#1 Edited by ALavaPenguin (191 posts) -

Besides world of warcraft. Nothing against world of warcraft but I just think I have gotten as much as I am going to get out of that game. I have been wanting to find a good MMO for a long time, one that isn't just a warcraft clone [or maybe it started that way and became it's own, I am ok with that, as WoW is hardly the same game it started out as in any way] or instanced all to hell and back. Or what seems like most mmos are these days, not really an actual mmo in the classic sense [where they are more of just online co-op games with a lobby zone or something lol].

Are there any modern MMOs with legs out there right now worth playing? Ones that actually would be worth investing a lot of time in, that is also an actual MMO?

I haven't really played anything but FFXI and WoW in recent years as most coverage sounded the same, games destined to be free to play games shortly or games that are effectively fully instanced.

I guess I miss the good old days of having a big world where I was running around doing stuff with other people, and not just constantly teleporting to special zones where only you and a few buddies are in, with the open world being pretty much just for solo play [which makes no sense! lol].

Also I am not interested in something crazy like eve lol.

I have been wanting to get into, and I mean really into [not just play for like a month get max level and then quit like most MMOs are designed for now adays] an mmo for about a year now but just don't know if anything is actually worth getting into for the reasons I have stated above.

I don't need to play an MMO if there are none right now that fit my criteria. I just would like to a lot =(

#2 Posted by believer258 (11983 posts) -

I don't play MMO's but it seems like Guild Wars 2 is the game to be playing in that whole scene right now.

#3 Edited by ALavaPenguin (191 posts) -

Isn't that game like guild wars 1 where it is mostly just instances with a lobby server? I am not sure I didn't play a lot of guild wars one but I remember back in the day of guild wars one many people didn't consider it an "actual" mmo until now where MMORPG has been redefined as what it is now.

#4 Posted by SomeJerk (3296 posts) -

The Secret World for the story, Warhammer Online elf-campaigns for the stories, don't care about anything else with how burnt out I've become on MMOs.

#5 Edited by Ares42 (2726 posts) -

The only actual MMO that's still running and doing really well is EVE. After the news over the weekend I went back and gave it another shot, and even though I've only played for 2 days I'm feeling the hooks this time around. It's nothing like what you're used to call MMOs anymore though, but rather follows the rules of the good old pre-WoW MMOs. Being all about the world, communities, trade and investment.

#6 Posted by Ravenlight (8040 posts) -

If you mean MMORPG, then no.

If you're after something that's just literally massively multiplayer, check out Planetside 2.

#7 Posted by gogosox82 (424 posts) -

Guild wars 2 is good. The secret world is good too if you can get past the somewhat dodgy controls. I heard tera was going f2p but I couldn't deal with the obscene amount of grinding you have to do but it has a great battle system.

#8 Edited by believer258 (11983 posts) -

@ALavaPenguin said:

Isn't that game like guild wars 1 where it is mostly just instances with a lobby server? I am not sure I didn't play a lot of guild wars one but I remember back in the day of guild wars one many people didn't consider it an "actual" mmo until now where MMORPG has been redefined as what it is now.

I watched the Quick Look of Guild Wars 2 and according to Jeff, the answer is that Guild Wars 2 is an MMO-ass MMO.

And, frankly, it looks like one. Massive worlds? Dudes fighting a lot of things? Dudes dicking around everywhere? Grinding? Getting the best armor? LOTS of guys everywhere?

And that's just from what I've seen. I'm really curious about the game but at the same time somewhat apprehensive about playing it because I've never played an MMO before and don't know if I'll commit enough to spend $60 worth of time in it, or even enough time to really see much of it.

#9 Posted by ALavaPenguin (191 posts) -

While I would enjoy playing a space based MMO I just don't know if I do want to commit that amount of time into an MMO that eve seems to require. Anything beyond what FFXI [used to] take is my limit probably.

#10 Edited by project343 (2833 posts) -

@ALavaPenguin:

  • Guild Wars 2 - spectacular experience that really nails a sense of open-ended freedom where you are the narrator to your own experience. And that's really what makes it special: it is a big ol' changing world that embraces what massively multiplayer should be able, rather than catering to self-absorbed isolationist. It gives you the option to pick which direction you want to go, which zone you want to be in, what skills you want to unlock, and how you ultimately want to experience the content; B2P $60
  • The Secret World - some poor-ish combat, but the best narrative in the genre (on-par with what you might expect if Rockstar put out an occult game set in modern day). More than that, it has the best dungeons in the genre--some really fucking interesting stuff; the 'no-levels' approach makes the progression feel rather unique and open-ended; finally, the game just reeks of atmosphere, solid world-building and imaginative quest design (in most cases, anyway). The game has a ton of really interesting ideas that should be experienced, especially if you can get by the rather bland combat; B2P $30
  • Path of Exile - do you like Diablo 2, but hate the direction Diablo 3 went with the series (toward narrative, heavily scripted encounters, streamlined mechanics)? If that's the case, you should be checking this out as soon as possible. It does so many interesting things with the core Diablo formula (removal of gold, skills as gems, etc.) that it feels both completely fresh and romantically nostalgic. Worth noting that this is a pseudo-MMO--in the same vein as the original Guild Wars: you see other people in towns and can group up, but if you venture off into the wilderness by yourself, you won't see anyone else disrupting your lootfest; F2P
  • Planetside 2 - think Battlefield at a crazy scale. I don't think this game is perfect: it suffers from some rather severe pacing issues (it can take way too long between the 'fun' parts of the game), and is so poorly optimized. That said, if you can find yourself a group of friends, you can really have a ball raiding small outposts or engaging in crazy hundred-on-hundred wars over key locations. F2P
  • TERA - the polar-opposite of The Secret World. TERA has a spectacular combat system that feels great. That said, the world is completely forgettable, and the quests are about as dull as you can muster up in your own imagination. I don't think it's for everyone, but I know quite a few people who are completely obsessed with this game. F2P (starting February 2013)

@believer258 said:

I watched the Quick Look of Guild Wars 2 and according to Jeff, the answer is that Guild Wars 2 is an MMO-ass MMO.

And, frankly, it looks like one. Massive worlds? Dudes fighting a lot of things? Dudes dicking around everywhere? Grinding? Getting the best armor? LOTS of guys everywhere?

And that's just from what I've seen. I'm really curious about the game but at the same time somewhat apprehensive about playing it because I've never played an MMO before and don't know if I'll commit enough to spend $60 worth of time in it, or even enough time to really see much of it.

There is a hotbar and you target mobs. That is about as 'traditional' as it gets, unless you somehow want the 'largeness' of the massively multiplayer online game to go away.

So many of the more nuanced elements of the MMO experience have been completely overhauled. I'd refer you to my own post on the matter. Jeff gives no fucks about the MMO genre and played the game for 30 minutes--I'd hardly call him a reliable expert on Guild Wars 2 criticism.

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#11 Posted by MordeaniisChaos (5730 posts) -

@ALavaPenguin: GW2 is very little like GW1. I mean, it has some of the same ideas in terms of class structure and all that, but it's a very different game. It's not as instanced as before.

@project343: I'm sure you don't mean it, but you come off a bit aggressive towards Jeff for basically saying he didn't get what he wanted or expected out of the experience. I think he's plenty expert on "I just wanted another Guild Wars game"-ness. Like it or not, Jeff was right, GW2 is more of a traditional MMO experience. It's structured the same even if it does have a lot of parts that have evolved. But those parts aren't new, they are just modified versions of existing systems.

#12 Posted by project343 (2833 posts) -

@MordeaniisChaos: I actually meant to sound hostile, and not because I completely disagree with his opinion of the experience. The problem is that Jeff tends to play a lot of MMORPGs, but has expressed strong disdain for MMORPGs that encourage multiplayer/cooperation; coincidentally, what Guild Wars 2 does differently, as a summating theme, is to bring people together in more meaningful ways and promote the one thing that this genre does spectacularly: playing with other people.

His opinion wouldn't be a problem if the only coverage that game got was from his quick play session. It would be as if the only person to cover, say, Starcraft 2 was Patrick who promptly shrugged it off as bring 'too competitive' for his liking. I don't expect Giantbomb to cover MMORPGs, but it always comes off as this completely irrational, emotional genre-critique from people who couldn't give less of a fuck about that particular genre. I'd rather them simply not even acknowledge the genre or releases, and suggest to go to other outlets for some more attuned criticism.

Is the game 'more traditional' than Guild Wars? Ya, I'd say so. They removed the city-as-lobby business and the heavy instancing. But this was also their intention. However, when you compare Guild Wars 2 to the majority of the genre out there, it does end up feeling wildly different. The instanced PVP feels a lot more like a DOTA game; the larger scale PVP feels like Battlefield: The RPG. The leveling experience is almost completely non-linear, the progression is significantly more horizontal than vertical, and the combat is way more about movement, creative skill use and positioning over, say, predefined rotations/priorities. This sort of stuff might not mean anything to someone who says: 'derp, there's a hotbar... must be like all the others,' but it certainly means a lot to anyone who cares about this particularly genre (read: most people who would be interested in this sort of game).

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#13 Posted by MordeaniisChaos (5730 posts) -

@project343: Jeff's opinion is just that, an opinion. He didn't shit on the game, didn't say "Yo don't play this!" and he certainly spend more than half an hour in it. It's a good game, and I don't doubt it. But just because it wasn't what Jeff wanted doesn't mean you need to get all defensive.

And the way Patrick dismisses shit he doesn't care for is, to use your words, wildly different from the way Jeff spoke about Guild Wars 2. Jeff explained how he felt about the game, and even if after playing way more of it he maybe would have gotten more into it than he did, that's the game's issue, not his. He didn't get the same enjoyment that he got from GW1, and didn't enjoy the direction they took the sequel in. But I don't recall him ever shitting on the game, saying it wasn't any good, or anything like that. It is a traditional MMO. Just because it's handling things a bit differently doesn't change the structure of the game. You fight monsters in a big open world with a lot of people running around doing the same thing. You experience PVP in instances as well as organically in the world. The gameplay is generally the same. All of these things have thier own new take in Guild Wars 2, but if you don't like ice cream, you'll be hard pressed to find a new twist on it that you'll enjoy much more than any other ice cream. Even if you add some syrup and sprinkles on top. There's nothing wrong with the structure of Guild Wars 2 being more traditional. That's the game they wanted to make, and they did an awesome job at it. Just let Jeff want something different out of his Guild Wars. It won't take away from anyone's enjoyment of the game, especially not yours.

Jeff doesn't dig the style, that's ok, even if you do. Let him enjoy his thing, and you enjoy yours.

#14 Posted by tourgen (4542 posts) -

nope. pretty much everything is just a bunch of instances bridged together. There isn't really many real MMOs out there. Hell I can't even think of one right now. What isn't instanced these days?

Eve is around but, you know. It's a hard nut to crack into and it doesn't quite live up to it's aspirations.

#15 Posted by buft (3320 posts) -

@Ravenlight said:

If you mean MMORPG, then no.

If you're after something that's just literally massively multiplayer, check out Planetside 2.

thats a really good suggestion, you get the massive scale but with great action thats pick up and play and considerably less grinding to get to the parts you want

#16 Posted by McShank (1629 posts) -

@gogosox82 said:

Guild wars 2 is good. The secret world is good too if you can get past the somewhat dodgy controls. I heard tera was going f2p but I couldn't deal with the obscene amount of grinding you have to do but it has a great battle system.

I double this for both guild wars and Tera which I played the Beta and I have toyed with my friends account here and there and Love it, just Cant see myself paying for both wow and tera atm till this contract ends for the diablo 2 purchase crap. Otherwise Guildwars 2 is pretty fun and the secret world is cool now that its F2P.

#17 Posted by StrainedEyes (1326 posts) -

I enjoyed my time with DCUO. They have added a ton since I last played it and have been thinking about hopping back in.

#18 Posted by Dark (390 posts) -

@ALavaPenguin: Nah GW2 feels like most other MMO's in world scale, no instanced area's like GW1. The leveling process is interesting to say the least, no actual 'quests' per say just random events to do. You gain experience from literally doing everything, exploring is XP, events are the best XP, finding hiden points of interest or viewpoints are xp. The only thing that awards bad amounts of XP are killing enemies.

However it is also has no sub fee, making it amazing as I can go back (and do every now and then) and play more of it. It is however still an MMO, its different in some ways but its still the same style of MMO with a different way to gain xp.

#19 Posted by 8Bit_Archer (456 posts) -

No

EVE seems rad though

#20 Posted by project343 (2833 posts) -

@MordeaniisChaos said:

It is a traditional MMO.

I suppose that's my problem right there. Calling it a just-like-everything-else game comes off as, to me, an insult. And both him and you are being incredibly reductive in this pseudo-criticism.

I simply do not agree. I don't think it's like everything else. I think it's wildly different in so many meaningful ways. You call it sprinkles, I call it fucking everything. It's like reductively calling LoL, HoN and DOTA2 'the same game.' This is the furthest thing from the case. Yes, if you're painting broad strokes and comparing them to the industry at large, they may seem super similar. But they're not, especially within that given genre. Guild Wars 2 and The Secret World are the most wildly left-field things that the themepark MMO genre has seen since World of Warcraft.

I'm just peed off that other people who may have been interested in that game, who truly respect Jeff's opinion, might have walked away from that buying decision based on that quick (and arguably uninformed) impression. I wouldn't be on this site if I didn't adore the entire staff and their promotion of subjective silliness, but I also see them as important voices who owe their community a bit of responsibility in that vocality. I don't want them commenting on MMOs, tower defense games, or JRPGs (both genres being openly talked about in broad, negative strokes on last week's podcast), or any other genre that they are not completely comfortable with.

I suppose it all amounts to this really awkward confusion for me. I respect his opinion so much, but at the same time, I almost have to completely denounce it as holding anything of value in certain contexts.

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#21 Posted by Azteck (7449 posts) -

I started playing Tera when it dropped the subscription but it's pretty old-school MMO (compared to things like GW2) so it might not be what you're looking for. Guild Wars 2 is a ton of fun until you hit 80 and then it's just kind of.. empty.

#22 Posted by Karkarov (3172 posts) -

@project343 said:

@ALavaPenguin:

@believer258 said:

I watched the Quick Look of Guild Wars 2 and according to Jeff, the answer is that Guild Wars 2 is an MMO-ass MMO.

And, frankly, it looks like one. Massive worlds? Dudes fighting a lot of things? Dudes dicking around everywhere? Grinding? Getting the best armor? LOTS of guys everywhere?

And that's just from what I've seen. I'm really curious about the game but at the same time somewhat apprehensive about playing it because I've never played an MMO before and don't know if I'll commit enough to spend $60 worth of time in it, or even enough time to really see much of it.

Yeah mostly what that dude said despite me deleting a lot of it. Sorry I hate giant quote boxes. That said avoid Guild Wars 2. It is the least common denominator mmo. It isn't a real mmo, other than dungeons which are totally forgettable and skippable there is no real reason to party with anyone. It is boring, grindy, and does nothing that really is all that innovative. It is just another mmo hype train.

The secret world is the best "real" mmo on the market now. The combat can actually be quite good if you design it to be, the problem with having total control of what you do in a classless system is that you can choose to play a boring as eff to use character. You can also choose to play something highly mobile that has alot of combo moves and revolves around a very active play style. Maybe not as effective, but a lot more fun. Lore, Story, World, and especially questing wise it is possibly the best MMO ever made.

Terra does have the best combat but in all other regardless it is lineage 2 minus semi ok pvp. Stay away unless you love asian/korean mmo's. If you don't know what a "korean mmo" is then don't play the game.

Planetside and Exile aren't mmo's really shouldn't be on the list.

Star Wars: The Old Republic is actually worth it if you want to see the story and want to do in game in a purely traditional been there done that mmo. It's raids at this point are actually faster, more fun, and in many ways more challenging than WoW's. Sadly the game also does nothing innovative to move the genre forward.

If you want to look for something new not yet out the re release of FF14 might actually be worth a crap and Blade & Soul if nothing else is one of the best looking mmo's ever made and promises actual good gameplay.

#23 Posted by iam3green (14390 posts) -

no, there aren't aren't any modern mmos right now. there is just wow and guild wars 2. only mmo that i played that i paid was WoW. i played that for a few years. it was pretty fun for the while.

#24 Posted by project343 (2833 posts) -

@Karkarov: Man. Some bold-ass opinions. I'd actually never recommend SWTOR in its current state: it is a complete money-grubbing effort on EA's part that butchered what was once a (somewhat) respectable release. They are no longer committed to bettering the experience for their subscribers; rather, their entire development effort seems focused on coming up with content to charge their already-monthly-subbed player-base.

I'll leave the rest alone because I'd rather not boil my blood.

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#25 Posted by Karkarov (3172 posts) -

@project343: I didn't say it was a great game, I said it was something you should play if you want to see the story and enjoy some totally generic been there done that mmo grind with a decent end game. Every mmo is a money grab in one way or another. No mmo is worth sticking with unless you have friends with you, hence, WoW still survives despite actually being a bottom tier piss poor mmo when compared to most other options these days.