no.the supers are completely balanced and without them it wouldnt be anywhere as fun.

Actually, I think secondary weapons should be removed from the Crucible. Players can only use their super once in a while, whereas specials can be used constantly and ammo is plentiful. They also tend to kill you in one hit, which makes most matches about who saw who first rather than any particular skill with a specific weapon.

As far the Crucible in general goes - it suffers from the same problem every other PvP system in a game like this suffers from in that there are people who do nothing but PvP, making them prohibitively good compared to those who us who only PvP occasionally. It's no fun to get wrecked over and over and over (and over) again by someone so much better than you are. On top of this, you have the additional problem of level imbalance. Although Bungie normalized weapons and armor, they didn't normalize player's skill trees, so high level players always have an advantage when matched with lower level ones.

They should at least be reblanced. Shorten the length of time it takes to pop Golden Gun, reduce the power of the Titan stomp, etc.

I'd also like to have the option to access the other classes without grinding out another character. I've spent 20 hours on my Hunter only to find it's grossly out powered in competitive MP by the other classes. I still really enjoy playing the main game with the class but I'd like something else for the Crucible.

Supers generating more supers for your teammates is the biggest issue, by themselves they're no different than a killstreak and while killstreaks are inherently imbalanced they're sort of part of the genre at this point. Much like the PvE I'm reasonably sure the PvP in this game is close to unplayable solo.

What?

No, seriously, what? Hunter, particularly Bladedancer, is THE most used and unbalanced class in the game. Its CDR on its ult, even without Intellect modifiers, vastly outstrips both Titan ults and its other abilities get more serious cooldown buffs than any of the other classes' options, barring Sunsinger, which is its own brand of bullshit. If it weren't for the fact that Warlock can straight up out-burst or out-sustain any Hunter given the chance to even come close to their ults, Hunter would be the only viable multiplayer class in the game.

It is shocking that the game shipped with both Titans as woefully bland and underpowered as they are right now, considering the ridiculous bullshit Sunsinger and Bladedancer can pull off.

EDIT: I suppose this came off as more confrontational than I intended. My experience with multiplayer has just been radically different than anything that would suggest Titan is any good at all. I dunno, it just seems like an underpowered, underwhelming class on the whole.

The problem may be that I've focused only on maxing out Gunslinger and have barely touched Bladedancer.

@thelastgunslinger That would make sense. I would very seriously recommend levelling the hell out of it once you hit 15, to be honest. It is kind of crazy bullshit.

Supers should stay, just needs some rebalancing.

While we're on the subject of PvP balance though, special melee attacks.... Great move to have 2/3 classes being able to insta-kill with melee, doesn't screw over the last class at all. Oh, they get a lunge ? Great, that way I can get into your melee range so you can instakill me. (yes, I'm bitter)

I have not played it but they looked terrible from all the footage I have seen. You will be in a firefight with a guy and then all of a sudden somebody just explodes and boom you're dead

yes let's take the one unique thing from Destiny's multiplayer out to make it more 'fair'

smh

everyone has specials, therefore specials are fair.

but its the only interesting thing going for it ?.

No, I really like the chaos. Fuck balance. Its fun to wreck 10 dudes with my bladedancer skill in the matter of moments.

I'd be ok with a playlist or two that remove all abilities except grenade/double-jump, but I just get the feeling it'd be pretty bland and too similar to other games. The supers are pretty much COD killstreaks -- the rich get richer by getting them more often, but everyone has a chance to occasionally do something crazy.

Keep em' in, how bout some more fucking maps and game modes though.

What!? Definitely not. I like that the game is fun, I'd rather not have that fucking neutered.

Special weapons should be removed? What? Goddamn. I guess people like this are the reason I don't get into most multiplayer shooters.

That multiplayer is no where near balanced. Them saying that level doesn't matter doesn't take into account the specials and types of weapons people are bringing in. As soon as I got a good auto gun I became able to hold my own. Also the specials are cool and taking them away would make the multiplayer a lot worse.

@bargainben: @bargainben: Its just that its incredibly frustrating to be on the other end of, to just suddenly be killed with nothing you can do to prevent it, though you may be right that it would make the multiplayer more bland were they completely removed. I think a good compromise if maybe the damage on them was lessened so that instead of an insta-kill they do something like 50% damage that way those on the recieving end still have a fighting chance and it could encourage team play and play into the lore described "class roles" aka you have a titan charge in and do their ground pound and a hunter hanging back ready to pick off the weakened enemies because the time it would take to for the titan to do and recover from the ground slam animation would leave him vulnerable. What do you think of that idea? I just think that having a multiplayer experience where you're constantly getting killed and there's nothing you can do to atleast feel like you could of prevented it or learned from the experience, its just frustrating

That's pretty much my opinion on it(minus the bladedancer part because I'm a warlock). I wouldn't like the crucible as much without them. The best part is jumping up in the air and launching down a nova bomb. Or be standing there and capturing a point, then out of nowhere, a titan lands a stomp in front of you. I think it looks cool and is fun. I couldn't care less if I actually win or lose these matches or if they are balanced, as long as they are fun. I used to play a LOT of Call of Duty(the first Modern Warfare) and I cared if we won or not then, but I've reached a point with multiplayer stuff where I just don't care anymore and barely ever play. Garden Warfare and Destiny have been the first time I've played a decent amount of multiplayer in a long while.

I found Golden gun the worst in Crucible matches. The other supers are basically guaranteed kills, sometimes multi-kills. With Golden Gun you still have to land those shots, some seconds after you want to given that the initialize animation takes a while too.

I switched to the other sub class recently and thought it took a much longer time to charge that super up. But I understood why when I was able to use it. I had a minuscule amount of health and just darted around taking out three full health guys (they even had that double health bar, which I STILL have no fucking clue how you get).

@honkalot: Pretty sure you do have that doub;e health bar, at least from another players point of view.

@planetfunksquad: Really?

In that case I will file that into my box of complaints where the game never explains anything. :(

I don't really get it either. I'm guessing on your screen at the top 2/3rd of the HP bar is the "shield" you see on other players. When you take heavy damage the last third turns red, I think this is the bottom HP bar you see on players. So two thirds for shields, one third of actual HP. Though I don't think it even matters since it all acts as HP. Why they show two HP bars on enemy players? I have no idea.

They are an integral part of what makes Destiny's classes Destiny's classes.

They should be balanced, not removed. Otherwise... go play a different game?

A mode could have no supers, but that's different than removing them altogether.

I think the multilayer is unbalanced. unless I'm crazy I swear this guy had 2 shields bars and a health bar (Blue, white, and red) And it was near impossible to take him down, though he was a really good player.

I could be wrong but I believe the reasoning is that you don't get bonus damage for headshots until you remove the shield part with the exception of snipers which do enough damage to break the shield and then still headshot after.

No, but a game mode without them would be nice.

@bargainben The Titan Supers are so inferior that it really is not fair to include them in the same playlists as Hunters and Warlocks.

I would even argue that the Vidmaster version of this game is Titan, Striker, no new armor, no new guns, Hardest Hard Mode every time.

Pretty sure you can get crits either way, but the two bars regenerate at different rates. They mentioned it in the first unfinihsed Destiny video, how the regeneration stops at 1/3 before getting the rest back.

Why on earth would you want one of the most interesting aspects of the PvP sandbox removed? Supers are part of what makes Destiny unique in a competitive environment. Given the relatively lacking suite of multiplayer features compared to other games, without supers Destiny wouldn't be nearly as unique or interesting as it is in competitive multiplayer. Without supers you may as well be playing any other multiplayer shooter.

I'm undecided. I need to play around a bit more to see how it affects the balance of the game.

It's in definite need of rebalancing. I love my Sunsinger, but I always switch over to Voidwalker for PvP because I just don't see the viability of being a support class in a team deathmatch. Fuck hunters. Well, not really. If I knew at the beginning what I know now, I definitely would have been one.

Since I really don't play that much Control/Salvage and stay to the other, simpler modes, the Bladedancer dominates, the Nova bomb and Golden Gun come up next almost immediately followed by the Titan ground pound. The Sunsinger's multigrenades beat out the Titan's bubble in the lowest tier of class supers. But this is just from my 50ish matches of personal experience.

Just add a playlist that is like Clash but without supers.

I am playing a Titan and haven't felt like the game is unbalanced enough to detract from the fun. I also haven't felt like I can't hold my own against any of the other classes.

Naw man, shit naw man.

That's not a Crucible problem, then. That's more of a Titan problem overall. Solution would be changing Titan to be of equal value to other supers not removing all supers.

I have no problems with the supers. I do kinda have a problem with the common, uncommon and rare weapon stuff, and the fact that you really don't unlock all the basics of your class until you hit level 15 or so - you don't unlock the stat boosts or grenade/super modifiers until then. Even though they level out the damage output of the guns and stuff like that, high level players still have weapons with additional modifiers for stuff like reload speed and stuff like that, something lower level players straight up can't access. Puts lower level players at a severe disadvantage. You unlock your super at the same point as you unlock your ability to play the crucible though, so that part is not much of an issue.

@fisk0: It's a disadvantage, but hardly a "severe" one.

My thoughts?

-Cry less

-Use more skill

-Don't play it

@otakugamer: They're not OP though. If you could have them forever and use them over and over, then yeah sure. But you can't unless you're already doing very well outside of using your super. And everyone gets to use their super at least once per game even if you don't kill anyone or collect any orbs.

Guns lead to a lot of deaths you can't do anything about. They should remove guns from the Crucible.

@otakugamer: I don't know, I feel like a well placed rocket would do the trick.

I don't think they should be removed, maybe a little balance is in order... that god damn Titan punch.
Last night I saw it coming and jumped as quick as I could to avoid it, still died.
Maybe adjust how much damage things like that do in such a scenario.
He landed practically on top of my buddy which yes, def should have killed him but I feel I should have taken way less damage considering I saw it coming and avoided it.
Perhaps another game mode will make some folks happy.

I bet you're a lot of fun at parties.

No. Once they even start nerfing stuff that game immediately becomes less fun. Also, are kill streak rewards in cod too powerful? They're there to add fun and variety to the gameplay. Taking them out would drastically make the game more boring.

Supers are but a drop in the bucket for the issues that game's versus multiplayer has. It's a pretty abysmal versus mode, and the fact that they force you to play it if you want to buy high end gear is like a spit in the face.

No I've been playing Crucible solo a lot and I've been doing fine, coming in top 3 consistently. It's mainly a matter of playing smart, knowing when to back off when you're overmatched and acting accordingly. And really, supers don't make as much a difference as often as people are saying. The chaos comes around and it goes around.

After playing a bunch more Crucible matches, no way should supers be removed, in fact, I'd say they're critical to keeping it so interesting.