As a guy who has seen way more than my share of dead bodies (shot, stabbed, burnt, bludgeoned, maimed, etc), trust me when I say seeing a dead man is pretty awful. Even if it is a mass murderer, the image of death tends to stay with you. Don't yearn to witness death.
You can say whatever you want, but you have to admit that this raises at least some suspicion on whether Bin Laden is really dead.
Also, OP, you're dumb as shit.
well flashback, obama did remove the ban on photographing coffins of our dead soldiers." @TwoOneFive: By that argument they should maintain a viewable file of ALL the people who were killed in the wars. Just in case you're feeling horny and bored with conventional porn. "
" @melcene said:And once again, to do what they do is to be become what they are. Why do you want go down to their level? Be happy you don't live in abject poverty in a third world nation where religious sacrifice seems like a logical out. God, the blatant ignorance and flag waving brutality of this topic is annoying." Not only would releasing the picture possibly enflame OBL's followers, but it will also serve to piss off the Americans (and others around the world) who are all boo-hoo over a human life, even if it's OBL's. "as i already pointed out in my original post: his death has already enflamed his followers. and even when Obama tried to be respectful giving him a proper islamic burial at sea, they became enflamed anyways saying it was a giant insult etc. so all this tip toeing around terrorists feeling is BULLSHIT. If they get one of our guys, they burn them and drag them through the fucking streets. "
dont woory they realease them at some point the CIA director even said so. and for those conspiracy theroists stop drinking the koolaide no matter what they say or show you wont believe them btw the pakistani intelligence service picked up everyone in that house after the raid bin ladin's daughter said she saw american troops shoot him and believe me pakistan has no loves of us. why would they lie like that?? they would want to disprove us any chance they get.
and one more thing for those of you saying osama had underlying causes for attacking us , do you know what they are?? its the fact that united states forces helped protect saudi arabia in the first iraq war instead of a group of muslim holy warriors that he said he could get to defend saudi arabia from iraq. it was the fact that he was shown up by a bunch of infidels. he is not a man that the world has injured in some way he is just the same as hitler and stalin a man with a lust for power
" @wickedsc3 said:" @ryanwho said:" @wickedsc3 said:Not at all, I think rotting in a US prison would be worse than killing him, and could possibly be useful in the war. But thanks for jumping to conclusions. Because honestly what does killing him do that capturing him would not? I by no means in my post said it was wrong to kill him, all I said was I didn't see whey they couldn't take him alive allowing us to gain more information."" They will never release it voluntarily. Because Im sure that photo shows things they don't want out. Mainly a unarmed man shot once in the chest and once in the head. I don't why they couldn't take him alive, it would not have been that hard to shoot to wound a unarmed man. As they did with the woman who actually charged at them, who they shot in the leg. Also the others in the building who they were able to zip tie on there way clearing the building. I don't think the photo will come out because the shot to the head was unnecessary and probably after he had died. Which would show the US in a bad light. "K Glenn Beck, now you're sympathizing with poor unarmed Osama. "I'm inclined to agree with you, because I think Osama had some intel that could help with dismantling the al-Qaeda networks. This is more of an assumption at this point, though. Even though he's dead, somebody else will step into his place, because I'm sure there might be a bit of a power vacuum within the terrorist network."
Dammit. I come here for vidya games. Not idiots that makes me rage.
This" All I wanted was just a few shreds of evidence, and nothing has been provided."
It's funny that no one made sadam's death a conspiracy because we saw video and photographs. Also it's funny how ppl dismiss things as conpiracy theory, so they don't listen to evidence.
Anyways, I got a new article, here is what it states from the london telegraph. It must be so convenient that the video cuts out so we can't even see osama bin laden at all.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/al-qaeda/8493391/Osama-bin-Laden-dead-Blackout-during-raid-on-bin-Laden-compound.html??
Osama bin Laden dead: Blackout during raid on bin Laden compound
The head of the CIA admitted yesterday that there was no live video footage of the raid on Osama bin Laden's compound as further doubts emerged about the US version of events.
Leon Panetta, director of the CIA, revealed there was a 25 minute blackout during which the live feed from cameras mounted on the helmets of the US special forces was cut off.
In an interview with PBS, Mr Panetta said: "Once those teams went into the compound I can tell you that there was a time period of almost 20 or 25 minutes where we really didn't know just exactly what was going on. And there were some very tense moments as we were waiting for information.
" @Napalm said:You doubt? I'd rather have the oppertunity to try than let's say shoot first NEVER EVER EVER ASK QUESTIONS!" @wickedsc3 said:they got a whole bunch of hard drives, flash drives, documents and about 6 computers from his compound, its at least something and i doubt interrogation would break him anyway "" @ryanwho said:" @wickedsc3 said:Not at all, I think rotting in a US prison would be worse than killing him, and could possibly be useful in the war. But thanks for jumping to conclusions. Because honestly what does killing him do that capturing him would not? I by no means in my post said it was wrong to kill him, all I said was I didn't see whey they couldn't take him alive allowing us to gain more information."" They will never release it voluntarily. Because Im sure that photo shows things they don't want out. Mainly a unarmed man shot once in the chest and once in the head. I don't why they couldn't take him alive, it would not have been that hard to shoot to wound a unarmed man. As they did with the woman who actually charged at them, who they shot in the leg. Also the others in the building who they were able to zip tie on there way clearing the building. I don't think the photo will come out because the shot to the head was unnecessary and probably after he had died. Which would show the US in a bad light. "K Glenn Beck, now you're sympathizing with poor unarmed Osama. "I'm inclined to agree with you, because I think Osama had some intel that could help with dismantling the al-Qaeda networks. This is more of an assumption at this point, though. Even though he's dead, somebody else will step into his place, because I'm sure there might be a bit of a power vacuum within the terrorist network."
Yes! We should all be more like the government. Did you know the government invented terrorism? Did you also know in some countries taxes, licenses, and other costs are known as legal bribes and extortion?" @TwoOneFive said:
" @melcene said:So...we should be more like the terrorists? "" Not only would releasing the picture possibly enflame OBL's followers, but it will also serve to piss off the Americans (and others around the world) who are all boo-hoo over a human life, even if it's OBL's. "as i already pointed out in my original post: his death has already enflamed his followers. and even when Obama tried to be respectful giving him a proper islamic burial at sea, they became enflamed anyways saying it was a giant insult etc. so all this tip toeing around terrorists feeling is BULLSHIT. If they get one of our guys, they burn them and drag them through the fucking streets. "
" Did you know the government invented terrorism? "Are you sure about that?
k birthers" @FourWude said:
This I think it's scary that so many people believe Obama just because he said so. It kinda proves that he can tell people whatever he want to without consequences." All I wanted was just a few shreds of evidence, and nothing has been provided."
"
Why would the White House want to potentially lose some of the goodwill and excitement they've generated by releasing a disgusting picture of a man who's been shot in the face.
Because enough is never enough for people. They wanted to see Obama's birth certificate. Did anyone really think they wouldn't immediately jump to something else as soon as that was released? They quickly hopped to his school transcripts and pictures of Osama's corpse as if either of those things are really relevant. People who want to de-legitimatize Obama are always going to find something to complain about. It's an endless cycle and it just makes America look stupid.
Releasing a picture of a corpse like a trophy is disgusting and barbaric. That's the kind of thing we hate them for, remember? That's also why I found it equally unsettling to see college kids in the streets drinking beer and singing over the death of one man who, while symbolic, wasn't really going to change anything. Seems a lot like when "the other guys" were chanting in the streets burning effigies of Bush, doesn't it? If Hollywood movies have taught me anything, it's that reveling in vengeance for the sake of vengeance is a belittling experience. We got him. Good. Let's move on with our lives now.
" Because enough is never enough for people. They wanted to see Obama's birth certificate. Did anyone really think they wouldn't immediately jump to something else as soon as that was released? They quickly hopped to his school transcripts and pictures of Osama's corpse as if either of those things are really relevant. People who want to de-legitimatize Obama are always going to find something to complain about. It's an endless cycle and it just makes America look stupid. "You, sir, I like the way you think. Followed
" @TwoOneFive: Like someone put it perfectly online: Why is a nation that was freaked about Janet jacksons nip-slip, clamoring for a picture of a blown-up Bin Laden "Hey, I like the fact that we love violence so much more than everyone else.
They shouldn't, but they also probably should.
So yeah, given that, I think they made the right choice.
There's no logical way to argue that they either have him alive or dead anyway, if you have any sort of rationality. So it's irrelevant. But they had to know all this would do is raise suspicion in a buncha people (9/11 is still a conspiracy, lol) so who the fuck knows.
It's like everyone on Giant Bomb is an ex-CIA operative.
All the reasons that have been given for not releasing photos seem bogus.
Too graphic? We are the same people that loved the Saw franchise so much that it got 52 sequels. The Human Centipede is a real, actual movie. You think we cant handle a grainy photo of some old dead guy?
The whole "it incites Muslim extremism" line is fishy too. What Muslims are going to be offended that we killed this guy and released his photo? Oh, the same ones that already hate us with every fiber of their being? If anything, a picture of their fearless inimitable leader with a giant fucking hole in his head might give them second thoughts about going around killing innocent civilians.
We have been told for the last ten years that this guy was the single greatest enemy of our nation and everything that it stands for and that we were doing everything in our power to find him and bring him to justice. Then trillions of dollars later, without even a cell phone picture of the guy to show for it, he disappears into the ocean with a little splash.
He deserves to be dead, and I'm convinced that he really genuinely is no more, but just release the photos. I don't need to see them, but there are plenty of other people who deserve to.
" Delta force killed Osama in front of his wife while he begged for mercy. they first shot his wife in the leg just because they could, then they shot him in the head. "Poor fella.
@skinnyman said:
I don't believe they really killed him in front of his wife, but it was delta force, the reason it was reported seals is because delta force is a secret. they say he was resisting, but that's just because it sounds better." @Dagbiker said:
Poor fella. So, where do you get your news, Al-Jazeera?Also it's been pretty widely reported that SEALS were the ones killed the bastard, not delta. Not that it would matter to you I guess. "" Delta force killed Osama in front of his wife while he begged for mercy. they first shot his wife in the leg just because they could, then they shot him in the head. "
I don't think they win whether they release the photos or not. There are some people who are pissed that the photos weren't released. But at the same time, there are other people that would have been pissed if those photos were released.
It's lose-lose.
He's dead, fucking Al Qaida said so. Yeah, I went to Google News and grabbed the first result. Go search it for yourself if you want a source that meets your indie-expectations, cynical douchers.
Oh no, I don't believe it when Al Qaida confirms their own fuckin' leader is dead. They're probably in cahoots with the US government trying to get Obama re-elected, right? IT'S BEEN PLANNED OUT SINCE THE 90'S!!! IT'S ALL A BIG PLAN!
Can we just accept the fact that he's dead already? Maybe the 9/11 victims' families don't want the picture released, ever take that into consideration? I'd like to see it, but I'd prefer the people who were actually affected by him to get their wishes before my own.
" Obama has everything to gain by letting extremist talking heads bloviate and dig themselves into a hole by stupidly suggesting Osama may be alive. Why take that away? Its entertaining. "Hey Ryan, stop posting awesome comments I entirely agree with, because I don't think it's possible for me to love you for it anymore than I do. <3
" @FourWude:
You know, everyone should know what they're talking about before posting here. Do some research. For example, they didn't have live video feed of the operation. Haven't you been watching the news? Everyone and their dog has been reporting about the "incredibly tense moment" (the media loves drama), when the seals entered the compound and they were unable to tell what was happening inside.
Part of the problem is that they had to announce this before they had a chance to talk to the seals or go over the information to make sure they knew exactly what happened. Obviously they couldn't wait to announce it, and the press was so rabid for details that a lot of people falsely reported what was happening inside the compound.
You can certainly blame the Obama administration for making a few mistakes about the details, but the larger story hasn't changed, and these are the sorts of things nobody will give a shit about two weeks from now. Does it matter if Bin Laden was armed or how many people shot at them (we now know he had guns within arms reach)? I have no problem with them immediately executing the people they already knew were dangerous, especially when you consider that these are people who arent afraid to be suicide bombers. What if they'd tried to take some of those guys alive only to find out that they got a bomb under their clothes, and in that second they hesitate, he blows it up? And frankly, the man needed to die. I personally don't care how it happened.
As for the photograph. I get the counterarguments against not releasing it. Radical muslims will be mad at us anyway. But put yourself in Obama's shoes. His military and national security advisors are saying don't release it, so why not trust their judgement? Even if I except the arguments minimizing the consequences, I still don't see any benefits that ought weigh those consequences.
"
You know I've been one of the few on here who HAS been doing the research. I have been following what has been happening closely and I have ALWAYS so far been willing to give the benefit of the doubt to the US government. But alas it is the government that has been messing us around.
You do realize that the official story has been changed 3 times already don't you. And at every juncture of the change I've been told to 'Take the Governments word for it'. Which is incredibly naive.
You stated the government didn't have live feed. Guess what, the government told us after the initial Obama speech that THEY DID HAVE LIVE FEED. Now the head of the CIA Leon Panetta says there was a total blackout for 25 minutes during the operation. So someone was telling fibs... oops. But I gave them the benefit of the doubt.
They've had almost 5 days to get the story straight and yet the official story is still not straightened out. Was Osama executed during or after the raid, conflicting reports? No one knows. Who's the woman? Was she used as a shield? We were told it's his wife and he used her as a shield, but again they fucked up and said no she wasn't and no shield was there.
Osama was meant to be shooting back initially as told by the always right US government. But alas they went and changed the story and told us he not only didn't shoot back, he wasn't even armed. So again who am I to believe?
We then come to dubious claims about respecting Islamic burial rites. They had to bury Osama's body within 24 hours, this law by and large doesn't exist in Islam, it's non-binding. And on top of that they dump the body in the sea, which is anti-Islamic anyway, makes a mockery of them respecting any laws to begin with. But again I waited for the government to clarify this position.
I was told by Obama that the US thanked Pakistan for its support in all of this. But Leon Pannetta, the head of the CIA stated there was no Pakistani involvement and they were kept in the dark. Later reports stated that Pakistan had been informed. Exactly who am I to believe? No seriously what am I supposed to believe? Obama or Leon Pannetta?
People keep telling me, like I'm supposed to be some naive idiot to just 'believe' the government. But even if I did just believe, what exactly am I supposed to believe??? There isn't a straight story to believe? If I believed everything the US government has so far said I'd be contradicting myself.
Before mouthing off and telling me to get my 'facts' straight, you should send your post to the White House and tell them to get their facts straight and once they do, tell them to send me a copy of the facts as well, I'd very much like to know.
P.S. Also I'd just like to point out I have NEVER claimed Osama was alive or in fact EVER refuted he was dead. It bothers me not one iota whether Osama is alive, dead, or making sweet butt love to Bush at his ranch as we speak. All I ever wanted was the truth of what happened. Nothing more. I just want to know what went on.
" He is definitely dead. They would not do any of this if they were not certain that was the case one way or another. However, the evidence for him dying how and when they claim he died so far amounts to "Trust us". Sorry, but Nixon (Watergate), Clinton (Lewinsky), Bush (WMD) already burned through any weight carried by the word of US administrations. Recent US Presidents have not shown themselves to be above lying when it was convenient for them to do so. There's a slam dunk re-election riding on Obama portraying himself as the Slayer of America's Enemies, so there is plenty of plausible motivation for shenanigans.That's just false. If you really think this photo could prove his death any more than has already been proven, then you just don't have enough of the facts.
I think it's likely they're telling it straight(ish), but if you're going to hastily dispose of the body where it can never be found, and then refuse to release any evidence at all (for very tenuous reasons), then nobody should be surprised that some people aren't prepared to just take them at their word. "
" He's dead, fucking Al Qaida said so. Yeah, I went to Google News and grabbed the first result. Go search it for yourself if you want a source that meets your indie-expectations, cynical douchers. Oh no, I don't believe it when Al Qaida confirms their own fuckin' leader is dead. They're probably in cahoots with the US government trying to get Obama re-elected, right? IT'S BEEN PLANNED OUT SINCE THE 90'S!!! IT'S ALL A BIG PLAN!Can we just accept the fact that he's dead already? Maybe the 9/11 victims' families don't want the picture released, ever take that into consideration? I'd like to see it, but I'd prefer the people who were actually affected by him to get their wishes before my own. "
That 'proof' comes from an internet website, which was made by an unverified poster. It was in effect a random post. The claims have never been substantiated, simply because the source cannot be tracked down.
There have also been a handful of 9/11 families who do want the photo's released, but this isn't about 9/11 families or al-qaeda sentiments, it's about what is the 'right' thing to do is. Sentiment shouldn't come into it.
And yes I am thoroughly one of those that believe the photo's should be released into the open. And then we can draw a line under all of this, once and for all.
" @Jimbo said:So you know a military operation of some kind took place in Pakistan and it involved a helicopter. That's about as far as your evidence goes. I have the (apparently unbelievably incompetent) ISI's word on what was allegedly said in an interview and (now) a boilerplate statement from 'AQ' which -according to your own link- hasn't even been independently confirmed as authentic." He is definitely dead. They would not do any of this if they were not certain that was the case one way or another. However, the evidence for him dying how and when they claim he died so far amounts to "Trust us". Sorry, but Nixon (Watergate), Clinton (Lewinsky), Bush (WMD) already burned through any weight carried by the word of US administrations. Recent US Presidents have not shown themselves to be above lying when it was convenient for them to do so. There's a slam dunk re-election riding on Obama portraying himself as the Slayer of America's Enemies, so there is plenty of plausible motivation for shenanigans.That's just false. If you really think this photo could prove his death any more than has already been proven, then you just don't have enough of the facts.
I think it's likely they're telling it straight(ish), but if you're going to hastily dispose of the body where it can never be found, and then refuse to release any evidence at all (for very tenuous reasons), then nobody should be surprised that some people aren't prepared to just take them at their word. "Lets look at the whole picture. If this picture is a missing piece of the puzzle, well, lets look at the rest of the puzzle. You have the pictures and video of the compound coming out of Pakistan, plus the accounts of the people who were there, both inside and from the neighbors who heard the helicopters. You have pictures of the burning wreckage of the helicopter they had to destroy. You have the interviews with Bin Laden's wife who was in the compound, saw him die, and confirmed his identity.With all that information, and the fact that everyone, from the White House to the Pakistani government and military, to Al Qaeda itself confirming the veracity of the events, do you really think that in this post-photoshop world that releasing the photograph is going to convince anyone who doesn't believe it yet? Do we really have to see every any and every single piece of evidence in existence before we accept something?"
" @TwoOneFive: Thats about as similar as carrots and lychee. The coffins of dead soldiers should be shown. We need to SERIOUSLY consider every time we decide to deploy people from our country. Its not just a personal cost to those soldiers and their families, but a cost to our nation.actually, yes. there would have to be witness, like for instance, loved ones of victims on 9/11.Our enemies deaths on the other hand do not have a cost to us. Its nothing something we should want..what we should want is justice and our enemies to stop being our enemies.Think about it a different way. Lets say they caught Osama and put him on trial. The trial would have ended in an execution. Would they have shown that? Pictures of that? Nope."
" @TwoOneFive: Why is there a debate over whether or not it was right killing him!? "i agree. he should have been captured alive. but im glad hes dead none-the-less
They are changing their story again, saying that only one guy had a gun, everyone else wasn't armed after they killed him. So they basically start assassinating everyone they can afterwards that moves or shooting them in the leg.
" @JackLumber said:" @FourWude:
You know I've been one of the few on here who HAS been doing the research. I have been following what has been happening closely and I have ALWAYS so far been willing to give the benefit of the doubt to the US government. But alas it is the government that has been messing us around.
You do realize that the official story has been changed 3 times already don't you. And at every juncture of the change I've been told to 'Take the Governments word for it'. Which is incredibly naive.
You stated the government didn't have live feed. Guess what, the government told us after the initial Obama speech that THEY DID HAVE LIVE FEED. Now the head of the CIA Leon Panetta says there was a total blackout for 25 minutes during the operation. So someone was telling fibs... oops. But I gave them the benefit of the doubt.
They've had almost 5 days to get the story straight and yet the official story is still not straightened out. Was Osama executed during or after the raid, conflicting reports? No one knows. Who's the woman? Was she used as a shield? We were told it's his wife and he used her as a shield, but again they fucked up and said no she wasn't and no shield was there.
Osama was meant to be shooting back initially as told by the always right US government. But alas they went and changed the story and told us he not only didn't shoot back, he wasn't even armed. So again who am I to believe?
We then come to dubious claims about respecting Islamic burial rites. They had to bury Osama's body within 24 hours, this law by and large doesn't exist in Islam, it's non-binding. And on top of that they dump the body in the sea, which is anti-Islamic anyway, makes a mockery of them respecting any laws to begin with. But again I waited for the government to clarify this position.
I was told by Obama that the US thanked Pakistan for its support in all of this. But Leon Pannetta, the head of the CIA stated there was no Pakistani involvement and they were kept in the dark. Later reports stated that Pakistan had been informed. Exactly who am I to believe? No seriously what am I supposed to believe? Obama or Leon Pannetta?
People keep telling me, like I'm supposed to be some naive idiot to just 'believe' the government. But even if I did just believe, what exactly am I supposed to believe??? There isn't a straight story to believe? If I believed everything the US government has so far said I'd be contradicting myself.
Before mouthing off and telling me to get my 'facts' straight, you should send your post to the White House and tell them to get their facts straight and once they do, tell them to send me a copy of the facts as well, I'd very much like to know.
P.S. Also I'd just like to point out I have NEVER claimed Osama was alive or in fact EVER refuted he was dead. It bothers me not one iota whether Osama is alive, dead, or making sweet butt love to Bush at his ranch as we speak. All I ever wanted was the truth of what happened. Nothing more. I just want to know what went on.
"
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