Thinking about getting a good (mid-end) gamer PC...

Hey guys, for some time now I'm thinking about getting a PC again. Right now I only own a laptop, which is perfectly fine for browsing and Photoshop work.

But, long story short, I feel like getting myself a PC for some games. Now I don't need the best of the best, I'm looking for a decent machine I can play games like Skyrim or some MMORPGs with. I've been looking through Amazon and this one: http://www.amazon.de/CSL-Sprint-H5832-FX-6100-CardReader/dp/B003TU0MEM/ref=wl_it_dp_o_pC_nS_nC?ie=UTF8&colid=3RC8E93XX61S&coliid=I3GOVE87QYZXMI has good reviews.

But I didn't work with a PC for the past 8 years, so I'm totally out of date with my knowledge. I probably have to get a new graphics card (next question), but would this one generally be considered ok for games like Skyrim? Please help a noob out. Thankies :)

Edit: Alternative: http://www.amazon.de/A22307W8-Computer-System-FX-Series-Mainboard-CardReader/dp/B009WMUI40/ref=cm_cr_pr_orig_subj

Edit 2: Building one myself is not an option ^^'

NO! That graphics card is terrible. Build your own PC, more fun and rewarding and you will get something very powerful for the amount of money spent on that very weak PC. I built my own PC from scratch 2 years ago and it was really easy. The graphics cards on those machines would probably look worse than playing Skyrim on a Xbox.

@Bourbon_Warrior said:

NO! That graphics card is terrible. Build your own PC, more fun and rewarding and you will get something very powerful for the amount of money spent of that very weak PC. I built my own PC from scratch 2 years ago and it was really easy.

Yeah but I have no idea how that works :D

If the graphics card sucks, like I expected, it should be no problem to change it.

I just wonder if the two models I mentioned are otherwise acceptable for games with requirements like Skyrim :)

@Morrow: Is building a PC an option? By spending the same amount of money you can get a much better machine than either of those you linked to.

@Morrow said:

@Bourbon_Warrior said:

NO! That graphics card is terrible. Build your own PC, more fun and rewarding and you will get something very powerful for the amount of money spent of that very weak PC. I built my own PC from scratch 2 years ago and it was really easy.

Yeah but I have no idea how that works :D

If the graphics card sucks, like I expected, it should be no problem to change it.

I just wonder if the two models I mentioned are otherwise acceptable for games with requirements like Skyrim :)

Graphics cards should be the most expensive part, this PC is way too expensive for what it is. Seriously it is so simple these days, like putting together a complex LEGO set. Im just saying for that amount of money you could build a really nice PC.

This video shows how basic it is to put them together, look at component sites and you can put together a PC that could max Skyrim with mods that make the graphics even better. You don't have to spend this much money, it just shows how simple putting together a PC is.

Go the AMD CPU and GPU route, with the 7000 series of GPU's at the moment you get Far Cry 3, Sleeping Dogs and Hitman Absolution.

http://www.tested.com/tech/pcs/2003-how-to-build-a-future-proof-1500-gaming-pc/

If your going to build a gaming PC make it worthwhile, with the next consoles coming out next year you really don't want it outdated with in a year.

@Morrow said:

Yeah but I have no idea how that works :D

If the graphics card sucks, like I expected, it should be no problem to change it.

I just wonder if the two models I mentioned are otherwise acceptable for games with requirements like Skyrim :)

If you're willing to sink in some time into tutorial videos (Brad Shoemaker has one of his very own), you should be fine. The hardest part of it all is screwing the whole thing together. You'd have fun with it, just remember to be really careful with the hardware.

That said, if you really don't want to build your own PC, that graphics card and processor won't allow you to enjoy a smooth-running Skyrim on high settings. You'd have to upgrade both those components, which should cost you a few hundred euros.

@Snail said:

@Morrow: Is building a PC an option? By spending the same amount of money you can get a much better machine than either of those you linked to.

Hmmm but I never did that before, I have no idea where to start. I also doubt I have the knowledge to do it. That's why I'm looking only for a mid-end machine. I thought I'd buy one, add a better graphics card and ta-daa :D

I play most games on consoles anyway, it would really be just for some exceptions like Skyrim and Online RPGs that aren't available for consoles. That's why I don't want to make a hassle... ^^

@Snail said:

That said, if you really don't want to build your own PC, that graphics card and processor won't allow you to enjoy a smooth-running Skyrim on high settings. You'd have to upgrade both those components, which should cost you a few hundred euros.

Hmm, that's odd, the second model seems to be above the required specs for Skyrim... well in that case I'll skip the idea.

http://www.amazon.de/Sapphire-11188-05-20G-Grafikkarte-Radeon-Speicher/dp/B005G50EOQ/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1355920870&sr=8-1

http://www.amazon.de/AMD-Phenom-Black-Edition-Prozessor/dp/B002SRQ214/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1355920924&sr=8-1

http://www.amazon.de/MSI-760GM-P23-SockelAM3-SB710-2xDDR3/dp/B005HF7F0G/ref=sr_1_6?ie=UTF8&qid=1355921055&sr=8-6

http://www.amazon.de/Corsair-XMS3-PC-1333-Arbeitsspeicher-DDR3-RAM/dp/B003N8GVUY/ref=sr_1_1?s=computers&ie=UTF8&qid=1355921128&sr=1-1

http://www.amazon.de/Lepa-W500-SA-Power-Supply-Watt/dp/B004J20AG4/ref=sr_1_4?s=computers&ie=UTF8&qid=1355921170&sr=1-4

Here are some components that would max out Skyrim on the PC all up is 400 Euros. Would just need a case and a OS which would cost like 100EUROS, Windows 8 is a real cheap OS.

@Morrow said:

@Snail said:

That said, if you really don't want to build your own PC, that graphics card and processor won't allow you to enjoy a smooth-running Skyrim on high settings. You'd have to upgrade both those components, which should cost you a few hundred euros.

Hmm, that's odd, the second model seems to be above the required specs for Skyrim... well in that case I'll skip the idea.

To be honest I hadn't looked at the second one. Forgive my bullshit, that should do fine.

@Snail said:

@Morrow said:

@Snail said:

That said, if you really don't want to build your own PC, that graphics card and processor won't allow you to enjoy a smooth-running Skyrim on high settings. You'd have to upgrade both those components, which should cost you a few hundred euros.

Hmm, that's odd, the second model seems to be above the required specs for Skyrim... well in that case I'll skip the idea.

To be honest I hadn't looked at the second one. Forgive my bullshit, that should do fine.

Oh, you just re-lit my excitement :D

So, if the AMD processor with 6x 3800 MHz is fine, is the graphics card ok too?GeForce GT 630 4096MB. I'm actually not a fan of Nvidia because I constantly had driver issues with their graphic cards...

@Morrow: No thats a terrible card, designed for low end use or Photoshop.

@Bourbon_Warrior said:

@Morrow: No thats a terrible card, designed for low end use or Photoshop.

I see ._. Can you recommend one?

@Morrow said:

@Bourbon_Warrior said:

@Morrow: No thats a terrible card, designed for low end use or Photoshop.

I see ._. Can you recommend one?

I recommended a whole PC build a few posts before, can run Skyrim on Very High - Max for 400 Euros. I can't recommend building a PC enough. Alot of the fun of PC gaming is putting together the machine. It is the PC I got at the moment with a better GPU, I can play Far Cry 3 on High and Skyrim with alot of graphics mods, plus i'm playing Fallout 3 again with some really nice graphics mods. Anyway I hope that helps, those machines are really overpriced and you would of been really disapointed when you loaded up Skyrim with them.

@Bourbon_Warrior said:

@Morrow said:

@Bourbon_Warrior said:

@Morrow: No thats a terrible card, designed for low end use or Photoshop.

I see ._. Can you recommend one?

I recommended a whole PC build a few posts before, can run Skyrim on Very High - Max for 400 Euros. I can't recommend building a PC enough. Alot of the fun of PC gaming is putting together the machine.

I saw that by now, you didn't reply to me directly so I wasn't notified of your post :P

But again, I'm just a casual gamer and prefer consoles a lot over PCs. That's why I don't have one to begin with. And I prefer convenience. I don't mind spending more money for the "easy" way of just ordering a complete PC (plus graphics card and/or more RAM). Building one from scratch? Nah-ah. Not for me.

BTW the graphics card you linked me to is only available as used... I want new ._.

Building a PC is SUPER easy these days. I linked my Tested.com's how-to video on it to a friend who had 0 experience with doing so and he had no trouble at all. Just get a friend to walk you through ordering parts or ask for suggestions. It may seem like a daunting task, but man, it's so rewarding.

@Morrow said:

@Snail said:

To be honest I hadn't looked at the second one. Forgive my bullshit, that should do fine.

Oh, you just re-lit my excitement :D

So, if the AMD processor with 6x 3800 MHz is fine, is the graphics card ok too?GeForce GT 630 4096MB. I'm actually not a fan of Nvidia because I constantly had driver issues with their graphic cards...

Oh shit. I must've misread, I thought it was a GTX card. The GT 630 is an entry level card. I'm not very familiar with it, but this guy seems to be able to run Skyrim just fine on high-settings (allegedly averaging at 40FPS). The thing is I don't know which CPU he's using, and I also don't know enough about AMD CPUs to advise you on that level - though I'm under the impression that the Athlon 64 FX is a fairly decent CPU that's been marketed as a gaming-oriented piece of hardware.

Bottom line: if you buy the most expensive of the two you will be well off for Skyrim and MMOs, but within a year you'll be way outdated for new releases.

I'm really not sure where to get the best deals with pre-built computers, and most suggestions you'll get out of this forum will be about building your own PC. It's just a shame that you'd want to spend that much money on a pre-built PC, when you could get a lot more mileage out of a computer for the same price if you assembled it yourself. If you change your mind the Giant Bomb forums are a great place to seek advice on PC-building.

Also I'd recommend an nvidia card over an AMD one because of all the stuff like PhysX technology that's exclusive to them, and can really improve a game's presentation.

@Morrow said:

@Bourbon_Warrior said:

@Morrow said:

@Bourbon_Warrior said:

@Morrow: No thats a terrible card, designed for low end use or Photoshop.

I see ._. Can you recommend one?

I recommended a whole PC build a few posts before, can run Skyrim on Very High - Max for 400 Euros. I can't recommend building a PC enough. Alot of the fun of PC gaming is putting together the machine.

I saw that by now, you didn't reply to me directly so I wasn't notified of your post :P

But again, I'm just a casual gamer and prefer consoles a lot over PCs. That's why I don't have one to begin with. And I prefer convenience. I don't mind spending more money for the "easy" way of just ordering a complete PC (plus graphics card and/or more RAM). Building one from scratch? Nah-ah. Not for me.

BTW the graphics card you linked me to is only available as used... I want new ._.

Sorry I don't speak that language so I didnt realize here is for 215 Euros http://www.amazon.de/Sapphire-HD6970-Grafikkarte-GDDR5-Speicher/dp/B004JNN87G/ref=sr_1_1?s=computers&ie=UTF8&qid=1355922584&sr=1-1, it is SO EASY and fun building a PC, I can't reinforce that point enough.

@Snail:

Hmmm I see, thank you for all the info ^^

@Bourbon_Warrior: Well thanks for your help ^^

@Snail said:

@Morrow said:

@Snail said:

To be honest I hadn't looked at the second one. Forgive my bullshit, that should do fine.

Oh, you just re-lit my excitement :D

So, if the AMD processor with 6x 3800 MHz is fine, is the graphics card ok too?GeForce GT 630 4096MB. I'm actually not a fan of Nvidia because I constantly had driver issues with their graphic cards...

Oh shit. I must've misread, I thought it was a GTX card. The GT 630 is an entry level card. I'm not very familiar with it, but this guy seems to be able to run Skyrim just fine on high-settings (allegedly averaging at 40FPS). The thing is I don't know which CPU he's using, and I also don't know enough about AMD CPUs to advise you on that level - though I'm under the impression that the Athlon 64 FX is a fairly decent CPU that's been marketed as a gaming-oriented piece of hardware.

Bottom line: if you buy the most expensive of the two you will be well off for Skyrim and MMOs, but within a year you'll be way outdated for new releases.

I'm really not sure where to get the best deals with pre-built computers, and most suggestions you'll get out of this forum will be about building your own PC. It's just a shame that you'd want to spend that much money on a pre-built PC, when you could get a lot more mileage out of a computer for the same price if you assembled it yourself. If you change your mind the Giant Bomb forums are a great place to seek advice on PC-building.

Also I'd recommend an nvidia card over an AMD one because of all the stuff like PhysX technology that's exclusive to them, and can really improve a game's presentation.

Stop misinforming people, that person is running at 720p with no anti aliasing, it would look not much better than a Xbox.

I think people should stop with this "build Your PC by yourself" thing. Yes, it's cheaper, but saying it's "easy" is just wrong. Maybe it is easy for you, but you still need to have at least some knowledge on how Things Works. You can't just be completely New and put in Components out of the blue like it's LEGO, & later on know where to look for drivers, or you could with tutorials yes, but be ready to spend a lot of time. No, just go for a decent pre-built computer & put in a AMD GPU (since you have trouble With Nvidia), maybe a HD 7950, I doubt you will be disappointed by its performance. For Skyrim specifically, it doesn't require much other than high VRAM & fairly decent CPU. A quad CPU With 3.40Ghz is good, & the GPU I stated above is well over the requirments for Skyrim.

@Morrow: To make a quick judgement on how good a video card is look a the second number in card name, this number indicates the relative power, (the first number is just the generation of the card, it's somewhat important as video cards get better every year, but nowhere near as important as the second)

Nvidia 1-4 HD video only, 5 basic gaming, 6-7 gaming, 8-9 crazy people

AMD 4-5 HD video only, 6-7 basic gaming, 8-9 gaming

a good reference http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/gaming-graphics-card-review,3107-7.html

This is a decent first PC if 500 euros is your budget, you could certainly do better building one from scratch though.

http://www.amazon.de/Multimedia-Hexa-Core-FX-Series-DVD-Brenner-Card-Reader/dp/B009HSUN3A/ref=pd_cp_ce_0

@Bourbon_Warrior: It's not misinforming. She says she's mostly a console gamer so even what's demonstrated on that video would be a slight step-up. Moreover, she's looking to play MMOs that are only available on PC, and that PC is more than fine for most popular MMOs out there. It does what she's looking for, but if he wants an optimal PC experience she'll have to spend some more dough - and I've also let her know that.

My German is a little rusty, so I hope I'm not reading any of that wrong.

For processors, Intel is the best way to go generally, though if you're on a tight budget an AMD will be all right. Just not great.

It's got a GT 630 and no, that is not a good card. Here are the Tom's Hardware benchmarks for Skyrim on the GT 640 - keep in mind that they're running it at a fairly low resolution (1280x1024). It could work, but I doubt that it would do very well, and it definitely wouldn't do that well under the load of a bunch of mods. I would search some more, find something better.

Finally, here is the Giantbomb guide on what PC parts to buy. It also says how to build one, but it's got tons of information on what parts are good.

@FritzDude: I kind of agree. Building my own PC for the first time wasn't difficult. But it took some time researching, picking parts, putting it together and tweaking the software. All in all, maybe a few bucks extra for a pre-built computer is worth it.

Then came the problems. Getting busted LEGO parts from the manufacturer is nowhere near as frustrating as PC problems.

@Morrow: If you're comfortable replacing the GPU and RAM, then there's really no way you wouldn't be able to build the entire machine. It's really hard to actually mess up when you're doing it, unless you throw the parts in the case a-la Brad.

@Morrow: If you don't feel like building your own PC, ask for the shop to build your PC for you. In Finland this one shop offers to build a custom PC and it costs only 50 € + the price of the components. This way you don't need to worry about anything. Just ask your local specialized computer shop.

@Icemo said:

@Morrow: If you don't feel like building your own PC, ask for the shop to build your PC for you. In Finland this one shop offers to build a custom PC and it costs only 50 € + the price of the components. This way you don't need to worry about anything. Just ask your local specialized computer shop.

That's a great idea, unfortunately I live in a rural area without a local specialized computer shop :(

@FritzDude said:

I think people should stop with this "build Your PC by yourself" thing. Yes, it's cheaper, but saying it's "easy" is just wrong. Maybe it is easy for you, but you still need to have at least some knowledge on how Things Works. You can't just be completely New and put in Components out of the blue like it's LEGO, & later on know where to look for drivers, or you could with tutorials yes, but be ready to spend a lot of time.

I had NO experience with PCs when I had a sudden windfall of cash a few years ago and my friend demanded I buy one.

With no outside help I ordered the parts, built it and had it running on the day of delivery. All thanks to the internet. This was all within the space of a few days, mind. So, I hadn't sunk in the hours you're suggesting.

We have the world's greatest information resource at our fingertips, so it is complete nonsense to claim someone with no knowledge couldn't do it.

OP clearly doesn't give a shit, but it's ridiculously easy to source quality, high-end components for relatively cheap and put the thing together yourself.

You then gain a more intimate knowledge of the machine, and should anything go wrong in future (it will), that knowledge will aid you in quickly identifying the issue and remedying it.

I'm going to be the unpopular one here. I bought my PC stock from Dell for around 600 bucks. I use it to play Guild Wars 2, Day Z and the Left 4 Dead games. It also runs Star Wars: TOR, WoW and a bunch of other random steam titles. I have not played Skyrim, the most graphically intense thing I ran was Saints Row the Third.

I build my first computer out of high school, and its kind of a nightmare if you don't have someone working with you the whole time if you're inexperienced. After the 2 years of working on my machine I bought my first Dell and never looked back.

That said, I'm not an avid full time PC gamer, I also have my X360 and my PS3. For my 600 bucks though I got a pretty decent PC with tons of RAM and a pretty good graphics card. For me it was worth it just to buy it and plug and play I don't have time to tinker like I used to. Building your own PC can be extremley rewarding if you know what you're doing, but I was looking for a time saver.

@Morrow said:

@Icemo said:

@Morrow: If you don't feel like building your own PC, ask for the shop to build your PC for you. In Finland this one shop offers to build a custom PC and it costs only 50 € + the price of the components. This way you don't need to worry about anything. Just ask your local specialized computer shop.

That's a great idea, unfortunately I live in a rural area without a local specialized computer shop :(

Well, try to search for a German computer online store and see if they offer building services when you purchase your parts online. I know it's possible since there is at least one shop like that here. I imagine Germany has at least one online store like that since it is a bigger country.

@GetEveryone: That's great. I don't know you, or Morrow for that matter, so I have no idea how good you two are with this, but we are all different. I myself used over two hours just mounting a Solid State Drive which I have never done before, & I used tutorials too, I even made a thread about it here. If you don't know much about computers (maybe just how to change GPU or similar), & you don't really care that much about Learning it either, I don't think it's smart to start building a computer. That's just my opinion. & I'm not stating that people without knowledge can't do it, I'm saying it will take time & patience in research, & the margin of error is greater, not just on the hardware side. The Components isn't exactly "cheap" that you can just trial & error your way through, or it Depends on what Component it is.

@Morrow Here's a website that will suggest all of the components you'd need to build the computer (besides the OS and a DVD drive) to you based on the price you want to spend on the computer: http://www.logicalincrements.com/ Prices are in USD, so if you've got 500 Euro to spend on it, I guess you'd be looking at the $520 or $550 tier to have enough leftover money for the OS and stuff. When picking a MoBo, it seems like you can usually get one bundled with some RAM on newegg, so look out for that.