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When It's Over, It's Over

Mass Effect 3's ending has sparked an enormous debate, one that highlights the problem with endings, the role of creators, and what it means to be a fan.

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(Note: This article does not contain spoilers for the endings of Mass Effect 3, Lost or The Sopranos).

Suddenly, a bright light appears, and it’s all over. After years of investment and hours of discussion with friends, just a few minutes of credits later, it’s like it never happened.

Whether it’s putting the the Island to rest during the series finale of Lost or witnessing the final moments of Commander Shepard’s fight against the Reapers in Mass Effect 3, endings have seemingly impossible tasks.

Mass Effect 3 has only been out for two weeks. Most players haven’t seen how the trilogy ends, but players who've already made it back to Earth have awfully strong opinions about how BioWare chose to take a bow.

BioWare chose to break its silence yesterday in a blog post by BioWare co-founder Ray Muzyka. The Mass Effect 3 team is listening to player feedback, Muzyka explained, and more details would be available in April. At no point did Muzyka announce the ending to Mass Effect 3 would see alterations, and Muzyka contends BioWare will maintain the “integrity of the original story while addressing the fan feedback.”

Lost, just like Mass Effect, relied on dramatic tension to be fulfilled in each's final moments.
Lost, just like Mass Effect, relied on dramatic tension to be fulfilled in each's final moments.

“Endings often just can’t win,” said Entertainment Weekly senior writer, game player and once regular Lost columnist Jeff Jensen to me recently. “Most screenwriters will tell you the hardest part of any movie, any story to tell, is just the end. It’s the thing that changes the most, it’s the endings that are the most fought over among collaborators. They’re the things that are just the hardest to land.”

Retake Mass Effect is a petition by fans asking BioWare to provide alternate endings to Mass Effect 3 that, in their eyes, better represents the choices made by players across all three games, explains the final, twisty, head-scratching moments, includes a “heroic” finish in line with the series’ themes of success against incredible odds, and much more. To make their point, Retake Mass Effect has raised $77,514 for the Child’s Play charity.

“We would like to dispel the perception that we are angry or entitled,” reads a statement on Retake Mass Effect. “We simply wish to express our hope that there could be a different direction for a series we have all grown to love.”

Other fans, like Spike Murphy in California, went a step further. Murphy filed a false advertising complaint with the Federal Trade Commission (FTC) and Better Business Bureau (BBB). You can read Murphy’s BBB filing here, in which he contends BioWare and Electronic Arts mislead the public about what would be in Mass Effect 3’s ending.

In his complaint, Murphy pointed to comments from BioWare designers, writers and producers about how player choices would directly impact the ending in very nuanced ways, creatures like the Rachni would play a huge role, the endings would not be as simple as A, B, C, and big mysteries would finally be answered.

Many of Murphy's arguments fall into semantic buckets, however, which makes his case difficult to make.

The response to Murphy’s decision by other fans was not completely supportive. Members of Retake Mass Effect pushed back on Murphy, painting his move as childish and over the line, but Murphy defended his decision.

“I figured this would be a big way to keep some pressure on BioWare and EA to actually respond to the fan base and give them a real response or explanation for what happened,” he told me.

Murphy, who works in advertising and political outreach, admitted to not expecting much to actually happen because of the filings--it’s a PR move on his part to push BioWare towards addressing his feelings about the ending.

“My hope is that we see some kind of change or addition to the ending that explains it,” he said. “The first step would certainly be an acknowledgement that this ending was not the ending that they said they were going to give us. That legitimizes the complaints.”

It’s unclear if BioWare’s statement yesterday accomplishes that, but Murphy said it felt “pretty good.”

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Jensen, who’s finished the first two games and is currently working through Mass Effect 3, has seen audience reactions like this many times before while covering TV and film. Jensen had a weekly column at Entertainment Weekly analyzing each new episode of Lost, including its polarizing finale. The ending to Lost prompted an intense dialogue, which left one batch of fans satisfied, another batch of fans still yelling at the showrunners through Twitter.

Lost co-creator Damon Lindelof, who helped write Ridley Scott's upcoming Prometheus, even commented about Mass Effect 3 on Twitter, a humorous tip of the hat to fans, the reaction and the developers at BioWare.

“In entertainment, and especially in the mediums of television and video games, they are ultimately service industries,” said Jensen. “Which is to say the customer is always right, and that’s going to be frustrating for storytellers to hear because ultimately you exist, your product exists, at the whims and desire of your consumer base. If they’re happy, if they’re unhappy, they’re right. Even if they’re wrong, they’re right. You have to deal with it.”

Whether it’s happening passively on TV or actively through a video game, endings to massive epics become about catharsis, a deeply personal release from everything that’s built up over the time you’ve spent inside this narrative.

With Lost, I spent every week watching that show with friends. We laughed, cried, and yelled at the show for years. I watched the series finale with the same friends, and we mostly cried. That moment with Jack? With his...? Man.

“Here, we really do see analogs to things like Lost or The Sopranos,” said Jensen, “where a fanbase that’s large and rabid and loyal and passionate and really, really invested--they’re not only getting the final game or final episode, the end of a story, they’re getting the door slammed on a huge part of their lives, a significant thing in their lives. To that end, an ending, then, must give you something more.”

The
The "numbers" were important to Lost, and mythology was key to some people's enjoyment.

I’ve been unable to fill Lost’s void after it went off the air, and maybe I never will. While I sympathize with those who didn’t find it to have the necessary amount of catharsis, I don’t agree with them. Though I cannot muster the same passion about Mass Effect 3, I get it.

“There seems to be a similarity here with Mass Effect 3,” said Jensen, “with a fanbase that has gone through these games and come to the end, and they want the full meal catharsis--they want everything. They want a heroic end, or the possibility of a heroic end. They want an emotional sendoff, they want resolution of certain mysteries, and they all want it to be coherent and skillfully done. It sounds like Mass Effect just didn’t nail that landing.”

The Sopranos and Lost's endings both caused waves. It’s an important moment for a game to cause the same level of ire, resentment and discussion, even if much of it seems negative at the moment. As Jensen pointed out, most people came around to appreciating what The Sopranos creator David Chase tried, and maybe the same thing will happen to Mass Effect 3 one day.

“I think Mass Effect, as a franchise, these three games taken together, I just can’t see how it’s not regarded as anything less than a landmark,” said Jensen. “There’s so many things to enjoy about these games and this world and the creative accomplishment of this series than just those final moments.”

For many, though, those final moments were everything.

Patrick Klepek on Google+

440 Comments

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Phatmac

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Edited By Phatmac

I just can't get over the fact about that stupid kid.. It just doesn't add up. It felt like someone else wrote that ending. It's not about having a happy ending or anything like that. The ending just felt out of place to me. It's a different case than Lost, which just didn't answer a lot of questions. It still had a far better ending than what ME3 had. The ending just came out of left field, I just can't accept it as the end of a 5 year trilogy. I just wanted some closure..

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Curufinwe

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Edited By Curufinwe

@vhold said:

It seems the biggest mistake Bioware made was overestimating the players.

That and forcing in a awful Chobot cameo just for the extra publicity from IGN.

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Karkarov

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Edited By Karkarov

No offense but he hasn't beaten the game yet, isn't a video game journalist (laughs ensue), and it doesn't look good that he "can't agree" with people who were okay with Lost's ending. If you are looking for "catharsis" I suggest you stop looking for it in the entertainment industry.

A long time ago a pretty sharp friend of mine taught me a simple rule. If you can't understand, relate to, and debate both sides of an argument in a lucid manner than you aren't qualified to debate either side. I see very few if any on the side of changing the endings who can do this.

Lastly as a person who works as customer service in the entertainment industry.... uh no.... the customer can be wrong and isn't right just because he wants to be.

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Curufinwe

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Edited By Curufinwe

@Grognard66 said:

So much rage and drama to little purpose.

Like the the rest of your awful, whiny post.

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Rasmoss

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Edited By Rasmoss

@Zithe said:

@Rasmoss said:

@Veektarius: But there is plenty of wrong with the general idea. The ending contradicts stuff in the very same game (the characterisation of the Geth and EDI). It's like whoever wrote the ending didn't read his own story.

The Catalyst acknowledges that. He says his solution won't work anymore. He probably would have said a lot more if BioWare hadn't cut out most of his dialogue.

He said his solution won't work because Shepard reached him. He doesn't acknowledge that the whole thing was needless in the first place.

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Krakn3Dfx

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Edited By Krakn3Dfx

If they change the ending, I'm getting a refund!

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Jost1

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Edited By Jost1

the ending to LOST sucked so much I could not believe what I was seeing. Kind of ruined the whole show for me. Fucking terrible!

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MidnightVice

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Edited By MidnightVice

A well-written, evenhanded article, and a really interesting read as well. Nice work, Patrick!

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Zithe

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Edited By Zithe

@Rasmoss said:

He said his solution won't work because Shepard reached him. He doesn't acknowledge that the whole thing was needless in the first place.

Would Shepard have been able to reach him if synthetic life were working against organics instead of with them? I realize this isn't the best argument, but no one outside of BioWare really knows what else he was supposed to tell us.

In that The Final Hours thing that Geoff Keighley put together, one of the writers mentioned that the Catalyst dialogue was supposed to be an investigative one where we would be able to ask a lot of questions and he would pretty much explain everything to Shepard, but they took it out. Hopefully this DLC they are planning will explain it further.

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ichthy

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Edited By ichthy

BSG ending anybody? I know that one also caused a total shitstorm for a couple days.

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Juno500

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@mutha3 said:

@patrickklepek: So far you guys haven't really touched on what you actually thought of the ending itself. The conversation on the bombcast this was primarily about the fan response to the endings. Ignoring all internet BS for a second, what did you think of the ending itself?

Didn't they say on the last bombcast that they wanted to wait a while until they got into spoilers?

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williamhenry

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Edited By williamhenry

@mutha3 said:

@patrickklepek: So far you guys haven't really touched on what you actually thought of the ending itself. The conversation on the bombcast this was primarily about the fan response to the endings. Ignoring all internet BS for a second, what did you think of the ending itself?

I thought they addressed that it was too early to talk about it?

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mrsmiley

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Edited By mrsmiley

I've decided to stop arguing for the indoctrination theory, and rather just wait to see what Bioware has for us in April. Personally, I think that the "ending" of ME3 is not the ending at all, but rather a preface to the ending, which will come via FREE DLC. This would be the only way to truly sell that the current ending is "real", based on Shepherd being indoctrinated. Make people think all that stuff actually happened, then release a DLC that has Shepherd waking up where he got downed by the laser... the story then continues...

Does that assume too much of Bioware's brilliance? Maybe. But again, we won't know anything for sure for a couple weeks.

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microshock

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Edited By microshock

@vhold said:

The complaint that the endings are all the same mainly reveals how unimaginative the complainers are. The ramifications of the 3 different endings are hugely different, it just doesn't beat you over the head showing that, you have to use your imagination just a little bit. It seems the biggest mistake Bioware made was overestimating the players.

I guess I was imagining how worthless every single one of my decisions were when they presented me with the same 3 "decisions" every single person in the game got.

A person could have literally played the opposite of me, and gotten the same ending. It makes no sense in a trilogy where your "decisions matter", and then the ending obviously threw that out the window.

Yeah, they're "different" like M&M's are different amongst each other. But they're really all the same, only changing the color of the explosion in between. Now, go back to your cave to think of another unique opinion where you poorly try to insult fans.

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Liquidus

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Edited By Liquidus

Lost and The Sopranos comparison are understandable but not fitting for Mass Effect 3. Video games are wildly different from TV shows or movies, they demand the player becomes a part of the world and gets invested especially Mass Effect where you're making major decisions that could have dire consequences. To see all that promise flushed down the toilet in the final minutes, that's what me and a lot of people I know are upset about.

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Aetheldod

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Edited By Aetheldod

Look peeps .... I have no problem with the endings that are there now ... if they were one out of many. Yes the ID theory is awesome , but it does not fit with my Shepard one bit. We just wanted what Bioware promised , different endings ( not just color a , b or c) according to all the things we did through out 3 games!!!!! If the game was just one , by god the ending we have , or rather the ID theory would be one of the most amazing endings in videogame history , problem is that this is not supposed to be 1 game , it is to be the culmination of 3 games that always made a big deal out of your decisions , those differences that made each playthorugh from each player kind of unique , that is the big deal here. Also they could just added friggin epilogues text like in Dragon Age Origin and things wouldve been smoother.

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Rasmoss

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@Zithe said:

@Rasmoss said:

He said his solution won't work because Shepard reached him. He doesn't acknowledge that the whole thing was needless in the first place.

Would Shepard have been able to reach him if synthetic life were working against organics instead of with them? I realize this isn't the best argument, but no one outside of BioWare really knows what else he was supposed to tell us.

In that The Final Hours thing that Geoff Keighley put together, one of the writers mentioned that the Catalyst dialogue was supposed to be an investigative one where we would be able to ask a lot of questions and he would pretty much explain everything to Shepard, but they took it out. Hopefully this DLC they are planning will explain it further.

Well, given that the Geth are only some hundred points worth on the war board, I'd say yes :-P

But the whole A.I./organics thing was never the main theme of the story anyway. The main themes from the very beginning was 1) the interaction of the galactic species - Do you try to make everyone work together, or do you use the others as stepping stones for Human superiority, and 2) Do you act from an ethical standpoint at all times, or do the end justify the means.

All of the important choices in the series has revolved around these two things. To sweep that aside at the last minute and elevate one of the minor themes to be the main crux of the story is the most jarring thing about it, IMO.

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C_Cage

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Edited By C_Cage

Artistic integrity is a completely romanticized view of how the business of selling art actually works and it's pissing me off. The only way to have full artistic control of your work is if you give it away for free. Since this is not a viable option for most people; artists must look at the trends in the market and hope to god that other people buy in to their artistic vision. If people do not you either stick to your guns in the hopes that they do before you die or you go back to the drawing board and bring something to market people appreciate.

While Bioware has made a lot of money on mass effect 3 already the success of their future DLC is something they must consider. It's either them or the market.

This is how the business of art has always worked. Some times people love you're original vision and sometimes people hate it either way if you're looking to put food on the table somethings gotta give.

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vhold

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Edited By vhold
@Microshock said:

Yeah, they're "different" like M&M's are different amongst each other. But they're really all the same, only changing the color of the explosion in between. 

If that's the only difference you were able to figure out or notice between the endings then you have given a perfect example of my point.
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mutha3

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Edited By mutha3
@Juno500: @WilliamHenry: Huh. I guess that's what  you get when you absentmindedly put on the show while doing something else!
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@vhold said:

@Microshock said:

Yeah, they're "different" like M&M's are different amongst each other. But they're really all the same, only changing the color of the explosion in between.

If that's the only difference you were able to figure out or notice between the endings then you have given a perfect example of my point.

Hey, when you ignore the entire length of my post other than your incredibly stupid "point" where you attempt to make yourself smart because you "got" the ending, you know you're pathetic. Jeez, some people.

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Grognard66

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Edited By Grognard66

@Curufinwe said:

@Grognard66 said:

So much rage and drama to little purpose.

Like the the rest of your awful, whiny post.

Like the rest of the children creating this nonsense, you foolishly equate being snarky with actually having a substantive debate about something. The rest of your immature posts only offer further evidence.

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bacongames

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Edited By bacongames

I like this article a lot but really the question is a gray one. On the one hand if the people consuming this shit hate the ending, I would accept the developers re-evaluating their creative decisions. However I don't feel the fans can come close to actually suggesting what that ending should be. The direct suggestion would be the pandering buckling of creative merit but I can see it going both ways if it was BioWare doing what they feel is right. If by "what they feel is right" means a DLC ending change or just some clarifications then I'm willing to see what that will be before I judge.

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LegalBagel

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@Metal_Mills said:

@815Sox said:

@Metal_Mills said:

Charles Dickens Great Expectations ending was changed. Why? Because people hated it so much. Does that means books and charles dickens are no longer art?

Dickens did this of his own accord due to urging from Edward Bulwer-Lytton, slightly different from doing so because a bunch of nerds (the great unwashed) were angry.

And how do we know this wasn't changed because they ran out of time? Casey Hudson specifically saying "The ending WILL NOT be you picking A, B or C" when in fact it was exactly that to a tee. How do we know this wasn't like Blade Runner and the ending was effective by other things? The original ending of that movie is hated by all. Including Ridley Scott and Harrison Ford.

The sad thing is, with everyone defending letting artists be artists, letting a work stand on its own, and not caving to pressure - I think the more likely reasoning behind the unsatisfying and nonsensical ending is what you said. They were pressured for time and money and so did a quick hash of an ambiguous ending to be explained and expanded on in epilogue DLC.

From the multiplayer, to the pre-DLC which was actually part of the story, to the entire marketing campaign, that seems to be the far more obvious conclusion seeing the ending, the "buy DLC!" message at the end, and their subsequent actions. And if that's the case, it's going to make all journalists going to bat for Bioware and telling them to stand their ground and defend the ending feel really stupid.

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Jaysinya90

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Edited By Jaysinya90

Good job Patrick, one of the first major pieces I've seen on it that was actually balanced rather than sensationalist

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mikular

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Edited By mikular

Apologies, that did read a tad venomous.

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Zithe

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Edited By Zithe

@Rasmoss: I don't think the endings are great, but I also don't think I would say that the struggle against the Reapers and their cycle is a minor theme. It's been present from the start and in all 3 games' conclusions.

Also, I know you weren't completely serious about how many magical points the Geth were worth, but you have to keep in mind that not only would you not get those points, you would have to subtract them from your current strength if they were actively working against you.

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chaosnovaxz

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Edited By chaosnovaxz

@Zithe:

It could go either way, I'm just saying. There's a deliberate camera shot showing us the exact same wound.

Cerberus was able to control Husks, but that's about it, nothing like controlling a human was ever established. Although the IM did look different; perhaps he had some Reaper mods? Who knows?

The point is Bioware just shoveled us some random, non-connected shit for an ending that makes absolutely no sense, and it's near impossible for us to deduce "what really happened" on our own. When we try, we get "indoctrination theories".

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unholyone123

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Edited By unholyone123

When you treat a video game franchise like it is some sort of quasi-religion, what else can you expect other than disappointment. This reminds me of the Mother 3/Earthbound 2 fans who just can't seem to let it go. Perhaps those who are upset about the ending should maybe be a little more introspective? It's just a game people. There will be plenty of other games in the future. Don't get too hung up on this one. By the way, I'm not trying to be condescending, I'm just pointing out the obvious.

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richardg234

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Edited By richardg234

I hate how people don't play this due to the ending

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@Carac: That theory is stupid and ripped off the belief that something is never over. Using that would be the same as saying "yeah we all planned this from the start" when in all actuality they didn't. If you do take the story's ending then it let's you choose to either break the cycle or begin the cycle again in a way that doesn't involve the reapers or synthetics, which is a valid ending. Jumping on the bandwagon of it being an "indoctrination" is ridiculous and steps beyond the bounds of the viewer/reader in terms of storytelling. Basically what I'm saying is that if one chooses to use this as a conclusion for the ending (one in which I might add took a lot of thought to come to, hint hint) then it should be an imposed ending and not one that is genuinely true.

I do agree on what Patrick is saying. I never watched Lost or the Sopranos but I did see Full Metal Alchemist and it's ending sparked the same amount of controversy due to how confusing everything was and how it left people feeling "left out to dry". The ending basically involved the same thing that ME3's did in which it relied on a clifhanger to allow people to make up what happened in their own mind. I do agree that ME3's ending is a bit lazy, having no real change between the three except for a colour change, but it does successfully wrap everything up throughout the actual story. The ending just leaves more questions but the story wraps up most of the major conflicts and helps people see what happened because of your actions in the first two games.

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Matterless

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SeriouslyNow

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Edited By SeriouslyNow
@patrickklepek: You seem to skip over the fact that Lost actually gave an answer to the last season's mystery - What was the alternate reality?  Mass Effect 3's ending gives no answers at all but, rather, places a Deus Ex Machina (quite literally) at the tail end to give the player an illusion of choice and to avoid having to give answers.  And that's also ignoring the myriad plot holes.
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vancealmighty

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Interviewer: [Regarding the numerous possible endings of Mass Effect 2] “Is that same type of complexity built into the ending of Mass Effect 3?”

Hudson: “Yeah, and I’d say much more so, because we have the ability to build the endings out in a way that we don’t have to worry about eventually tying them back together somewhere. This story arc is coming to an end with this game. That means the endings can be a lot more different. At this point we’re taking into account so many decisions that you’ve made as a player and reflecting a lot of that stuff. It’s not even in any way like the traditional game endings, where you can say how many endings there are or whether you got ending A, B, or C.....The endings have a lot more sophistication and variety in them.”

They flat out lied. Period. YOU LITERALLY GET AN A, B or C ENDING. People can think the fans are just bitching over nothing, and they should get over it, but the reality is that they, and I, were lied to.

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Matterless

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Edited By Matterless

And expanding the Lost parallel, didn't Lost release an epilogue video due to fan reaction? It wasn't a retcon, but an acknowledgement of a lack of closure felt by the audience.

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@vhold said:

@Microshock said:

Yeah, they're "different" like M&M's are different amongst each other. But they're really all the same, only changing the color of the explosion in between.

If that's the only difference you were able to figure out or notice between the endings then you have given a perfect example of my point.

Here is a video that literally shows you the lack of any meaningful difference.

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Nomin

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No wonder Jeff, being colorblind, thought the ending for ME3 was rather lacking.

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Zithe

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@GrandHarrier said:

@vhold said:

@Microshock said:

Yeah, they're "different" like M&M's are different amongst each other. But they're really all the same, only changing the color of the explosion in between.

If that's the only difference you were able to figure out or notice between the endings then you have given a perfect example of my point.

Here is a video that literally shows you the lack of any meaningful difference.

The difference though is not how they look or how they play out, it's what they mean for the future of the universe. You going to tell me that a universe where all synthetic and organic life are fused together into one type isn't a game changer? Or a universe where all synthetic life as we know it is wiped out?

I'm not really defending the endings here, I would have loved if the ending took a lot of our choices into account so that we all got personal endings tailored to our own Shepards, but the three choices they offer you DO make a huge impact on the universe.

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Death_Unicorn

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@patrickklepek said:

@Death_Unicorn said:

Patrick, don't write about Mass Effect 3 until you finished the game.

I finished it last Sunday.

Apologies. These last couple of days have been intense as a big fan of Mass Effect and my attitude towards gaming press has become a little sour due to a large amount of publications demeaning users who feel upset towards the ending. So, yeah, I guess I should go listen to the bombcast if I want to hear your opinion of the ending then?

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Max_Cherry

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I personally have no problem with ME3 having a poor ending; however, I also have no problem with fans petitioning to change Mass Effect 3's ending. It is a great misnomer to damn these people as being "entitled" because entitlement is a general vice, and in a sense the fan base is entitled to voice their opinions with a level of expectation that they be met. The fans are a part of Mass Effect's development and their feedback will shape future video games in this genre. A much better word would be "emotional".Alas, all people are emotional beings.

This is not unprecedented. In the early 20th century people were dismayed with the ending of the Sherlock Holmes saga where (spoilers) Sherlock Holmes falls to his death. The fans reaction was so strong that Sir Author Conan Doyle changed his original ending bringing Sherlock Holmes back to life.

PS: Don't get into the whole video games as art debate. That never leads anywhere.

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@Zithe said:

@Rasmoss: I don't think the endings are great, but I also don't think I would say that the struggle against the Reapers and their cycle is a minor theme. It's been present from the start and in all 3 games' conclusions.

Also, I know you weren't completely serious about how many magical points the Geth were worth, but you have to keep in mind that not only would you not get those points, you would have to subtract them from your current strength if they were actively working against you.

Yeah but it was never really clear what the Reapers were and what their motivation was. In fact it was said that their existance was "beyond human understanding" or somesuch. Mostly they acted as a backdrop against which you made your decisions.

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phatcat

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I never played ME (I'm trying too, but I'm just not liking the stuff between story beats... you know the game) so I didn't understand why everyone is so mad

then a friend sent me this image....

No Caption Provided

I understand why everyone is so angry now :\

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Sergotron

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@Carac: @Carac said:

If the indoctrination theory is true, they planned all of this. It would also explain why they want to wait until more people have finished it to say, "You all got tricked/indocrinated...and here's the battle that happened after the battle of shepard's will vs reaper Indocrtination that was happening in his head" (the ending we've seen).

The only ending where Shepard breathes in the rubble where he was hit by the Harbringer blast on earth was the one the reapers didn't want you to pick and the one that symbolizes not giving into indoctrincation. The left choice being that of the illusive man, and the central choice being that of Saren. We've all been played/tricked by indoctrination...I hope. I mean, why else would the trees and bushes from your dreams show up on the field around you after being hit by Harbinger's beam. Why would the narrow path to the console in the citadel be an amalgam of ship designs throughout Shepard's story (including the Shadow Broker's), all of that "Reaper vignetting" in the next to last scene. The last scene where Anderson represents Shepard's will fighting Indoctrination and the Illusive man representing Indoctrination. And the "choice of three" being the Reaper's test to see if indoctrination worked.

Wow, seeing this made me really like that ending now.

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napalm

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@C_Cage said:

Artistic integrity is a completely romanticized view of how the business of selling art actually works and it's pissing me off. The only way to have full artistic control of your work is if you give it away for free. Since this is not a viable option for most people; artists must look at the trends in the market and hope to god that other people buy in to their artistic vision. If people do not you either stick to your guns in the hopes that they do before you die or you go back to the drawing board and bring something to market people appreciate.

I actually find it highly hilarious that everybody is willing to step in and defend videogames only as a consumer-based retail product, but when developers are challenged on other levels, everybody wants to double back on the consumer product point of view, step in and just go, "no, bro. It's art. You just don't get how art works."

This is exactly one of those times where literally, the entire game enthusiast press has double-backed and defended, "games are nothing but art, bro." Fuck off and pick a side. You don't get to have your cake and eat it too. That isn't how this fucking thing works, that you can just flip flop on a whim when it's fucking convenient for you. I've lost more respect for people in the enthusiast press over this debacle than I think I ever have, exactly for this reason. Stick to your fucking guns or fuck off.

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anubite

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Valve spent months iterating its ending for Portal 2. They never gave up. They even playtested the ending, watching for player reaction and feedback. They created an ending that appealed to their testers, making it open enough to facilitate a sequel yet satisfying enough to make the player's feel good about what they'd done.

BioWare gave up. Or at least, that's my feeling. Nobody wanted to create a quality ending so they shoved it out the door. This is unacceptable. BioWare should have more rigorous practices like Valve. But they don't and their profits should suffer for it. Nevermind that they did lie to us - they SAID that the ending would NOT be you simplying chosing the ending - it would culiminate from your choices. They said this multiple times. And the exact opposite happened.

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studnoth1n

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for those who regard this as some kind of victory in the democratic process, you're deluding yourselves. all this reveals is your inability to recognize when you're being blatantly pandered to, and ultimately, how immobile you are to protest. if someone made a shoddy product based on unkept promises, the consequences should be clear and direct. don't support it, let alone wait around for things to be "righted." however, it seems most have developed an unusually strong tolerance to being insulted.

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veektarius

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@Rasmoss said:

@Zithe said:

@Rasmoss said:

@Veektarius: But there is plenty of wrong with the general idea. The ending contradicts stuff in the very same game (the characterisation of the Geth and EDI). It's like whoever wrote the ending didn't read his own story.

The Catalyst acknowledges that. He says his solution won't work anymore. He probably would have said a lot more if BioWare hadn't cut out most of his dialogue.

He said his solution won't work because Shepard reached him. He doesn't acknowledge that the whole thing was needless in the first place.

I don't believe that your point is relevant. The Catalyst/Reapers are built on an assumption that organic life will ultimately create synthetic life that will destroy it. It doesn't matter if it is wrong. Or rather, it is the belief that it is wrong that motivates your decision to stop the Reapers, which is what you do on any of the three endings. The fact the Catalyst believes it (erroneously or not) is not a plot hole. It was programmed to believe it.

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@jbreality:

But if the child does represent Reaper interests (or even Harbinger), nothing he says can be trusted. The red choice likely only destroys the reapers and leaves all other synthetic life, it's made to sound like the worst choice because it would mean their attempt to Indoctrinate Shepard failed. And you know co-existence is possible because you just "fixed" the Geth/Quarian divide. The entire sequence is in Shepard's head, this is an internal battle of wills, so the true purpose of the Catalyst and destruction of the relays is likely also a fabrication. After being hit by Harbinger's beam, nothing can be taken at face value. Look behind Shepard after the beam hits and he gets up, the trees from his dreams are where you just ran through. Look at the "wavy red vignetting" of the camera view during the Illusive Man's speech. The wound Shepard inflicts on Anderson suddenly showing up on him (gunshot to the lower left abdomen) that the camera focuses and lingers on.

On the flip side, if the ending was originally meant to taken at face value, Bioware would be crazy not to pickup the Indoctrination angle and run with it, saying "yeah...that's it....it was all part of the plan" *nervously looking at each other*. It makes too much sense. The codex description of indoctrination describes Shepard's last 10-15 minutes to the letter.

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@studnoth1n
 
So you're saying people should have known how the game ended before they bought it?
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@Curufinwe said:

@Grognard66 said:

So much rage and drama to little purpose.

Like the the rest of your awful, whiny post.

CUT MY LIFE INTO PIECES

THIS IS MY LAST RESORT