@Fluxxed: Giving my opinion that girls shouldn't have to hide that they're girls isn't white knighting.
I also think gays should be able to serve openly in the military. While the scale of both statements are different, the sentiment is the same. People who are bigoted are the problem, not the people they hate.
" @Fluxxed: Giving my opinion that girls shouldn't have to hide that they're girls isn't white knighting. I also think gays should be able to serve openly in the military. While the scale of both statements are different, the sentiment is the same. People who are bigoted are the problem, not the people they hate. "
Someone disagrees with a woman on the internet, they must be bigots!
" @Fluxxed: Giving my opinion that girls shouldn't have to hide that they're girls isn't white knighting. I also think gays should be able to serve openly in the military. While the scale of both statements are different, the sentiment is the same. People who are bigoted are the problem, not the people they hate. "
Someone disagrees with a woman on the internet, they must be bigots! "
Most of the people in this thread are saying women shouldn't be allowed to make their sex known. That is a bigoted statement. It suggests intolerance towards women. And yes, I think the intolerance stems from sexual rejection.
" In this thread, "nice guys" get to take out their pent-up aggression on women that don't want them. "
I have a girlfriend. Furthermore, you're the one being a "nice guy" here. I hardly consider myself a nice guy. I just really don't give a shit. I aggressively don't give a shit, which is why these threads and type of people are so annoying. It has nothing to do with her having a pussy, and everything to do with her being obnoxious. So yea, I really don't care if she flaunts that she's a chick on the net and then gets annoyed when people tell her to get back in the kitchen because they don't care.
At the same time I'm not going to waste my time doing that, if only because woman jokes are pretty old at this point. That said, I really don't care when they work and annoy her.
" @Fluxxed: Giving my opinion that girls shouldn't have to hide that they're girls isn't white knighting. I also think gays should be able to serve openly in the military. While the scale of both statements are different, the sentiment is the same. People who are bigoted are the problem, not the people they hate. "
Someone disagrees with a woman on the internet, they must be bigots! "
Most of the people in this thread are saying women shouldn't be allowed to make their sex known. That is a bigoted statement. It suggests intolerance towards women. "
Actually they're saying that you'll get abuse no matter what your gender is, or anything about you for that matter, this is the internet. Of course it's not right that sexist comments are thrown about so freely, but it isn't going to stop because some random internet dickheads say it's wrong and makes me sad :'(
@Pinworm45:@Fluxxed: I'm just saying that I don't think most girls are "asking for it", that's all. I think a lot of guys tend to perceive it that way, but there's a difference between not flaunting your sex for a reaction, and hiding your gender altogether. The internet will claim a girl is "asking for it" just because they have a feminine screenname, or because they use a microphone, and I think that's bullshit.
There are cases where girls are being obnoxious or are being mocked equally to their fellow gamers, but I don't think that justifies a lot of the hate.
I also have a girlfriend, and am not socially awkward. I don't need to White Knight. I just happen to have this opinion based on my experiences playing online with my female roommate.
" @Fluxxed: Giving my opinion that girls shouldn't have to hide that they're girls isn't white knighting. I also think gays should be able to serve openly in the military. While the scale of both statements are different, the sentiment is the same. People who are bigoted are the problem, not the people they hate. "
Someone disagrees with a woman on the internet, they must be bigots! "
Most of the people in this thread are saying women shouldn't be allowed to make their sex known. That is a bigoted statement. It suggests intolerance towards women. And yes, I think the intolerance stems from sexual rejection. "
No one said that women shouldn't be allowed to make their sex known. What are you talking about?
@Afroman269: I wasn't saying you were being a dick, but rather particular or capricious. I understood it just fine and my first language isn't English either. Plus, it never feels nice when someone tells you to fix your grammar.
I wonder how many of the gamers in this thread that hate "attention whores" also think that they're "nice guys" that girls won't give a chance. I'm betting the cross-over is pretty high, because most "nice guys" are just passive-aggressive pricks.
"
This, so much this in this thread. You couldn't be any more passive-aggressive unless you put jews and nazis together in a funeral, also Godwin's law.
" No one said that women shouldn't be allowed to make their sex known. What are you talking about? "
On the last page alone:
" i talk shit to girls who are attention whores the ones who make a point t let everyone know they are a girl."
" And how, pray tell, do these people know you're a woman? Sounds like you're shit talking to me or being an attention whore. "
" You shouldn't reveal information that can lead to those things. "
It is the woman's fault for not hiding their gender. Revealing their gender makes them an "attention whore". Come on guys, we all know this is how most gamers are acting online towards women.
" No one said that women shouldn't be allowed to make their sex known. What are you talking about? "
On the last page alone:
" i talk shit to girls who are attention whores the ones who make a point t let everyone know they are a girl."
" And how, pray tell, do these people know you're a woman? Sounds like you're shit talking to me or being an attention whore. "
" You shouldn't reveal information that can lead to those things. "
It is the woman's fault for not hiding their gender. Revealing their gender makes them an "attention whore". Come on guys, we all know this is how most gamers are acting online towards women. "
Advising someone not to release personal information and telling someone they shouldn't have the option are two different things.
@Axxol: Okay, they're aren't saying they shouldn't be allowed. They're saying it's their own fault. Don't ask, don't tell.
Good thing guys don't need to avoid voice chat and any masculine identifiers on the web, because that would be bullshit.
I play games online with my female roommate. After 3 months, she doesn't feel comfortable with voice chat, and gets PMs after every game because her tag is obviously feminine. It is not "equal" harassment.
You seem to not be getting the true point of what a majority of the disagreeing people are saying here.
Competitive video games are like competitive sports. When you play them, you get your adrenaline up and generally more aggressive. When you're feeling more aggressive, you tend to say more aggressive things to... well, just about anybody.
Until recently, the area of competitive video games were primarily a male dominated activity. To those of you new to this type of activity, men are lewd, vulgar, dastardly and bastardly to each other in competitive environments. We insult each other, take digs at one-another, spit out baseless insults, this is part of being in this type of competitive world.
What happens when a woman comes into this? Nothing. Nothing new happens at all. They're not more of a jerk or less of a jerk, they're just picking on an aspect of what she is as part of the collective competition. In fact, one could say someone being nice to them or "White Knighting" them would be giving them special treatment and generally telling them that they aren't strong enough to deal with what's expected in this genre of gaming.
As far as hiding their sex, no, they shouldn't have to at all. I agree with that. Here's the rub though, if they don't, they should be ready, willing, and able to take any amount of shit thrown at them. This is the writing on the wall for ANY competitive gamer, male or female. They can evolve to roll with the punches and throw some themselves, or they can cower in a corner and wonder why everyone is being so mean. THESE ARE THE ONLY TWO ANSWERS TO THE QUESTION.
@OppressiveStink: I added to my last post. I play with a girl regularly. She gets PMs and shit-talk constantly, and I don't. No one else does. If a girl is in a match, they are the source of all the shit-talk in my experience. I'll get people bitching at me if I fuck up, or some angry PMs if I win, but I don't think it's equal harassment for girls that is just focused on the player's sex. People on the boards tend to say guys get it just as bad, and if you can't handle it, hide your gender. I don't think they should have to hide, and I don't think it's equal.
no, see, the reason i harass women isn't because i'm a socially maladjusted, obese, unkempt, misogynistic man child, it's that they're all literally attention whores.
@Wrighteous86: That's funny, I could forward you a whole box of MvC3 shit-talk in my box just from this weekend and I'm a dude with a deep voice. Perhaps you're just not good enough to piss people off.
@OppressiveStink: That comment was focused on voice chat, and I don't play fighting games. Thanks for following up your reasoned and articulate argument with a lame personal attack at my gaming skill level though. Thanks for the intelligent discussion.
@OppressiveStink: If you're point is: the internet is full of jackasses, I got your point. I'm just arguing that most of them are passive-aggressive misogynist jackasses.
I don't really care guys. I have a different opinion from you. I'm done with this pointless back-and-forth. I think I've made my case.
Mute/block irritating people and move on. Its been working 22 years for me so far.
And if its too much for ya to handle girl, just don't let people know your a chick. Unplug your microphone, don't put it in your profiles and stuff. I often play without microphone as I rather focus on the game anyway.
Srsly now... What kind guys? sammich equals a food item and by no means is a specific dish. so gesh. specificity with the remarks please boys.
Now on to more of a serious note; there really just isn't much you can do about it since it's definitely not going to change anytime soon. I mean it's on a schema level of sorts with a majority of the worlds population. It's just definitely something you've really just got to take in strides that's all and implementing more ways to reduce it certainly wouldn't hurt though .
Don't take it so seriously. I think everyone takes shit in games that are competitive, both guys and girls. It just seems more direct when they try to find anything that they can use to offend you. Like "get back in the kitchen" and so on. For example, im a dude with two nationalities. If I play on servers that officially use the language that im poor handling with and I try to communicate with them, they will bash me for it and use a specific name for people with my nationality. The only cure for this is to not care, play with friends, change server. But if you must, add some oil to the fire and have a laugh.
That's my two cents into this discussion and I beg my pardon as english is not my main language and haven't read english books for ages.
" I really hate the term "Female Gamer". It makes no sense to me. "
Seriously, this.
Go eat a dick, gender has nothing to do with anything. If they weren't saying "get back in the kitchen", it'd be "i fucked your girlfriend", "you're a faggot", etc. It doesn't fucking matter, people will find something about you to rip to shreds no matter what. It happens to Every. Single. Person. On the internet.
@Three0neFive: So you are the one SENDING those messages. Interesting.
To be honest, every personal property you display online will eventually be a target. No matter if it is your gender, race, nationality, age or whatever. Insults feel better if they are personal. I'm German, and people like to remind me about that all the time on XBL.
" @Three0neFive: So you are the one SENDING those messages. Interesting."
Nah, I'm just a proponent of toughening the fuck up and not deluding yourself into thinking everyone in the world cares that you have a vagina. You don't see guys going around posting threads about "Guy gamers and whores who bother us", because most guys (or at least ones I'd consider associating myself with) know that most people don't give a shit that they have a dick.
It's not just women. People on the internet in general are just major assholes to everybody. Some are trolls, others are pissed off because they're getting their ass handed to them, some are genuine hicks.
" no, see, the reason i harass women isn't because i'm a socially maladjusted, obese, unkempt, misogynistic man child, it's that they're all literally attention whores. "
gamers
@Three0neFive
said:
" @mnzy said:
" @Three0neFive: So you are the one SENDING those messages. Interesting."
Nah, I'm just a proponent of toughening the fuck up and not deluding yourself into thinking everyone in the world cares that you have a vagina. You don't see guys going around posting threads about "Guy gamers and whores who bother us", because most guys (or at least ones I'd consider associating myself with) know that most people don't give a shit that they have a dick. "
hahahhaah
WILL SOMEONE PLEASE THINK OF THE POOR PRIVILEGED 14-30 YEAR OLD WHITE MALES
edit: what the fuck are you talking about anyways, the losers on this site spew out misogynistic bile on daily basis
A lot of people who play games, and an even higher percentage of males who frequently post online have had no luck with women because they were nerds, socially awkward etc. They eventually start blaming the women not themselves like they should and this view is reinforced by all the sexist memes and "get back to the kitchen" type comments that 4chan has sent out into the world. They see a girl doing and excelling at something they love and thought was "theirs" so they lash out because they are broken human beings.
It's always easier to blame something other than yourself for your flaws. It's the same as people who self diagnosis disorders like Aspergers, if it's something beyond your control then you don't have to work to change it and can just wallow in self pity blaming something else for the rest of your life. That's my opinion on why some people react this way: something they blame for their horrible lives is in the one thing they can cling onto and they don't like it.
Mostly because a lot of them try to get as much attention as possible. It's also sad that we're still at this point where one has to say "I'm a Girl-Gamer" instead of just saying "I'm a gamer".
" @Vortexus1981: Replying to your OP with this. A lot of people who play games, and an even higher percentage of males who frequently post online have had no luck with women because they were nerds, socially awkward etc. They eventually start blaming the women not themselves like they should and this view is reinforced by all the sexist memes and "get back to the kitchen" type comments that 4chan has sent out into the world. They see a girl doing and excelling at something they love and thought was "theirs" so they lash out because they are broken human beings. It's always easier to blame something other than yourself for your flaws. It's the same as people who self diagnosis disorders like Aspergers, if it's something beyond your control then you don't have to work to change it and can just wallow in self pity blaming something else for the rest of your life. That's my opinion on why some people react this way: something they blame for their horrible lives is in the one thing they can cling onto and they don't like it. "
Yeah, I know an actual autistic person(that means a real one, diagnosed by a doctor, not the internet) and while he certainly has his quirks, he also has a social life, a girlfriend, a loving family.....and doesn't waste huge amounts of his time wallowing in self-pity.
The way I see it is that people will always to find something to try and bring you down with.
I play SSF4 a lot online, and I get "hate-mail" every now and then, and they never go personal because my online name doesnt give them anything to work with, if your name clearly indicate that you are a girl, they are gonna comment on that. If your name indicates that you are hispanic/black/asian/white whatever they are gonna go for that.
So I don't think it's more of a "guys hating on girls" thing as much as it is "people loosing hating on the people winning" thing.
@mutha3: That's why I specified "self diagnosed". People read the wikipedia article and see that one of the symptoms can be poor social skills and they think "wow that explains why I have such poor social skills". I know that people who are actually on the autistic spectrum have very full and rich lives.
" It's not like it's all hugs n handshakes between males on XBL - there's plenty of hostility on there to go around. Are you having any trouble on Giant Bomb? "
Too true. And often about someone being "a fag" or "your mother." So no matter which genders are involved, it ends up involving sexuality and gender stereotypes. People using online anonymity to figure out their identity? Or lowest common denominator?
And I agree with @Dany. You don't get responses because people want to say a zinger, get a quick laugh, and move on.
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