    @Badhands: Dude, level scaling...i understand you can like the game but level scaling dude. That's really the only argument i need.
    whats with the level scaling complaints, I never ran into any problems with it, then again i never slept.

    So you don't recall running into highwaymen inexplicably armed to the teeth with magic swords and armor?

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    dillonwerner

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    #64  Edited By dillonwerner

    I can't had Bethesda no matter how hard I try,

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    kashif1

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    #65  Edited By kashif1
    @Hailinel said:

    @kashif1 said:

    @TheDudeOfGaming said:
    @Laketown said:

    you forgot the part where the main story was bad, there was like 6 voice actors + patrick stewart, and the terrible dialogue interface.

    And Sean Bean, i mean come on, the dude played Boromir...BOROMIR!
    Anyway OP, you didn't actually make an argument for the level scaling, it's what destroyed Oblivion.

    @Badhands: Dude, level scaling...i understand you can like the game but level scaling dude. That's really the only argument i need.
    whats with the level scaling complaints, I never ran into any problems with it, then again i never slept.

    So you don't recall running into highwaymen inexplicably armed to the teeth with magic swords and armor?

    Yeah, but that was on a level 100 file, i have two files, one at level 2 and another that i got from gamefaqs was at level 100 at the beginning of the game.  Now that i think about i never did properly experience the level system.  
     
    Nah if i had one complaint it would be this.  When i stole a horse the guards knew even though there was no one there.  I checked the wiki and it turned out that another horse had reported me to the guards for stealing.  Then there is the one guy who you assassinate with an enchanted arrow, since the arrow has a one second delay before it kills him, if he sees you you will be reported to the guards.   Red Dead Redemption had a better law reporting system than that game.  Still I don't regret the hundreds of hours i sunk into that game and will probably play it again before skryrim comes out.
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    Rusputin

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    #66  Edited By Rusputin

    ANYTHING in the Elder Scrolls franchise is pretty amazing imo.... and I'm really not sure why people complain so much about Oblivion.  Despite the level scaling issue, if you just custom enchanted ONE weapon properly, you can 2-3 shot anything in the game.  It did have it's flaws here and there, but so does every game.  I can't think of any other single player game  I've sunk nearly as many hours into, and that's saying something.

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    President_Barackbar

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    @Getz said:

    Morrowind was deeper; more factions, more dialogue, more choices, more weapons, more story. Not saying it was all good, but the sheer magnitude of that game left me speechless through my 300-some hours. Oblivion sacrificed a lot of that breadth for a denser, more detailed and polished presentation. Some people resented that; who are you to say they're wrong?

    Because people who think Oblivion is a great game are fucking tired of people telling us its shit and we aren't "real Elder Scrolls fans" because we don't worship Morrowind as our personal Lord and Savior.

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    mylifeforAiur

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    #68  Edited By mylifeforAiur

    It just comes down to personal taste at the end of the day: I thought Morrowind was a grand and exciting adventure; Oblivion just felt like a grind.

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    Storms

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    #69  Edited By Storms

     

    However, slowly learning that I'm Jesus FUCKING Christ and that in a past life I was right in the middle of one of the most formative conflicts in the world was infinitely more entertaining to me than just being some pawn of Akatosh to be played in the never-ending chess-battle of the gods.

    You know what movie came out not long before Morrowind, during it's creation phase? The Matrix. Same basic mono/mega-myth "I'm the one" stuff. Except in this one you're the pawn of Azura and not Akatosh. I liked it, but I saw through it at the same time.  
     

    state matters of opinion as empirical fact; much like how you're going about things  

    I'm doing no such thing. It's the haters that are making such spurious claims as "Oblivion only had two types of areas" and "all the forests were identical". I'm dealing in facts, sir. Nice try to make it about me, though.
     

    and the main reason why many people here are responding so strongly to you. 

    It's not a popularity contest. Or is it? I wouldn't know, I'm new here. 
     
    Either way, most people aren't responding to me. They're just taking this thread as an opportunity to sound off on their love and/or hate of Morrowind/Oblivion. Between me and those who are responding directly to me and getting worked up about it, I expect that even if nobody admits now that they've been schooled, we'll all walk away from this heated and sometimes rude exchange with a better understanding of other people's perspective on these games e.g. "now that you mention it, the world of Cyrodiil does have some diversity I failed to notice before" and on the flip-side "yeah, that system was worse than I remembered". So, it really doesn't matter to me how strongly people respond.
     

     I mean, when you remember something fondly you don't want things to change. Most people are like this. You feel the need to get defensive about Oblivion, and at the same time indict people for clinging to Morrowind the way they do. You're telling me you don't see the hypocrisy in that?

    I might, if my position on Oblivion were actually the polar opposite of people that bash Oblivion without a solid reason besides it not being Morrowind. But that's not my position. When Skyrim comes out, I'm not going to be all "ZOMG NO GREAVES" and "THEY GOT RID OF SOME SKILLS AGAIN". 
     
    Morrowind and Oblivion are two of my three favorite games but I'm not unwilling to accept change and a few misfires. You know why? Because like I said in my OP that nobody read: Nobody makes games like Bethesda. The complaints that people make are either about things that don't exist in any other game, anyway, or about things that changed from Morrowind. 
     
    And it's perfectly fine to have liked Morrowind and not Oblivion and vice versa (although I'd urge anybody who dislike either game to have a more open mind). But a lot of these reasons pretty much apply to all video games -- yet it's only Oblivion they complain about. And not everybody who does this likes Morrowind either but we're not talking about those people. 
     
    I'd rather have these things be imperfect than non-existent, as they are in all other games.
     
    @Sputty:  Okay, Oblivion had leveling issues (that you can avoid in OVER 9000 different ways), and sometimes the dialogue wasn't special and was delivered poorly. And you say that there are ways to make the NPCs feel real while they stand in the same spot day and night (did Morrowind NPCs really seem real to you? Are you really saying they had good dialogue when they all said the same thing until the LGNPC mod?), somehow. 
     
    Okay, so... what Massive, Open World, Semi-Sandbox, 1000 Hour+, Single Player, Super-immersive RPG do you play that's so much better? (Skyrim doesn't count yet =D ). Name it and I'll denounce Oblivion as trash like the very small but vocal contingent that hates it and I'll play that instead.
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    pweidman

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    #70  Edited By pweidman

    @Storms: Fallout 3 or New Vegas fill that bill there duder.

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    President_Barackbar

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    @Storms: Here here! Excellent post!

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    Getz

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    #72  Edited By Getz

    @President_Barackbar said:

    @Getz said:

    Morrowind was deeper; more factions, more dialogue, more choices, more weapons, more story. Not saying it was all good, but the sheer magnitude of that game left me speechless through my 300-some hours. Oblivion sacrificed a lot of that breadth for a denser, more detailed and polished presentation. Some people resented that; who are you to say they're wrong?

    Because people who think Oblivion is a great game are fucking tired of people telling us its shit and we aren't "real Elder Scrolls fans" because we don't worship Morrowind as our personal Lord and Savior.

    Why do you care what idiot fan-boys think anyway?

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    President_Barackbar

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    @Getz said:

    @President_Barackbar said:

    @Getz said:

    Morrowind was deeper; more factions, more dialogue, more choices, more weapons, more story. Not saying it was all good, but the sheer magnitude of that game left me speechless through my 300-some hours. Oblivion sacrificed a lot of that breadth for a denser, more detailed and polished presentation. Some people resented that; who are you to say they're wrong?

    Because people who think Oblivion is a great game are fucking tired of people telling us its shit and we aren't "real Elder Scrolls fans" because we don't worship Morrowind as our personal Lord and Savior.

    Why do you care what idiot fan-boys think anyway?

    Gets annoying after a while.

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    HalfSunkBoat

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    #74  Edited By HalfSunkBoat

    I think that Co-op in a Elder Scrolls game could be fun. I don't think they should ever do it, but I could see some ways it could be fun.

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    SeriouslyNow

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    #75  Edited By SeriouslyNow

    @pweidman said:

    @Storms: Fallout 3 or New Vegas fill that bill there duder.

    Hell almost every game in a modern sense has a Messiah protag of some degree, certainly almost every RPG.

    @Storms said:

    However, slowly learning that I'm Jesus FUCKING Christ and that in a past life I was right in the middle of one of the most formative conflicts in the world was infinitely more entertaining to me than just being some pawn of Akatosh to be played in the never-ending chess-battle of the gods.

    You know what movie came out not long before Morrowind, during it's creation phase? The Matrix. Same basic mono/mega-myth "I'm the one" stuff. Except in this one you're the pawn of Azura and not Akatosh. I liked it, but I saw through it at the same time.

    Yeah, you might want to research that statement a little more. The Wachowzkis have stated multiple times that The Matrix is inspired by Anime and Video Games right at the core of its story. Also, see above and The Hero with A Thousand Faces- published in 1949, which likely informed both.

    Oblivion is by no means an awful game but Morrowind is definitely the better of the two in terms of content, enviroment story and variety of play styles.

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    BBQBram

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    #76  Edited By BBQBram

    Hey guys, let's say Morrowind is pretty good, and Oblivion is too, and Skyrim will probably be better. Turns out all these games are part of one franchise you can be a fan of without internal conflict. Tadaa!

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    Hailinel

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    #77  Edited By Hailinel

    @kashif1 said:

    @Hailinel said:

    @kashif1 said:

    @TheDudeOfGaming said:
    @Laketown said:

    you forgot the part where the main story was bad, there was like 6 voice actors + patrick stewart, and the terrible dialogue interface.

    And Sean Bean, i mean come on, the dude played Boromir...BOROMIR!
    Anyway OP, you didn't actually make an argument for the level scaling, it's what destroyed Oblivion.

    @Badhands: Dude, level scaling...i understand you can like the game but level scaling dude. That's really the only argument i need.
    whats with the level scaling complaints, I never ran into any problems with it, then again i never slept.

    So you don't recall running into highwaymen inexplicably armed to the teeth with magic swords and armor?

    Yeah, but that was on a level 100 file, i have two files, one at level 2 and another that i got from gamefaqs was at level 100 at the beginning of the game. Now that i think about i never did properly experience the level system. Nah if i had one complaint it would be this. When i stole a horse the guards knew even though there was no one there. I checked the wiki and it turned out that another horse had reported me to the guards for stealing. Then there is the one guy who you assassinate with an enchanted arrow, since the arrow has a one second delay before it kills him, if he sees you you will be reported to the guards. Red Dead Redemption had a better law reporting system than that game. Still I don't regret the hundreds of hours i sunk into that game and will probably play it again before skryrim comes out.

    You don't need to be nearly such a high level to see the weirdness of the level scaling take effect.

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    konradbm

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    #78  Edited By konradbm

    I bitch about Oblivion in the same way people sort of harmlessly bitch about the people in their lives that they adore. I know I love it unrequitedly and I know compared to pretty much everything else in its category it is top of the heap, so the only thing left to criticise is the little flaws.

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    strangone

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    #79  Edited By strangone

    You forgot the part where the quests were all terrible.

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    konradbm

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    #80  Edited By konradbm
    @strangone said:
    You forgot the part where the quests were all terrible.
    That's pretty unfair, given how awesome the Dark Brotherhood stuff was. And frankly I had more fun and spent more time in that quest arc alone than I did in most other games.
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    Revan_NL

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    #81  Edited By Revan_NL

    I never played Morrowind, so I can't comment on whether or not Oblivion is worse. All I can say is that Oblivion is one of my favorite games of all time. It was the game that really felt nextgen, early in the lifespan of the 360

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    Storms

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    #82  Edited By Storms

    I figured out what all this reminds me of. This rant: 
     
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8r1CZTLk-Gk 
     
    And the comic panel it inspired:
     
    http://theoatmeal.com/comics/smartphone 
     
    The "I hate when people complain about their smartphones" part way down there. 
     
    This is almost a perfect analogy to bashing Oblivion. 
     

    Oblivion fan: "OMG! I'm flying! In a chair, in the sky!" 


    Oblivion basher: "Yeah, but the seats are uncomfortable and don't go back far enough. And the Sky Internet is down, which is totally unacceptable."

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    BasketSnake

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    #83  Edited By BasketSnake

    I should probably google around a bit before I write this because it might be confirmed but I'd be surprised if there weren't many more voice actors in Skyrim than in Oblivion.

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    TwoLines

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    #84  Edited By TwoLines

    Oblivion doesn't need your defense, turkey! I think it was awesome. Now it's a bit grating. But I really enjoyed it when it came out.

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