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When It's Over, It's Over

Mass Effect 3's ending has sparked an enormous debate, one that highlights the problem with endings, the role of creators, and what it means to be a fan.

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(Note: This article does not contain spoilers for the endings of Mass Effect 3, Lost or The Sopranos).

Suddenly, a bright light appears, and it’s all over. After years of investment and hours of discussion with friends, just a few minutes of credits later, it’s like it never happened.

Whether it’s putting the the Island to rest during the series finale of Lost or witnessing the final moments of Commander Shepard’s fight against the Reapers in Mass Effect 3, endings have seemingly impossible tasks.

Mass Effect 3 has only been out for two weeks. Most players haven’t seen how the trilogy ends, but players who've already made it back to Earth have awfully strong opinions about how BioWare chose to take a bow.

BioWare chose to break its silence yesterday in a blog post by BioWare co-founder Ray Muzyka. The Mass Effect 3 team is listening to player feedback, Muzyka explained, and more details would be available in April. At no point did Muzyka announce the ending to Mass Effect 3 would see alterations, and Muzyka contends BioWare will maintain the “integrity of the original story while addressing the fan feedback.”

Lost, just like Mass Effect, relied on dramatic tension to be fulfilled in each's final moments.
Lost, just like Mass Effect, relied on dramatic tension to be fulfilled in each's final moments.

“Endings often just can’t win,” said Entertainment Weekly senior writer, game player and once regular Lost columnist Jeff Jensen to me recently. “Most screenwriters will tell you the hardest part of any movie, any story to tell, is just the end. It’s the thing that changes the most, it’s the endings that are the most fought over among collaborators. They’re the things that are just the hardest to land.”

Retake Mass Effect is a petition by fans asking BioWare to provide alternate endings to Mass Effect 3 that, in their eyes, better represents the choices made by players across all three games, explains the final, twisty, head-scratching moments, includes a “heroic” finish in line with the series’ themes of success against incredible odds, and much more. To make their point, Retake Mass Effect has raised $77,514 for the Child’s Play charity.

“We would like to dispel the perception that we are angry or entitled,” reads a statement on Retake Mass Effect. “We simply wish to express our hope that there could be a different direction for a series we have all grown to love.”

Other fans, like Spike Murphy in California, went a step further. Murphy filed a false advertising complaint with the Federal Trade Commission (FTC) and Better Business Bureau (BBB). You can read Murphy’s BBB filing here, in which he contends BioWare and Electronic Arts mislead the public about what would be in Mass Effect 3’s ending.

In his complaint, Murphy pointed to comments from BioWare designers, writers and producers about how player choices would directly impact the ending in very nuanced ways, creatures like the Rachni would play a huge role, the endings would not be as simple as A, B, C, and big mysteries would finally be answered.

Many of Murphy's arguments fall into semantic buckets, however, which makes his case difficult to make.

The response to Murphy’s decision by other fans was not completely supportive. Members of Retake Mass Effect pushed back on Murphy, painting his move as childish and over the line, but Murphy defended his decision.

“I figured this would be a big way to keep some pressure on BioWare and EA to actually respond to the fan base and give them a real response or explanation for what happened,” he told me.

Murphy, who works in advertising and political outreach, admitted to not expecting much to actually happen because of the filings--it’s a PR move on his part to push BioWare towards addressing his feelings about the ending.

“My hope is that we see some kind of change or addition to the ending that explains it,” he said. “The first step would certainly be an acknowledgement that this ending was not the ending that they said they were going to give us. That legitimizes the complaints.”

It’s unclear if BioWare’s statement yesterday accomplishes that, but Murphy said it felt “pretty good.”

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Jensen, who’s finished the first two games and is currently working through Mass Effect 3, has seen audience reactions like this many times before while covering TV and film. Jensen had a weekly column at Entertainment Weekly analyzing each new episode of Lost, including its polarizing finale. The ending to Lost prompted an intense dialogue, which left one batch of fans satisfied, another batch of fans still yelling at the showrunners through Twitter.

Lost co-creator Damon Lindelof, who helped write Ridley Scott's upcoming Prometheus, even commented about Mass Effect 3 on Twitter, a humorous tip of the hat to fans, the reaction and the developers at BioWare.

“In entertainment, and especially in the mediums of television and video games, they are ultimately service industries,” said Jensen. “Which is to say the customer is always right, and that’s going to be frustrating for storytellers to hear because ultimately you exist, your product exists, at the whims and desire of your consumer base. If they’re happy, if they’re unhappy, they’re right. Even if they’re wrong, they’re right. You have to deal with it.”

Whether it’s happening passively on TV or actively through a video game, endings to massive epics become about catharsis, a deeply personal release from everything that’s built up over the time you’ve spent inside this narrative.

With Lost, I spent every week watching that show with friends. We laughed, cried, and yelled at the show for years. I watched the series finale with the same friends, and we mostly cried. That moment with Jack? With his...? Man.

“Here, we really do see analogs to things like Lost or The Sopranos,” said Jensen, “where a fanbase that’s large and rabid and loyal and passionate and really, really invested--they’re not only getting the final game or final episode, the end of a story, they’re getting the door slammed on a huge part of their lives, a significant thing in their lives. To that end, an ending, then, must give you something more.”

The
The "numbers" were important to Lost, and mythology was key to some people's enjoyment.

I’ve been unable to fill Lost’s void after it went off the air, and maybe I never will. While I sympathize with those who didn’t find it to have the necessary amount of catharsis, I don’t agree with them. Though I cannot muster the same passion about Mass Effect 3, I get it.

“There seems to be a similarity here with Mass Effect 3,” said Jensen, “with a fanbase that has gone through these games and come to the end, and they want the full meal catharsis--they want everything. They want a heroic end, or the possibility of a heroic end. They want an emotional sendoff, they want resolution of certain mysteries, and they all want it to be coherent and skillfully done. It sounds like Mass Effect just didn’t nail that landing.”

The Sopranos and Lost's endings both caused waves. It’s an important moment for a game to cause the same level of ire, resentment and discussion, even if much of it seems negative at the moment. As Jensen pointed out, most people came around to appreciating what The Sopranos creator David Chase tried, and maybe the same thing will happen to Mass Effect 3 one day.

“I think Mass Effect, as a franchise, these three games taken together, I just can’t see how it’s not regarded as anything less than a landmark,” said Jensen. “There’s so many things to enjoy about these games and this world and the creative accomplishment of this series than just those final moments.”

For many, though, those final moments were everything.

Patrick Klepek on Google+

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TrackZero

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Edited By TrackZero

@caseyg said:

As for comparing Lost to Mass Effect?, apples and oranges. Lost is a TV show and like movies/novels can only have one ending. Mass Effect is a video game and as such can have a variety of endings all equally valid.

Agreed. While I appreciate Patrick's writeup, there's two issues he either is overlooking or isn't aware of.

As you've addressed, this is a game. Specifically one that is built around multiple choices. That said, it doesn't mean choose-your-own-ending. But what it should mean is your choices up to that point then reflect one of multiple endings. All we are given is really one.

Secondly, and this is the crucial one, seemingly everyone discussing this topic are talking about different things. Let me be clear on this, unless you're aware of it already through your own deduction or because you've seen it, the ending isn't really an ending. By that I mean, the last 5 minutes in a way are just "fake". I urge people to go youtube the video "Shepard's Indoctrination (NEW)", otherwise we're not all on the same page. I actually long for a few more weeks to pass so people can talk openly about the ending so these misconceptions can be cleared up in a public forum.

Taking both those items into account, you're left with the realization that you didn't actually see the game end. Following that, the entire thing was designed for DLC (and specifically a DLC ending). All we can do now is wait and see if the DLC will be free or not, but left with that feeling that had all these complaints not come out in the open, this is probably the first time gamers would be paying for DLC to end an RPG series. That's where the real rub is and where the discussion should be happening. Again, please go watch that video so we're all on the same page.

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WinterSnowblind

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@darkdragonmage99 said:

@studnoth1n: Honestly I think my appreciation of real storytelling is the reason I hated the ending of mass effect 3 . I don't think video games have quite made it to truly good stories. Mass effect came close but it lost track of the plot they had planned out a few times by the feel of it. It's hard to get a series of games to have a coherent story from start to finish because the developers want to change so much between the games.

I wonder do you watch/listen to ted talks because there is a good one on storytelling.

I'd completely agree. The game completely abandoned the style of storytelling they had been going for in the past 3 games, in favour of the high concept mumbo jumbo for the final 10 minutes.

And again, I think it's hard to talk about artistic integrity when it's obvious from the very start that it was never intended as the true end. They openly admitted that it was supposed to be a polarising end, because they wanted people to discuss the game. I'd say with some amount of confidence that releasing DLC to further explain everything was always their plan, and the fact it deviates so much from what the original writer of ME1 and 2 wanted pretty much proves that.

Comparing it to how story telling works in books and movies just doesn't work, videogames are just so completely different, especially when it comes to the fact they're supposed to be player driven.

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lamzor

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Edited By lamzor

one of the best TV show series finale was in The Shield. Show had its highs and lows but the ending was brutal.
Lost was very good but until they started flashbacks in flashforwards in alternative universe future(in flashback). ending was weirds and underwhelming.

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PandaL

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@darkdragonmage99: Oh,thanks, that's good to know, since I don't usually go into another playthrough right after one.

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caseyg

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Edited By caseyg

@studnoth1n: Yeah, because no one would ever go back and plays through a game again to get a different ending, right?

As for comparing Lost to Mass Effect?, apples and oranges. Lost is a TV show and like movies/novels can only have one ending. Mass Effect is a video game and as such can have a variety of endings all equally valid.

Also, what is up with people claiming that if BioWare modifies the end of Mass Effect it's going to ruin video games? As of now the endings to games are %95+ crap. It can't get any worse. Yes there are some good ones, but they are the exception not the rule. Even my favorite game of 2011, Dark Souls, had two endings both of which are not very good. I don't think many people care though because Dark Souls is all about challenging exploration and overcoming harsh difficulties. The story isn't all that important. On the other hand Mass Effect is all about the story. Not doing a good job on it is like making a Mario game with terrible jumping controls.

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Lysergica33

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Edited By Lysergica33

@AV_Gamer: FF7 does give answers, although they are implied, and the style of the game and the storytelling is totally different to ME3. ME3 is a kind of "choose your own adventure" type book, FF7 is a massive, massive novel, if we're going with this book analogy. The FF series tends to deal with more black and white morality, good ultimately triumphing over evil and that is the intended ending. They save the world, whether they live to tell the tale is another story, although Red XIII looking over a ruined Midgar says a lot to me. Not a particularly worthy comparison though.

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Lysergica33

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Edited By Lysergica33

I haven't played the game, and have no intention of doing so, but I've been keeping up wioth the whole contraversy, and I have to say, that video explaining the indoctrination theory makes a damn good case in its favour, so much so that it's probably in Bioware's best interest to run with it even if it wasn't their intended interpretation of the ending (although I get the feeling it is.) But still, there's a reason I'm not playing this game, and it's because Bioware and EA are full of shit. Monetising the "real" ending is a dick move, both from an artistic and business perspective, and you can bet that's what they're going to do, and if you don't want to support those kind of practices you give your money to people who DO deserve it. Hence why CD Projekt Red and From Software get my cash and not Bioware. The twist is clever, but it's incredibly deceptive and for all the wrong reasons, and personally, I don't really think that's cool.

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darkdragonmage99

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@PandaL:  you can get to the 5000 reg without multiplayer you just have to play through a second time
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AV_Gamer

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Mass Effect 3's ending is a lot like the outcry that happened with Final Fantasy 7's ending. No one could make sense of it. Did Meteor destroy the planet? Did Aerith's Holy Materia save the planet? And what happened to the party members afterwards? This caused Square-Enix to create compilations to give the game a final conclusion. It didn't do that much better IMO. The same thing will happen to Mass Effect 3. All the extra DLC's, Prequels, and whatever else won't remove the stink for many fans. Personally, I thought the obvious ending choice was decent enough, though not explaining what became of the crew and why joker was fleeing tainted it.

Also it clearly seems to be a money-grab scheme by EA. Don't give a real conclusion so we can keep making content to charge them for. I see now why Jeff gave the game 4 out of 5 stars.

And Bioware can suck a fat one for killing Anderson off; he was the soul of the Mass Effect series.

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PandaL

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To me the problem is not the way they end the story, but the way they present the endings. All endings, good or bad, are way too similar to one another. At the end, there's no joyce of exploring other endings since the only real difference is the colour. Also there's only one branching point and it is only at the very very end, that makes the ending quite dettached from the main game. (I don't mean the good or bad endings, I mean the "green", "red" and "blue" endings)

Also forcing the players to play multiplayer portion to achieve the good ending is an absolutely terrible idea.

I think they should keep the way the story ends, but 1 redo all the ending scenes, 2 make the choices through out the game affect which ending you'll see and 3 remove the multiplayer restriction for the good endings

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SeriouslyNow

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@Nicholas said:

@SolidOcelot said:

I simply want a 3 hour Q&A session with the folks at BioWare, I want to get their side of the story, specifically to ask why is the ending filled with plot holes. Was there more to it initially, were they rushed, did they run out of ideas.

They seem to be building to a certain conclusion one minute and what follows instead is illogical.

I hope what BioWare ends up addressing is simply the holes in the story, closure would be nice, but I can live without it.

Wow. Yes. This. I agree.

OK. To be more articulate about my feelings...

The stuff between Joker, EDI and to an extent Shepard as well, is some of my favorite stuff in the game. To forget that ever happened is maddening. I could go on.

ARGH!

Pretty much this.  The fans who accept the ending choices as logical or even relevant plainly don't understand the plot of this game alone, let alone the others which preceded it.  How anyone who actually cares about the story cannot be infuriated with the SYNFETIX R BADZ ending is beyond my mere mortal comprehension.
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phrali

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Edited By phrali

i never liked lost. but that ending was dumb.

but the sopranos? i used to absolutely love that show. and the ending basically RUINED THE WHOLE SERIES. it was just so fucking stupid. it was like "hey thanks for watching all these years, by the way, fuck you, here's an ending where nothing happens. NOTHING. show over. thanks for the money."

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ICF_19XX

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@catpowerd said:

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@mutha3 said:

"artistic integrity"

Hahaha that's gotta be shoped right?

No. Unfortunately.

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ICF_19XX

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@SolidOcelot said:

I simply want a 3 hour Q&A session with the folks at BioWare, I want to get their side of the story, specifically to ask why is the ending filled with plot holes. Was there more to it initially, were they rushed, did they run out of ideas.

They seem to be building to a certain conclusion one minute and what follows instead is illogical.

The "cycle" is clearly not inevitable since a few hours earlier you quell a century old war and have the Geth helping quarians rebuild their planet. Not to mention you spend hours helping EDI a synthetic come to gripes with her new "life". The Geth are even made out to be sympathetic and where supposed to believe no matter our choices this is how the game ends.

I hope what BioWare ends up addressing is simply the holes in the story, closure would be nice, but I can live without it.

Wow. Yes. This. I agree.

OK. To be more articulate about my feelings...

The stuff between Joker, EDI and to an extent Shepard as well, is some of my favorite stuff in the game. To forget that ever happened is maddening. I could go on.

ARGH!

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darkdragonmage99

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Edited By darkdragonmage99
@studnoth1n:  Honestly I think my  appreciation of real storytelling is the reason I hated the ending of mass effect 3 .  I don't think video games have quite made it to truly good stories.  Mass effect came close but it lost track of the plot they had planned out a few times by the feel of it.  It's hard to get a series of games to have a coherent story from start to finish because the developers want to change so much between the games. 
 
I wonder do you watch/listen to ted talks because there is a good one on storytelling.   
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luthorcrow

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@DG991 said:

Jesus... shut the fuck up about Lost Patrick.

The ending to that show was fucking awful and the show only had a good first season and confusing seasons day after day.

Mass effect was good right up until 3... even the start of 3 wasn't half bad, but the ending fucking destroyed it.

LOST was crap. I wish you would never mention it again but I know you will continue to talk about it and be its lone defender.

Patrick is hardly the lone defender of Lost and you criticism reads my like a drunken rant then anything rational. If you found it confusing, fine, but not everyone suffers from ADD. Lost was one of the best T.V. shows and definitely one of the best sci-fi shows of all time. You can hate it but don't pretend that it wasn't intelligent, well written and crafted show.

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darkdragonmage99

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Edited By darkdragonmage99

All  advertisement is  false  advertisement  if you want an example walk into a fast food place look at the picture beside a sandwich order and be amazed it looks nothing like the picture.  

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DG991

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Edited By DG991

Jesus... shut the fuck up about Lost Patrick.

The ending to that show was fucking awful and the show only had a good first season and confusing seasons day after day.

Mass effect was good right up until 3... even the start of 3 wasn't half bad, but the ending fucking destroyed it.

LOST was crap. I wish you would never mention it again but I know you will continue to talk about it and be its lone defender.

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studnoth1n

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Edited By studnoth1n

@vancealmighty: i completely understand the frustration. had i followed the series to the third, final chapter, i'm sure i would have been up in arms too. however, i did sense they were taking this franchise into a more obscure, metaphysical direction, where a confusing or underwhelming ending wouldn't be out of the question. again, my point is that it would be fruitless for bioware to go back and essentially try to "repair" the story. we can't pretend to go back and misremember the original decisions they made in the storyline, can we? you can repair a loose gameplay mechanic, but not the collective decisions that reflect the thoughts and feelings of the authors, which are essential to any storyline, even a bad one.

as i mentioned earlier, there's an immutable integrity to any story, and these "experiments" which assume otherwise attempt to subvert what myself and others already know will not work. even if one does not understand the more dogged principles and techniques in storytelling, most people get the basics-which is why it's over. again, that doesn't mean we can't console each other and exercise our frustrations in open forum, but there's no way anyone who truly appreciates storytelling, on any level, could be satisfied by such a bastardizing "amendment." again, it's over.

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MrWizard6600

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@Zithe said:

@Grixxel said:

@foodmonster said:

...

Yup, I still believe in this theory. Which, in my opinion, makes the entire trilogy amazing.

I wouldn't get your hopes up guys. The theory still has a lot of problems and means that BioWare shipped their game without an ending. I'm pretty sure the DLC they release is going to prove this theory wrong.

And the way they do that is by leveraging the Geth (IIRC that’s the only reason to not pick destruction)?

I don’t buy it.

This story hit some real good beats; many of the story-telling techniques mass effect has become famous for are in ME3 in force. Sacrifices are made, and for the most part, they are powerful.

When a game has less than 3 years to be developed it’s been shown, time and time again, that its corners are going to be cut. It will not be complete creatively, it will not have the Easter-egg touches, and it will have a mountain of tech-debt.

They experimented with some things and didn’t have the time to get feed-back and iterate, so what you got was potentially novel mechanics, potentially interesting story beats, and an ending that they simply needed time to re-write.

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ArchTeckGuru8

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Edited By ArchTeckGuru8

I like the ending of Lost, im glad that its not a perfect thing too. Same with ME3.

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jimi

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Edited By jimi

I really hope they just confirm indoctrination theory and move on. We will likely never know if bioware intended it or it was just complete luck but indoctrination theory is an ending that I actually really enjoyed.

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golguin

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@ElCapitan said:

@SolidOcelot: To be perfectly fair,

the cycle with the Quarians/Geth and EDI are only broken because they all incorporate Reaper technology. The Reapers claim to be beyond the cycle (to a certain extent they are) so the cycle has not been broken, you've simply integrated Reaper understanding to current synthetic life.

Of all the things I've read on the ending (and I've read quite a bit) this is the first point that proves the Synthesis ending was required to truly break the cycle. In my mind I had attributed the geth/quarian and EDI situations as only having worked because of Shepards direct intervention. Future civilizations wouldn't have a Shepard to stop the cycle so Synthesis was the only answer.

However, the only reason the Geth situation was truly resolved was because of the Reaper upgrades. The same goes for EDI and her Reaper tech body.

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FilipHolm

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Edited By FilipHolm

The indoctrination theory would explain a couple of things. But if that were true, why would they agree to re-write it? So there goes that theory basicly...

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vancealmighty

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@studnoth1n: I'm not one of the people who thinks the ending should be changed, and that whole #RetakeMassEffect thing is silly. I just think that there is OBVIOUSLY something to be pissed about here. I've been a BioWare fan for a long, long time, and they haven't outright lost my faith (DA II not withstanding), but I can be both angry AND curious to see what happens. I'm of the mind that some kind of post game DLC was in the works from the very beginning.

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Edited By mpgeist

@jorbear said:

I think that the ending of ME3 is completely shitty, but changing a work of art like that to appease people is wrong.

A work of art that tells me to buy DLC at the end.

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Edited By ApocalypseLater

Immediately after finishing ME3, I felt as though I would never want to play through the series again. I was mostly disappointed that the brief scene featuring your crew was the most resolution you received following your final decision. Two days later though, I launched the fist one and as soon as the menu music started, all of the love I had for the series came rushing back. The end may have been disappointing to me, but I can accept it, and it hasn't tainted what came before it for me.

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AntiLion

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You made a far better article out of this issue than Navarro did. Good work Klepek.

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Edited By HadesTimes

Loved the article Patrick. I hated the ending. But I say leave it alone. It's over and in a month or so the internet will be off ranting about something else.

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@Veektarius: Pretty much. Tempers are hot right now, and everyone will calm down, and the game industry will not be ruined and in a larger context, will have barely changed. The only real people who lose out, whatever scenario occurs, are those who were beyond pumped for the conclusion to Mass Effect, and didn't enjoy it.

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veektarius

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@Tylea002:

It's like Marcus Aurelius said - Reject your sense of injury and the injury itself disappears

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Edited By Tylea002

@Veektarius: Oh yeah, so it was. I do remember something about the Reapers shutting off the relay network to allow easier harvesting, though. Still, the whole thing is riddled with elements that are poorly explained, and to what seems like a majority is definitely not-ideal and dissapointing in an area or more, but as to actually changing it?

Hoo boy, the only thing I know for sure about the situation is that BioWare are not envied by me right now. How the fuckery will they not piss everyone off?

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veektarius

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Edited By veektarius

@Tylea002 said:

@Veektarius: 1) Probably - the whole point of the choices is that you make them BEFORE you know the exact consequences, and in my state of mind, winning or dying on our own terms would have been the most satisfying, if depressing and hopeless, conclusion.

2) The catalyst controls the citadel and the reapers - soveriegn's plan in ME1 was to attack the citadel and use it to shut off the mass relays - how the Reapers always wipe out life. They move the catalyst to earth but can't shut off the mass relays? A cool question and a possible twist if answered, but it is not.

3) And yep, this is the main point, that literally cannot be argued. It's disappointing.

1) heh.. that's artistic, I guess, but I don't think it makes sense outside of a movie.

2) No... Sovereign's plan was to take over the citadel and use it as a relay to bring in the reapers from dark space.

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garudalicious

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I see a lot of things about artistic integrity floating around...I think I do not understand the concept of "artistic integrity" very well, so I want to ask:

The discussion around artistic integrity seems to suggest that it is somehow wrong or inappropriate for fans/consumers to voice complaint about the ending or request a new one.

However, I disagree with the premise that artistic integrity is a function of fan reaction or their requests. If Bioware believe in their art and believe it should not be changed, they will stand by what they delivered and accept the consequences of possible monetary loss. Such a stance would exemplify artistic integrity. I might dislike it if they were to do this, but I could respect the stance.

On the other hand, if they choose to address the complaints and modify the ending it would be of their own accord, for reasons they feel justify the changes. Whether their reasons are financially, a desire to appease their fans, or anything else, it's ultimately their decision.

As such I don't understand why changes or additions they produce, for reasons they feel are justified, would be considered an *inherent* degradation of the original piece?

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deactivated-58afe98346ace

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I havnt played ME3 yet but i dont think it can really be compared to lost.

Lost was built upon not knowing, while ME3 was known for giving in depth explanations to how the world itself works. Apples and Oranges, as they say.

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michaelfossbakk

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Edited By michaelfossbakk

Loved the inclusion of LOST, though I'm a little biased as I loved that show.

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Indoctrination theory is almost as good as what Bioware would've conceived AFTER having reexamined the trainwreck of an ending they've tacked on, having badly reacted to the brunt of criticisms that it generated. Certainly doesn't answer the inexplicable destruction of mass relays if Reapers were actually gauging the readiness of galaxy to defend itself against synthetics, which in and of itself requires insane logic, among other things.

Just seat back, relax, have a cold one, and just take it all in for what it is, since this saga ain't over yet.

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Mr402

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Edited By Mr402

Wow this issue is as trivial as they come. Ending was fine no matter what you chose. My Shepard walked into the light and the cosmos was saved for all sentient being's organic or otherwise. You need no other explanation then that.

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LoggerRythm

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Edited By LoggerRythm

I'm not pissed at the ending, just confused.

I, like many others, would like Bioware to explain everything to me. Especially that weird scene after the ending that doesn't add up. Well, unless they were being money whores and eluding to the DLC that's down the road. That's just sad.

This whole chapter of Mass Effect feels like EA had more of their hands in the cookie pot, the other two games felt more solid. The story always felt like it had plot holes in it but come on, they never dropped the ball like they did at the end of 3. Hell I was expecting like 3 or 4 disks this time around since there were so much side events left over from the other two.

What ever happened to that psycho path from 2 that sent you an e-mail talking trash about carving your name in other living beings and his? I was expecting that and other drop offs from 1 and 2 to be side quests and all we got was another scan BS time waster for our troubles.

If this is truly Bioware at their best, then the fact that Bioware isn't the company they used to be continues to disappoint. Especially after Dragon Age 2. That was a sad attempt of a game.

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Lord_Punch

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@FrakesFace said:

Thanks for spending time and looking at how everyone is approaching this issue as opposed to calling one side "entitled" and leaving it at that. This whole situation about endings and how invested listeners react to those endings deserves a lot more consideration than I think a lot of the press has been giving it.

What this guy said.

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@Grixxel said:

@foodmonster said:

@Sergotron said:

@Carac: @Carac said:

If the indoctrination theory is true, they planned all of this. It would also explain why they want to wait until more people have finished it to say, "You all got tricked/indocrinated...and here's the battle that happened after the battle of shepard's will vs reaper Indocrtination that was happening in his head" (the ending we've seen).

The only ending where Shepard breathes in the rubble where he was hit by the Harbringer blast on earth was the one the reapers didn't want you to pick and the one that symbolizes not giving into indoctrincation. The left choice being that of the illusive man, and the central choice being that of Saren. We've all been played/tricked by indoctrination...I hope. I mean, why else would the trees and bushes from your dreams show up on the field around you after being hit by Harbinger's beam. Why would the narrow path to the console in the citadel be an amalgam of ship designs throughout Shepard's story (including the Shadow Broker's), all of that "Reaper vignetting" in the next to last scene. The last scene where Anderson represents Shepard's will fighting Indoctrination and the Illusive man representing Indoctrination. And the "choice of three" being the Reaper's test to see if indoctrination worked.

Wow, seeing this made me really like that ending now.

This is actually really compelling and I think is more consistent to the caliber of storytelling then to simply say, that Bioware just put a bad ending on the game. I must admit, I was not that disappointed with the ending as many were since i viewed the entire 3rd game as the ending and not simply the last few minutes. All the checks made for my decisions from previous games and how that determined the story was super impressive. In truth I only responded to make sure this video did not get buried under all the hate.

Yup, I still believe in this theory. Which, in my opinion, makes the entire trilogy amazing.

I wouldn't get your hopes up guys. The theory still has a lot of problems and means that BioWare shipped their game without an ending. I'm pretty sure the DLC they release is going to prove this theory wrong.

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Tylea002

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Edited By Tylea002

@Veektarius: 1) Probably - the whole point of the choices is that you make them BEFORE you know the exact consequences, and in my state of mind, winning or dying on our own terms would have been the most satisfying, if depressing and hopeless, conclusion.

2) The catalyst controls the citadel and the reapers - soveriegn's plan in ME1 was to attack the citadel and use it to shut off the mass relays - how the Reapers always wipe out life. They move the catalyst to earth but can't shut off the mass relays? A cool question and a possible twist if answered, but it is not.

3) And yep, this is the main point, that literally cannot be argued. It's disappointing.

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veektarius

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@Tylea002:

1.) Well, if you tell the starchild to go fuck himself, the Reapers destroy Earth (and everything). I suppose they could add that as an option. Is that what you'd have chosen? More dialogue options would be could. They said they're clarifying the ending, though, so this'd probably be something they'll address.

2.) I don't understand what you mean here, please clarify. What is inconsistent? That the catalyst is on the Citadel?

3.) I have already openly agreed with you that the sequence of events in the ending cinematic defies logic without some significant, missing sequences.

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EDfromRED

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happymeowmeow

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Nice article, interesting take on this.

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Edited By danieljd

I was really disappointed with the last few minutes of ME3, but I don't think Bioware will change much (if any) of it. I would like to see more of what happened to the rest of the crew and the fleet that Shepard collected, but even if I don't get that I still loved the game and the trilogy. I don't feel strongly either way about the whole protest thing or the reaction from those who are angry about Bioware possibly changing something.

I really enjoy what you bring to the site Patrick, keep it up man.

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@foodmonster said:

@Sergotron said:

@Carac: @Carac said:

If the indoctrination theory is true, they planned all of this. It would also explain why they want to wait until more people have finished it to say, "You all got tricked/indocrinated...and here's the battle that happened after the battle of shepard's will vs reaper Indocrtination that was happening in his head" (the ending we've seen).

The only ending where Shepard breathes in the rubble where he was hit by the Harbringer blast on earth was the one the reapers didn't want you to pick and the one that symbolizes not giving into indoctrincation. The left choice being that of the illusive man, and the central choice being that of Saren. We've all been played/tricked by indoctrination...I hope. I mean, why else would the trees and bushes from your dreams show up on the field around you after being hit by Harbinger's beam. Why would the narrow path to the console in the citadel be an amalgam of ship designs throughout Shepard's story (including the Shadow Broker's), all of that "Reaper vignetting" in the next to last scene. The last scene where Anderson represents Shepard's will fighting Indoctrination and the Illusive man representing Indoctrination. And the "choice of three" being the Reaper's test to see if indoctrination worked.

Wow, seeing this made me really like that ending now.

This is actually really compelling and I think is more consistent to the caliber of storytelling then to simply say, that Bioware just put a bad ending on the game. I must admit, I was not that disappointed with the ending as many were since i viewed the entire 3rd game as the ending and not simply the last few minutes. All the checks made for my decisions from previous games and how that determined the story was super impressive. In truth I only responded to make sure this video did not get buried under all the hate.

Yup, I still believe in this theory. Which, in my opinion, makes the entire trilogy amazing.

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wsowen02

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Edited By wsowen02

So we had to endure all the people whining for two weeks, are we going to have to endure the press whining about the whiners for another two weeks?

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@Undeadpool said:

@Tumbler: Not sure why I got a response to this, but to accuse Bioware of "not caring" about their 7 year-old game franchise is ludicrous. Now I don't know whether to place the blame on EA or them, but frankly that ending was pure high science fiction. The kind the fans CLAIMED to be clamoring for (instead of "some CoD bullshit). It was exactly in the same vein as Isaac Asimov, Arthur C. Clarke and Harlan Ellison (ESPECIALLY that last one).

I think your comment was at the top and I just hit reply, didn't mean for it to be directed at you. I'm not mad that the events of the ending, I can accept the whole sacrifice, no happy ending thing. But the way they combined created everything seems like they just gave up and said, we're done, this is what they get.

"If they don't like well fuck them. You got that movie of the ship, ok good just combine that with those two shots of them turning around, then take that crashed ship scene...it isn't done? Do I look like I give two fucks, use it. And that video of the stuff blowing up across the galaxy, make that green red and blue, ok, well this needs something else...hey grab that pic of those two looking up at the planets, yeah scan that and put this voice over on it. "Hey you, get in front of this mic and read this.

Boom, done, that is how you make video games people!"

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Tylea002

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Edited By Tylea002

@Veektarius: I don't know if changing it is worth the precedent it sets, but regarless it's a bad ending in my eyes, and I'll try to illustrate what I think he's saying about inconsistencies in choice:

1. You can't tell the starchild to go fuck himself, you cannot ask him any questions and get any clarification on anything. This is a series that was built on an overabundance of information - so why at this very end point can we ask nothing? Why can we not make the choice that fits with our personality, the one that says it's not worth a sacrifice like this, and putting our faith in the galaxy to fight the reapers - even if everyone dies, it's a choice that fits with characters.

2. The LORE inconsistencies are mind boggling. The Reapers actions with the citadel being the catalyst are extremely suspect due to Sovereign's motive in the first game, and this is never adressed. Aside from this one point, the most important point, the lore has been pretty much spot on in all the games.

3. Joker and the crew. Don't get me wrong, Joker losing control of the ship was the most powerful visual image of the game, but why was he running? How was the crew there? What? It's simply bad writing to end a story without explaining the final step in the journey the characters took, especially when it shows a wild change in character. Joker, and your crew, would stand with you to the end, if anything, they'd go to the citadel.

I mean, aside from that, there's the more subjective look, being the kid is dumb as shit, the galaxy destruction happening for no reason other than the kid saying it has to, the fact there's a new character who just turns up and explains everything, and the thematic disagreements, but all that stuff is subjective, some people may enjoy how that's done. I happen to disagree, but whatever. The three points above are the main complaints and less subjective - we don't know what the fuck Joker was doing, and why it contradicts with his character. That's a fact - some people are able not to care.

I wish I was one of them.